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Talking out loud Islam needs a rebootByAhson Saeed HasanPublished: November 14, 2014

At the very out set, let me cla rif y tha t I am neit her a reli gio us schola r nor do I have

disciplined knowledge about theMuslim faith. The views expressed in this article are

purely based on the perspective that one has developed over the course of the past

many years. This is by no means a critique of a faith that millions of folks all over the

worl d foll ow.

To begin with, as paradoxical and contradictory it may sound, amidst all this opulent

irreverence, the Muslims claim that there is a back-to-religion movement the world over, as

a reaction to the incessant indulgence in pleasures of the flesh or maybe as a refuge from the

feeling of emptiness it leaves within. The religion is attracting more adherents compared to

other faiths. Interestingly, many of the new converts and the not-so-happy Muslims are keen

to find out for themselves how the old faithful are handling their religious commitments.

What is attracting them to Islam is its claimthat it abhors rituals like the ones elaborated bythe Catholic Churchor the ceremonials adopted by the Brahmin to elevate himself into a

superior caste.

The religion is based on a complete code of life combining the spiritual with the temporal. But

what is offering the greatest attraction to the common folk? To theAfro-Americans, in

particular is Islams stern repudiation and rejection of any distinction of race, colour, caste or

social standing.

The outsidersquest for true Islam should induce the followers of the faith to re-examine

themselves and to see if they are repelling and driving away the new converts or helping them

consolidate their faith. Some tough questions, therefore, need to be answered and a minute

soul-searching is called for.

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The Muslim holy site of the Dome of the Rock on the Al Aqsa mosque compound in the Old City of Jerusalem. PHOTO: AFP

The first point we have to bear in mind is that more mosques do not necessarily mean more

Islamor greater compliance with the Islamic code of life. If that were true, the estimated five-

fold increasein the number of mosques across the land since the establishment of a country

like Pakistan should have resulted in evidence of more devotion, piety and piousness.

Unfortunately, that has not happened.

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If anything, there has been a terrible deterioration in the overall national character, which

includes religious intolerance, hatred amongst various sects of Muslims, and a virtual

nullification of the good and the virtuous.

It is indeed reprehensible, and Muslims will have to admit, that today they have more of

dishonesty and debauchery, and more of normal failings than ever before. The worst of it is

the insensitivity toward other religions and disrespect for those who do not qualify to be

regarded as Muslims. What ISISdemonstrates, therefore, is an absolute brutal

decline/downfall in the fortunes of Muslims the world over.

Muslims need to look into the phenomenon more closely without inventing excuses or shifting

blame. There are, undoubtedly, economic forces that are grinding the followers of Islam down

to desperation and there also is the communication revolution that provides a vision of a morecolourful life in the hereafter, all have contributed to the quandary, to the situation in which

Muslims find themselves today.

Worst of all, Muslim religious divines, instead of rebuilding/reconstructing the overall Islamic

character, are busy brainwashing the young for wagingjihadon the Jews and the Christians.

This begs the question:what has Islam done to save Muslims from this disastrous fate?

The answer is to be found in separating the spiritual from the temporal in flagrant

renunciation of one of the basic principles of the Muslim faith namely that Islam is a

complete, indivisible code of conduct. Muslims seem to have split between Christ and Caesar.

Furthermore, this state of affairs points to the inadequacy of the sort of religious teaching thatinduces compliance with its tenets. Learning the Holy Quran by heart or reciting it with

fervour is hugely commendable. But the real benefit accrues only from a comprehension of

the crux of Gods message. Most khateebs(Muslim religious scholars) in their sermons tend to

dwell on the supernatural and the far-fetched, and try to regulate the lives of their followers

with stories they think will excite and hold their interest, while others seek to enhance their

popularity by arousing sentiments on parochial sectarian/religious issues.

It is difficult to figure out how much of it is prompted by ulterior, materialistic motives.

The first fault can possibly be easily remedied by convincing the khateebsthat what the

Muslim society needs most today is convincing the followers that observance ofHaqooqul

Abad(rights of the people) is at least as important asHaqooq-Allah(rights of God), if not

more that is to say, while God might condone missing a prayer or two (out of the fivemandatory ones during the course of the day), He will not forgive any wrongs to our fellow

human beings, irrespective of their race, creed or religion.

On a larger scale, suicide bombings are not allowed taking away innocent lives in the name

of God is absolutely a no-go area crashing planes into buildings and playing havoc with other

nations integrity in order to teach them a lesson is perhaps the most intrusive form of

recklessness that characterises modern-day Islam.

The khateebswill be doing a greater service to the society and Islam by driving home these

points related to everyday life and, in the meantime, refrain from entertaining their

listeners/followers with fascinating stories/tales of another world. More than that, their

sermons will carry conviction only if people see them practice what they preach. Ironically,

they do sermonise equality and brotherhood duringHajjsermon, yet, the Saudi royal

familyhas an exclusive enclosure in theKaaba.Is it hypocrisy or is there something

inherently wrong with Islam?

The religious divines who take upon themselves the onus of determining which sect is right

and which is wrong or who is a good Muslim and who is a kafirare being too presumptuous,

rather audacious. God has not entrusted them with any such mission. Frequently their own

party is in question, and by defying Gods directive against setting judgment over faith of

fellow Muslims or those from other faiths, to the extent of killing them, they render

themselves liable to be treated as any other murderer a common criminal who deserves no

mercy. In fact, they merit divine wrath of dividing the Muslim world.

One does notice that a lot many Muslim countries indulge in sectarian strife at the state level.

We would have been sparred of the wrath of the Taliban had the Saudis been not so keen on

spreadingWahabismin the Muslim world. They are a classic example of inciting intra-

Muslim dissension and using their oil money to fight their war for political, economic and

sectarian primacy.

Worse still is the racial bias that, despite the religions strict prohibition of any distinction

between Muslims (save on the basis of piety), still shows up consistently. The way almost all

Arab States lined up with Iraq back in the decade of 1980s in its aggression against Iran

profoundly compromised the religions claim to be a unifying force that makes no distinction

among its followers on the basis of race, colour or culture.

There is also a feeling that the Arabs do not take the same measure of interest in overall

Islamic causes the Muslim world collectively does on issues that are a primary concern to theArabs the issue of Palestineis the case in hand.

Finally, it is flagrant failures of the so-called practicing members of the Muslim world to

comply with the basics of the Islamic moral code that is causing deep distress and

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disillusionment amongst those who can be regarded as the silent minority. What angers them

even more is the pretence of being superior Muslims by virtue of the fact that they follow the

Islamic practices habitually even though they violate the fundamental tenets of the faith. But

for this blatant hypocrisy, a lot more people the world over might have been swarming into

the Islamic world.

Despite the change of times, Muslims enjoy unprecedented freedom in the United States to

worship and preach their faith. Young Muslims who come here for education worship

together as Muslims and not as Shiites or Sunnis, Indians or Pakistanis bow, pray, plead and

implore forgiveness from their Lord, mix-up with each other without prejudice or

discrimination. The fact that most of them are educated and enlightened and act the same

way enables them to rise above parochial, sectarian and ethnic interests, and work for the

betterment of the community as a whole.

As for the politicised Muslims, things will not improve unless the teachings of the real Islam

are followed an Islam without sloganeering against Jews, Hindus, Christians, Shiites or

Sunnis an Islam without moral and spiritual corruption an Islam without guns and

grenades, suicide bombings and the grand plans to destroy the West an Islamwhich grants

due respect to any one and every human being an Islam which provides rights to all

individuals irrespective of their colour, caste, creed, sect or religion an Islam that leads by

example.

Muslims need to stop pointing fingers at other religions and take stock of their own situation.

They need to learn from other faiths respect the ideals for which the followers of those faiths

stand for preach peace instead of prejudice that ends up in abstract hatred that conveys nosense whatsoever.

Muslims need to loosen up! Confining the religion to orthodoxy hasnt gotten them anywhere.

In fact, so far, it appears that it has been a campaign, a mad rush for the dark ages! For some

odd reason, Muslim countries seem to follow their Arab (read Wahabi) brethren and look for

a leadership role from the sheikhs. It is a faulty arrangement. Can there be a separate and

distinct leadership that can be created? Can the moderate Muslim countriescome forward,

take the lead and enlighten the Muslims?

May be one day or may be never.

However, what Islam really needs now is a self-sustaining movement within the enlightened

spheres. For starters, taking the route of ijmaand ijtehad(religious consultation to keep pace

with the changing times) may not be a bad idea. This process of consultation does not

necessarily have to be conducted by the bearded and the turbanedbut people who wear suits

and ties, jeans and khakis, who can probably take the initiative and thereby end up doing a

much better job.

Islam needs better leadership. The followers, the sincere ones and not the wretched al Qaeda,

ISIS or the Wahabi crowd, have to make hard choices. This is the time to put the house in

order. This is the historical opportunity to make amends and seek forgiveness from those who

have been hurt, bruised and battered by militant Islam and make a decision, once and for all

times to come, that the faith itself is all about universal peace and harmony and free from

those draconian hollowness of violence and aggression. Like a computer system that needs

some servicing, Islam needs a reflecting reboot.

Ahson Saeed Hasan

The writer is a Washington DC based journalist who has written extensively on US

foreign policy and South Asian affairs. He tweets @tweetingacho

(twitter.com/tweetingacho)

RSS Feed Email me Email me

The views expressed by the writer and the reader comments do not necessarily reflect the views andpolicies of The Express Tribune.

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Faraz Talat19 days ago

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"True Islam" is in the eye of the beholder. There is no Muslim sect or thought school

on Earth that claims to be following a "false" version of Islam.

Muslims need to accept the diversity of beliefs among them, as other religious groups

are learning to do, instead of chasing the mirage of "true religion". There is nothing

objective about faith.

You must sign in to down-vote this post.

Anoop 18 days ago

10

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> Faraz Talat

And that will happen how?

And, why stop there? If you are being rational enough to accept there is no

"True Religion" among sects of Islam, people might as well go one step

beyond and accept all Religions are man made.

What you say will never happen because in people's minds accepting the

other sect as Muslim is a slippery slope. If Ahmadis can be Muslims, in spite

of violating the core principle in Islam, why stop there? Accept even idolator

Hindus. Or, non-theist Buddhists. Christianity resembles Islam anyway.

Rationality is a slippery slope. That is why it will never be embraced by the

majority.


wb 16 days ago

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> Anoop

He cannot say that for obvious reasons.

In Pakistan to say that Islam is a man made religion is tantamount to

denying Prophet the prophethood. Which is called as gustakh e rasool.

Meaning, violation or insult to the prophet.

The punishment is death under blasphemy law.

And he is using his official social media here. He will be caught easily

and sent to jail and then death.



5/45

Critical 18 days ago

5

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> Faraz Talat

"True Islam" is like "True Communism"....

Everyone thinks they can bring it in their govt and say that another country

is following the false version when it fails,....


wb 19 days ago

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> Faraz Talat

100%.

Just to improve upon what you have written, I would replace the word True

with Perfect.


Zee18 days ago

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What an absurd blog! Only portraying Islam image as usually west do and what else

you expect

Without doing the root cause analysis you will land nowhere. Let me tell you that,

it's a direct result of double standards of the world for Muslims, how, see Palestine,

Kashmir still unresolved but east taimoor get independence from Indonesia withinno time because Christians were asking the same.

Invasion in Iraq and killing millions of innocent Iraqis on baseless account (WMD)

and allowing minority to rule on majority. Invasion in Afghanistan etc.

Those who bought USA and NATO in reference with Iraq can buy anything which

western media and world sell to them


Faraz Talat 15 days ago

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> Zee

What a fascinating portrayal of our national ego problem.

The "root" cause is that we're no angels. In our minds, a mob murdered a

Christian couple for blasphemy, probably because the mob leader's village had

been colonized by the British, and his pet cat got killed in an American drone

strike.

Well, not really. Sometimes things are terrible because WE mess things up.

WE perpetuate bad customs and glorify horrendous political ideologies, and

then use NATO and USA and Illuminati to soothe our own guilty conscience.


ZKhan 9 days ago> Faraz Talat

Only People like you in Pakistan need reform not other Muslims...You

Stop supporting terrorism in Kashmir and Afghanistan and even in

your Country then major terrorism Problem will solve...Islam don't

need reform a People like you in Pakistan need some sense..Your

People kill Christian Couple attack other minority and you blame on


6/45

0

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Islam and Muslims....

Forget about other Countries if really want your Country and Society

to Progress than Change your mind and think like human

being..Every Problem will Solve..


Parvez19 days ago

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That was quite an exhaustive read.

Much of the Western world functions on the principles laid down in Islam and they

seem to be doing pretty well. So I don't think Islam needs a reboot, but those who

loudly preach it in the Muslim word but don't bother to implement what they preach,

needs rebooting.


hammurabi 18 days ago

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> Parvez

This is a myth that western world functions on islamic principles.All the

religions have common moral principles.The west has changed after

industrial revolution and by the thinking of philosophers such as

Ruosso,Nitzche, and others like

Marx,Lenin,Bertraind russel,Martin Luther king.


Parvez 17 days ago

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> hammurabi

Read the comment in its entirety........the message is in the end, not in

the beginning.

....and of course what you say is right, how can one dispute that.


ab1990 19 days ago

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> Parvez

what a joke!! Most Muslim countries dont have democracy . What principles

are you talking about?


Maximus Decimus Meridius 18 days ago

7

> ab1990

once again we see that you Xenophobic attitude has forced you to just

waddle in to reply without even reading the comment properly. plz re

read the comment then feel free to comment.



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imran khan 15 days ago

0

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> Maximus Decimus Meridius

sir.can i have ur email



0

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> imran khan

you can click my disqus profile and send me a msg via

facebook.


Parvez 18 days ago

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> ab1990

Please read my comment again.


18 days ago

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> ab1990

-women's rights- right of property, divorce etc.

-basic hygiene practices

-democracy (http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki...

I am sure there's more. Btw he said ISLAMIC principles, not the

Muslim world


wb 18 days ago>

"-women's rights- right of property, divorce etc."

EXcept for right to property (which is also stacked up against

some of the many wives of a man who have no children), no

other rights were given to women. Not by scriptures and not by

men. Divorce was almost always used as a weapon against

woma n.

"-basic hygiene practices"

It's indeed very sad that religion has to give basic hygiene

practices which is acquired by other by virtue of common

sense. And not today, not 1000 years ago, several thousand

years ago.

"Democracy"

What democracy are you talking about? Just because the

scripture says, and so does common sense that elect the best


8/45

19

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among you as leader, that doesn't become democracy. Stop

hijacking others' ideas.



3

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> wb

Before Islam your so called "hygiene taken from common

sense" was non existent. It was Islam which gave the principles

of hygiene which are in vogue today. learn to do your research

before posting.

Democracy is not your average "common sense". It requires a

person to sacrifice his own right to rule in favor of another.

Even in Roman times it could not be adopted to its maximum

degree, then Islam gave true democracy. Again I see that you

have just saw and comment and you got the itch to reply.

Before the time of extremists Muslim women were given all the

rights that men have. try picking up any book from that timeand there are various instances of women being financially

independent.


wb 16 days ago

2

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> Maximus Decimus MeridiusIf your comment made an iota of sense, I would have logically

replied.

Sorry to say, your writing is totally out of place both in terms of

content and logic.



1

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> wb

yes the best way to escape is to just claim that you cannot see

the logic. even though the reality is that you dont have an

answer.


18 days ago

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> wb

1. http://www.islamswomen.com/art...

2. If you had ANY knowledge of pre Islamic Arabia, you would

be thanking Islam right now. Education does a lot to ppl, you

know. I suggest you get some.

3. http://www.ahl-alquran.com/Eng...

Read, then talk.



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8 days ago

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> Gp65

FYI, Ancient Greece's version of democracy only considered

MEN capable of voting and choosing a suitable leader. Now

compare that with Islam, where women were included when

electing the four rightly guided caliphs after the death of the

Holy Prophet PBUH. So tell me, which one is "proper"

democracy?

As I have just proved above, it was Islam which came up with

the whole idea of democracy. So what the "west" claims to

follow in the election of a leader, IS an Islamic principle. Thus

the pre- Islamic Arabia comment still stands, whether you

compare it with the west or not.


Roon 13 days ago

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> wb

"pre-Islamic India was even more mature civilization"

Not really true, the warrior classes and raj put kingdoms were

constantly up in arms with each other. These wars were

glorified by them but reading between the lines these were

quite bloody. See the death toll and destruction caused by

Asoka's wars. (He later repented but that doesn't change thefact that he caused it). There was significant Hindu-Buddhist

tensions especially under the reign of the Sunga Empire:

"Following the Mauryans, the first Brahmin emperor was

Pushyamitra Sunga, and is believed by some historians to have

persecuted Buddhists and contributed to a resurgence of

Brahmanism that forced Buddhism outwards to Kashmir,

Gandhara and Bactria."

"wars, battles, violence and corruption"

Describes the Ancient Roman Empire perfectly, yet it is

considered the greatest and largest civ. in the ancient world.

This our civilization is better than your civilization arguments

are pointless and redundant. How will you feel if Western

countries boasted of their own achievements and considered

others inferior. I'm sure one would call it racist no?


Gp65 9 days ago

0

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>

pre-Islamic Arabia was not the only inhabited place in the

world. Hence to compare with that andclaim that the idea of

democracy was first mooted by Islam or that even idea of

hygiene first emanated in Islam is disingenuous.


ab1990 18 days ago>

Did u forget some more:


11/45

21

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1. death sentence for apostacy

2. stoning for adultery

3. driving ban for women

4. polygamy for men and ban on polyandry for women



6

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> ab1990

There is no death for apostacy in Islam

There is no stoning for adultery in Islam

There is no ban on women owning or driving vehicles in Islam

YES. one reason is that if both polygamy and polyandry are

allowed then there will be no way to ascertain whose child is

whose and our DNA will deteriorate. there are also other

reasons.

Please DO NOT claim that the beliefs of extremists are true

beliefs of Islam. This is tantamount to saying thatThe belief of "Neog" (i.e giving your wife to another man for

copulating so that she can get pregnant) is a belief of ALL

hindus.(this si written in many Hindu commentaries including

"Stayarath Parkash" chapter 4 page 146

So just as we don't think that all hindus give their wives to their

friends, same way you should not think that the beliefs of

extremists are the true beliefs of Islam.


wb 16 days ago

6

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When a Hindu writes something it doesn't become universal to

all Hindus.

But Quran is universal to all Muslims.

And I can quote many verses from Quran which promotes

violence and treats women as much less than men.

ET always removes comments where I mention Quranic

verses by number. But if you have a copy of Quran, and Sahih

al Bukhari, (both are available for download in pdf) read them.


16 days ago

2

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> wb

Give it a try. Each and every single one of your "quotes" will be

explained to you.


wb 16 days ago>

Explained by whom? There are as many explanations as there

are Maulvis.


12/45

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If Quran is such a perfect book, why did god make so many

ambiguous statements that can be interpreted in 100,000

different ways?


16 days ago

0

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> wb

Then where are u gonna get your quotes from? Let it be if it's

so "ambiguous". Or just quote so you can be proven incorrect.


16 days ago

1

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> wb

But if a Muslim does something, it's universal for all Muslims

right? Buckets of hypocrisy!



1

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> wb

I salute you sir. What you are saying is exactly what I have

been trying to get you to understand.

The universal teaching for muslims is Quran. not the

interpretation by any one man.

Please mention the verses which you think promote violence.

(I dont think they ever removed verse numbers, there are

many comments on ET with verse numbers)


wb 16 days ago

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Thanks for your salute. But I'm afraid it's premature and you

did not understand what I have written all along.

Quran which is universal (although Ahle-Hadees such asWahhabis will kill you if you don't consider Hadees as primary,

almost as important as Quran) teaches a lot of misogyny and

violence.

You can just read Quran to find out which are they if you

haven't read already.

I could go on about other things about Quran, but I know my

comments about them have been blocked by ET.

But just read Quran.



13/45

18 days ago

1

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> ab1990

Learn to differentiate between culture and religion. It's useless

telling you, but the punishments were made to STOP one from

committing the crime ie. so they think about the punishment

before they do the deed.. I can provide links aswell but I prefer

not wasting time on you. The driving one is just stupid in your

part. Yeh, "Islam said in so and so verse, women should not

drive."


siesmann 18 days ago

6

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>

Well,who is stopping Muslim countries adopting the "Islamic

principles"


Anoop 18 days ago

5

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>

Women's rights?

And, do educate us what Muslim women are supposed to do ifthey are in an unhappy marriage. Can they say Talaaq thrice

and get out of it?

And, what do men have to do?

Lets not even talk about Alimony in such cases. Shah Bano

case in India proves that.


17 days ago

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> Anoop

Can't copy paste too much on ET, so:

http://www.islamhelpline.net/n...


Anoop 16 days ago

5

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>

Just tell me the name of one woman who has divorced her

husband by saying Triple Talaaq. I only need a name.

I have a name of a guy ready to share with you.

If its possible, then lets see it being practiced.



14/45

wb 16 days ago

5

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> Anoop

Triple talaq is only for men.

Women have to go through a lot of painful process to get a

divorce.

Also a woman has to wait for three months before remarrying.

A man c an marry instantly.

The most absurd divorce rule is, is the couple want to remarry,

then the woman has to marry someone else, consummate the

marriage and then marry the original husband.

And this has turned many sex crazed Mullahs to offer this

service. And I'm not kidding. You can go to youtube and watch

a program called on the front with Kamran Shahid.



2

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> wb

Yes Triple Talaq is only for men. Because If a women wants to

leave a man she is allowed to leave him instantly. However she

also has to wait for 4 months before remarrying.

This is a plus for women so that they are not forced to live with

a person they don't like for 3 months. I fail to see why this

bothers you. you want to make women live in the same house

with a person whom they hate and want to divorce?

The remarrying rule is there to make sure that couples

understand the gravity of the issue. these days hindu and many

other religions allow their adherents to remarry instantly. this

has lead to divorce becoming a plaything. It was intended to be

a very grave issue and Quran tells us that we should

understand it importance. also by making marriage and

divorce a plaything Hinduism and other religions have led their

adherents to destroy family life.

You are talking about extremist sex crazed mullahs offering

this service? Well no one thinks that they are right. but in

hindu holy books it is said

"A women whose husband dies should not remarry an

individual, rather she should copulate with ten or twelve strong

men to produce children" (Satyarath Prakash ninth editionChapter 4, subheading 118, page 191)


wb 15 days ago> Maximus Decimus Meridius

"The remarrying rule is there to make sure that couplesunderstand the

gravity of the issue. these days hindu and many other religions

allow

their adherents to remarry instantly. this has lead to divorce

becoming a

plaything."

That is the stupidest excuse I've ever heard.

All these excuses, these explanations are absurd and it's like a

cock and bull story.

To any logical person it makes absolutely no sense. It can only

please and satisfy people with little brain and blind faith.

In case you didn't know divorce among Muslims is higher than

divorce among Hindus.

And stop lying. Women can't get a divorce instantaneously. She


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must to go to a Mullah to get a divorce.


15 days ago

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> wb

Stupidest thing you have heard, yet you can't say it doesn't

exist in the book he mentioned. You have been creamed my

friend!



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> wb

She doesn't have to go to a mullah. She can divorce

immediately. Again please do not force misinterpretation of my

religion upon me. making remarriage difficult is done to show

gravity in issue. why is this stupid only you can know. But you

did not notice my last line. Any excuse that you can provide for

you scripture saying that women should live like prostitutes?

You always do this. ignoring these aspects of hinduism will not

make them go away you know. you will need fairy powder for

that


Guest 14 days ago

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I have interacted with many Pakistani muslim women in

Womens Shelter in the West. They stated they cannot divorce

their husbands, it has to be done through Mullah



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> Guest

and I have interacted with many many Pakistani women.

They all know that they can get a divorce through court.Reuters ran a story that more and more Pakistani women are

now able to get divorce. I know of many women in Pakistan

who just sent thier papers through court. Perhaps you

misunderstood what you were told.


15 days ago> wb

Omg and you say you know Islam -.-

In short: the remarry thing is so the husband knows that if he

dares divorce his wife, the only way he can get her back is after


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she has slept with another man. It is supposed to ward one

AWAY from divorce, so he does not commit the act to prevent

seeing his ex wife with another man. All these "Islamic

punishments", like cutting the hands off for stealing or lashes

for adultery are for preventing the acts from happening. If you

had actually READ ahadith as you claim to have, you would

not have missed the one where a man comes to the Holy

Prophet PBUH and says that "punish me, for I have committed

adultery" the Prophet of Allah told him to get away and said

that the punishment was set to stop you from committing the

crime.

Any more rules u want clarified?



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> Anoop

women don't have to say the talaq thrice with waiting period in

between.

They are given the dignity to just say it once and then leave the

house. Islam has preserved their dignity and has allowed them

to leave the person they hate at once. This is in favor of

women. forcing women to follow the triple talaq would not

have made sense.


Anoop 15 days ago

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Concrete example please. I don't care for hyperbole.

If you can't provide one, take back what you said.


16 days ago

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> Anoop

Did u not read maximus response?!


Anoop 15 days ago

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>

I've asked you for an example where this has happened. Name

of the woman who has divorced her husband.

If you had it you could have given it and shut me up. All talk..

Islam is this, Islam is that, but it when it comes to

implementation, it is "misinterpreted", but at the same time it is

not open to misinterpretation.Lead by giving an example of any Islamic country. If you can

tell me one example from Gulf, the birthplace of Islam, that

would be icing on the cake!



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15 days ago

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> Anoop

The most well known story that references khula and serves as

the basis for legal interpretations is the story of Jamilah, the

wife of Thabit ibn Qays:[3]

Narrated Ibn 'Abbas: The wife of Thabit bin Qais came to theProphet and said, "O Allah's Apostle! I do not blame Thabit for

defects in his character or his religion, but I, being a Muslim,

dislike to behave in un-Islamic manner if I remain with him."

On that Allah's Apostle said to her, "Will you give back the

garden which your husband has given you as Mahr?" She said,

"Yes." Then the Prophet said to Thabit, "O Thabit! Accept your

garden, and divorce her once."[4]

".. When Rabia bint Masood obtained Khula from Thabit, the

prophet asked her to wait until one menstrual cycle before she

could go to her home". (An-Nissai, Abu Daud, Tirmidhi)

:) icing on the cake!


Anoop 14 days ago

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>

I asked for quantifiable proof. Not excepts from fiction.

There are 57 Muslim majority countries, dozens of Islamic

countries. Are you telling me you are relying on unproved,

unscrutinized Islamic Texts? Don't you have any modern

precedents from dozen or so Islmaic countries?


14 days ago

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> Anoop

What is wrong with you?! You will not accept that God exists

until a lighting bolt hits and on the sky is your answer!

This is a respected and properly sourced hadith and knowing

you, you will deny anything to prevent yourself from being

proven incorrect. Shame. And I dont know of any "Muslim

Newspaper" where divorces are published. Although I

personally do know of a lady who got khullah similar to the

quoted hadith. Why, do you want her number? -.-


wb 14 days ago>

You can celebrate your little victory. But please know that ET

has blocked two of my important comments.

In one I had quoted verses of misogyny and hatred from

Quran.

In the other I had quoted Prophet Mohammed with Versem

chapter and Book from Sahih Al Bulhari.


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Both blocked.

I told you ET doesn't like me challenging Islam.

In such a biased environment, truth can never prevail.

This is why Pakistan is also failing. So is most of Muslim

countries.


14 days ago

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> wb

Verse Number? Link to verse? Are you already giving up? Stop

blaming ET, cos they pass comments against Islam daily and

you would know best :)

And why havent you answered my other responses? You were

explained the true meaning and proven incorrect. Nowacknowledge it so you dont bother other Muslims with the

same Q&A.



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> Anoop

http://www.reuters.com/article...

There are some names mentioned in this news story. I hope

this satisfies you because you asked for a single name and there

are many here


Anoop 14 days ago

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Thank you for the link. Its a good thing women have a way

out.

I don't think there is any way for a Muslim woman to get

divorced in India and get her right. Shah Bano case proves

that.

How is it in Pakistan?

"Court-ordered child support payments to divorced mothers in

Pakistan are rare and enforcement even rarer.", from your link.



1

> Anoop

yes rare. but on the increase.

You said there was not a single case of a female divorcing a

male. So i presented this case.



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wb 16 days ago

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>

I don't know why you are posting this link.

We all know the concept and conditions of Khula.

The right to divorce empowers women? Is that the only or is

that the most important right for a woman?

This shows how desperate one is to prove that Islam gives

women rights.

I can also quote verse where a woman is considered to be half

of a man.

I can also quote verse which gives a man to strike his wife if he

disobeys.



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> wb

please quote the link where women is considered to be half of a

man.

and please quote where a man is allowed to strike his wife.

You should understand that Quran is in Arabic and one word

can have many meanings. That is why the Holy Prophet SAW

explained it to us by acting upon the Quran. You can see that

he never hit his wife, or any other woman for that matter.


16 days ago

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> wb

Go on, qoute both, I have already answered them in previous

comments and have no trouble copy pasting my responses :)

A woman is telling you Islam gives her the best of rights. But

no, you will believe ANYONE but her. It's like asking a non

Muslim woman how a Muslim woman feels.

Try asking them, it's free. I doubt you will though. Why? I

have noticed this trend in you ppl, you can't accept the fact that

you are wrong. That you may have, in your mind, a prejudicebuilt upon lies.


wb 16 days ago>

You have answered nothing. The links you shared were

nonsense.

A woman also says wearing burkha is good. A woman also

says that she must obey her husband. A woman can say a lot

of things.


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Unless a woman has understood what women's rights are, she

doesn't know what she talks about.



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> wb

It is her choice. I don't get this . If a woman wants to run

around naked or semi nude she is allowed to do that by the

likes of you(and many of you encourage her) but the minute

she wants to cover up her head people like you start to harass

her and call her an extremist.

It is her choice. She is allowed to wear what she pleases and do

what she pleases.

Same with interaction of women and men. If a women

demeans herself and allows a man to physically hurt her

during intimacy, all the likes of you are there to applaud and

clap around, calling her progressive. But the minute a muslimwoman says that she wants to live in harmony with her spouse

she is targeted by people like you who harass her and call her

backward.


14 days ago

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Word. Like women are solely here to fulfil a mans desires -.-

but if they don't get to sexualise a woman without her

permission, it's oppression!


16 days ago

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> wb

Yes so as a non Muslim MAN, you would know best how

Muslim women feel. That's what I call non sense. And still no

quotes from you.


wb 15 days ago

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>

No. What you don't know is I have interacted and worked with

Muslim women's organizations. I know what reality is. And

most importantly I have read Quran and Hadees and I know

what they teach about women. So, I can safely say that I know

a lot more about Islam than most people here.



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> wb

More than a Muslim? Nope. Live as a Muslim for a week WB.

If you are a man, I dare you. A week. A single week where you

will do what Muslims do and refrain from what Muslims do

not do. Chuck in a day for fasting aswell. Won't hurt would it?

Tried this with Anoop once. Sorry to say, but that guy was too

afraid to even commit.

Yet you don't provide proof? Muslims women's organisations

exist because those women want to remain Muslim, correct?

Or else they would name it "women's organisation". Why don't

you ask them how they feel then? Ask them whether it's Islam

which makes their life difficult or is it their Muslim

father/brother/husband? They live as Muslims. So if you

haven't got the guts to muslimize a week in your life, then

simply ask them.


wb 14 days ago>

Yes more than a Muslim. Because when you live as a Muslim

you live in a particular class/locality/neighborhood/sect.

When you work with Muslims you work with every sects,

every classes, every neighborhoods, every locality.

I don't see the point of living as a Muslim, which I find

wasteful adventure. There is nothing afraid to be living as a

Muslim. But it is a very discomforting thought to follow a

culture of insecurity, constraint. What you are asking is not a

dare for me. It is a nonsensical waste of time and I don't need

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suc nonsense n my e.

You keep asking for proof. I hope ET allows me to write from

verses.


14 days ago

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> wb

A non Muslim knows the reality of living as a Muslim. Not

accepting this statement. No matter what you say, you are still

in the "outside", knowing nothing about whats going inside.

I wonder why a religion which encourages a "culture of

insecurity :L" is the fastest growing faith in the world too

according to conversions of course, not births. And which

religion does not have constraints? If you dont want anyrestrictions in your life, dont follow a religion, simple.

And right, you're scared too :)


Gp65 8 days ago>

it is the 'fastest growing' reported religion for 2 reasons:

1) Fertility rate among Muslims is higher than non-Muslims

2) in India as well as western countries, there is no law against


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conversion to Islam (did you know that A.R. Rehman was orn

a Hindu)? However in Muslim countries a Muslim converting

is considered apostacy. Thus new entries are counted but exits

are not reported thus artificially inflating the number of

Muslims in the world.


8 days ago

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> Gp65

Give us some credit lady! 100,000 people per year convert to

Islam in America alone. For every 1 male convert to Islam 4

females convert to Islam, I wonder why?

Is the number of people wanting to leave enough to even

impact the amount of conversions? I dont think so. And

whether you think about "Muslim" countries or not, why in the

world are so many people living in the west converting to this

faith? ,

Also, the fertility point is ridiculous. Just look at Iran, where

the average family had ~7 children in the 1980s and has 1.7

today, a lower rate than France or Britain. Or look at the UAE,

with 1.9 children per family. Or Turkey, which now has 2.15

children per family. Or Lebanon at 1.86! Around the world, the

average Muslim family size has fallen from 4.3 children per

family in 1995 to 2.9 in 2010.

So to conclude, it is the number of Muslim conversions which

are increasing, not the number of people born into Islam.



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> Anoop

According to Islamic principles (Given in the Quran) the

husband cannot divorce his wife at once. I don't know who

gave you that information. Perhaps you watched some serial

on the TV, it does happen like that in serials. Anyway, a

husband is required to wait one month after giving the first

divorce, then again one month after the second divorce. The

wife can remain in the husbands house or she can go home,

the husband is required to give her enough money that she can

live according to her means during these three months.

these are the statements of the Holy Quran. And these are not

subtle statements, the Holy Quran gives precise instructions

about divorce and how it should happen.

You should not force the misinterpretation of extremists on the

entire religion. As I have already pointed out it will betantamount to saying that All Hindus swap and share wives as

per the instructions of Neog.


16 days ago

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Exactly! Seriously, these ppl either rely on isis' version of Islam

or some here-say to prove their point! Never picked up a quran,

a list of quotes from answeringislam.organd walah- duck soup

ready.



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wb 15 days ago

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>

You maybe unawar e of your own world. I am very much

aware of Muslim world in India.

And I have quoted everything here from Hadees and Quran.

And all silly explanations you give to explain these rules are

unbelievably stupid. And these are the exact explanation your

CII and our AIMPLB gives.



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> wb

awe poor you.

Firstly you have not quoted anything that has not been

explained.

Secondly you have not explained any quote from Smrtis or

Satyarath Prakash. Neither have you provided quotes from

eminent scholars saying that SMrtis are garbage. The only

thing that you have done is cry foul like a little child.

What do you think we should do? just let you misinterpret

Islam and when hinduism is presented as violent and devoid ofany morals let you just turn tail and run away?


wb 15 days ago

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Are you blind sir? Read my comments, I have said these books

are not our holy books. You just keep repeating that.

And regarding the quotes from Quran, I haven't quoted

anything. I have only asked you to read. Because ET blocks my

comments whenever I challenge verses of Quran. They're

afraid too much these days.


15 days ago

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> wb

Then post links of verses. It's not too hard.


Maximus Decimus Meridius 15 days ago> wb

I have repeatedly asked you to give me quotes of any eminent

Hindu scholar who says that Smrtis are rubbish. but you turn


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tail everytime. You cannot just say "these are not our holy

books" everytime. You must show some Hindu scholar who

says Smrtis are rubbish or else you will be proved an ignorant

Hindu.


wb 15 days ago

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I have repeatedly told you that ET is afraid to publish my

challenges to Quranic verses.

Don't make me repeat everything.



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> wb

oh. now ET is afraid? they allow atheists to post. they allow

Christians to post. They allow each and every other human on

the face of this earth to post, but when it comes to poor little

WB they turn all nasty. are you going to cry now?

Just look at their top comments guy. name anoop and

nationality indian. I am not sure if he is hindu or atheist or any

other faith for I have not seen him divulge his faith BUT hehas questioned Islam many many times and always his

comments go through.


wb 15 days ago

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They allow every one to post. I never said they don't.

Understand English properly. They don't allow anything

challenging scripture and prophet Mohammed.

In this blog alone many of my comments are blocked by them.

Please don't repeat the question again and again and again.



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> wb

Look at anoops comments, and many others. They allow you

to challenge scripture.



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14 days ago

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> wb

You must've missed my comments then.

Anoop asked a talaq question, and I answered with a Hadith-

defined as a saying of the holy prophet PBUH. Now what?


Gp65 8 days ago

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Please read what Pasthan Trayi is: Upanishads, Bhagvad Geeta

and Vedas. Everything excepting this is not considered a holy

book by Hindus.



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> Gp65

I already replied to this in another comment . I would like to

add that I have googled "smrti" and run through lots of pages

but all of them seem to say that they are holy texts. If you can

quote a source where it is said that smrtis are not holy books,

rather they are "garbage" as another person just said, then I

will appreciate it. I am sorry, but I cannot just take your word

for it now can I? If you want me to quote sources I can quotemany where it is said by hindu scholars that smrtis are holy


15 days ago

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Too good!!!! >. Maximus Decimus Meridius

There are 3 holy books for Hindus : Bhagvad Geeta, Vedas andUpanishads. When you quote from some random source and

claim it is Hinduism it is absurd.


Maximus Decimus Meridius 8 days ago> Gp65

I did not quote a random source. I quoted an encyclopedia

which is run by hindus. I then respectfully asked for a source

where it is said that smrtis are "garbage" or "rubbish". If this is

indeed the prevalent thinking then some eminent scholar must

have said it. plz show me who said it.


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>

yup. and the minute I start to give them Hinduism 101 lessons

they run away.


wb 16 days ago

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My dear sir,

Islamic principles is also derived from Hadees and not just

Quran. True Quran categorically says that a talaq can only be

given after a waiting period.

But based on Hadees this has been rendered void and in every

country, including Pakistan triple talaq is valid.

It happens in India. It happens in pretty much all Islamic

countries.

This is not the interpretations of extremists. This is the

interpretation of ordinary Muslims.



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> wb

there are also muslims who wait for the three month period. I

have stated a number of times that I will not go into debates asto which muslim says what. If you want to debate use the

Quran.


wb 15 days ago

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Sorry then you don't know your own religion.

Hadees is as important to Muslims as Quran is and Sharia is

based on Hadees.

Hadees is not a person. And Hadees perfectly allows triple talaq

at a stretch.



Sharia is based on Quran, don't tell me what my religion is


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14 days ago

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> wb

Quran> Hadith every time. How do you NOT know this? The

Quran is considered word of GOD, Hadith are saying of the

Holy Prophet PBUH and sunnah is what He did. They are

utilised to SUPPORT rules of sharia. Why would the word of

God be below the recorded sayings of a human being? Ever

heard of shirk?

Are you even serious or are you running out of things to say?!


Anoop 18 days ago

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>

Naila and Parvez

This is an disingenuous comment. All Religious ideas claim todo that. Islam is no different than every other Religion out

there in this aspect.

Western and the free world works on the golden principle. The

Constitutions of Democracies reflect that.

If Islam's emphasis is so heavily on golden principle, why is

there a punishment on apostasy?

You have modeled your interpretation of Islam on your

worldview. But, there is very little evidence to suggest your

version is widely accepted, even among Muslims.

In fact, Naila, the persecution of your own sect proves that..



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> Anoop

there is no punishment of apostasy in Islam. I have repeatedly

said that. There has never been any punishment. Extremists

can never show even one single case where a person was

punished for apostasy.

you may ask me "then how do these extremists justify such

punishments if they are not in Islam".

The reply is that that misquote various traditions where people

were punished for revolt, desertion, rebellion and terrorism. So

of course these people had left the Islamic state and they had

denounced Islam. So the present day extremists claim that

these people were punished for apostasy when in reality their

crimes ranged from rebellion to desertion(these are stillpunishable by death in all countries).

I hope this satisfies you on the apostasy issue.


Anoop 15 days ago> Maximus Decimus Meridius

If you are so confident, lets conduct an experiment. Why don't

you change your name for a period of 3 months and adopt a

Hindu sounding name. Tell people you have converted and let

us see if you still commenting on ET after 3 months.

On the other hand. I can give you a name of a guy who


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converted to Islam in India and has won Oscars.



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> Anoop

I have said again and again that what happens in Pakistan is

not true Islam. However people do convert to other religions in

other countries and they are not harmed. I think you may

have missed my first reply where I said that I will debate on

Islam, not on the misrepresented Islam of these mullahs but

the Islam that is described in the Holy Quran.


Anoop 14 days ago

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You can pick any Mullah in your local mohallah to do that.

How is it interpreted is not my business. Islamic world has a

terrible problem and all countries seem to have the same exact

problem.

And, don't blame it on Pakistan, if a Muslim converts out of

Islam in India, he would most certainly be killed by his own

friends and family.

There is not a continent on Earth which is not affected by

islamic Terror. Be it TTP, Al Shahbab, ISIS or whatever

nomenclature, they all exhibit similar behavior and their

ideology is near identical. There is only one common thread -

Quran.

Its the same with all Islamic countries. A woman was caned in

Malaysia for drinking beer.

I see the end result, not concerned about inconsequential my

fiction is better than your fiction debates.



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> Anoop

Well thank you for your first line. I am an Ahmadi . We allow

women to divorce their husbands without waiting for three

months. Also Ahmadi women ans men are allowed to change

their religion without any fear of death or beatings. As our

community is very active in India you can ask an Indian

Ahmadi to take you to an Ahmadi scholar and he will give you

this information face to face.

I hope you are satisfied


wb 16 days ago> Maximus Decimus Meridius

You have said wrong.


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Read Sahih Al Bukhari 9:84:57

Read the whole book 84.



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> wb

Each and every tradition where it is mentioned that apostates

should be killed has been called unauthentic by scholars.

Simple reason. The Holy Prophet SAW never killed anyone in

his life who strayed away from Islam.


wb 15 days ago

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Is there a documentary that was shot on Prophet Mohammed

some 1400 years ago, as he lived?

No.

So, what is the source about Prophet Mohammed's life?

Hadees.

Sahih al Bukhari says that Prophet Mohammed ordered for

death for apostates. I have given you chapter and book

reference.

If that is a lie according to scholars, then the whole book is

erroneous.

That means Hadees is invalid at all.

Good I have no problem. But most Muslims do.


Roon 14 days ago

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> wb

"apostates"

Know this wb. When the hadith and quran speaks of apostates

it means those who "fought against Allah and His Apostle", as

narrated by another hadith, not just regular people who leave

their religion.

I have read 9:84:57. It says the Zanadiqa should be put to

death.

They are non-believing people who antagonized Islam

(zindiqs). The people being killed in 9:84:57 are these people

who were apostates true but had also opposed Islam militarily.

The concept is similar to that of the Kharijites who betrayed

Islam and murdered Hazrat Ali. Not to mention that the point

of the particular hadith is not to use fire as a method of

execution.

"According to Sharia punishment to adultery"



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Roon 13 days ago

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> Roon

Also I would like to add that Shariah is very diverse and has

multiple interpretations. Many Muslims have liberal

interpretations of Shariah which contrasts with the extremists

version.

Alas through ill providence, fundamentalists efforts, (and

recently Wahabi, Saudi money) this version is suppressed.

Example:

Sir Syed Ahmad Khan himself:

his view of Islam was rejected by Orthodox Muslim clergy as

contrary to traditional views on issues like jihad, polygamy and

animal slaughtering. And was even considered a Kafir by them.

Recently in Pakistan:

Liberal professor of Islam shot dead in Pakistan

http://www.theguardian.com/wor...The professor issued fatwas pronouncing, for example, that a

Muslim woman could marry a non-Muslim man, and that

women need not remove lipstick or nail polish before saying

their prayers.

You only see the fundamentalists version which in truth is not

surprising as the liberal version is suppressed.



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> wb

If he ordered their death then he must have gotten some killed

too. the hadith which you quoted reads that "whoever changes

his faith then kill him". then by default all muslims should

have been killed for they changed thier faith to Islam. This

shows that this hadith is not authentic. Learn some logic

please. Btw you have still not answered me on the neog query

as to whether it is done to all widows or just young widows.


wb 13 days ago

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Learn to read in the context.

Your excuse is like a child saying "dog ate my homework."

You can do all circus, but only you can get fooled by such

excuses and apologies.



again you make an illogical claim and try to wiggle. instead of

answering my question about neog whether it is done to all

widows or just young widows. you tried to skirt the issue. plz


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tell me if it is done to all widows or just young ones then we

will talk


ZKhan 9 days ago

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>

What a Fake Link you have provided...


9 days ago

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> ZKhanYep it seems didn't work. If you want anything clarified, then

ask a question.


Freeman 18 days ago

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> Parvez

The problem I have with your argument - similar arguments have been

advanced in other blogs and opinions by other Muslims - is that Islam came

after, not before, Judaism and Christianity (and Classical Greece which

invented democracy in 500 BCE) and other religions. Islam may have had

"egalitarianism" and "color-blindedness" as ideals (which is nowhere to be

seen today) but is undercut by many contradictions contained within it, and it

never had what we call democracy, unless you have some other definition

that differs from accepted ones. Like all other nations in human history (so

don't feel bad), until modern times, autocracy and lack of individual freedoms

was the general rule, and still is. Unlike other cultures and religions

(especially those of India and points East) which are not incompatible with

democracy, Islam and democracy are mutually contradictory, whether

ideologically or historically. The case for democracy was made by intellectuals

in Europe with Enlightenment and rationality and haltingly in practice, such

as enactment of the Magna Charta of England and "rights of man" of the

French Revolution. Of course, the US with its Declaration of Independence

and the world's first written Constitution is the first major democracy of

modern times and an inspiration for all others!



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> Freeman

USA is an inspiration? where blacks were hung in trees as recently as

1960? Thank you but i am not inspired.

america is a little child when it comes to democracy.

Secondly, the word is Magna Carta, not carta.

thirdly, after bush won the election against LA Gore. i am pretty sure

we can say the USA is not the epitome of democracy, or rather we can

say that USa is a corporation, not a democracy.



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Freeman 16 days ago

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Sorry, but the autocorrect feature of this site corrected my

"Carta" to "Charta" - I hope I did not offend you too much.

Your comments about the USA seem to spring from personal

animus than objectivity and rationality. Yes, you can find fault

in any human enterprise, including American democracy. But

why has its written constitution has been a model for most

modern democracies? Why its modern inventions and scientificcontributions, as well as culture, have been so universally

accepted and copied? Yes, slavery was a blot, but all African

Americans today are proud of their country and have been

defending it against all enemies for a long time. Yes, there are

inequities, but with time will be removed. But things are far

better today and the democracy stronger than its was in 1965

when the legal doors to immigration were flung opened to all

the people of the world. Ask the people of the world lining up

for the privilege of migrating to the U.S. Ask the 2.5 billion

people from China and India - if you do not want to include

"Muslim majority" countries whose inhabitants seem to despise

- as you do - the U.S. and the West (but are not averse toimmigrating here).



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> Freeman

I fail to see how your reply is connected to my comment.

I said "Blacks are marginalized in the USA". you cannot say

that they are there are active churches who say that blacks are

subhuman.

I pointed out your spelling error. ty for clearing that up.

I pointed out that your claim that USA is a great democracy is

wrong because the Bush/Al Gore elections show that it is not.

Please be kind enough to reply to my comment. your wall of

text has no bearing on my comment. It may have been a good

standalone comment but as a reply to my comment it makes

no sense.


Freeman 15 days ago

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Max (or whatever your True Believer name is), you are a piece

of work, Sir! You seem to know it all. I'd suggest you open the

top of your head as they did in the opening of all the Monty

Python shows and look inside your brain. You'll have your

answer(s). Peace be unto you!


Maximus Decimus Meridius 15 days ago> Freeman

Blacks being marginalized is common knowledge. anyone who

says that he doesn't know that is ignorant(are you claiming

this is rocket science?)

same with Bush / al Gore election.

I don't get it. I am arguing about the state of American


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democracy and you are attacking me.


wb 16 days ago

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I agree that USA has committed innumerable crimes against

humanity.

But if you look at today, USA is still better than most countries

in the world.

I'm saying this with sadness, as an Indian.


16 days ago

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> wb

To live in, yes. But the acts they are committing even today,

no.


wb 16 days ago

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>

If you want to talk about their acts of today, then I'd say

they're a million times better than all of Muslim countries

combined.


16 days ago

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> wb

May be equal, but not less.


wb 15 days ago

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>

hehehe.

good way to bargain. But no. USA is a lot better than all

Muslim countries combined.



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88% of them died and were thrown in Atlantic Ocean?

Who may I ask has been involved in practically all wars in the

past century? Directly or indirectly?

Who has killed thousands in drone strikes and continues to do

so today?


wb 14 days ago

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>

again my reply is blocked by ET.

This is why Pakistan is a failed state today.

Great job ET. Keep on blocking. You're only helping the failure.

By the way is it Narjis Fatema? Who used to block my

comments under the name Yoghurt Lover?



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> wb

they blocked your reply but published this? I think that this

"they blocked my reply" is something you use when you dont

have an argument and you have been so soundly beaten that

you got yours handed to you on a silver platter.


wb 13 days ago

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> Maximus Decimus MeridiusYes.

Because I had challenged some 6 verses of Quran to start with.

I have noticed 100s of problems in Quran.

This was only the beginning. And ET blocked it.


14 days ago

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> wb

What was your reply? I am wrong? Nope, can't be, it's in the

history books that America killed these people.


Maggi 17 days ago> Parvez

Somebody should tell you that Islam functions on the bases of faith in Allah,

faith in Prophet (pbuh), faith and practise in Namaz, Roza, Hajj.None of


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these are followed by Western World.



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> Maggi

o really? faith in God is not present in west?

You should just get yourself to USA and ask them what their country's

motto is.

Then you should get yourself a 20 dollar bill and see whats printed on

the back


Freeman 16 days ago

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But which God? :-)


siesmann 16 days ago

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But it doesn't say it is a christian God.West leaves God's work

to God.Muslims take it upon themselves to act for and as Allah.


Gp65 8 days ago

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Please point out where in the US constitution does it say that

Allah is the only God?

The idea of God is not unique to Islam and greatly predates

Islam. To claim that West is following Islam because US motto

is 'In God we trust', is clutching at straws.


Maximus Decimus Meridius 8 days ago> Gp65

The comment was that Islam functions on basis of their faith

in Allah but this is not present in the west. I replied that faith in

God is present in the west. I never said that US constitution

says Allah is the only God. I pointed out the fact that west is

not an atheist entity. Also I never said that the idea of God is

unique to Islam. tbh my view and belief is that ALL religions

were started by the Almighty God. This includes Hinduism.

This is the reason I consider the ancient Holy men of Hinduism

in high regard and think of them as godly men who the most

virtuous men of their respective ages.


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Gp65 8 days ago

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> Parvez

I understand the spirit of your post and agree. However the notion which is

promoted by Imran that the Nordic countries are so good because they arepracticing Islamic values is simply not grounded in facts.

Atheism is the norm in these countries and not punishable as apostasy. Nor is

their any call on its citizens to attack non-believers. High taxes are collected

from all citizens and not simply from non-believers like jizya was. There is no

mention of democracy in any Quranic verse.


ab199019 days ago

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you should leave usa and preach this lecture in saudi or iraq or syria for greater

results. I would love to see how much time you would have to spend while giving

this lecture in those countries.



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> ab1990

I don't know why people like you just HAVE to comment negatively.

If a person is preaching in USA, you say come to Iraq you lazy person

He comes to Iraq you will say "Go preach to ISIS, not to general populace"

He preaches to extremists and you will say" Stop preaching start fighting"

He fights and dies, then people like you will say ," so what? he should have

killed every ISIS member and extremist before dying".History has shown that pessimists like you never do anything themselves ,

and when anyone else does something they (out of pure jealousy) try to

demean his good works.

You must si

islam needs a reboot

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