Announcer: BulletproofRadio.Astateofhighperformance.

DaveAsprey: You'relisteningtoBulletproofradiowithDaveAsprey.Today'scoolfactofthedayisthatanewstudyjustfoundthatacompoundinstrawberriesmightpreventageassociatedneurodegenerativedisease.Ifyou'vereadHeadStrong,thatabouthalfofusunderage40haveearlyonsetmitochondrialdysfunction,that'skindofabadthing.Andthisnewstudysaysthatthatcompoundfromstrawberriescalledficitincouldbeparticularlyhelpful.

However,Igottosayyou'regoingtohavetoeatanawfullotofstrawberriestogetanybenefit.It'skindoflikeresveratrolinredwine.I'dliketotellyouredwineissuperhealthybecauseofresveratrol,it'sjustyouneedtodrinklikeatruckloadofwinetogetasmuchasyougetinalittlecapsule.WhichisoneofthereasonsIlikesupplements.Thatsaid,itcouldbekindofcool,right?Inthisstudy,itwasattheSalkInstituteintheneurobiologylab,aplacewhereI'veactuallybeen,aprettyamazingplace.Andtheyfoundthatmicethatgotlargedosesofthisstuffhassignificantlyreducedcognitivedeclineandinflammationfromaging.

GiventhatI'mlookingtolivetoatleast180,andIhopeyou'lljoinmeinthatquest!AndIalsoplanto,well,dietryingifnecessary,maybethisissomethingyouwanttostartthinkingabout.Eatafewstrawberriesandmaybetakesomesupplements,thingslikethat.

Allright.Today'sepisodeisgoingtobefantasticfunbecauseifyou'rewatchingonvideo,ifyouwanttoseethisvideogotobulletproof.com/YouTubetofindthechannel.I'mrecordingitliveintheheadquartersofTOMSshoeswithnoneotherthanBlakeMycoskie,whoisthefounderandchiefshoegiverofTOMS,amultiplesuccessfulentrepreneur,andaguywhojustwroteabookcalled“StartSomethingThatMatters,”talkingaboutsocialentrepreneurshipandthingslikethat.

SoBlake,welcometoBulletproofRadioandthanksforhavingme.

BlakeMycoskie: Thankyou.ThanksforcomingintoourheadquartershereinL.A...

DaveAsprey: Wegottoknoweachotheralittlebitbeforethisinothermeetings,andusuallyIinterviewmaverickscientists,peoplewhoaredoingcrazyworld-changingthings.AndIwantedtointerviewyou,becauseyou'renotonlyashockinglysuccessfulentrepreneur,you'reactuallyagoodhumanbeing.

BlakeMycoskie: That'snice.Thankyou.

DaveAsprey: AndIwanttotalktoyou,notnecessarilyina'howcanyoustartacompany'andallthatsortofstuff,althoughwe'llprobablytalkalittlebitaboutthat.Someportionofpeoplelisteningareinterestedinthat,butalotofthemarelike,"HowdoIperformbetter?"Andyou'reaguywho'slivedaprettyamazinglife,

andyou'vegotalotofmindfulnessbuiltinbothyourbusiness,andjustyourownpersonallife.So,Iwanttogodeepinthatdirection,ifyou'recoolwithit.

BlakeMycoskie: Absolutely.Iloveit.It'sdefinitely,I'llsayapassionofminethathasdevelopedovertheyears,asthingshavehappenedinmylife-likebecominganewdad,orgettingmarried,ordealingevenwitheventhesuccessofTOMS,hasledmetoaplaceofwantingtobemoremindful.

DaveAsprey: Youjustmentionedbeinganewdad.Aswe'rerecordingthis,tomorrow'sthebigday.

BlakeMycoskie: Yes.Iknow,it'scrazy.ThisisliterallythelastthingonmycalendarbeforeIgohometogetreadywithmywife,whowillbegivingbirthtooursecondchildtomorrow.We'rehavingababygirl.Andoneothercoolfactofthedayisthatwewillbehavingourfirstdaughtertomorrow,andtomorrowisalsotheInternationalDayoftheGirl.

DaveAsprey: Ohwell.

BlakeMycoskie: Ithoughtthatwasin...likeifyou'regoingtobebornonadayasagirl,whynotbebornontheInternationalDayoftheGirl,whichourdaughter,Charlie,willbebornon.Yeah,thatwasfunny.Heather,mywife,wasaskingmeaboutmyscheduletodayincaseshewentintolaborearly,andIwaslike,"Igotthis,Igotthis,Igotthis,andIreallyhopeIdon'thavetocancelonDave,becauseI'vebeenlookingforwardtosittingdowntogethersincewemetseveralmonthsago."So,unlesswegetacallhereinthenexthourandahalf,Ithinkwe'regood.

DaveAsprey: Iwasliterallyfiguringwe'remaybe50/50andIcouldn'tbelieveyouthatyousaid,"Alright,let'smeetthedaybefore."Sothankyou.

BlakeMycoskie: It'sgreat.It'sgreat.

DaveAsprey: NowIwentthroughkindofyourtrackrecordhere,andyou'vestartedlikefourcompaniesbeforethis,andoneofthemstoodout.Youstartedastudentlaundrycompany,oneofmyfirstbusinessplanthingsIworkedonatWhartonwasarounddoingalaundryservicebecauseit'ssuchanannoyanceforpeople.Soyouactuallydidthatandlikemadeamillion-dollarcompanyoutofthat.Youwerehowoldwhenyoudidthat?

BlakeMycoskie: Iwas19whenIdidthat,thatwasmyfirstbusiness.Andthefunnythingaboutthatis,andIthinkasmanyentrepreneurssay,thattheirideaactuallycomesoutofnecessityversusanythingelse.AndIhadbeenplayingcollegetennisatSMU,andbrokemylegandhand,wasinthisbig,likeabodycast-andIcouldn'tcarrymylaundrydowntothefacility.Andso,Ihadanecessity,Iliterallyneededsomeonetocomepickupanddelivermylaundry.Andbackthen,somepeoplewon'tknowwhatthisis,butthereisthisthingoftheYellowPages.

DaveAsprey: It'slikeanalogGoogleorsomething.

BlakeMycoskie: Yeah.It'slikeayellowGoogle,butprintedonpaperwithonlyonetrillionththeinformation.Butyes,IlookedintheYellowPages,thereisnoonethatwoulddoit.Andsothatledto,"Gosh,thisseemslikeagoodideaforabusiness,thatiscalledEasyLaundry."Thatwasmyfirstbusiness.

DaveAsprey: Soyousolditforamillionbucksorsomethingbeforeyouwerewhat?Early20s?

BlakeMycoskie: Yes.Iwas22whenI...

DaveAsprey: Whatdiditdotoyourheadwhenyoumadeamillionbucksat22?

BlakeMycoskie: It'sinteresting,Ithinkyouwouldappreciatethisbecauseyouhavesomanypassionsandinterestsinthekindofbusinessentrepreneurial,kindofpersonalgrowthspace,isIwasalreadyontothenextthingasIwastryingtosellthatbusiness.Andso,asthatwashappening,itgavemedefinitelysomefinancialfreedom.ButIwasalreadysodeepintoinvestingintomynextthingthatitwasn'tlikeitchangedmylifestyleatall.Iwasstilllivinginasmallapartment,stilldrivingprobablyjustanokaycar,watchingmyspending,andreallyjustpassionateaboutthenextbusinessideaIhad.

AndIthinkthatthatjustgoestokindofthewayIthinkaboutbusiness,ismoreabout...Iloveinventingthingsthatdon'texistinculture,orsolvingproblemsthatIwanttosolveformyselforforothers.Andso,itwasmoreofjustawaytohavesomecapitaltogodothatmore.

DaveAsprey: That'sprettyunusualthough.Iknowalotofpeoplewhomademoneywhentheywereintheirearly20s,whoprettymuchblowitall.Didyourparentsraiseyouwithsomeweirdattitudetowardsmoney?Thisislikedeeppsychology.Everyonehasissuesaboutmoney.

BlakeMycoskie: Everyonedoes,andIthinkyoucanhaveissuesaboutnothavingenoughmoneyorthenhavingtoomuchmoney,andunfortunatelythere'sthere'salotofpainandsufferingthatcomesfrompeoplewhoaresuccessful,asI'msureyou'vemet.Ithinkit'smoneyhasneverbeenoverlyimportantoridolizedinmylife.Largely,maybebecauseIgrewupinuppermiddle-classfamilythathadenoughmoney.Itwasn'tlikewewereseenasrich,butwealsowereseenasveryfortunate,verywelloff,wewereverygrateful.

Mydadwasadoctor,mymomwasanauthor.Ithinkitwasanenvironmentthatitdidn'tplacesuchanimportance.Oneofmyfavoriteentrepreneurs,SaraBlakelywhostartedSpanx.She,Ithink,saysthebestthingaboutmoney.Shesaid,"Blakemoneyisfuntomake,moneyshouldbefuntospendandmoneyshouldbefuntogiveaway.Andyoushouldhaveequalfundoingallthree."Andthat's,kindof,myphilosophyaboutmoney.

DaveAsprey: Yourparentsorsomeonedidsomethingrightbyyou,becausethevastmajorityofpeople,includingmewhenIwasthatage,havethissubconsciousfeararoundmoney.It'slikefearofnothavingenoughandthenfearoflosingit,andthenfearofmakingthewrongdecisionwithit.Ifyoudon'thavemoney,you'refearful,ifyouhavemoneyyou'refearful,andthenitdrivesnotgiving.Itdrivespeopletojustmakefearfuldecisionsthatactuallylosethemtheirmoney.

Thishappenedtome,ImadesixmillionbucksandIwas26.IlostitwhenIwas28.AllIhadtodowasquitmyjobandkeepmy$6million,butI'mlike,"No,Icouldmakemore.I'llbehappywhenIhave$10million."Imadealltheseterribledecisionsinretrospect,andnowIrecognizeIwasrunningkindofunconsciousprogrammingaroundnotbeingworthy,andallsortsofweirdstuff.Youmadeyourmillionbucks,right?

BlakeMycoskie: Yeah.

DaveAsprey: Andyoujustneverhadthefearaboutmoneything,youlookedatitasatool.

BlakeMycoskie: Itwassomethinginmyentrepreneuriallife,I'vemadeandlostseveraltimes,soit'snotlike...whileImadesomemoneyonthatbusiness,Ilostmoneyonthenextbusiness,thenImadesomemoneyonthenextbusiness.Andit'sbeenthiskindof...Ifeellikeit'sjustkindofpartoftheentrepreneurialjourney,soit'snotsurprisingtometohearthatyoumademoneyandthenyoulostitandthenyou'vemademoremoneybecauseentrepreneurs,Ithink,aremoreinterestedincreatingthingsandbuildingthingsthantheyareaboutaccumulatingwealth.

DaveAsprey: Absolutely.

BlakeMycoskie: Sometimesthatwealththattheyaccumulateendsupslippingthroughtheirhands.Ithinkattheendoftheday,itcomesbacktothesepatternsthatwedevelopwhenwe'reveryyoung,andyoucouldsaythattheyareneurologicallyhard-wiredintoourbrain.AndIthinkthat'swhysomanypeoplehavethesepatternsandthesecertainkindofreactions,bothgoodandbad,tomoneyorbeingafraidoflosingit,becausetheywitnesstheirparentsdealingwithmoneythatway.AndlikeIsaid,Iwasveryfortunate,inthatwealwayshadsufficientmeanstoallowustodo,notjustthebasicthingsinlife,buttakeafamilyvacationeverysummer,andgiveeachothernicegiftsontheholidays.

Myparentsareverycharitable,theywerealwaysgivingmoneytodifferentcauses,orthechurch,orhelpingpayforpeopletogoonmissiontripsorwhateveritwas.SoIthinkIjustgrewupwitha,thankfully,areallygreatrolemodelinmymomandmydad,athowtheyengagedwithmoney.

DaveAsprey: Whathappenedwhenyoufailedatyoursecondcompany?Howdidyoudealwithfailure?

BlakeMycoskie: Ithinkthehardestthingaboutfailinginabusinessiswhenyouactuallyhavetostop.Becauseyoucouldstillthink,"Thisisagoodideaandthiscouldbesuccessful,Ijustaddalittlemorecapitaloraddalittlemoretime."Butwhenyouliterallyrunoutofmoneyandyoucan'tgetanymore,especiallyifyou'reraisinginvestormoney,that'slikeareallyfrustratingthing.It'slikethegame'sover,theclock’sdoneandyoudon'tgettokeepplaying.

ItriedtostartatelevisionnetworkwhenIwas22.Itwasanallrealitycablechannel.TheideacametomeafterIwasontheAmazingRacerealityshowwithmysisterPaige.Andweraisedsomemoneyfromventurefundsandsomeprivateequity,andweproceededtospendthemoneyintryingtobuildthisnetwork,andultimatelyrealizedwejustcouldn'tgetitdone.There'stoomuchcompetition,FOXjustlaunchedtheirownrealitychanneletc.,andwehadtoletgoabout20,25peoplethathadbeenworkingonthisprojectwithusforalmosttwoyears.

Andthehardestpartaboutthefailingwasnotjustthatwedidn'tgettokeeppursuingthisvisionthatwehad,butitreallywaslikeIdidn'tgettoshowupinworkandexperiencelifewiththeseamazingpeoplethatIhadbecomereallygoodfriendswith.Likeweallhadtogofindjobs,orwehadtogodosomethingelse.Andthoserelationshipshadtobeseveredjustbecausewedidn'thaveacompanytogoto,wasreallyhardandthentryingtokeepthoserelationshipswasnexttoimpossiblebecausetheheadofprogramming,shehadkidsinhighschoolandsheneededtogofindajobatatraditionalnetwork.

Andtheheadoffinancehadtogogetajob.Somuchofourrelationshipsinlifearehappeningbecauseofthetimethatwespendwithpeople,largelybecauseoftheworkthatwedo.Andso,whenyoudon'tgettodotheworkthatyouweredoing,thatmeansyoualsodon'tgettohavetherelationshipsthatyouhad.I'maveryrelationalpersonandsothatwas,Ithinkwhatmadeitreallydifficultwas,Ididn'tgettohavethetimewiththesepeoplethatIhadenjoyedsomuch.

DaveAsprey: Didyouhavelikethevoiceinyourheadthatlike,"Oh,Iscrewedup.Ifailed,Ididn'tdothisright."Wassomenegativeself-talk,orareyoujustkindofchillthatway,thatitwasmorejustabout,"Imissmyfriends."

BlakeMycoskie: Ithinkitisalittlebitofboth.Ithinkitwas...Forme,thebiggestlessoninthiswasthatwehad,andtothisdayIstillbelievethiskindofhypothesisruns,wehadagreatideainthattherewasatonofpeoplethatwere,atthistime2000...thisis2003,we'rejustobsessedwithrealitytelevision.Sowehadalotofpeoplethatwerereallyinterestedinthecontentthatweweregoingtobeputtingout,andtheywerereallyobsessedwiththerealitystarsofliketheSurvivorsandtheAmazingRace,theBigBrothers.

Andweweregettingallthosepeoplewhowantedtobepartofournetworkbecauseaftertheywereontheshow,theyhadnothingtodo,andtheywanttokeeptheir15minutesoffamegoing.Sowehadgreatcontent,wehadgreat

kindofcelebrityassets.Advertiserslikedthiscontent,becauseitreachedaverycoveteddemographic,that's18to34-year-old,thattheywerealltryingtoreach.Everypartofthebusinessequationmadesense-exceptthecableoperatorsdidnotneednewchannels.

There's500ofthem,whywouldtheypayme?They'renotgoingtogetanymoresubscribersiftheyaddthischannel.Andso,therewasasinglegroupofcompanies,aboutsixoftheminourcountry,thatcontrolthefateofthisgreatideaeverreachingitsendconsumer.AndsoIlearnedabiglessoninthat.IwasveryfrustratedwithmyselfthatIdidn'thavetheforesighttoseethatbeforeIraisedallthismoneyandhiredallthesepeople,becauseifso,Icouldhavejustgonetothemfirstandseenifthere'sanychanceintheworldthatweweregoingtogetontheirnetworksandifnot,thenIwouldn'thavespenttwoyearsofmylifetryingtodoso,becauseIprobablycouldfigurethatoutprettyquickly.

DaveAsprey: Youhadthewrongcustomeridentified,youwerelookingatviewersnotthepeoplewhowouldpay.

BlakeMycoskie: Exactly.Andsothatwasthehardestpart,wasjustfeelinglikeIreallyhadmissedsomething,andthatdidcreatesomenegativeself-talk.ButIthinkthelargerpartofthethingthatmadeitsohardwasjustthatImissedthepeoplethatIhadworkedwith,andIreallyfeltlikewewereonafunmissiontogetherthatweweren'tabletocontinueworkingon.

DaveAsprey: Ifeltthat,evenjustwhenyouleaveacompanyafteryou'vebeenthereforafewyears.Youformalltheserelationships,andIthinkalotofpeoplewhentheychangejobs,theykindoffeelliketheylosttheirsocialsupportnetbecausesomanyofus,ourfriendsareourcoworkers.

BlakeMycoskie: Today,agentlemannamedSeth,who'sworkedinsaleswithmesince2009/10,thisishislastday.Andwespentafewminutestogether,andgaveahug,andbothshedafewtears.Andasafounderofacompanythathasabout500employees,andnowwe're11yearsold,I'vehadthatexperiencemany,manytimesnow.AndIthinkit'skindofthehardestpartaboutaboutbeingafounderandhavingacompanythathashadsomesuccess,isthatit'snotforever.HeservedTOMSforareallylongtime,andhedidgreatworkwhenhewashere,andit'stimeforanewchapterinhiscareer,inhislifeandhemovedon.

AndthenumberofthoseconversationsI'vehadovertheyears,especiallyfromtheearlyemployeesthatwereintheapartmentwithme,orintheoldwarehouseinSantaMonica,they'relikefamily.Andso,whentheygoofftodosomethingelse,eventhoughthere'salwaysgoodreasonsandthere'shugsandthere'stears,it'sstillalittlepieceofmedieseverytimesomeoneleaves-becauseI'mstillheregrinding,andbuildingthevision,andworkingharderthanevertomakeTOMSrelevantinourcultureandtobehavingimpacteveryday.Sowhensomeonechoosestodosomethingelse,it'salwayshard.

DaveAsprey: Formeatleast,itkindoftriggersalittlebitoflikethey'reabandoningme.Iknowthat'snotrealbutyougetthatlittletwinge.Butthenyou'realsolike,"Well,Ihadagreatopportunity,itwastherightthing."Italwayskindoffeelsgoodthoughwhensomeoneleaves.LikeIhadanemployeeleaveandstartacompanythatendedupinvestinginourcompany.She'sfantastic,Iwashappysheleft,Ithinkallthereasonswereright.Karissa,youknowI'mtalkingaboutyou.She'sstartedamakeupcompany,actuallyonethatwasacopy...

BlakeMycoskie: Drive,right?

DaveAsprey: Thereyougo.Doyouknowher?

BlakeMycoskie: Ido.

DaveAsprey: Excellent.Iwasgoingtosay,shedefinitelyborrowedyourgiveidea,becauseshegivesmakeuptowomenwhoarerecoveringfromcancer,fromchemotherapyeverytimeyoubuyhermakeup.Butit'sverymuchtheideathatyoupioneeredaroundthisgivingcompany,andshe'sdoingfantasticallywell.SoI'mlike,"Howcanyoube..."Iwillingtobesadandthenyoucanbelike,"Wowthisisamazing."Likesomeoneleft,thatfeelsgood.

Whataboutthough,whatgoesthroughyourheadwhenyouareaswell,"Here'ssomeonewhoworkedout,butthey'renotworkingoutanymore."

BlakeMycoskie: That'salsosomethingthatasafounderyoudealwithalot,especiallyinkindofthe...Iwanttosaywe're11yearsoldnow,inthemiddleyears,sotospeak,kindofonceyou'veprovenyourbusinessmodelandit'sworkingandyou'rehavinghighgrowth,it'sjustpartofbuildingabusinessandIthinkthebestadviceIeverreceivedfrommentorsandpeoplewhohavebeendownthispathbeforeme,istoactquicklyandtoactreallytransparently.Justbereallyhonestwiththepersonandwithyourself,andnottrytosqueezethemintoanewroleorredefinetherole,becauseultimately,thatislimitingthemandholdingthembackandthebusiness-andit'snotfairtotheotheremployeesthatarestillsurroundedbythatperson.

It'sjustpartofwhatwedoandyougottohavetheseconversations,andIthinkthequickeryouhavethoseconversationsandthemorejustopenandhonestyouareaboutwhyyou'rehavingtheconversation,it'skindoflikepullingoffaBand-Aid.Ithurtsbutifyoudoitquickly,thatthepaingoesbyprettyquick.

DaveAsprey: Ithinkthere'salotofpersonalgrowththathappensbeinganentrepreneur,becauseitforcesyoutobealittlebitmoreconsciouswithyourrelationshipsbecauseyou'relike,youwanttohelpsomeoneatthesametime,ifit'snotreciprocalforwhateverthereasonis,atacertainpointjusttobeabletopracticethatskillofsaying,"Allright.Let'sbothfindwhat'srightforusas..."That'sbeenadifficultthingformeasanentrepreneuraswell.Butitsoundslikeyounavigatedthesewatersremarkablywell.

AndI'mstilldiggingandIthinkpeoplelisteningareinterestedinthattoo,likeyou'vedonethisfourtimesandyou'vecreatedthisnewbusinessmodelofgiving,whatwouldhavebeenthestickingpoints?Orlikewhatarethehardthingsthatyouhadtoworkonyourselfinordertogetyourcompaniestodothesethings?

BlakeMycoskie: Man.Severalthings.Onaverytacticallevel,justinTOMSshoes,thehardestpartwasmakingtheshoes.Ijustneverwasashoemaker.Imainlyhiredpeoplethatcamefromkindofthepassionofgivingandnotthedriveofexcellentshoemakingandsoproductionforatleastthefirstfiveorsixyearswasveryhardtogetright,andverycostlywhenyougetitwrong.Andyouhaverecalls,oryouhavecomplaints,andyouhave...Soitjustisataverytacticallevel,thehardestthingaboutgrowingTOMSwasneversellingtheshoes,itwasactuallyinmakingtheshoes.

Andthenalsoreallymakingsurethatweweregivingtheshoesinareallysustainable,responsiblewaybecausenooneinthehistoryoftheworldhadevergivenawayasmanyshoesasweweregivingandstillgivingaway.Andwe'vegiven85millionpairsofshoesaway!Sothere'sjustnoorganizationsetuptoliketelluslike,"Thisisthewaytogiveinaresponsiblewaythatdoesn'tdisruptlocalmarketsordoesn'tundercutthelocalshoeseller.Thesearethewaysthatyoulooktocreatingaid,butnotneedindependency."

There'sallthisreallydeepkindofthinkingaround,howdoyouhelpthoseinneedinaresponsibleway.Andthatwasreallyhard,becausewejustdidn'tcomefromthatbackground.SoIthinkwhatI'velearnedis,youhavetoasklotsofquestions,tobeverycurious.Youadmitwhenyoudon'tknowwhatyoudon'tknow,andyoureallylookforpeoplewhoareexpertsinthesespaces.Andsoovertime,thereasonourqualityofourshoeshasgotteninfinitelybetterthanthefirstyearsiswe'vehiredamazingveterans,thateitherworkedatNike,orVans,orothercompaniesthatknowhowtomakegreatshoes.

Andonthegivingside,we'vehiredincredibleleadersofnonprofitsfromalldifferentsectors,thatarethinkingdeeplyaboutourgiving.Thosearethetacticalchallenges.Ithinkaninternalchallenge,JohnMackeythefounderofWholeFoods,toldmeonce,andIgottospendsometimewithJohnwhenIlivedinAustin.

DaveAsprey: Heisagreatguy.

BlakeMycoskie: He'sanamazinghumanbeing,andhesaidthattheconsciousnessofabusinesscanonlyberaisedastheconsciousnessofitsleadersisraised.

DaveAsprey: Amen.

BlakeMycoskie: AndIthought,"Man."Andthatwasislike2012,I'djustgottenmarried.I'dhadrealsuccessasanentrepreneurandIwasprobably,Ihadn'tdonereallymuch

self-workatthatpoint.AndIreallytookthatadviceseriously,becauseIsaid,"IfI'mgoingtocontinuetoleadTOMS,Ineedtoworkonmyselfmore."Andthatwasareal...anditturnedoutthatworkingonmyselfmoreledtobetterrelationshipswithmyfamilymembersandfriends,definitelyabetterrelationshipwithmywife.

AndIthinkasitrelatestobusiness,Ihavealotmoreempathy,Ithink,andI'malotmoreemotionalintelligencetoourstaffandtopeopleweworkwiththanIdidbeforeIstartedworkingonthat.SoIthinkofthechallengesthatIfacedingrowingTOMSandevolvingit,alotofthemhavebeenmetbymeworkingonmyselfmorethanworkingonthebusiness.

DaveAsprey: Thanksforsayingthat.Oneofmyobservationsjustinmyownpast,myownexperience,isthatacompanyisoftentimesadirectreflectionofthepsychologicaloremotional,evenlikethespiritualstateofitsleadership.Ifyou'realljackedup,itseemslikethingsjustdon'twork.Allright.SoI'mhappythatyouwenttherebecausewhatdidyoudotoworkonyourself?Likewhatarethethingsthatpeoplearelisteningwouldwanttoknowaboutthatmaybetheycouldworkonthemselves,whetherornotthey'releadingacompanyornot.

BlakeMycoskie: Sure.SooneofthefirstthingsIdidisIwenttothisamazingretreatcalledtheHoffmanInstitute.AndtheHoffmanInstituteis,theyhavetwofacilitiesintheUnitedStates,oneupinNapaandoneinConnecticut.Andwhattheyreallyfocusonisthesepatternsthatwedevelopasyoungpeopleasaresulttogaintheloveofourparents.Andweeitherareemulatingandmimickingcertainpatternsofourparentstogaintheirloveandattentionorwe'rerebellingagainsttogettheirloveandattention.

Butitallcomesdowntothatkindofcentralpremise.Butwhathappensisisthosepatternsendupgoverningandrulinganddictatingourlifemorethanourownfreewill.

DaveAsprey: Yes,absolutely.

BlakeMycoskie: Andthat'sahugething.Thecrazythingaboutitis,mywifewentfirstandittookmeacoupleofyears,eventhoughIsawsomereallypositivechangesandbenefitsinherlife,becauseIhadthislikekindofidealizedfamilyrelationshipwithmymomandmydad.WewerekindoftheBradyBunchandwegotalong.Myparentsweremarriedfor40plusyearsandIwaslike,"God,Iwasgivenalltheseopportunities,theyweresosupportiveofme.Therewasallthispositivestuff.Ican'timaginethinkingthatthere'spatternsinmylifethatareholdingmebackthatweredevelopedbecauseofmyparents."

Butwhatyoufindis,someofthethingsthathaveledtoyoursuccesstoday,areactuallyholdingyoubacktofurtherevolvinginthefuture.AndIdiscoveredalotaboutmyselfandIlearnedsomeamazingtoolstostayconnectedtothatandto

keepmyselffromkindofgoinginthesamecyclesthatwaskindofdictatingmylifeandIthinkmyconnectiontomy...Iwanttosayfreewill,becauseIalwaysfeltlikeIhadfreewill,butIwascompulsivelymakingdecisionsandactingcertainwaysbecauseIwasstilllivingasa12-year-old,versuslivingasa40-year-old.

Andindoingthatworkreallyhashadahugedifferenceinmybusiness,andinmyrelationships,anddefinitelyinmymarriage.

DaveAsprey: Ittakesalotofcouragetotalkaboutthat.AndI'mhopingthatoverthenextfewyearsthatthiswilljustbecomecommonknowledge.It'snotlikeanyofuschoosestorerunpatternsfromourchildhood,theyrunbeforeyouhavethechancetonoticethem.Sothey'resortofinvisible.Andeveryoneofmyfavoriteentrepreneurs,likepeoplewhoarebuildingcompaniesbutpeopletheyalsowanttospendtimewith,they'veallsomehowchanceduponthatknowledgelike,"MaybeIcouldworkonthat,"andthere'smanydifferentpaths.

Andthatis,Ithink,iswhatmakesthemfantasticleadersversusthereareleaderswhoarefearbasedandcrack-the-whipkindofpeople,butnoonewantstohangoutwiththem.

BlakeMycoskie: No.AndIthinkalsowhathappenedformeis,Ibecamealotlessreactive.OneofthecyclesthatIfoundinmybusinesslifethatI'mhappytoshare,Icamefromhispersonalwork,waswhatIwoulddois,Iwouldworkincrediblyhard,havetotunnelvision,dedicatemyentirelifeenergytothebusinessandintofurtheringthebusiness.Andthen,I'dbeensoexhaustedanddepleted,thatIwouldalmostresentthebusinessforwhatIhadgiventoit.AndsothenIwould,luckilybecausewehadhadsuccessandIhadgreatpeoplearoundme,Iwouldtotallycheckout.

LikeIwouldgosomewhereforamonthortwo,andjustlikenoemail,nophone.ThisisBlaketime,Igottoclaimmyfreedomback.Andsothenwhatwouldhappenis,afteramonthortwoofbeingsomewhereandtotallycheckedout,IwasstartingtofeelguiltythatIwasn'tputtingenoughtimetothebusiness.AndsoI'dcomebackintothecompany,talkaboutadisruptivefounder,I'dcomebackintothecompanywithlikethinkingIhadtohavethesilverbullettosolvewhatevertheissueatthetimewas,andthenthewholecyclewouldstartagain.

Andsonow,Itakealotoftimeoffinthesummers,IspentalottimeWyomingwithmyfamily.Butinsteadoflikecheckingout,likeIwouldhavedonebeforeIdidthiswork,Iactuallyworkacoupleofhourseveryday.AndsoeventhoughtechnicallyI'monkindofsummertimewiththefamily,I'mstayingengaged,I'mworkingwithpeople,andthenwhenIcomebackinSeptember,it'snotlikeatidalwaveiscomingback.It'sjustlike,ohtheyseememoreinthephysicalforminsteadofonSkype,oronthisrobotonastickthatIusetogoaroundtheoffice.

DaveAsprey: Youhaveoneofthose?Idotoo.

BlakeMycoskie: It'samazing.CalledDouble,doyouuseit?

DaveAsprey: Mineisn'tcalledDouble.I'mforgettingwhatthename...Beam.Mine'scalledaBeam.It'slikealittleface.

BlakeMycoskie: It'slikeaSegwayonastick,andthenithaslikeaniPad.

DaveAsprey: Withyourface.Asimilaridea.

BlakeMycoskie: Samething.SoIusethatalotinthesummertimetostayinmeetingsandstayconnected.Butthatwasareallyinterestingthingofunderstandingthatthatkindofneedingtobethesavior,needingtobethecenterofattentionledmetothisthingwhereIwaslikeallin.AndIwasjustlike100%committedandthenIwasallout,versusmoreconstantconnectedroletothecompany.AndnowIfeelmuch,muchworseeven.AndthathashelpedalotofthingsnotjustinthebusinessofTOMS,butalsojustinmypersonallife.

DaveAsprey: AndwhatbroughtthatawarenesstoyouwasgoingthroughtheHoffmanprocess?

BlakeMycoskie: Yeah,goingthroughtheHoffmanProcess,becausepartofwhatyou'redoingisnotonlyidentifyingpatternsthatarecausingthiscompulsivebehavior.Butalsokindofmorelike,whatthosepatternsleadtointermsofcyclesthatultimatelyleaveyoufeelingdepleted.

DaveAsprey: WhenIfiguredoutthepatternsthathaddrivenalotofmysuccess,inanotsopositiveway,IactuallyhadalotofguiltwhereIwaslike,"GoodGod,howcouldnothowcouldIhaveallowedmyselftolikegoanactlikeanassholeallthetimewithoutknowingit?"Didyoudealwithanyofthat,you'relike,"OhmyGod,Ican'tbelieveIwasdoingthat?"Orwasyourself-forgivenesskindofbuiltintothat?

BlakeMycoskie: Ithinkthethingthatwasthemostinterestingtomewasthispatternorthisthingaroundidentitycreation.whenIwas13,14yearsold,Iwasreallygoodtennisplayer,andoneofthebettertennisplayersinthestate,andprobablythebesttennisplayerinmyneighborhood.Andso,IquicklyformedanidentityasBlakethisgreattennisplayer,whichwasverydifferent.IgrewupinTexas,wheremostguyswerefootballplayersorbasketballplayers.SoIwasalreadyalittledifferentbecauseIplayedtennis.ButthenbecauseIwasareallygoodtennisplayer,itwasasenseofidentity.

Andthenthatledthroughcollege,untilthenmestartingmyfirstbusiness.Andthenat19,Ibecameknownasayoungentrepreneur.Andsoformy20sandeveninmyearly30s,Idon'tknowwhenyoustopbeingayoungentrepreneur,justanentrepreneur,Istillcursethatday-Ireallylikedwhenpeoplereferenced

tomeasayoungentrepreneur.Thatwasahugepartofmyidentity.AndthenwhenIstartedTOMS,itwasthesocialentrepreneur.Anditwaslike,"Wow,thispersonisredefininghowbusinesscanplayaroleinimprovingsocietyanddealingwithissuesandthingsthatareimportantbeyondjustmakingmoney."

AndsowhatIrealizedwas,Ihadbeenchasing,anditwasreallyimportantformetobehavingthesereallytightlydefinedidentitiesthatalsoledtoalotofattention.Andso,IwascomfortablewhenIhadalotofattention.OneofthethingsthatIdidn'trealizeIdidn'treallylikeaboutmyselfwaslike,Idon'twanttobethepersonthatneedsattention.I'vebeenatdinnerpartieswiththatpersonatthetable,andthatpersonisobnoxious.IfI'mdoingthingsthatarecausingpeopletogivememoreattention,andmypatternsandmylifeiskindofbeingdirectedtowardsdoingthingsthatdrivemoreattentionmyway,itjustdidn'tfeelgood.

Thatwasareallyeyeopeningandliberatingfeelingbecausenow,Istillstrugglewithpatternsofcourse,butIcatchmyselfandI'mlike,"AmIdoingthisbecauseIreallywanttodothisandthisismyauthenticself,oramIjustdoingthistogetattention?"BecauseifI'mdoingtogetattention,I'mjustthemonkeytherenotincontrolofthewayI'mliving.Andithashadanimpact,andIthinkitmakesmejustmorepresent,moreawareandinallaspectsofmylife.

DaveAsprey: Allright.Doyoumeditate?

BlakeMycoskie: Ido.Ido.IwishImeditatedmore.IstarteddoingTMaboutfouryearsago,that'stranscendentalmeditationforanyonelisteningdoesn'tknowwhatTMis.IhadtriedseveraldifferenttypesofmeditationbeforethatandwhatIfoundaboutTMisthatit'suttersimplicitywaseffectiveformeandtheideaofhavingamantrathatiskindofasoundfeelingorvibrationandallowingyourmindtogothereversusliketryingtocontrolyourmindtonotthinkofthingsortothinkofsomethingorconstructsomething.Forme,itwasamuchmorecalmingformofmeditation.

TheTMkindofworldwouldsaymeditatetwiceaday,I'mdoingprettygoodifIgetfivemorningsaweek.LikeifIgetfiveoutofsevenmorningsaweekfor20minutes,IfeellikeI'minthemeditativezoneandit'shavingapositiveimpactonmylife.AsIthinkaboutthenexttwomonths,thatI'mgoingtostayhomeinthehouseandtakeapaternityleave,withournewdaughtercoming.I'mcurioustoseeifIcangetonceinthemorning,andonceintheeveningwhenthebabyandmommyaresleeping.

I'mgoingtotrytomeditatemore,that'soneofmyintentionsforthenexttwomonths,andseeifitfeelsdifferentthanmyfivemorningsaweekrightnow.Butforaboutfouryearsnow,I'vebeenprettyconsistentwithfivemorningsaweek.

DaveAsprey: Nice.Iwishyouluckonbecomingamoreadvancedmeditator,asabrand-newdad.Thisisyoursecondchild.

BlakeMycoskie: Iknow.I'malwaysoptimisticandusuallynaïve.Sowe'llsee.

DaveAsprey: Ijusthadtorunanexperimentwith“TheBulletproofDiet”whenIwasstilltestingthingsout,andIstartedthatexperimentthatdaymyson,mysecondchildwasborn,becauseIknewthatIwasn'tgoingtogetafullnight'ssleepforalongtime,I'llsleepfivehoursorlesspernightbydesignsinceI'dprobablywouldhavesleptanyway.AndthenI'lladdabunchofcalories,andlookatwhathappens,andallthiskindofstuff.Anditwaskindoffunny,becauseitstarteddoingreallywellbutIcan'tsaythatIadvancedmymeditationpracticeorthatIwasaparticularly...

Iguessitwasaproductivetimeforme,andIwasworkingIstartedBulletproofbutatthesametime,itwasitwassortoflikeit'salwaysdisruptiveinpartofmeditationis20minutesofnodisruption,eventhoughitfeelslikethere'salotofunpredictability.Soyoumaymanagethatreallywell,infactIsuspectyouwill,butthattypeofunpredictability,howdoyoudeal...ThatisamicroexamplejustbecauseIwantedtomeditate,I'mnotgoingtogetto...Howdoyoudealwithbiggerandpredictablethings?Whathappenstoyouemotionallywhenyouexpectedthingstogothisway,whetherit'sbusinesswiseorpersonalwiseandtheyjustcompletelydon'tgothatway?Whatisyourinnerresponse?Howdoyoudealwiththatsituation?

BlakeMycoskie: It'sinteresting.IthinkitleadsbackalittlebittomeditationandI'llshowyouhowIgetthere,isthatIfeelthatIambetter,capableandpreparedtodealwithunpredictabilityandjust,I'llevensaythingsgoingnotmyway,whenIhavecertainthingsinmylifethatIdohavecontrolover.Soforinstance,abouttwoyearsagowhenIwas39,IdecidedthatIwasgoingtogetinthebestshapeofmylifebythetimeIturned40,upuntilthatpointforlikethelastdecadeofbuildingTOMS,Iwasworkingcrazyhours,Iwasnoteatingverywell.AndIdefinitelyhadlostmyathleticabilityandfitnesslevelthatIoncehad,whenIwasplayingcollegetennis.

Nothavingcontroloverthat,Ithinkwascreatinganxietyaroundotherthingsofmylife.Andthenwhenthingswerefurtherunpredictable,Ididn'thavesomethingIcouldgobacktotogetthatcontrolorthatpredictability.Sobytakingmydietandmyfitnessseriouslyandgettinginthebestshapeofmylife,whichIhavecontinuedtobeandsincethen,fornowalmostayearandahalf,itallowsmetobemorecomfortablewithunpredictabilityintherestofmythings.Iwaslike

Itallowsmetobemorecomfortablewithunpredictabilitytherestofmythings,aslike,”IknowI'mgoingtogetmymorningworkoutin,andI'mgoingtoeathealthymealssoIhavesustainedenergythroughtheday.”So,whenthingsdon'tgoasIwant,atleastIhavealittlebitofsenseofcontrolofmyschedule,andofmytime,andmypersonalwell-being,andso,Ithinkitjustallowsme,equipsmetobemoreopentothingsnotgoingmyway.Doesthatmakesense?Idon'tknowifIexplainedthatverywell.

DaveAsprey: Yeah.IthinkIgottoit,you’rebasicallysaying,“I’vegotcontrolofmybodynow,thereforeatleastIhavethat,evenifIdon'tcontrolsomethingelse,"youstillhavethatleveloflike,Idon'thaveanti–anxietyorjustthatlevelofcalmnessthatcomesfromlike,“I'vegotsomethinganyway.”

BlakeMycoskie: Exactly,andIthinkthat'swhereitalsogoesbacktomeditation.Whereifyouhaveameditationpractice,thenyouknowthatyou'regoingtogetatleast20minutesadaythat'sjustforyou,yourtimenow,hopefullyyou’llchoosetherighttimesoyoudon'tgetinterrupted.Butintheory,ifyoucanfindthattime,thenitgivesyouasenseofempowerment,sothatwhenthingsdon'tgoyourwayoryoudogetinterrupted,youfeellikeyoualreadykindofcheckedoffoneofyourneeds.

I’vegottenthatreally...It'sfunny,mywifeandIareverydifferentinouractivitylevelneeds,IneedliterallytoburnenergyanduntilIburnthatenergy,Ihavelikeasenseoflike“I'mrevving,revving.”Andifyou'rearoundmethatcanstarttogetannoyingandIcangetannoyed,becauseIhaven'tgottenthatenergyout.So,wediscoveredinourrelationshipthatshedoesn'tliketogetupparticularlyearlyandIdon'tmindgetupatfive,fivethirty.

So,ifIgoandjustcrankaworkout,orsurfsessionin,orrockclimbinginthesummertime,fromlikesixtoeight,evenbeforeourkidsgetup,I'mactuallyreallypleasant,andI'mreallychillfromeighttoeleven,whenwehavebreakfast,whenItakethekids...I'vealreadytakencareofsomethingandI'vekindofexpendedenergy.ButifIhaven'tdonethat,andthenI'mgoingintomyday,andI’mstillhavingthatkindoflike,“Ineedtogetthisout,”Andthenallofthesethingshappeninmydaythatgivemenocontrolofmyday,thenitcanputmeinafunk.

DaveAsprey: It'sreallycoolthatyousaidthat'swhatworksforyou,Iseesomanypeoplearelike,“Well,thispersondoesthat,soI'mgoingtogodoit.”AndIknowsomepeoplewhoarewiredthewayyouare,andIknowotherswhoarelike,”ifIhadtodothateveryday,Iwouldhatemylife.”So,howdidyoudiscoverthisworkedforyouversussomeotherthingthatmightnotworkforyou?

BlakeMycoskie: Ithinkthatgoesthroughalotofwhatyou'vewrittenaboutinHeadstrong,inotherpodcaststhatI'velistenedtothatyou'vedone,it'sallaboutexperimentation.

DaveAsprey: Justbytestingit.

BlakeMycoskie: Yeah.It'sreallyabouttesting.Ithinkit’slike,youdosomethingforaweekortwo,howareyoufeeling?Youdosomething...it'sgreattogetknowledgeandlearnfromotherexamplesandtoreadbooksandlistento...Iloveinformation,Ilovenewideas,butultimately,ithastoworkforyou.SomethingI'verecentlylearnedinmyworkingout,isthatIwasover-training.

DaveAsprey: Iwasabouttoaskyouaboutthat,beautiful...

BlakeMycoskie: IgottoapointtowhereIwasactuallyfeelinglikeIwasn'tasvibrantandasexcitedforthesemorningworkouts,andIgottoapointwhereIwaslike,“IthinkI'mjustworkingouttoomuch.”So,Icutitbacktolikereallyjusttwohardsessionsaweek,andI'mreallylookingforwardtothosesessionsnow,IfeellikeI'mgetting...I'mkeepingthesameleveloffitnessifnotgettingstronger,andI'mtraininghalfasmuch.So,that'ssomethingthat,noonecouldhaveprescribedthattome,Ihadtobelisteningandintuneinwithmybodyandmyself,inordertoknowthatandtonoticethat.

DaveAsprey: Ithinkyou’vejusthelpedalotofpeoplebytalkingaboutthat,becauseI'veseenthisoverandoverwithlikehighperformingCEOtypes,I'vedonealotofcoachingalthoughlatelywithBulletproofRadio,isI'mnotdoingasmuchcoaching,butIstilldoit,likewithneurofeedbackstuffandall,anditseemslikeit'saguythingmostly,andlike,“Okay,I'mrunningacompany,I'mdoingwell,andI'mgoingtobeanIronmantriathlete,andI'mgoingtoflyaroundtheworldtodoallthesethings.”

Andit'slikerecoverybecomesthebigvariable,nothowhardcanyoupushyourself,becauselikewe'rewiredtopushourselvesespeciallywhenthere'samission,whichyouclearlyhave.So,yourecognizedjustyoufeltthat...Didnotmeasureheartratevariability,oranyofthosethingslikethat,orsexhormones,ortestosteronelevelsdroppingoryouwerejustlike,“Idon'thavethatzestIusedtohave.”

BlakeMycoskie: Yeah.Iknow.It'smoreofjustanintuitivefeelingthatIwasn'tfullyrecoveredbythetimeIwasgoingbackintothegym,orintothenextworkout,orIwassurfingtoomanydaysinarowinthemorning.

DaveAsprey: Istheresuchathing?

BlakeMycoskie: Thereis.Yourshouldersgettired,yougetexhausted,andyou'redoingitoutofhabit,andnotoutofreallylisteningtoyourbody,whereyourbodyissaying,"God,really,justsitandhaveanicecupofcoffeeandmaybereadabookthismorning."It'sfunny,oneofthethingsthatI'vereallybeenworkingon,goingbacktothepersonaldevelopmentislike,justgettingbetteratsitting,beingreallycomfortableatsitting,likewatchingmysonplayintheyard,andnotfeelingtheurgetodoanything,butjustbesittingthere.IthinkthatisaschallengingassomeoftheathleticpursuitsI'vehadovertheyears.

DaveAsprey: Well,that'sbasicallyanotherformofmeditation,itisjustpracticingawareness.

BlakeMycoskie: Yeah,absolutely.

DaveAsprey: Ithinkthat'schallengingforalmosteveryCEO,andjustforalotofpeopleingeneralnow,partlybecauseofFacebookandeverythingelse.Butyoucan

alwaysbedoingsomething,andthat'smaybeanareawhereI'mcapableofthat,butI'mnotsurethatIwouldchoosetodothat,givenachoice.Atleastit'sachoiceversusanautomaticbehaviorfornow,becauseyou'rerealizing,“Okay,IfeeltheurgetodothisbutI'mchoosingtodosomethingelse,”andthenyoufeellikeyou'vegotthecontrolthere.

BlakeMycoskie: Yeah.Ithinkitallgoesbacktoifyou'retakingcareofyourself,ifyou'regettingthesebasickindofchecklistofthingsthatallowyoutolivewiththemostenergyandawareness,thenthesethingsareeasiertodo.Andthenwhenyourworldstartsspinningoutofcontrolandyoudon'tfeellikeyouhavethatcontrol,thenit'shardertobepresentandtosit,andtodothesethings.

DaveAsprey: So,didyouhirelikeapersonaltrainer,andapersonalchef,andanutritionist,andamassagetherapist,anarmy,anentourageofpeopletolikehelpgetinthebestshapeofyourlife?Howdidyougoaboutdoingthat?

BlakeMycoskie: No.I'veactuallyjustbeenslowlybutsurelyaddingthosepeopleintomylife,butno,Ioriginallywasjustreallyworkingwiththetrainer.Thatwasthemainthing,havingtheknowledgethatIwasgettingthemostoutoftheamountoftimethatIhadtocommittothat.Ithinkfromadietstandpoint,itwasreallyjustmainlycuttingoutsugarandalotofsenselesscarbs,formethatwas...Onceagain,everyone'sdifferent.Butforme,itwasrecognizingthatbycuttingoutalotofsenselesscarbs,andalsoalmostallsugar,theweightandthebodyfatjustfelloff.

DaveAsprey: Nice.Thatseemssohardforalotofpeople,butthere'ssomepeoplewhoseemtoneedtheircarbs,right?

BlakeMycoskie: Absolutely.

DaveAsprey: So,thisisanothercaseof,“Don'tdowhatworkedforme,dowhatworksforyou.”

BlakeMycoskie: Absolutely.

DaveAsprey: Goodadvice.Nowlet'stalkalittlebitaboutyoursenseofmissionbecausethat'ssomethingthatreallystruckmewhenwefirstmet,likeyougenuinelylovewhatyou'redoing,whydidyoupickthismission?

BlakeMycoskie: It'sinteresting,peopleaskmeallthetime,likethere'salltheseproblemsintheworld,howdidyoudecidethatyouwantedtohelpgivekidsshoes?AndI'malwayssaying,“Ididnotchooseshoes,Ifeellikeshoeskindofchosemeinaway,”becauseIwasdowninArgentinaandIwasn'tlookingtostartanonprofit,orwasn’tlookingtostartasocialenterprise,Iwasn'tlookingtodoanythinglikethat.Iwasjustonvacation,andnoticedthattherewerelotsofkidsinthestreetthatweren'tinschool,thatdidn'thaveshoes,andmetsomepeoplethatwereworkingatanonprofit,thatwerehelpinggetkidsshoes.

Therewasaserendipitousseriesofeventsthatledtothis.Whatseemedlikeaverysimpleideathereislike,"Man,there'salotofpeopleintheworldthatliterallydon'thaveshoesthatneedthem."Andthere'salotofpeopleintheworldbuyingshoeseverydaybecausetheyjustwantthem.So,ifyoucantakewhatsomeonewants,andprovidewithsomethingsomeoneneeds,thatwouldbeareallycoolvalueexchangeintheworldofbusiness.

Andthisis2006,whenthiswasnothappening.Andso,whatIgotexcitedaboutinkindofwhatbecameTOMS,wasjustkindof,Ithinkitwasthatrebelliousspiritinmeofwantingtodosomethingdifferentthanjuststartinganotherbusiness.Andso,Igotveryexcitedaboutusingbusinesstohelppeople,andatthesametimecreateasuccessfulbusiness.Andso,themissionofTOMS,ofwhatwecallusingbusinesstoimprovelives,andtheoneforonemodelofbuyapairofourshoesandwegiveapair,thatverymuchcameoutofaverysimpleideaandobservation.

Anditwasn'tlikeabigelaboratekindofplan,orIdidn'thaveanybackgroundinlikepublichealth,orIdefinitelyhadn'tbeeninvolvedincharitiesbefore.So,itreallywassomethingthatveryorganicallygrewoutofaseriesofobservationsandkindofpiecesthatIputtogether.Havingsaidthat,asTOMSstartedtogrow,asothercompaniesstarttoouremulateoneforonemodel,asIgotkindofputonthispedestaloflikesocialentrepreneurs,andthatwaskindofcategoryofbeingdefinedbysomeoftheactionsthatIwastakingorthebookIwrote,orwhatever.ThenIstartedtounderstandthisideaofmissiononamuchmorekindofmacrostandpointoflike,“Okay,I'vebeengiventhesegiftsandbyusingtheseentrepreneurialgifts,IcannotonlyimprovethelivesofpeoplewhoIwillnevermeet,butIalsocanhopefullyinfluencealotofpeoplethatIdomeet,ordogettolistentomespeakingataconferenceoranarticlethatI'vewritten."

Andifthosepeopletakethatinformationandstartbusinessesthatimprovepeople'slives,thentheimpactisexponential.Andso,whatkindofgetsmemostexcitedtodayisnotjusttheworkthatwe'redoingasTOMS,butwhatIcanhelpempower,inspireetc.,otherentrepreneurstodo,becauseItrulybelievethatbusinesscanbeaforceforgood.Andthemorethatwethinkofitthatway,themoresuccessfulthebusinessis,becausethere'salwaysvaluestohavingabusinessledbyamissionfromaprofitperspective,andfromanemployeeretentionperspective,andthecustomerloyaltyperspective.Butalsothatthisreallycanbetheanswertomanyofthesocialinjusticesandissuesthatwefaceinmoderntimes.

DaveAsprey: So,yousortoffounditanditjustresonatedwithyouandyouwentwithit.Andlatelythough,itseems,infact,notitseems,you'veannouncedeveryyearyou'repickinganewcause.Howdoyougoaboutpickinganewcausethat’sgoingtohavethemostimpact?

BlakeMycoskie: So,thisisagreatexampleofbeingamuchmore,Iwouldsay,awareorflexibleentrepreneurthanIusedtobe.SoIannouncedthatbackin2013or2014,we

haddoneshoes,wehaddoneeyewear,whereeverytimewesoldapairofsunglassesorprescriptionglasses,weeitherpaidforaneyesurgeryorgavesomeoneprescriptionglasses.Thenwelaunchedacoffeecompany,wherewewouldprovidecleanwaterwhenthecoffeethatweweresold,andthenthelastproductwedidwasbags,andwehadthissafebirthkit,thatwewoulddelivertowomenwhoweregivingbirthintheirhomes.

DaveAsprey: That’sthecoolestthingeverheard.Ilovedthatyoudidthat.

BlakeMycoskie: Thankyou.Anditwassofun,becausewhenweknewthattherewasanopportunitytosellbags,whenyousellshoesandeyewear,it'slikeanaccessorycompany.Itmadesensefromabusinessperspective,butwecouldn'tfigureoutwhattogive.AndthenwhenweranacrossthisworkthattheU.N.workersweredoingwithdeliveringthesesafebirthkits,whichreallyhelpedreduceinfantmortalitybyahugepercent,becauseitprovidedjustthebasicneedfromahygieneperspective,itwasreallybeautiful.

Wedidtheseseriesofproducts,andIwasencouragedtokeepondoingthem.AndthenwebroughtinaCEOofTOMS,andIsoldhalfthecompanytoaprivateequityfirm,andbroughtonapartner,andaswelookedatitlike,“Okay,let'sstopforasecondandlookattheTOMSbusiness.”BothourCEOandmynewpartnersaid,“Iactuallythinkwecandomoreimpactbyfocusingonlessthings.”Andasanentrepreneur,andassomeoneIknowyourselfaskindofaninventorlikeme,thatcouldhavegonereallybad.Butinstead,becauseIhaddonesomeworkonmyself,andIwasinaplacewhereIhadmoreawarenessofmystrengthsandweaknesses,Isaid,“Okay,I'mgoingtobecuriousaboutthis,sowhy?”

Andso,Iaskedallthequestionsandultimately,theywereabletoconvinceme,overwhelminglyconvincedmeandlike,“let'sreallyfocusonourshoes,oureyewear,ourcoffee,ourbags,andlet'snottrytolaunchsomethingneweveryyearbecausethatputssomuchstrainontheorganization,thatwe'renotabletofullycapitalizeontheproductsinthecategorieswe'rein.Anditconfusesourcustomer,becausetheyhaven'tevengotfullyintothenewproductyet.”

Andsowechangedthatstrategytwoyearsagoandit'sbeengreat,we'veseengrowthinalltheseothercategories,andIthinkit'sallowedustooperatewithmoreexcellencehereinthebuilding,andfranklyIfeellesspressurebecauseIdon'thavetocomeupwithsomethingneweveryyear.It’sactuallyworkedoutquitewell,butitwasdefinitelynotthepathIwouldhavetakenifIwasjustleftonmyown.Ithinkit'sbeenagoodexampleforthepeoplewho'vebeenwithmealongtimetoseehowI'veevolvedasaleader,andopentootherwaysofapproachingthegrowthofourbusiness.

DaveAsprey: Thefocusthingisn'tagoodachallengeforalotofentrepreneurialtypes,I'mgettingthisfrommyproductteamallthetime,I’mlike,“Let'sdoyouseethis,peoplewillloveit,itwillchangepeople'slives.”Andthey'relike,“Maybe,butnotnowbecauseifwedothat,we'renotgoingtokeepdoingwhatwe'redoing,

we'renotgoingtolaunchthelatestColdBreworwhatever.”Therearelimitsandlike,“Canwejusthiremorepeople?Weraiseventuremoney.”

Butthetruthisthat,evenifyoudoallthesethings,there'sthecustomerconfusion,andalsoyoucanonlyscaleacompanyatacertainspeedyouhirenewpeople,thenyoulosetheculture,ifyoutriplethesizeofthecompanyinthreemonths,howwouldyoudothat?So,yourownpathofawarenessledyoutobecoolwiththatconversationsaying,“Allright,Isaidwearegoingtodooneoftheseeveryyear,andnowI'mchangingthatdecision,andnowwe'regoingtostickwiththeoneswe'vegotandwe'regoingtodothosereallywell,andmaybedosomethinglater.”

BlakeMycoskie: Absolutely.AndIwasveryvocalinthemediaaboutthatkindofproclamationoflike,“Thisiswhatwe'reabout,we'retheoneforonecompany,onenewproducteveryyear.”Andsotokindofgobackand...Thatwasanidea,andwedecidedchangeourplans.Ittakesalevelofhumilityandopenness,butIthinkwitheachofthesethings,whichIthinkisalotofthethemeofthisdiscussion,isgetbacktowhatJohnMackeysaidlike,“Raisetheconsciousnessoftheleadersinthebusinessconsciousnessgoesupto.”

DaveAsprey: Howdoyoudealwithcritics?

BlakeMycoskie: That'ssomethingthatI'vedefinitelybeenajourneyforme,becauseIdidnotusedtodealwiththemverywell,andItookitverypersonallyatfirst,especiallybecauseintheearlydayswhenwefirsthadstartedinwas2006,thebusinessreallystartedgrowingin2008,2009,2010.I'dsay2011waswhenwestartedreallygettingcriticized,anditwascrazytome,becauseweweredoingsomuchmoreanddonatingahugepercentageofourrevenue,tryingtomaketheworldabetterplaceandimprovepeople'slives.

Andthenwehadpeopletalkingabouthowwe’regivingshoes,we'rejustonlycreatingdependencyissuesindevelopingcountries,orthatweweren'tcreatingenoughjobsinthecountriesandwewerejustgivingaid.Andsomeofthecriticism,inessence,fromapurelyintellectuallevelwascorrect.Butinapracticallevelitwaslike,“Okay,youshowmehowyoucanmakeafactoryinHaitiovernight?Itjustdoesn'thappen,"like“Theydon'tmakeshoesthere,theydon'thavetherawmaterials,theydon'thave..."It'seasytolobinthiscriticismfromsomewhereincyberspacethatIwouldtakesuperpersonally.

DaveAsprey: Didyoujustsaycyberspace?

BlakeMycoskie: Yeah.

DaveAsprey: It'sbecausewe’reover40,man…Ilovethat.

BlakeMycoskie: Butthat'swhereitcomesfromandso,Iwouldsaylike2010,2011,maybeevento12,Iwouldrespondbytakingitverypersonally,beingkindofhurt.AndthenI

recognizedthatyoucanlearnatleastthematically,youcanreallylearnfromcritics.So,Istartedreallyunderstandinglikewhereismostofcriticismcomingfromwithourmodel?Becauseit'saverysmallpercentageofpeople,butthey’reveryloud,andso,whataretheymostloudabout?Andisthereanythingthatwecandoasabusinesstoaddressit?

Andtheareathatweultimatelyreallydugintowasinjobcreation,I'manentrepreneur,Ilovehelpingcreatemoreentrepreneurs,andso,iftherewasawaytouseoursupplychainandourbusinessmodeltodomorelocalmanufacturinginthecountriesthatwe'regiving,thenIwasallin,philosophically,intellectually,butinpracticalitycouldwedoit?Andsowesetagoalofmaking30%ofallofourgivingshoes,withinthreeyears,inthecountriesthatwesellthemin.

Andweachievedthatgoal.So,Ithinkthatitisover40%today,andwemakeshoesinKenya,andwemakeshoesinEthiopia,andwemakeshoesinIndia,weusedtomakeshoesinHaiti,butthatultimatelydidn'tworkout.WestilldodesignofshoesinHaiti,anddoalotofartaroundtheshoesinHaiti,butnottheactualphysicalmanufacturing.Anditwassomethingtowear…oncewestoppedtryingtofightthecriticsordefendourposition,andwewereopeningtolisteningtoit,thatithelpedkindofgrowourbusinessandithelpeduswithaninsightaroundwhatourcustomerswerecaringthemostabout,andthatwasseeingthatcompanieswerehelpinginthejobcreationspace,indealingwithpovertyandnotjustinaidspace.

DaveAsprey: So,I'venoticedthattherearetwotypesofcriticsoutthere,thecriticswhoarelike,“Idon'tlikethisbecause...”Andthentheylistthingsthattheydon'tlike,thingsthattheythinkshouldbechangedandthengiveyouareason.Andthenthere'sanotherkindofcriticthatsays,“You'reainsertabunchofinsultshere,”becauseandmaybethey'rethesamepoint,maybethey'renottheotherpoint.Doyouseeadifferencebetweenthetwotypes?Anddoyoutreatthemdifferentlyfromabusinessperspective?

BlakeMycoskie: Ithinkthefirsttypeismoreconstructivebecauselike,“Idon'tlikethisbecause...”Andthere'salistofreasonsandyoucandisagree,andargue,anddebatethem.Whensomebodyislike,“Idon'tlikeyoubecause...”ThenIthinkit'smoreofapersonalattackandIdon'tknowreallywherethatleadsto,becausewearewhoweareandnoneofusareperfect.Andyoudon'tevenknowmereally,youdon'tlikethemediaversionofmerightnow.Ithinkthoseareeasierjusttodismissandtoignore,becausethey'rejustnotintellectuallystimulatingatall,there'snothingtodebate,Iguessthat'sthewayIlookatit.

DaveAsprey: So,thosedon'tpushyourbuttonsatall,because…

BlakeMycoskie: Notanymore.Imean,whenIwasyounger,ofcourse,theydid.

DaveAsprey: Yeah,samehere.Likethosecertainpartswerelike,“Okay,it'sallgoingbacktoseventhgrade.”Andthosepatternswetalkedaboutbefore.Ifeellikeit'smostlypeoplewhoareheavilybulliedlike,“I'mgoingtogetevennow,I'm50.”AndI’mlike,“Allright.”So,that'showyoudealwithcritics,andhowyoumakeyourdecisionmaking.Howdoyoukeepyourculturethatyou’veworkedsohardtobuildinthecompany?NowthatyouhaveaCEO,nowthatyou'vesoldhalfthecompanytoaPEfirm,whataretheactionsthatyoudotokeepyourenergyinthecompany?

BlakeMycoskie: Well,I'mreallyblessedbecauseunlikesomeentrepreneurs,Imean,youhearhorrorstorieswithbothprivateequityandCEOs,IhaveaCEOthatIfeelislikethegreatestpartnerI'veeverhad.Ifeelsoluckyinthat,webothhavedifferentskillsets,wecomplementeachotherwell,wehaveatonofrespect,whichIthinkisthenumberonethingthatyoumusthave.Andwealsospeakveryopenlytoeachotherwhenwedisagree,andinaveryconstructiveways.

Thatrelationshipisreallygreat.AndthesamethingwithmypartnersatBainCapital,whichisaPEfirmthatismypartner,wedon'talwaysagreeonthingsaslike,productsweshouldlauncheveryyear,butwereallyaresolutionorientedandwebothhavethemacrovisionabsolutelyshared,andthatistousebusinesstoimprovelives,tocontinuetogrowTOMSintoahighlyprofitablebusinessthatalsohelpsatonofpeople.Andwhenyoukindofagreeonthebigthings,thelittlethingskindofworkthemselvesout.

So,yes,IthinkthatI'minasituationwhereIhavereallygreatsupportaroundme.Nowhowdoyoukeeptheculture?Ithinkcultureissuchaninterestingthing.WhatIfoundis,there'salotofthingsyoucandothatyouthinkhelpculture,andtherearesomereallysurfacethingsthatIkindofhavefallenintothetrapofthinkinglike,“Oh,we'regoingtohavehappyhoureveryFriday,orwe'regoingtodo...we'regoingtoputagyminandofferwellnessclasses.”Thoseareperks,thosearen’tculture,andcultureactuallyishealthiestwhenyouhaveaclearvisionofwhatyou'retryingtoaccomplish,andthevisionmatterstopeople.

Actuallythebestwaytohavecultureistohaveareallyclearstrategythat’sworking,becausepeoplefeelreallygoodwhenthey'recomingtoworkeveryday,andit'sclearwhattheyneedtoaccomplish,andthey'regiventhetoolsandtheempowermenttodoso,andthey'regoingandthey’rekickingass.Theylovetheirjobs,theythinkthatcultureisamazing.Theminutethatstuffisn'tclear,andwe'vehadmanytimesatTOMSthat’snotclearandIguaranteerightnowthere'sprobably,Idon'tknow,10%,15%ofourstaffthatsaysit'snotclearforsure,soit'sneverperfect,butthattomeiswhatcultureis.

Cultureactuallyis,everyonewithasharedvision,workinghardandfeelingempoweredtodoso,andaccomplishingwhateveritisyourcompanyisaccomplishing,whetherit'smissionbasedornot.Ithinkyoucanhavegreatcultureandprobablybeanevilcompanybecauseeveryoneisthereforthesamereason,tocreateevil.It'sreallyinteresting,IthinkI'velearnedalotof

thingsyouthinkareincreasingorimprovingyourculture,arethesekindofsurfacethingsthatsoundfunandthatyoudo,andyeah,they'reniceperks.Butunlessthestrategyisclearandtheempowermentisthere,noneofthosethingswillmakeupforthelackofculturethatyoucouldhave.

DaveAsprey: Nice.Bythewayifyou'relisteningtothis,youcantellthatI'mpickingBlake'smindaboutthisstuff,becauseI'manentrepreneurwhohasn'tdoneasmuchashehasso,youcanseeI'mgettingmylittlelessonshererightnow.So,thanksforthat!

BlakeMycoskie: Whatevercanhelp!I'vegottensomanypeoplehelpingme,that'sforsure.

DaveAsprey: It'sprettyamazinghowpeoplestepuptohelpwhentheythinkyou'redoinggoodstuff.Now,we'recomingupontheendoftheshow,andI'mlookingforwardtoaskingyouthequestionI'veaskedeveryguestontheshow,whichisthat,ifsomeonecametoyoutomorrowBlake,andsay,“Look,IwanttoperformbettertoeverythingIdoasahumanbeing,notjustmywork,notjustsports,butjustmywholelife.”Whatarethethreemostimportantpieceofadviceyouwouldhaveforthem?

BlakeMycoskie: It'ssuchagoodquestion.Okay.So,thefirstthingIwouldsay,createaverysimpledailygratitudepractice.Like,handsdown,spendingfiveminutesinthemorning,fiveminutesintheevening,writinginajournalallthethingsyou'regratefulfor,isprobablythemosteffectivethingI'vedonetomanagemystresslevel,myclarityofthought,myenergy,myattitude,everything.There'ssomething,Idon'tknowifit'sproveninscienceornot,butwhenyou'regrateful,it'sreallyhardtobenegative,ordepressed,orwhateveryouwanttoaddinthere.

DaveAsprey: Youcanseeinyourbrainwaves,gratitudeisreal.

BlakeMycoskie: Yes.GratitudeissuperrealandIthinkintermsofhighperforming,youfindpeoplewhoarehighperformers,they'regratefulpeople,andthemoreopportunitiesputinyourdaytoexpressgratitudetoothers,themoreoxytocinthat'screated,themorealiveyoufeel.So,that'snumberone.

Numbertwois,drinkmorewater.Itsoundssupersimple,butinthislastyear,Ihavereallymadeitapracticetodrinkatonofwater,makesureyougetsomeHimalayanseasaltinthereaswell,sothere'ssomeelectrolytes,becauseyoucan’tdrinktoomuchwater.Butfindoutwhattherightamountforyouis.

Onceagain,thatthemeisgoingthroughthisshow,butjustdrinkingwateralldaylong,nowyouwillhavetopeemore,andthathassomeinconvenience,especiallyifyouhavealongcommute.ButIreallyhavefounditincreasesmyenergylevelinahugeway,Ifeellikeeverythingisworkingbetterinmybodyandit'ssuchasimplething,butit'sahabitthatyouhavetocreate,ittakesawhilelikeyouhavetogetusedtoitliketocarryingthatNalgenebottle

everywhereyougo,startingeverymeetingwithofferingpeoplewater,fillingyourwaterup.Ifoundthatthishasnotbeenahabitthatjusthappenautomaticallybutithastakensomework.ButnowthatIthinkit'sfullyingrained,I'mdefinitelyperformingbetteratkindofeveryaspectofmylife,bysimplydrinkingwater.

OK,sothosearetwothatjustimmediatelypoptomind.Athirdone,man,I'mtryingtothink.Ithinkthethirdonewouldbesettinggoals,butreallypubliclyannouncingthemsoyouhaveaccountability.Ithinkalotofpeoplesetgoals,andIusedtowritegoalsinmyjournalsallthetime.ButIthinkIstartedaccomplishingmygoals,andsomepeoplecallthismanifestation,andIstartedmanifestingthingsthatIwantedtohavehappeninmylife.ThemoreIwasnotafraidofsharingthemwithlovedones,onsocialmedia,withmycoworkersbecauseonceIsharedthem,thelikelihoodofmestickingtoitwentupexponentially.

Becausepeoplewouldaskmeabout,"Howareyoudoingonthatgoal?"SolikewhenIsaidI'mgoingtogetinthebestofmylifebythetimeIturn40,Itoldeverysinglepersonthat.Likeifyouwenttodinnerwithmelike,"Whathaveyoubeenupto?""Well,guesswhat,I'mgoingtogetinthebestshapeofmylifebythetimeIturn40."IfIwasreconnectingwithsomeoneIhadn'tseeninawhile,"Well,whathaveyoubeenupto?""Well,I'mdoingthis."Ijustkepttellingpeoplethatandthenenoughpeoplekeptasking,"Well,how'sitgoingisgoing,isitworking?Whatareyoudoing?"Andthenitjustbecameapartofmyidentityinasense,anditledmetoactuallyachieveit.

AndIthinkthatthereisalotofpowerinthepersonalaccountability,andfranklyIthinkthisisapositiveofsocialmedia,isit'sveryeasytogetpeopletotrackyourprogressandtokeepyouaccountablewhenyousayyou'regoingtodosomethingtoallofyourfriendsandfollowersonline.Ithinkintermsofreallylookingatperformance,beinggrateful,drinkingwaterandthensettinggoalspubliclyisagreatwaytoperformbetter.

DaveAsprey: You'rebasicallyoutsourcingaccountabilityforyourgoals.

BlakeMycoskie: Yeah.It'ssuperimportant.

DaveAsprey: OrCrowdsourcingIguess.

BlakeMycoskie: Crowdsourcingprobablymorethanoutsourcing,yeah.

DaveAsprey: Ilikethat.That'ssocool.Idon'tthinkthat'sananswerI'veheardbeforeeither,whichiskindofcool.Youmightbethesecondpersontosaydrinkwater,whichiskindofcooltoo.Prettyunusualstuff.Blake,it'sbeenagreatpleasuretohaveyouonBulletproofRadioandthanksforhavingmehereatTOMSheadquarters.

BlakeMycoskie: Great.ThankyousomuchDave.Appreciate.

DaveAsprey: Ifyou'dliketoday'sepisode,yougooutandpickupapairofTOMSshoesandwhenyoudothat,anotherpersonsomewherewhoreallyneedsshoesisgoingtogetapairandIthinkthat'sawesome.Haveanawesomeday.Ifyoulikethisepisode,youknowwhattodo,besidesgettingsomeTOMSshoes,headonovertoiTunes,gotobulletproof.com/iTunesandleaveareview.

Youjusthadgratitude,oneofthosethingsyoucando,whenyouleavereviewforthis,it'sawayofexpressinggratitudesoyouwinandotherpeoplewhofindtheshowalsowin.Sothanksfortakingthatmaybe20secondstodothat.