deposition of adolfo guevara in dole case

7/25/2019 Deposition of Adolfo Guevara in Dole case

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Exhibit 1

FI2016 Feb-01 P

U.S. DISTRICT

N.D. OF AL

Case 2:15-cv-00506-RDP Document 50-2 Filed 02/01/16 Page 1 of 23


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1/27/2016 Juana Perez 1A, et al. v. Dole Food Company, Inc., et al. Adolfo Enrique Guevara Cantillo

www.DigitalEvidenceGroup.com Digital Evidence Group C'rt 2016 202-232-0646

Page 1

SUPERI OR COURT, STATE OF CALI FORNI A

COUNTY OF LOS ANGELES

____________________________

)

J UANA PEREZ 1A, et al . , ) Case No. BC412620

)

Pl ai nt i f f s, )

)

vs . )

)

DOLE FOOD COMPANY, I NC. , )et al . , )

)

Def endant s. )

____________________________)

Deposi t i on of

ADOLFO ENRI QUE GUEVARA CANTI LLO Test i f yi ng i n hi s i ndi vi dual capaci t y

Bar r anqui l l a Cour t house, Bar r anqui l l a, Col ombi a

Wednesday, J anuary 27, 2016, 9: 33 a. m.

Report ed by: Robert V. Shor t

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

DI GI TAL EVI DENCE GROUP

1730 M St r eet NW, Sui t e 812

Washi ngton, DC 20036

( 202) 232- 0646



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Pages 2 t o 5

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1 Deposition of ADOLFO ENRIQUE GUEVARA

2 CANTILLO, Testifying in his individual capacity,

3 held at the location of:

4

5 Barranquilla Courthouse

6 Especialidad Juzgados:

7 Barranquilla Juzgado8 Calle 40, No. 44-80

9 P-8 Edif. Centro Civico

10 Barranquilla, Colombia

11

12

13 Pursuant to Notice, before Robert V. Short, a

14 Certified Shorthand Reporter.

15

16

17

18

19

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22

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1 A P P E A R A N C E S

2

3 ON BEHALF OF PLAINTIFFS:

4 TERRENCE P. COLLINGSWORTH, ESQ

5 INTERNATIONAL RIGHTS ADVOCATES6 1301 Connecticut Avenue NW, Suite 350

7 Washington, D.C. 20036

8 (202) 527-7997

9 [email protected]

10

11

12 ON BEHALF OF DEFENDANT DOLE FOOD COMPANY, INC.:

13 ANDREA E. NEUMAN, ESQUIRE

14 ANNE CHAMPION, ESQUIRE

15 GIBSON, DUNN & CRUTCHER LLP

16

200 Park Avenue, 47th Floor17 New York, New York 10166-0193

18 (212) 351-4000

19 [email protected]

20 [email protected]

21

22

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1 A P P E A R A N C E S (Cont.)

2

3 ALSO PRESENT:

4

5 JUDGE ALEX DEL VILLAR DELGADO

6 HERNANDO CABEZ, ASSISTANT TO JUDGE

7 INES ZULETA HERNANDEZ, CLERK

8 YVETTE CITIZEN, LEAD/CHECK SPANISH INTERPRETER

9 JESUS RIVERA, LEAD/CHECK SPANISH INTERPRETER

10 DANIEL STROUD, LEGAL VIDEOGRAPHER

11 ROBERT V. SHORT, DEPOSITION OFFICER

12 STEPHANIE LESLIE, DEPOSITION OFFICER

13 ROBERT PERILLO, PARALEGAL, CONRAD & SCHERER

14 XIE JIANING, INTERNATIONAL RIGHTS ADVOCATES

15 GILMA YINETH BAEZA ACOSTA

16 ALMANZA BARRIOS MEDARDO, PRISON GUARD

17

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1 C O N T E N T S

2

3 EXAMINATION OF ADOLFO ENRIQUE GUEVARA PAGE

4 CANTILLO

5

6 BY MR. COLLINGSWORTH 14

7 68

8

9 BY MS. CHAMPION 37

10

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12

13

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Pages 6 t o 9

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1 P R O C E E D I N G S

2 - - -

3 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: Good morning, ladies

4 and gentlemen, we're on video record. The time is

5 9:33 a.m. Today's date is January 27th, 2016.

6 This is Job No. 5914. My name is a

7 Daniel Stroud, I'm your video specialist. The8 court reporter is Robert Short; in collaboration

9 with Digital Evidence Group, located at 1730 M

10 Street NW, Suite 812, Washington, D.C.,

11 [email protected].

12 We are located today at Barranquillo

13 Juzgados Courthouse in Colombia. This case is

14 appearing before the Superior Court of California,

15 County of Los Angeles, entitled Juana Perez 1A,

16 et al., versus Dole Food Company, et al.

17 This is Case No. BC412620.

18

This is the beginning of Video 1 of19 Volume I in the deposition of Adolfo Enrique

20 Guevara Cantillo.

21 This deposition is being produced on

22 behalf of the defendants and noticed on behalf of

Page 7

1 the plaintiffs.

2 You may swear in the witness or state

3 your appearance.

4 (Yvette Citizen assumes the role of lead

5 interpreter and Jesus Rivera assumes the role of6 check interpreter.)

7 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: Are you going to

8 swear the translators first or you want us to

9 appear first?

10 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: And also

11 present here today is the witness, Eduardo

12 Enrique -- no -- Adolfo Enrique Guevara Cantillo.

13 And I would request that the witness confirm his

14 identity by providing his ID, stating his age and

15 his profession or occupation.

16

THE DEPONENT: My name is Adolfo Enrique17 Guevara Cantillo. My ID number --

18 LEAD INTERPRETER: The interpreter

19 doesn't have it.

20 THE DEPONENT: -- I'm 46 years old and my

21 profession is ex-military. And my ID number is

22

Page 8

1 LEAD INTERPRETER: -- - ?

2 CHECK INTERPRETER: -- -

3 THE DEPONENT: -- -

4 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: And so you're

5 here and you have a moral and legal commitment

6 to -- for this declaration. It is a moral

7 commitment, because we are committed to the truth.8 But there are also legal implications.

9 Because if you do not tell the truth, you could be

10 subject to criminal sanctions for providing false

11 testimony, according to our penal code Article 442.

12 And according to the penal code -- the

13 article of the penal code that I just mentioned to

14 you, it indicates that if a person in a judicial or

15 an administrative proceeding does not provide the

16 truth -- either the whole truth or partial truth --

17 the person can be subjected to four to eight years

18

in prison.19 So knowing all of this, Mr. Guevara

20 Cantillo, I will ask you then to take the oath to

21 tell the truth. Please raise your right hand.

22 Do you swear -- do you affirm that you

Page 9

1 will tell the truth in this matter, the whole

2 truth?

3 THE DEPONENT: Yes, I do, I swear.

4 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: And finally,

5 Mr. Guevara, I just want to advise you that6 according to Article 33 of our political

7 constitution of Colombia, a person is not obligated

8 to incriminate themselves or to testify against a

9 spouse, a permanent partner, or a blood

10 relationship.

11 If -- understanding all of this, if you

12 wish to testify, we can proceed.

13 The matter in which you are going to

14 testify about today involves a civil case regarding

15 the survivors of Colombian citizens that were

16

murdered --17 (Lead interpreter and judge converse in Spanish.)

18 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: -- who were

19 allegedly murdered by the self-defense forces. And

20 this allegedly took place between the years of 1997

21 and 2006.

22 The lawsuit has as its objective to --



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1 that Dole Food Company assume responsibility for

2 the alleged murders and the harm that was caused to

3 the alleged victims.

4 On -- on the other hand, the defendants

5 in this case have denied these allegations, and

6 they have stated that they had nothing to do with

7 the facts that are alleged in the lawsuit.8 And so basically the testimony that you

9 will provide today is going to be related to any

10 knowledge that you may have regarding these alleged

11 murders or any harm that had been done and any

12 relationship between the AUC and Dole Company and

13 also any contact that you may have had with the

14 plaintiffs or any other pertinent matters.

15 Do you understand all of this?

16 THE DEPONENT: Yes, sir.

17 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Okay. And now

18

having informed the witness of the previous19 matters, I would now ask, Counsel, as you know, the

20 procedure here is to now ask the witness to provide

21 a narration of the things that he knows.

22 But I know that we are under time

Page 11

1 constraints here. So I'm referring to you,

2 Counsel, if you want to continue with this process

3 or if you would rather just enter into the

4 examination?

5 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: Thank you, Your6 Honor. On behalf of the plaintiffs -- and I can

7 represent that Dole has agreed with this -- the

8 parties would request that we go immediately into

9 our questioning due to the time constraints.

10 Thank you.

11 MR. SHORT: Stipulate to waiver of

12 appearances. Say it.

13 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: And counsel stipulate

14 to a waiver of appearances so that we can proceed.

15 MS. CHAMPION: Dole Food also stipulates

16

to waive the reading of appearances.17 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: We will need the

18 court reporter to swear in the translators and the

19 witness for our record.

20 MS. LESLIE: Do counsel from both sides

21 stipulate that they understand that the reporters

22 are not Notary Publics in this venue, but

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1 nevertheless would like them to administer the

2 oath; and further stipulate that they waive any

3 objection to the validity of the deposition based

4 upon the oath?

5 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: We agree.

6 MS. CHAMPION: Yes, Dole Food agrees.

7 MS. LESLIE: Okay. Will the interpreters8 raise their right hand, please.

9 Do you solemnly state that you will

10 true -- truly and accurately translate the language

11 from English to Spanish and from Spanish to English

12 to the best of your ability, so help you God?

13 LEAD INTERPRETER: I do.

14 CHECK INTERPRETER: I do.

15 MS. LESLIE: Please raise your right

16 hand, Senor Cantillo.

17 Do you solemnly state that the testimony

18

you are about to give in this case shall be the19 truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth,

20 so help you God?

21 THE DEPONENT: Yes, I swear it.

22 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: (Speaking

Page 13

1 Spanish.)

2 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: Your Honor, one quick

3 thing; to be fair to the witness, I think you

4 should advise him that Dole might want to try to

5 take his notes at the end of the proceeding, so6 that he should be aware of that.

7 MS. CHAMPION: I think I would put it a

8 little differently, Your Honor; that if he takes

9 notes related to his testimony here, it becomes a

10 discoverable document and we're entitled to look at

11 it.

12 LEAD INTERPRETER: The witness said "all

13 right."

14 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Mr. Guevara,

15 did you understand what the attorneys have said?

16

THE DEPONENT: Yes, Your Honor.17 It presents no inconvenience to me, Your

18 Honor. Because they're not really notes. I just

19 write down the questions so that I can be resolving

20 them.

21 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: Great. So

22 Ms. Champion has very helpfully handed me a



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Pages 14 t o 17

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1 schedule. Thank you. I'm going to go for 50

2 minutes. At 10:40 on the nose, I am going to stop.

3 And then Dole will go from 10:40 to 11:45. And

4 then I have the last 15 minutes to redirect.

5 MS. CHAMPION: Just -- I just want to

6 note that that assumes we take no breaks,

7 et cetera, which hopefully we can do.8 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: Okay.

9 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Unless some

10 urgent or physiological needs require it.

11 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: Okay. Thank you.

12 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: All right

13 then. Now the attorney for the plaintiff may be

14 heard and he can continue with his examination --

15 or he'll start his examination of the witness.

16 ADOLFO ENRIQUE GUEVARA CANTILLO,

17 after having been duly sworn by Stephanie Leslie,

18

CSR, pursuant to stipulation of counsel, was19 examined and testified through the interpreters as

20 follows:

21 EXAMINATION

22 BY MR. COLLINGSWORTH:

Page 15

1 Q Good morning, Mr. Guevara. I want to

2 thank you for coming today.

3 I am Terry Collingsworth, and I represent

4 some 62 Colombian individuals who had a family

5 member they allege was murdered by the AUC.6 We have filed this case in California,

7 which is why we have this very complicated

8 procedure here. And we're here to gather evidence

9 in the plaintiffs' case against Dole Food, alleging

10 Dole's responsibility for the murders.

11 I'm going to be asking you a number of

12 questions about the facts. And I just want to ask

13 you to please, if you're not clear on what I'm

14 asking or there's any issue at all, to stop and ask

15 me to clarify, please.

16

A Si.17 Q Have you and I ever met before or had any

18 discussions before?

19 A No, sir, none at all.

20 Q Can you please tell us your military

21 service record, just when did you start and what

22 was your rank and so on?

Page 16

1 A I entered the military cadet school,

2 General Jose Maria Cordoba in the city of Santa Fe,

3 Bogota, in the year of '91. I graduated as a

4 sublieutenant of the army in the year '93 --

5 (Lead interpreter and deponent converse in

6 Spanish.)

7 A -- '93. And then I was sent to training8 in counter-guerilla matters and also in -- for

9 parachuting techniques. And subsequently I was

10 sent to Battalion No. 42 in Bombona in the city of

11 Puerto de Rio Antioquia.

12 From there I was transferred to Cartago

13 Valle, to Battalion 23 Vencedores.

14 From there I was promoted to

15 lieutenant --

16 LEAD INTERPRETER: And the interpreter

17 needs to clarify or re-ask the name and number of

18

the battalion.19 (Lead interpreter and deponent converse in

20 Spanish.)

21 THE DEPONENT: -- and then I was sent to

22 the Bomba Brigade No. 1, to the counter-guerilla

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1 Battalion No. 21. And after that I was transferred

2 to GAULA, of the Atlantic, del Atlantico, which is

3 based here in the city of Barranquilla. And that

4 took place 1998.

5 And at the end of 1999 I was called or6 asked to take a course to become a captain. And so

7 I took that course until June of 2000, and then I

8 was transferred to the Department of Pichar. And

9 then in 2002 I was transferred to El GAULA of

10 Magdalena. And there my duties were to be as a

11 second in -- second commander and intelligence --


13 Spanish.)

14 THE DEPONENT: -- and chief of

15 intelligence.

16

In 2004 I was sent to take FBI courses,17 to Washington, D.C.; and as I said, I was trained

18 in counter-guerilla tactics and parachuting. I

19 have two medals for the public order, one for Jose

20 Maria Cordoba, and two medals for distinguished

21 service --




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1 Spanish.)

2 THE DEPONENT: -- in liberating

3 personnel. It's called Order of Liberty. And also

4 the Ayacucho medal for infantry soldiers. That is

5 a brief summary of what my life was within the

6 legality of the military.

7 BY MR. COLLINGSWORTH:8 Q Thank you very much.

9 At some point in your military service,

10 you began also working with Jorge 40; is that

11 correct?

12 A Yes, sir.

13 Q And when was that?

14 A I've known commander -- my commander

15 since 1998, when I started working in the GAULA of

16 the Atlantic. That is the point that I started

17 working with him.

18

Q And when you were work -- let's let the19 record be clear.

20 What is Jorge 40's real name, please?

21 A Rodrigo Tovar Pupo.

22 Q When you started working with him in

Page 19

1 1998, what was your understanding of what his

2 position was?

3 A I'm sorry, the position of who?

4 Q Of Jorge 40.

5 A My Commander 40, it was my understanding6 he was the commander of El Cesar, Magdalena, La

7 Guajira, Atlantico. He was in control of those

8 regions.

9 Q Did he have a title of some sort in the

10 AUC?

11 A Yes. He was a commander, but I wouldn't

12 know how to tell you this. Well, see, at that time

13 it was still not known as the Northern Bloc or

14 Bloque Norte.

15 Q But at some point he became known as the

16

commander of the Northern Bloc; is that correct?17 A Yes. He was considered the commander of

18 the Northern Bloc. Once the Mancuso was

19 demobilized, he assumed the position of commander

20 of the Northern Bloc.

21 Q While you were working with Jorge 40 in

22 the AUC, did you have a nickname, something they

Page 20

1 called you in the AUC?

2 A Yes. I had various aliases.

3 Q Can you tell us the ones you can recall?

4 A Jonathan, Alejandro, 101. Those are the

5 ones I remember at this moment.

6 Q Thank you. The -- from -- when did you

7 stop working with Jorge 40 and the AUC?8 A Well, I stopped working -- well, I think

9 I'm still his worker even now.

10 Q When did you stop having an active

11 role -- maybe let's ask, when did you go to jail?

12 A Well, when I stopped committing crimes or

13 it was when I demobilized in 2006.

14 Q You were a very well-regarded and

15 promoted military officer.

16 So why -- why did you decide to also work

17 with the AUC?

18

What was your purpose?19 MS. CHAMPION: Objection -- permission to

20 object, Your Honor.

21 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Go ahead.

22 MS. CHAMPION: I simply object to

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1 counsel's characterization before the question. I

2 don't think that that is in the record.

3 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Answer.

4 THE DEPONENT: No, every time --

5 because -- well, see, I didn't go over and start6 working with the AU -- with the self-defense units.

7 I -- what -- I made public a reality that the

8 Colombian public was denying --

9 MR. PERILLO: "The Colombian state."

10 LEAD INTERPRETER: "The Colombian state,"

11 thank you.

12 THE DEPONENT: -- the Colombian state was

13 denying. I was opposed to that situation, so I

14 chose to request my retirement. It was a voluntary

15 retirement that I solicited. I just want to

16

clarify that I never actually was retired by the17 army.

18 And the reason for my leaving was my --

19 is because I didn't agree with the way things were

20 being carried out. I was not in agreement with the

21 way the public armed forces were dealing with these

22 matters.



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2 Q Thank you. Was there something -- what

3 did you want to do instead?

4 What -- what was the source of your

5 disagreement?

6 A From awhile back, we had started seeing

7 what is now called false positives. There was not8 a real will by the -- or from the -- from the

9 army -- from the armed forces at that time. They

10 were not willing to fight the subversion head-on.

11 And I identified with the frontal manner that the

12 AUC had to end with this problem.

13 Q Since you mentioned "false positives,"

14 can you briefly explain what that term means for

15 the record, please?

16 A False positives were executions that were

17 presented as operational results by the different

18

forces; police, army, armed forces --19 CHECK INTERPRETER: "Navy."

20 THE DEPONENT: -- navy, who would make

21 agreements with illegal groups to deliver people to

22 be executed and then presented as if they had died

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1 in combat.


3 Q And you've -- I've seen some interviews

4 you've done in the press.

5 You have said that this was state policy6 to use the false positives; is that correct?

7 A Yes, that is correct. It is so correct

8 that General Navarrete at this moment -- at this

9 time he's the commander of the first division

10 having been accused of killing several people

11 outside of combat. Facts that I demonstrated. And

12 he was part of my payroll when I was a commander --


14 Spanish.)

15 A -- with the front Martires de Valledupar.

16

MR. PERILLO: "Of Valledupar."17 THE DEPONENT: Of Valledupar, Martyrs of

18 Valledupar. This demonstrates the lack of interest

19 of the state -- or very little interest they have

20 to actually bring clarification to what happened,

21 to these facts; and also a lack of willingness to

22 show the violations of human rights.

Page 24


2 Q Thank you. As I have very limited time,

3 I'm going to have to shift to focus on another

4 issue.

5 While you were working with Jorge 40, did

6 you have knowledge of any companies, either in

7 Magdalena or Cesar who were providing financial8 support or other support to the AUC?

9 MS. CHAMPION: Permission to object, Your

10 Honor.

11 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Go ahead.

12 MS. CHAMPION: The question is irrelevant

13 to the extent it relates to Cesar.

14 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: The witness

15 can answer the question.

16 THE DEPONENT: It's about what?

17 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: I can repeat the

18

question.19 Q While you were working with Jorge 40, did

20 you have knowledge that his front was receiving

21 financial support or other support from any private

22 companies in the Magdalena area or in Cesar?

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1 A No. Nobody -- nobody can affirm that

2 that -- that a company -- nobody can confirm that,

3 that a -- that a company had supported him.

4 But I can affirm this -- what I -- what

5 can be affirmed is that all -- all of the6 businesses, the cattle people, the banana growers,

7 the palm growers, the mango vendors -- all the

8 agricultural businesses -- they all contributed to

9 the AUC. All of them contributed in a way that you

10 could call almost voluntary.

11 But what happens is that times have

12 changed. And in times of peace, it's very easy to

13 criticize the war. So nowadays everybody's talking

14 and criticizing about the methods that were used

15 then.

16

But nobody remembers when you couldn't17 move through the highways or the roads or you

18 couldn't -- people couldn't go to their farms,

19 couldn't visit their families.

20 And it was very easy for us to be

21 considered from vict- -- to abusers of the people

22 in the zone that we liberated at one time.



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2 Q So let's focus on when the war was going

3 on. I understand what you've just said. You've

4 testified that all of the companies that were

5 operating in those areas supported the AUC.

6 MS. CHAMPION: Permission to object.

7 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Yes, yes,8 absolutely.

9 MS. CHAMPION: The question misstates the

10 witness' testimony and it lacks foundation. He did

11 not say all the companies paid. He said ranchers,

12 farmers, et cetera, not "companies."

13 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Restate your

14 question.

15 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: Sure.

16 Q Let me -- let me restate the question so

17 there's no -- no error on the record.

18

A But I understand clearly what the19 question is --

20 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Witness, turn

21 off your microphone and wait for the attorney to

22 restate the question.

Page 27


2 Q Permission -- I'm just going to restate

3 the question. And let's just focus on the banana

4 companies.

5 Are -- are you aware of whether the6 banana companies that were operating in Magdalena

7 were among the various growers who supported and

8 collaborated with the AUC?


10 Honor.

11 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Proceed,

12 proceed.

13 MS. CHAMPION: The question is overbroad

14 to the extent it pertains to "banana companies."

15 This case is not about banana companies. It also

16

misstates the witness' testimony again.17 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Witness,

18 answer the question.

19 THE DEPONENT: First of all, I didn't say

20 the companies supported. I said that it was

21 impossible for someone -- for a person to attest

22 that the companies contributed or supported the

Page 28

1 self-defense units.

2 As I spoke when I -- in my previous

3 answer, I said that certain people -- real persons

4 collaborated with the self-defense units on their

5 own behalf.


7 Q Are you personally aware of any banana8 plantations in Magdalena where the plantation owner

9 or manager collaborated or supported the AUC?

10 A I think -- I think that a person

11 collaborates either through action or omission.

12 And when I was in the legal sector in a battalion,

13 all of them -- all of them, all of them -- I am

14 speaking about all of them.

15 All the plantations devoted to any type

16 of activity, due to either out of fear or due to

17 conviction, they collaborated with the self-defense

18

units. At that time the population preferred the19 self-defense units than to continue under the

20 oppression of the FARC --

21 Q Thank you.


Page 29

1 Spanish.)

2 A -- the pressure.

3 LEAD INTERPRETER: Interpreter

4 correction: Not "oppression," "pressure of the

5 FARC."6 BY MR. COLLINGSWORTH:

7 Q Thank you.

8 Can you describe what the AUC was able to

9 do for the banana plantations in Magdalena once

10 they decided to take action there?

11 A No. We can't talk about that it was for

12 the banana plantations. I think the AUC, what they

13 did was for the businesses, the plantations, the

14 growers, just for the population in general. What

15 they did is take the guerillas out of their area

16

and allow them to live in peace.17 Q Do you know, in your personal knowledge,

18 did the Dole Company have plantations -- did you

19 ever see evidence of Dole plantations in the banana

20 zone in Magdalena?

21 A I saw containers for the Dole Company.

22 But, I mean, do I have like -- can I attest to the



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Pages 30 t o 33

Page 30

1 fact that this certain plantation belonged to the

2 Dole Company? Well, I -- I wouldn't be able to

3 confirm that.

4 Q Do you know of a -- another AUC commander

5 who's known as Carlos Tijeras?

6 A Yes. Yes, I know him.

7 Q Can you tell us what his position was?8 A He was a commander of the William Rivas

9 Front that operated in the zona bananera region.

10 Q Did you interact with him, coordinate

11 with him?

12 A Yes.

13 Q In what way?

14 A Whenever -- whenever we were going to

15 carry out some type of joint operation, whenever we

16 had to mobilize or move personnel, transport war

17 material in their battalion vehicles or transport

18

personnel.19 Q Was he beneath you in the command

20 structure?

21 A No. We had the same rank within the

22 organization. I'm talking about when I was within

Page 31

1 the --

2 MR. PERILLO: GAULA.

3 THE DEPONENT: -- GAULA -- okay. The

4 army's GAULA.

5 BY MR. COLLINGSWORTH:6 Q So while you were in the army, the army

7 coordinated with people like Carlos Tijeras in --

8 in the ways that you've described?

9 A Yes, of course. I told you I was part of

10 the self-defense units and the army since 1998.

11 Q I just need the record to be clear, sir.

12 Thank you.

13 Were -- were you ever given an order to

14 kill Carlos Tijeras?

15 A Yes, sir.

16

Q From whom did you receive that order?17 A From General Mario Montoya.

18 Q And do you know where the general

19 received his direction?

20 A That order directly or indirectly came

21 from the presidency after the death of the mayor of

22 the banana zone, a gentleman who's last name was

Page 32

1 Miranda.

2 Q Thank you. Again so the record is clear,

3 so did Carlos Tijeras kill the mayor of zona

4 bananera and -- that you've just named, and then

5 you were directed to kill Carlos Tijeras?

6 Is that what you've said?

7 A Yes. General Montoya knew that I had a8 close relationship with the AUC. And it was very

9 easy to ask for a meeting for Tijeras -- to ask

10 Tijeras to meet with me.

11 And at that moment I was supposed to lay

12 him down or kill him. And I said I wouldn't do

13 that. And at that point I asked to leave the armed

14 forces immediately.

15 Q What information do you have that -- at

16 the -- the present -- strike that.

17 The president at this time was Mr. Uribe;

18

is that correct?19 A Yes.

20 Q And what information -- what information

21 do you have that the order to you to kill Carlos

22 Tijeras came from the presidency?

Page 33

1 A That, I believe, is in a video -- I

2 believe that should be in a video that -- or in one

3 of those community council meetings that Mr. Uribe

4 used to carry out during that time period.

5 If my memory doesn't fail me, that was in6 the Hotel Santa -- Santa Mara, where he gives the

7 order to General Montoya, in a public manner, that

8 he needed to capture or eliminate that delinquent,

9 that criminal.

10 Q Going back -- thank you.

11 Going back to Jorge 40, did you have any

12 knowledge at all about how he managed to pay for

13 all of the men under arms that were under his

14 command?

15 A Yes, of course.

16

Q Can you tell me what you know, please?17 A I can say what I can attest to, what I

18 know. I was also a front commander. And I had 600

19 men under my command of the AUC. I was commander

20 of the north and Cesar and all of Southern Guijara,

21 including part of Sierra Nevada and the Serrania

22 Del Perija.



11/23



Pages 34 t o 37

Page 34

1 My Commander 40, he didn't send me money

2 to pay for -- to pay my men. Me, as a front

3 commander, I had to answer for the payment for all

4 of the expenses of my front. That's how it was

5 known if I could grow or if I wasn't able to grow.

6 And I made the -- I paid it -- I

7 maintained it with the collection for payments for8 hectares, for collection of gasoline, through

9 contracts.

10 Based on all of this, I would then -- I

11 would collect funds, based on all of this. And

12 each commander, according to my Commander 40's

13 orders, was supposed to be autonomous with his men.

14 Q In your front's op- -- in your front's

15 operations in Cesar, did you collect any funds or

16 receive any assistance from the Drummond Company?


18

JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Proceed.19 MS. CHAMPION: Your Honor, obviously

20 Drummond has nothing to do with this case. It's a

21 separate company, not a defendant here, nothing to

22 do with this case. This question is irrelevant.

Page 35


2 question, Counselor.

3 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: Your Honor, if I may,

4 one of our theories is that other companies --

5 Chiquita has pled guilty in U.S. court for6 supporting the AUC. And Dole denies it. One of

7 our theories is that every company paid.

8 And so if I could confirm that the

9 Drummond Company -- another American company -- was

10 supporting the AUC, it supports my theory that it's

11 impossible that Dole did not pay.

12 MS. CHAMPION: That's ridiculous.


14 question and formulate it in such that --

15 (Lead interpreter and judge converse in Spanish.)

16

JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: That it has to17 do with Dole -- in what pertains Dole.

18 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: I'll ask a different

19 question.

20 Q Mr. Guevara, just today, I appreciate

21 your testimony, and I think you've been very honest

22 with me, and I want to thank you.

Page 36

1 I'm wondering whether you yourself have

2 security concerns about yourself or your family

3 because you're speaking out against these powerful

4 interests that are still out free?



7 Spanish.)8 MS. CHAMPION: It's irrelevant.

9 What's the relevance?

10 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Answer the

11 question, Witness.

12 THE DEPONENT: No, no, no. Not me, no.

13 I lost my fear a long time ago.


15 Q Have you taken any security measures for

16 your family that's outside of the prison?

17 MS. CHAMPION: Counsel, time.

18

MR. COLLINGSWORTH: I've got one minute.19 THE DEPONENT: Yes. Yes, but not because

20 of these matters. I've done it because of the

21 Colombian state, because of the military forces and

22 the political classes. That's the real mafia.

Page 37

1 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: Thank you very much.

2 (Jesus Rivera assumes the role of lead interpreter

3 and Yvette Citizen assumes the

4 role of check interpreter.)

5 EXAMINATION6 BY MS. CHAMPION:

7 Q Hello, Mr. Guevara -- hello, Mr. Guevara,

8 I'm going to ask you some questions now. I

9 represent Dole Food in this case.

10 CHECK INTERPRETER: The interpreter is

11 going to ask the other interpreter if he wants to

12 switch seats.

13 LEAD INTERPRETER: No, no.

14 THE DEPONENT: I will assist you.

15 BY MS. CHAMPION:

16

Q Can you tell me what GAULA was?17 A (Speaking Spanish.)

18 Q What does it stand for?

19 MR. SHORT: Wait.

20 MS. CHAMPION: Oh, sorry.

21 THE DEPONENT: GAULA is -- it's the

22 unified action group for liberating personnel. It



12/23



Pages 38 t o 41

Page 38

1 is an anti-kidnapping unit.

2 BY MS. CHAMPION:

3 Q Is it an acronym?

4 A Yes, GAULA incorporates that name.

5 Q Can you tell me what the letters stand

6 for?

7 A (Speaking Spanish.)8 Q Okay. Thank you --

9 A It's the unified action group for

10 liberating personnel.

11 Q So when you were a member of GAULA, your

12 commander was Mario Montoya?


14 Spanish.)

15 A Well, he was the division commander, and

16 the GAULA belonged to the division. And that

17 commander was Major Edgar Ivan Quinones Calderon --

18

LEAD INTERPRETER: Excuse me.19 THE DEPONENT: -- Cardenas.

20 BY MS. CHAMPION:

21 Q And when you were in GAULA, you carried

22 out assassinations; is that correct?

Page 39

1 A Yes, that's correct.

2 Q How many people would you say you killed

3 while you were in GAULA?

4 A Personally, myself, I killed six, seven,

5 at that time. I don't recall exactly, but it was6 more than six --

7 LEAD INTERPRETER: Or, excuse me.

8 THE DEPONENT: -- it was not more than

9 six.

10 BY MS. CHAMPION:

11 Q And were other assassinations carried out

12 at your direction?

13 A No. I would execute those personally,

14 those were executions I carried out personally.

15 Q And you carried out those assassinations

16

because you were directed to do so by your military17 superiors; is that correct?

18 A Yes, that's correct.

19 Q And so when you left GAULA to join the

20 AUC, you did so voluntarily, you testified earlier;

21 is that correct?

22 A Yes. I retired voluntarily from the

Page 40

1 military forces.

2 Q To join the AUC?

3 A No. I had already been a member for many

4 years prior.

5 Q Can you tell me the date in which you

6 consider yourself to have joined the AUC?

7 A In September of 1988.8 Q The AUC killed many people also, did it

9 not?

10 A Yes, yes.

11 Q And was Jorge 40 your commander the whole

12 time that you were in the AUC?

13 A Yes, of course, from the moment I joined.

14 Q And isn't it accurate that Jorge 40 has

15 admitted responsibility for dozens of murders?

16 A Yes, I believe so. I believe he has

17 admitted to many cases as a perpetrator --

18

LEAD INTERPRETER: Strike that.19 THE DEPONENT: -- as an author.

20 BY MS. CHAMPION:

21 Q And you testified earlier that you still

22 consider yourself a member of the AUC, even to this

Page 41

1 day?

2 A No, not a member of the AUC, because it

3 no longer exists. I consider myself a friend of my

4 commander, Jorge 40.

5 Q And the forces that you commanded while6 you were in the AUC, I believe you said it was a

7 few hundred men -- 600 men; is that correct?

8 A Yes, approximately 600 men.

9 Q And the area in which that force

10 operated -- I just want to be clear -- you said

11 Guajira, Cesar, anywhere else?

12 A No. It was northern Cesar and southern

13 Guajira -- La Guajira.

14 Q Thank you. And those are provinces; is

15 that correct, or departments, as you may call them

16

here?17 A Well, no, I operated in northern Cesar,

18 that is a department. And I also operated in

19 southern La Guajira, another department. And those

20 two areas were joined, and that's where I operated.

21 Q I understand. Magdalena is a separate

22 department; is that correct?



13/23



Pages 42 t o 45

Page 42

1 A Yes, that's a different department.

2 Q Did you personally make an agreement with

3 anyone in Magdalena to provide support to the AUC?

4 A Could you please repeat the question?

5 Q I'll make it a little more specific.

6 Did you personally make any agreement

7 with any farmer, rancher, grower, in Magdalena to8 provide monetary support for the AUC?

9 A No. When I was in Magdalena, I was not

10 openly from the AUC. I was in the AUC, but I was

11 from GAULA.

12 Q So the answer to my question is: "No"?

13 A "No," that's correct.

14 Q Thank you.

15 And were you ever responsible for

16 collecting money for the AUC in Magdalena?

17 A No. I understand that -- well, I don't

18

know if in Magdalena it was different, but in Cesar19 those monies were collected by my commander,

20 Jorge 40.

21 Q And have you seen -- are you in

22 possession of any documents that reflect any

Page 43

1 payments received by the AUC from anyone in

2 Magdalena?

3 A No. No, that doesn't exist.

4 Q I wanted to clarify something that you

5 said earlier as well, which is: Where you were in6 2- -- the year 2000, you said departmiento de

7 Pichar the Pichar department or something?

8 What was that? I didn't catch it.

9 A Bichada, Bichada. Bichada.

10 MR. PERILLO: With a D, "Bichada."

11 THE DEPONENT: Yes. It's in the -- it's

12 in the eastern area, in the south.

13 MR. PERILLO: It's right there

14 (indicating).

15 MS. CHAMPION: Okay. Thank you. I see

16

it now.17 Q It's in the far east of the country,

18 nowhere near the coast; is that correct?

19 A Correct.

20 Q And so the time period that you were in

21 Magdalena began in 2002; is that correct?

22 A That's correct.

Page 44

1 Q And you were there until 2004, when you

2 went to Washington, D.C.?

3 A Yes. In 2004, when I retired from GAULA

4 and I continued with the AUC.

5 Q So you never commanded AUC forces in

6 Magdalena; is that correct?

7 A Yes. In other areas of Magdalena, yes,8 like in Pibijay, in Remolino --

9 LEAD INTERPRETER: Interpreter needs to

10 inquire.


12 Spanish.)

13 THE DEPONENT: -- but not in the northern

14 part of zona bananera, no.

15 BY MS. CHAMPION:

16 Q Okay. And what were the time periods in

17 which you commanded AUC forces outside the banana

18

zone in Magdalena?19 A In '98 and '99, when I was with GAULA

20 from the Atlantico province, I would go and direct

21 AUC forces in that area.

22 Q But you never commanded AUC forces in the

Page 45

1 banana zone when you were with GAULA or afterwards;

2 is that correct?

3 A No. Being in charge of the AUC -- AUC

4 forces in zona bananera, I never did that.

5 Q You testified about how you collected6 money for your troops in Cesar and Guajira. You

7 said that you got money from contracts.

8 What did you mean by that?

9 A It was contracts carried out by the

10 state, contracts executed by the state.

11 Q Public contracts; is that accurate?

12 A Yes, with hospitals or municipalities,

13 municipal governments, or -- or government --

14 governments.

15 Q Are you aware that Carlos Tijeras, also

16

known as Jose Gregorio Mangones Lugo -- did I get17 that right -- has provided a declaration in this

18 case?

19 A No. I don't know what Jose Gregorio may

20 have said.

21 Q Mr. Mangones said that when he arrived in

22 Magdalena, there was a lot of FARC there.



14/23



Pages 46 t o 49

Page 46

1 Is that accurate to your knowledge?

2 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: Permission to object.


4 Spanish.)

5 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: I -- I -- I withdraw,

6 sorry.

7 THE DEPONENT: Yes, that's correct.8 BY MS. CHAMPION:

9 Q And so at that time the AUC did not, in

10 fact, have control of all of Magdalena; is that

11 correct?

12 A No. No, that was not -- there was no --

13 there was no full control. There was partial

14 control.

15 Q Now, you testified that you stopped

16 committing crimes in 2006 or '7.

17 What year was it?

18

A No, in 2006 -- in March of 2006, when the19 demobilization took place.

20 Q And you've been convicted of multiple

21 crimes; is that correct?

22 A Yes -- already, yes.

Page 47

1 Q Including several homicides?

2 A Yes.

3 Q At least -- how many homicides?

4 At least five?

5 A You mean convictions or pending --6 convictions pending?

7 Q Let's cover the convictions first.

8 A For the convictions, I think it's three

9 or four, something like that.

10 Q And you still have pending murder

11 charges; is that correct?

12 A Yes. They're -- they're pending my

13 acknowledgment.

14 Q How many?

15 A Around 60, more or less.

16

Q Wow. You've also been convicted of17 theft; is that correct?

18 A Yes, for that -- for that as well, theft.

19 Q How many counts?

20 A I don't have a number for that.

21 Q And you've been convicted of conspiracy?

22 A Conspiracy to commit a crime.

Page 48

1 Q Conspiracy to commit what crime?

2 A For belonging to the AUC.

3 Q And going back to the theft charges, you

4 said you didn't know how many.

5 Are there more than six, less than six?

6 A No, no, no. For -- for the theft there

7 was -- there was one, one case. A taxicab was8 stolen, stolen by people that were under my --

9 under my command. And so I acknowledge that based

10 on the chain of command.

11 Q So you said you have about 60 pending

12 murder charges.

13 Do you have any other pending criminal

14 charges?

15 A Yes. All the false positives that the

16 state has not yet investigated.

17 Q Anything else?

18

A No, I don't believe there's any more.19 Q And I believe you've also been convicted

20 of illicit recruitment; is that correct?

21 A Yes, that's correct, for not having asked

22 the -- the illegals for their identification

Page 49

1 number.

2 Q Who are you referring to when you say

3 "illegals"?

4 A Yes, when I arrived there, the -- the

5 bloc -- the front was already set up. And6 according to -- to the law, I should have asked the

7 members for their identification number, to see who

8 was a minor or who was of age. That's why I was

9 convicted.

10 Q Did you say the bloc was already set up?

11 A The front. I was a front commander.

12 Q The AUC front?

13 A Yes, the front in the -- and the AUC.

14 Q And the front, of which you were a

15 member, was called the Martyrs of Valledupar.

16

Correct?17 A Yes, I was a commander of the front.

18 Q Oh, it's Valledupar?

19 A Yes. It was La Paz, El Molino,

20 Las Aguas, San Diego, Urumita, Manaure, Villanueva,

21 all the way down to San Juan, El Batallon Rendon

22 and down to there.



15/23



Pages 50 t o 53

Page 50

1 Then that was -- that was the area of

2 south of northern Cesar and southern La Guijara,

3 which I commanded. And Valledupar includes those

4 30 districts -- 30 districts.

5 Q Okay. Thank you. Is it also known as

6 the Martyrs of Cesar for short?

7 A It's Martyrs of the -- of Valledupar.8 Q You know Ivan Otero; is that correct?

9 A Yes.

10 Q Is he your attorney?

11 How do you know him?

12 A No. He provided services, he provided

13 services for some guys who were part of the

14 organization.

15 Q Did he provide services to

16 paramillitaries before the demobilization?

17 LEAD INTERPRETER: I need to inquire.

18

(Lead interpreter and deponent converse in19 Spanish.)

20 THE DEPONENT: Yes, yes, yes. He

21 provided services to some of the guys in the

22 organization who -- who fell off, who were taken or

Page 51

1 were captured, you know, doing jobs.

2 BY MS. CHAMPION:

3 Q Were captured by the authorities before

4 the demobilization; is that correct?

5 A Yes, yes, yes, that.6 Q Do you know how far back that activity

7 goes?

8 A From what I know -- from what I'm aware

9 of, up to the demobilization.

10 Q Did the AUC pay his fees?

11 A Well, I would pay them to him. I would

12 pay them to him when it involved my people.

13 Q Do you know whether other AUC commanders

14 also paid him for work involving their men?

15 A No, no, no. Every commander was

16

autonomous regarding what he did.17 Q Have you ever met with him to talk about

18 providing testimony for this case or any other case

19 in the U.S.?

20 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: As counsel has

21 objected to my efforts to talk about other cases,

22 the question should be restricted to the Dole case.

Page 52

1 MS. CHAMPION: I would like to respond

2 briefly, Your Honor. Counsel -- I'm a little

3 surprised by that objection, only because Counsel

4 has admitted that the witnesses in this case, as

5 well as in the Chiquita, case overlap completely;

6 therefore, their discussions or negotiations with

7 witnesses in the Chiquita case cannot be separated8 from the ones in this case; in addition, with

9 respect to the Drummond case, there is also overlap

10 of witnesses.

11 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Defining

12 "overlap."

13 (Lead interpreter and judge converse in Spanish.)

14 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: Your Honor, counsel

15 can't have it both ways. If she wants to ask him

16 about Drummond, then I should be able to ask him

17 about Drummond.

18

JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: I will not19 allow the question, because it's -- we said it

20 earlier, we're going to limit ourselves to the Dole

21 case, as well as it what was stated to me in the

22 letter rogatory.

Page 53

1 MS. CHAMPION: Your Honor, I -- I believe

2 I should at least be able to ask about Chiquita.

3 They've admitted that their witnesses are exactly

4 the same in both cases.

5 And if they paid him or made any6 negotiations with him with respect to the Chiquita

7 case, there's no distinction between this case and

8 that case with respect to a payment to a witness or

9 a negotiation with a witness.

10 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: On a previous

11 occasion counsel for the plaintiffs asked about

12 Drummond, something like that.

13 And on that occasion, I did not allow the

14 question from the counsel because it did not

15 pertain to the Dole case.

16

So in -- in this occasion we're also17 going to focus on the Dole case. So continue with

18 your examination.

19 MS. CHAMPION: Respectfully, Your Honor,

20 whether Chiquita made a payment and whether Dole

21 made a payment are completely separate issues.

22 Whether they paid a witness to provide



16/23



Pages 54 t o 57

Page 54

1 testimony regarding Chiquita and Dole, as all of

2 their declarations that they've gathered from AUC

3 witnesses do, those are obviously related. It's

4 not apples -- it's not apples to apples, it's

5 apples and oranges.

6 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: And I

7 insist -- I insist. In the letter with the8 commission that was entrusted to me, it states that

9 the matters to be discussed have to do with Dole.

10 In this case, for this witness Guevara Cantillo, he

11 was being asked about the murders of the plaintiffs

12 suing Dole.

13 MS. CHAMPION: Your Honor --

14 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Excuse me.

15 And so, therefore, that is outside the authority

16 and the request that was made to me by the letter

17 of rogatory.

18

So we're going to discipline and control19 the examination and focus on this subject matter of

20 Dole. Because anything else is outside my sphere

21 of authorization and outside of what is being

22 requested in the letter rogatory.

Page 55

1 MS. CHAMPION: I would just like to

2 maintain this objection for resolution by the court

3 in California, Your Honor. Because that court has

4 already ruled that payments to AUC witnesses in all

5 of these cases need to be -- we are entitled to6 discovery regarding them, whether they're to

7 Drummond witnesses or Chiquita witnesses, precisely

8 because of this overlap.

9 I'm also holding their discovery

10 responses. The plaintiffs own discovery response

11 in this case says, "Any response as to the Chiquita

12 litigation is identical to this response as to the

13 Dole litigation."

14 And this is a question about any meetings

15 with witnesses for this case. And they say right

16

there that it's identical. So I will just maintain17 the objection.

18 But if Your Honor would like me to

19 restrict my question, I can do that. I understand

20 also that we're out of videotape, so we need to

21 take a short break.

22 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: We're going off the

Page 56

1 record. The time is 11:20 a.m.

2 This'll be the end of Video 1, Volume I.

3 (Brief recess taken.)

4 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: We're back on the

5 record. The time is 11:29 a.m. This marks the

6 beginning of Video 2, Volume I. You may continue.

7 BY MS. CHAMPION:8 Q Have you been offered any money by

9 Mr. Collingsworth?

10 A Excuse me, can you please repeat the

11 question?

12 Q Sure. Has Mr. Collingsworth, the

13 gentleman sitting here (indicating), offered you

14 any money?

15 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: (Gesturing.)

16 THE DEPONENT: No, I've never seen him

17 before.

18

BY MS. CHAMPION:19 Q Are you aware of him offering money to

20 any other former paramilitaries?

21 A No, no.

22 I could not state something like that.

Page 57

1 Q Has Mr. Otero offered you any money?


3 Spanish.)

4 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: Objection, the

5 question is vague, he -- for what purpose?6 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Restate your

7 question.

8 BY MS. CHAMPION:

9 Q Has Mr. Otero offered you any money in

10 connection with providing testimony?

11 A Mr. Otero visited me -- well, he went to

12 jail -- to the jail four or five days ago. But I

13 did not meet with him.

14 I am ill currently, have cancer, and I

15 had a very high fever. But he sent word with a guy

16

who works for me regarding the purpose of his17 visit.

18 And regarding my collaboration with the

19 matter that I have pending --

20 LEAD INTERPRETER: Excuse me.


22 Spanish.)



17/23



Pages 58 t o 61

Page 58

1 MS. CHAMPION: Declaration.

2 THE DEPONENT: -- regarding a declaration

3 in the matter that I have pending. And I told him

4 that I didn't, that I was not, because fortunately

5 at this moment I didn't need any money.

6 BY MS. CHAMPION:

7 Q So he offered to pay you for a8 declaration; is that correct?


10 Spanish.)

11 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: Objection, that

12 misstates his testimony.

13 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Answer the

14 question.

15 THE DEPONENT: Yes. Yes, he was offering

16 to me. But I told him I didn't need the money.

17 BY MS. CHAMPION:

18

Q Did he ask you to say that -- did he tell19 you that he wanted the declaration to say something

20 specific?

21 A Yes. What he -- the message -- the

22 message that he conveyed was to help him, to help

Page 59

1 him in this case.

2 Q In this case?

3 A Yes. Yes, in this case.

4 Q Are you aware of him making a similar

5 offer to any other witnesses?6 A No. I cannot state that, I only state

7 what I can prove.

8 Q Has anyone ever told you that he made

9 such an offer to them?

10 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: Objection, calls for

11 hearsay.

12 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: The witness

13 may answer.

14 THE DEPONENT: No, no. Because I imagine

15 that everybody's looking for his own best interests

16

and they're not going to tell you about it, much17 less when people are needing money.

18 BY MS. CHAMPION:

19 Q I'm confused by your answer.

20 Are you telling me that you haven't --

21 that no one has ever told you that Mr. Otero made

22 such an offer to them or that you don't want to

Page 60

1 tell me whether anyone has told you that?

2 A No. What I want to tell you is that no

3 one has told me if he has been offered money or

4 not. I am speaking about what happened to me, what

5 I can show that has happened to me.

6 Q Are you familiar with any witnesses that

7 have provided declarations related to this case?8 A Yes, of course.

9 Q Such as who?

10 A Isn't Canoso in the list of witnesses in

11 this case?

12 Q Do you know his real name?

13 Yes, I do believe he is a witness in this

14 case.

15 A Gelvez Al Barracin is the last name -- Al

16 Barracin. Yes.


18

Spanish.)19 BY MS. CHAMPION:

20 Q Do you know whether he was offered any

21 benefits in connection with providing testimony?

22 A No. But what I do know, that he is a --

Page 61

1 he lies all the way from here to China. What I do

2 know, that he was -- that he never was -- he was

3 never a member of --


5 Spanish.)6 A -- he was never -- nor did he have

7 anything to do with the AUC -- he had nothing to do

8 with the AUC.


10 Spanish.)

11 LEAD INTERPRETER: I need to --


13 Spanish.)

14 THE DEPONENT: Yes, he's a -- he's like a

15 stooge. He's like a -- he's like a -- he's

16

easily -- somebody who's easily handled, like a17 stooge.

18 BY MS. CHAMPION:

19 Q Easily manipulated; is that what you

20 mean?

21 A Yes, he's manipulated. And as I say, he

22 never had any position, nor did he have any



18/23



Pages 62 t o 65

Page 62

1 responsibility, within the organization.

2 Q So based on your knowledge of him, you

3 believe that someone could influence his testimony?


5 Spanish.)

6 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: Objection, misstates

7 his testimony and is leading.8 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: That's

9 correct. Restate your question.

10 BY MS. CHAMPION:

11 Q The question is based on your knowledge

12 of him.

13 Do you believe that someone could

14 influence his testimony?


16 Spanish.)

17 LEAD INTERPRETER: (Speaking Spanish.)

18

JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: (Speaking19 Spanish.)

20 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: She's plainly asking

21 for his opinion, which Your Honor has said is not

22 appropriate.

Page 63

1 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Withdraw the

2 question and continue with the ones that were

3 pending.

4 BY MS. CHAMPION:

5 Q I apologize. I forgot whether you6 testified whether you were aware whether of

7 Mr. Gelvez Al Barracin was offered any benefits in

8 connection with providing testimony in this action?

9 THE CLERK: (Speaking Spanish.)


11 Spanish.)

12 LEAD INTERPRETER: What is the name

13 again?

14 MS. CHAMPION: Gelvez Al Barracin.

15 THE DEPONENT: Okay. It's not about what

16

I think. It's not about what I think, it's -- but17 what I can prove. And what I can prove is that

18 Gelvez Al Barracin is a liar.

19 BY MS. CHAMPION:

20 Q Are you familiar with Edgar Ariel Cordoba

21 Trujillo?

22 A No, not by that name, but perhaps by his

Page 64

1 alias.

2 Q Cinco Siete, 57, or Virgilio?

3 A Yes, Virgilio. I know him by Virgilio.

4 Q And are you aware that he has provided

5 testimony in this case?

6 A No, I'm not aware.

7 Q Are you aware that Mr. Mangones has8 provided testimony in this case?

9 A No, I'm not aware.

10 Q Are you aware whether he was promised any

11 benefits for providing testimony in this case?

12 A Talking about Jose Gregorio?

13 Q Yes, Mr. Mangones.

14 A I would not be able to prove it.

15 Q But you suspect it?

16 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: Objection --


18

Spanish.)19 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: Objection, calls for

20 speculation. It's asking for his opinion.


22 question.

Page 65

1 BY MS. CHAMPION:

2 Q Are you aware of any facts that would

3 support that Mr. Mangones was offered benefits for

4 providing testimony in this case?

5 A No. I mean, I don't have the means to6 prove it.

7 CHECK INTERPRETER: "I wouldn't be able

8 to prove that."

9 THE DEPONENT: I wouldn't have the way,

10 the means, to prove it.

11 BY MS. CHAMPION:

12 Q Do you know whether Mr. Mangones knows

13 Mr. Otero also?

14 A Yes, he does know him.

15 Q Do you know if he's met with him about

16

this case?17 A No, I'm not aware.

18 Q Do you know Jairo Alfonso Samper

19 Cantillo, alias Lucho, or Juan David or Victor

20 Piroba or something like that?

21 Victor Piroba or something.

22 A Isn't he from Los Pipones? I think they



19/23



Pages 66 t o 69

Page 66

1 call him Los Pipones, something like that.

2 Q Yeah, I think that's correct.

3 So you know him?

4 A Yes. Yes, I know who they are.

5 Q Are you aware that he provided testimony

6 in this case?

7 A No.8 Q Are you aware whether he was provided any

9 benefits for providing testimony in this case?

10 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Counsel,

11 you're out of time, re -- answer the question and

12 then we'll be -- and then we're done.

13 THE DEPONENT: No, I have no knowledge.

14 What -- what I wanted to tell you -- I mean, I

15 think I want to tell you about my experience that I

16 lived alongside my commander, Jorge 40 -- Jorge 40.

17 It's that matters of such importance, of

18

such relevance for the organization, would be dealt19 with, with individuals with such little relevance

20 within the organization.

21 MS. CHAMPION: Can I just ask for one

22 clarification, Your Honor, what he means by

Page 67

1 "matters of such relevance"?

2 It's not clear from his answer.

3 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Okay. We'll

4 do the following answer and then we'll yield to

5 opposing counsel.6 MS. CHAMPION: Thank you, Your Honor.

7 THE DEPONENT: Yes, because I'm talking

8 about things that I lived through, regarding

9 companies -- relevant matters such as companies,

10 such as the multinational companies. Talking about

11 matters that I -- I experienced, that I lived,

12 alongside my commander, Jorge 40.

13 He was not going to deal about these

14 issues with people who --


16

Spanish.)17 THE DEPONENT: -- and the only two people

18 who we have mentioned in all these names that have

19 a certain degree of hierarchy or rank within the

20 organization is Jose Gregorio and myself.

21 And the rest that you have mentioned

22 them -- that you have mentioned have been patrolman

Page 68

1 or low ranking members. Because I doubt very much

2 that my Commander 40 would have sat down with them

3 alongside a representative of a multinational

4 company, for example --


6 Spanish.)

7 THE DEPONENT: -- to undertake any kind8 of negotiation just such as the ones you were

9 talking about.

10 MS. CHAMPION: Thank you very much.

11 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Okay. Now we

12 will proceed, so counsel can continue with the

13 minutes -- 10 minutes until -- until 12:07, so that

14 he can finish with his time.

15 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: Gracias, Your Honor,

16 I will begin.

17 (Yvette Citizen assumes the role of lead

18

interpreter and Jesus Rivera assumes the role of19 check interpreter.)

20 FURTHER EXAMINATION


22 Q Thank you. Yes. You testified that when

Page 69

1 you -- before the demobilization, if some of your

2 guys got arrested, that Ivan Otero would represent

3 them; is that correct?

4 A Correct.

5 Q So if -- if I understand this, they were6 charged with crimes by some public authority, and

7 he appeared in a court and defended them against

8 criminal charges; is that correct?

9 A Correct.

10 Q And you testified that five days ago Ivan

11 Otero came to the prison; is that correct?

12 A Correct. Five or maybe four days, I'm

13 not exactly sure.

14 Q Okay. And you never met with him,

15 because you were ill and not feeling well; correct?

16

A Correct.17 Q Who is the person who brought you a

18 message that Otero wanted to meet with you?

19 A It's a person that provides security for

20 me.

21 Q Is it a public official or one of your

22 men who is a prisoner also?



20/23



Pages 70 t o 73

Page 70

1 A It's a trusted man from -- one of my

2 trusted men.

3 Q Now, I don't -- I don't want to put words

4 in your mouth, but he -- this trusted man, what did

5 he say to you about Ivan Otero wanting to meet you?

6 MS. CHAMPION: Permission to just put an

7 objection on the record for the California court,8 which is just hearsay. It doesn't prevent him from

9 answering.

10 (Deponent converses with prison guard in Spanish.)

11 THE DEPONENT: It's not a problem. I

12 mean, that's what he said -- that I have -- I have

13 a picture of the conversation. I have a picture,

14 photograph of the conversation -- because it was

15 passed to me through a Blackberry -- a

16 Blackberry -- where it's detailed saying that I

17 should collaborate in a process that I have

18

pending. And he's asking me for -- it's explicit,19 asking me for a response --

20 LEAD INTERPRETER: I think the

21 interpreter --

22 CHECK INTERPRETER: "And since you are

Page 71

1 asking me to be specific with my answer, I will do

2 so."

3 LEAD INTERPRETER: Okay.

4 THE DEPONENT: -- that if I collaborate

5 and everything goes well during the process, that6 he will then have a certain collaboration with me.

7 That's the message that he sent to me

8 from the outside, that my trusted man that was

9 talking to him at that time -- he was translating

10 to me what he was telling him. And I answered that

11 I was not interested and that I was not going to

12 see him.


14 Q Was there any discussion in this message

15 about the substance of your testimony, what -- what

16

you were going to say?17 A Yes. He was asking me to favor him in

18 the testimony.

19 Q What -- what do you mean by that?

20 A Well, I think that what he wanted to

21 do -- this is what I think what he wanted --

22 Q No, not what you think.

Page 72

1 What did he say?

2 A Well, I'm thinking this because of what

3 was transmitted to me. For me to say things or

4 state things that weren't so, against the Dole

5 Company, to -- so that it would be favorable to him

6 in the process and he could win a lawsuit.

7 That's what he proposed to me.8 Q Can you -- can you -- that -- that's a

9 very serious statement.

10 Can you tell me the words that he used

11 then?


13 Honor.


15 Spanish.)

16 MS. CHAMPION: Counsel is testifying.

17 His characterization is not part of the question.

18

THE DEPONENT: No, no, no. I'm a very19 serious person too. And I'm not going to talk

20 about or do something that I cannot show or prove.

21 He went to offer this to me.

22 And I'm going to state it even more

Page 73

1 clearly for you, so you can see how serious this

2 is. He offered me money so that I could involve or

3 incriminate Dole in something that I cannot attest

4 to or that I cannot prove and nobody -- and, in

5 fact, nobody can prove.6 It cannot be proven. Because my

7 commander, Commander 40, never -- never --- had any

8 type of meeting that dealt with matters regarding

9 his command with any front commander, and much less

10 so with people of lower ranks.

11 So -- so I will return and I will

12 continue to affirm that Mr. Otero went to ask for

13 my collaboration with -- went to offer me money --


15 Spanish.)

16

THE DEPONENT: -- in this -- in this17 procedure, in the case that it would be a positive

18 results.


20 Q Was any figure offered?

21 Was there any specific number in the

22 message?



21/23



Pages 74 t o 77

Page 74

1 A No. No, there was not an amount.

2 Q And -- and was the purpose of the offer

3 made? Did he say what the money was for?


5 Honor.


7 Spanish.)8 MS. CHAMPION: It's asked and answered.

9 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: That is

10 correct. Restate your question, Counselor.

11 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: I'm -- I'm going --

12 I'm going to just ask a couple questions about

13 something different.

14 Q Carlos Tijeras was a commander of a

15 front; correct?

16 A Correct.

17 Q And like -- like you testified about

18

yourself, do you know that he was responsible for19 raising funds for the operation of his own front?

20 A That front, it is my understanding, was a

21 lot smaller. And what he has told me is that he

22 needed support from a higher command when he was

Page 75

1 lacking or short on funds.

2 But like I stated at the beginning of

3 this proceeding, subjects or delicate matters were

4 not dealt with directly by front commanders, but

5 directly by the commander of the Northern Bloc,6 which was my commander, Commander 40. That was the

7 way it was in my case, with my front. And I

8 believe it was the same with the others.

9 Q Do you have knowledge about whether

10 Carlos Tijeras was an effective commander in the

11 AUC?

12 A Yes. Yes, he was a very good commander.

13 Q And when you were asked to kill him, you

14 refused?


16

Honor.17 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Go ahead.

18 MS. CHAMPION: First, the -- the prior

19 question asks for an opinion. This question has

20 been asked and answered. And we are out of time.

21 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: That is true,

22 the witness had already stated the --

Page 76

1 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: Okay. I'll restate

2 the question.

3 Q Why did you refuse to kill Carlos

4 Tijeras?

5 A Because you cannot be disloyal in life.

6 And if there was already an agreement within the

7 self-defense forces, it needed to be complied with.8 Q What -- what agreement are you referring

9 to?

10 A An agreement that was made in a district

11 of Minca in Santa Marta, in the district of Minca

12 in the Sierra Nevada of Santa Marta. And at that

13 point there was an agreement between the state and

14 the self-defense unit to eliminate the flagelo --

15 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: "Scourge."

16 LEAD INTERPRETER: Okay.

17 THE DEPONENT: -- the scourge of the

18

Pesca Milagrosa --19 LEAD INTERPRETER: Miraculous fishing

20 is --

21 THE DEPONENT: -- it was -- it was

22 basically kidnapping highway. So at that point the

Page 77

1 zones were divided into Santa Marta and Bosconia in

2 that area. So one part was going to be controlled

3 by the state and the other part would be controlled

4 by the self-defense units.

5 This can be proven. But after -- after6 that time up to 2004, the statistics or the

7 kidnappings were reduced by about 70 percent.

8 That's what was called democratic security. But it

9 was nothing else, it was just an agreement between

10 the state and the paramilitary.

11 MS. CHAMPION: Your Honor --

12 MR. COLLINGSWORTH: We're out of time.

13 MS. CHAMPION: Oh, you've finished?

14 Your Honor, Dole Food would like to

15 request a copy of this text message or e-mail that

16

Mr. Guevara described.17 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: What is it

18 that you're asking me for?

19 MS. CHAMPION: He said he had a picture

20 of something from a Blackberry, something related

21 to the offer from Mr. Otero.

22 THE DEPONENT: Not a problem.



22/23



Pages 78 t o 81

Page 78

1 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Okay. Okay.

2 I do not have the legal authority to order the

3 witness to deliver something in his possession.

4 MS. CHAMPION: But he could voluntarily

5 provide it, Your Honor; is that correct?

6 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: Perfect, that

7 would be fine.8 So, Witness, if you would like to make

9 that available to her, that's fine. But this is

10 not something that you would have to do by order of

11 this court.

12 MS. CHAMPION: Thank you, Your Honor.

13 JUDGE DEL VILLAR DELGADO: There will be

14 nothing else and nothing further.

15 This proceeding is hereby concluded.

16 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: We're off the record.

17 The time is 12:08 p.m. This will end Video 2,

18

Volume I, in the deposition of Adolfo Enrique19 Guevara Cantillo.

20 (Signature having not been waived, the

21 video deposition session of ADOLFO ENRIQUE GUEVARA

22 CANTILLO as concluded at 12:08 p.m.)

Page 79

1 C E R T I F I C A T E(BARRANQUILLA)

2 (COLOMBIA) I, Robert V. Short, Certified Shorthand

3 Reporter, do hereby certify that the aforementionedwitness was first duly sworn by Stephanie Leslie,

4 as noted by stipulation of counsel, to testify to

the truth; that I was authorized to and did report5 said deposition in stenotype; and that the

foregoing pages are a true and correct6 transcription of my shorthand notes of said

deposition.7 I further certify that said deposition

was taken at the time and place hereinabove set8 forth and that the taking of said deposition was

commenced and completed as hereinabove set out.9 I further certify that I am not attorney

or counsel of any of the parties, nor am I a10 relative or employee of any attorney or counsel of

any party connected with the action, nor am I11 financially interested in the action.

The foregoing certification of this12 transcript does not apply to any reproduction of

the same by any means unless under the direct13 control and/or direction of the certifying

reporter.14 IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have hereunto setmy hand this 31st day of January, 2016.

15

16

17

18

19 ____________________________20 ROBERT V. SHORT,21 Certified Shorthand Reporter22

Page 80

1 Adolfo Enrique Guevara Cantillo c/o

2 GIBSON, DUNN & CRUTCHER LLP

3 200 Park Avenue, 47th Floor

4 New York, New York 10166-0193

5

6 Case: Juana Perez 1A, et al. v. Dole Food Company, Inc., et al.

7 Date of deposition: January 27, 2016

8

Deponent: Adolfo Enrique Guevara Cantillo9

10 Please be advised that the transcript in the above

11 referenced matter is now complete and ready for signature.

12 The deponent may come to this office to sign the transcript,

13 a copy may be purchased for the witness to review and sign,

14 or the deponent and/or counsel may waive the option of

15 signing. Please advise us of the option selected.

16 Please forward the errata sheet and the original signed

signature page to counsel noticing the deposition, noting the

17 applicable time period allowed for such by the governing

18 Rules of Procedure. If you have any questions, please do

not hesitate to call our office at (202)-232-0646.

19

Sincerely,

20 Digital Evidence Group

Copyright 2016 Digital Evidence Group

21 Copying is forbidden, including electronically, absent

22 express written consent.

Page 81

1 Digital Evidence Group, L.L.C.

1730 M Street, NW, Suite 8122 Washington, D.C. 20036

(202) 232-06463

SIGNATURE PAGE


5 Witness Name: Adolfo Enrique Guevara Cantillo

Deposition Date: January 27, 20166 7 I do hereby acknowledge that I have read

and examined the foregoing pages8 of the transcript of my deposition and that:9

10 (Check appropriate box):

( ) The same is a true, correct and11 complete transcription of the answers given by

me to the questions therein recorded.12 ( ) Except for the changes noted in the

attached Errata Sheet, the same is a true,13 correct and complete transcription of the

answers given by me to the questions therein14 recorded.15 16 _____________ _________________________17 DATE WITNESS SIGNATURE18 19 20 21 _____________ __________________________22 DATE NOTARY



23/23


Page 82

Page 82

1 Digital Evidence Group, LLC

2 1730 M Street, NW, Suite 812

3 Washington, D.C. 20036

4 (202)232-0646

5

6 ERRATA SHEET


Witness Name: Adolfo Enrique Guevara Cantillo

8 Deposition Date: January 27, 2016

9 Page No. Line No. Change

10

11

12

13

14

15

16

17

18 19

20

21 ___________________________ _____________

22 Signature Date


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