our people internal exiles

8/14/2019 Our People Internal Exiles

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.., _.I WIIS encouraged to be fairly independent-very conlrary to tilesocialization most Latin women are given, However, I a lso had aU thoseother melisages: get married, hal'e children, do aU that stuff. Bllt I wanted

to be an art i st . My family didn't want me to he an a rt is t because it was crazy thing to be. What impactdoes ) 'our ar t have on real life? I think.Iot ofthe ethic seeped into me: it's not good enouy!just to be an artist .11010' ....ill you support )'oursclf? What does it mean to the people you live.round? All those questions got to me. So in college I also minored inhistory and in education. I developed back-up systems, ....hich haveproven \'ery valuable in my work.I went to llchool in the sixties at the state unh'enity in Nortbridge,c. lifornia, in the par t o f the San Fernando Yalley which wall all white.I.ookingacross that campus I would never seea Meltican or a black personorunybody of color. This was before the EEOr program, during the timewhen we ....ere beginning to agitate for Mrican-American studies,Chicanofludies, Amcrican Indian studies. There were groups of people saying.~ \ 1 ; ' e ' r e using thuUSlinds of Chicano young men in the Yietnllmesc War. ,.And clearly, in the university system Chicanos l Iad no presence. So thelixlies hlld a very powerful innuellcc on me. I had hml all the8e feelingsbUI no place to hang tlwm. The Movcmicll to gave me a place to focusthern find arf. rm the fact that I ....asn t crazy.I was thrown right in the middle of aU that struggle hu t was very muchi,;olated, The moment I left my comlllunity to go to college, I was isolatedfrom Illy own people hccause nol l l lat many of them went 10 college, amiIwas isolate..1from auy sense of my own culture in the unh'ersit) system.When I got oul of school, I broughl what I had learned hack to m)'family and listened to their r ~ l ) ( l n s e l i . When I showed he r my work, myp-Indmother saitl to me. "What is this? What's it for?" It was clear toli e lha t somehow I had been encouraged not to be 10'110 J was, to useI 'ulern European ar l as my model. J hadn'l even learned about l..osTruGrandes, the three greut muraljsts. Ieven had no idea abOllt murals.III (act, I had been doing mural work fo r a ) 'ear before I even heard ofthe Meltican muralists.

~ I grandmother wall no dummy. She knew a lot abotlt healing and hadkn influcnced hy the Indians in he r understanding of religion. Itwasn'lllraighl Catholicism because if you hang an amulcla (a l iule pouch with'pecial herbs and things in it) around somebody'll neck to heal them andkrtp Ihe spirits away, that's not CathoLicism in tile strictest sense. She.dong with my mother, had raised lIIe, and I saw he r a8 3n extremelyPOwerful person-spiritulllly powerful-and I respected hel ', I thought.Iheft are the people I rea lly know and care about. J love these p l ~ o p l e .Ind I really want 10 make them understand, make them be part of thisprOCess I'm going through. I f I'm supposed to be interested in COlll"ullicating, if my work is supposed to elevate the spirit of human beings,lil,t J decided these people ar e not human beingll? It seemed crazy to

Diane Neumaier(From an inter_l.'ieu It;irh tht!Chicana murolulJud,. Buca)

O , Ih- ""I,rnal cxiles. To affirm Ihat ll;\ a valid t:llperience.ur peop care .... . . I" ' I t Th hewhen aU other things ar e working against it . IS a po ~ l 1 c a a ~ _at s I, I ' ' I ' _Amerjellns lind slarl bemg Chicano". Whentlllle we stop l'emg \l ""ucan d'd , " .ItUI"C )'UU can make them Isappear , )'OU canyou eu), a pe0l' e Ii "-control tht:m. . I I d'lr. 1, ' II bonier frolll MeXiCO lIrc I It: 1Il0S I leu tThe pcop c camillO< over H:' .., \ ,' E I '" II ., al"e the mosl explOited III th e ..os i nge t.0 urg'ullze veil t wIIg I It:} I b fweat;ho 15' evt'nlhough they l I rc provitling II vel'Y 10"'C(IIiI. a or arct,:11. I IOrti , '\ ,\h e 'ct:ollumy in a vel'Y 5ubst


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Political Aru, S " b " ~ T l i , , ~ Aer. f D i . , , ~ N ~ U t D D ; r r Z6110 the East Side, change into boots and jeans, and go s it on the curb withme kids. There are people who ar e bridge people, and my ahilily to m o n ~between diose great extremes has made it pos si hl e f or me to do what Jdo. Possibly, hecause J had a universit), education, becallse J became; l n g l i c i : l ; ~ d to, a c e r t a i ~ degree.. I was ahle 10 come hack to nlY ownromnlllRlty wllh more IIlformatlOn and make things happen.I f ormed my fi rst mural team of twent y k ids f rom fOllr daferent

__ighl)()rhoods. It was the f irst t ime in recent history that the)' hatilleenIble to put aside their differences and work together, That was in 1970.We (lid three p i e c e ~ that summer. including Mi Abuc/ita, a giant three_,ided balldshell W l t l ~ a grandmother im.age in i t -my grandmother,,etuall),. I had to do It on a volunteer baSIS, bu t I got the kids paid.Vondalism ill the city park system is ill the millions of dollars. TheRecreation and Parks Department paints the walls white and dates them'thai wa) ', even i f t he ), 'r e marked again, the puhlic "i l l know t h drpartmcnt took car e o f its responsibility. Judging by the way the citylpent it!! dollnrs, property damage was the concern, not the fact that kidsIiterttlly die i n t he parks, o\'crdosing, That's of Iiule significance. Whatisof 5ignificance is that before these kids fall over Ihey wrile on the walls,It w ~ dis tr es sing to me to sec kids die , to sel: that human being!> were

IIOt as Important as propcrty. I would go to the people in the Recreation,lid Parks Department thinking that oblJiolUl)' if they could see the \alllelheir appropriation of moncy reOI."Cted, they would he mOI'C responsiveIothc communit). I would SlIy, "Why i!! it that in East L.A. you have IIpark built in 19"23 witll the smallesl acreage per capita, when it has oneJtbe largest usages illihe cily? Wh)" call't )'OU expand this park? Whydon't yOll pu t ill tcnnis courts?"When t1wy stnrted saying shit to lIIe like,"Mexicani don"t like to play tennis." I started getting the picture. I knewIUt there wall racism, bu t I t1idll't undcrstand how i t was institutional"'d.People were amazed at ou r wurk. The (,os Angeles Times run sensational artidc.'S like "Teenage Youth Gangs Pu t Down Kni\'es for Brushes.'"Ttrrible. The head of nee allll Parks came tlowlI to Ihe site--the kids

~ u g h t he WilS a I l l l re , and he' s I lIcky he got ill and out of Ihcl"{."-lInd"lid to IIle, silllpl)', "How can we hottle ond package what you do?" Ikpn to understand that I was becoming to the City of Los Angeles a"lIbllerful instrument of graffiti al.Hltement. But I wall accomplishing IllY!'Ilb at the !lallle time b)' doing Illy own work in the street-which forlit wa clearly 1I0t graffiti abatement.. The grolll) of ,)Cople I was working with was very connected to Dnd.n,uenced by visual symbols-in tull005, in the k ind of writing thai went"Uln the street-hut there wall no visible reflection of themselves in the~ e community. Nothing ofthe architecture or visllalsymbols reflecteddie presence of the people-other than the graffiti. First il was a .Jewish~ m u l l i t ) " then Mexican people moved in. What I could 8 ( ~ e was that

I was given two classes, one a t te n in the morning and another One 81Ihree in the afternoon. It wait twenty-six miles from Illy home, so I woulddo my morning clan and then hang out in the parks. I began to reaUywatch stred Jjfe. I saw young people, teenagers, adolescents, the thro....away IH:Orle. Nobody wanted them ill the parks; the Recreation andParks Department had 110 progrllms planned for them becaulle they WCrtvandals, ~ c a u s c they were i J l v o l n ~ d in gang warfare. So they would playdominoes, drink wine, IImoke dope, hang out in \'8rioull corners. Therewas always this constant battle. The I)()lice would be called to gel rid ofIhem, and the kids would come back, l ike a f lock of pigeons that fly upand land aga in , So I made f ri ends wilh a 101 of them, 1 met some kidswho were involved in talloo work. Of course, they were also wri tins IUover the walls.Visual symbols, calligraphy basically, were a focal point in their life 011the IItreel. You could read a waU and learn everything you needed toknow ahout that community, about the guys or gir ls who hung out in thestreet-who t hey were, who they hung out with, what gcneration theywere, how mallY of them ha(1 the same nickname--1l11 in wha t they uUpfacayQsos.

I ~ c a m e something of an exper t reader of strect writing. I knew whowas who in four or five different neighborhoods hecause I taught ItIlifferent places. I realized I ....as /IIm'ing from Olle part to the nexi. butthey couldn't. They could not go fi\'e hlock, ....ithout heing ill danger froraother gangs. Some of the feuds w e n ~ fifty or sixty years old,Thai ....as m}" constituency. It'll certainly not the .... holc of the Chicano

communit)'-l have to say thai I gct nry IlCrturhed whenJH:Ople pcrcei,'tthc Chicano community as hdng people who write all o\'cr the w a l l . ~ - - - b u tthis is a street pheno/llcnon that has been on die inerr-ase. In the sixtitt,it was more politicalilogans: now, it's ahollt territory. II has to do ",ilhpeople lIa)'ing, "Listen, I own nothing here. So I own )"our waU. lien',who I am." The tattoos ar e a whole tIl ing, too, Kills with tat tooed tu non their cheeks! What does that s a ~ ahout how the k ids feel .hau lthemselvell? What"s going on for them is pretty rough, and it'll refltcttclin the highest dropout rate in the entire lllition.I laid I wan te d t o f"rlll a muraitealll. Pretty soon I had a nurnbtr firp eop le who began to hang with nil:, who trusted me and would dosomething I a sked thclII to do. At thai point nobody knew what a muralwas; i t wal ln't the phenomcnon it is now. I had to expluin that we wert'going to do n big picture on the wulL But I had t o figure out how ~ rcthe waH hack. It was marked. Who do I have 10 talk to to get permls!tolIto use this wal l? So I said to the kids, "Listen, I'm going to take off y ~ u ~placaylUos. Here's what we're going 10 do . Do yOIl wal1t to work ",,1us?" It was like negotiating treaties. btThe most imporlant 5kill that I've had to develop in this work i 8 1 ~ l t table todeal with people in City Hall, then jump in my car, drive ten nll


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Br taking a sma ll object and lransformin" it inlO a . ."ant illl .h I I I k .. d ' e age, )OUI(ac peop e 0 00 at II In a IHerent way Clau, Old. ' k IWh ' ' ' ' uergnew a lOutthaI. en your ~ h o l e body fits in to the eye of II mOllumcntally rende dhtad, ) ' O ~ ar e gomg. to ~ o o k ut it ill a way YOIl IIcw:r looked at till: :e ebt-fore. 1 he SlIlIIe Ihlng IS trlle of the issues includ"d ; . " I YT k . f h" , ... Ie mura ,8 e II piece 0 Istoncal information' 3::1\ 000 ,,x.... II f ' JV. '"' ' peop e wer edtportet r om th e California region in the thirties 75 000 f LoI(J 1 ." r o m ~:\ngc es" t was slim ar to what's going on now' w.,h ., ... I Ie economic!'l'CCSSlOn peop e IiIreconcerned that Mexican p'o'llearc takin " . . hd . h ' Ik' g lelr JO s~ I 8gam t ey re ta 109aboui 'mother Bracero p , o ~ . ) B ''h ' O' m. u you maylIot care. muc I a out history, That's Ihe altillide you get from a lo! of/"'OJ'lc, Who cares about that fucl?" But t1ICII . f , , foo d d, . ' '. ,.... r l i ly! ren enngtach person", 110 s g c ~ t m g O ~ the tram, lind standing nexi to the oversized(are of someone who Ii feelmg the agony of that deportation Ih .d f h erelno.a,' not to I entl y Wit thut feelin, Ax .1, I,ghl , ,' " .. c lllllges )'OU 8ee t lemin a dlffercnt way, You make thcm real Yo .. "ok" ,." . 0' , ' . . . lap jJcn agalll , rtake a concept: the IllUSIOn of pcn'l>crity " . k ' 0" ' " k If I' k . .. .. 1O( 0 nnage t la l.111 spea" to thaI. Then have people transform the scalc to four limesutural slz,e, At I,he end of that proces8. they can perceive the cOllcept inI subsiantltlll)' dlffel'ent way,In 1914 I thought: Well. ~ e t 1 , l i ~ is really interc.Ilting. I think anybodyruuld make a mural. Certamly It s blelJk in Ih,, ".,y ' - , ' h.. L e S sce w at we

fan do about all the grey concrete walls. There were a lot of artists outu( work a,nd a lot of pcople in differenl communities who could use the"i'pOrtUllIty to let the walls sl)Cak for them."bad becollle fairl)' friendl) ' with a number of political fi!>rures at thatI"uot. hecause t ~ n ~ y Ilall I:OIIIC to the s it c. s eell ""hat J wus floing, helpcd

n l with the.polll:e who wen: bothering l iS , llud 80 forth, I wrote II pilin10 get t he City c ooncil to hel p us pay for an East Side bri, .d Th.." A I ' e, ereasn tone , 'eXlcan representative on the whole counci l not one inf , r t e e , n - - e v ~ n though the popllllltioil was III'OUIIII forty p e r ~ e l l t ChicanoInut mdudl/lg an uncounted population of probably ~ l I e or two millionuRllocumcnted worker ). One IIf the council members to ld me "You'/ IfIO)'S f rom the White Fl:nce gang ""cre showin! Ibeirdesigns, (We always do this 10 gh'e pCtlple a chance to I ~ o m e invohedin the I ' r o c e i l , ~ , TlwlI therl: lire no sUl'priseil--collllllunit)' people hate~ L l r p l i s e s . ) A WllIJI;lI1 in the hack uf the 1'00111 said, "All you e\'cr do ifruin e\'cr)'tlling:in tile communily, You wrile allover e\'er),thillg. Yoo ' I ' tjust worthless. Why sllould w(' help )'ou?" I thought. "My, what anoutllUriit of hostility," I thought till: kills weft: Iloing wOllllerfully to getul' i n f ronl o f II crowd like tlHlt alill ~ ( l e l l k - I h i s fl'(J1II Ill'oplll who ,,',ereIlot esselltiallr \'el"ll(ll, I askl'il, '-Wllo is that?" 0111: ofthl' kid1i aid i t "'uhis l I I o l l 1 1 ~ r . But \'\"111'11 till' Imrenls saw tlwirkids doillg sarn,thing posili\'t.ClIIlIICI:tiIJIIS limon:; tile fumiJ)' IIIl'rnhers hegan tn ,1,:vl'lop agaill'Few gids I'urticillllll:d dudn!; that timc" It was milch t:asi,:r organizinlalllollg tIll" )'oullg 1110::11 III"('ausl' girls were not alIowl.'iltlll' same mobilit),

II has 11(.-':11 II long prOCCS.'lllrllwing tlu: young brirls in. hut i t 's equal. II'Itakcn tllis many )'I"lIrS for til;lt 10 hllpp.:n, You sec. Lltiu women arenol5u1'1I0:;cll to h l doing thing;; li h climbing 011 :;cnffoldillg, being in theIJuhlic eye,

any population could 1II0,'e through the place without being reflected init.Symbols already haclliignificance in this community. and it made senstto createanother set of s)'mbols acknowledging the people's commonality,the fact that they came from the same place and had a common cuhure,II seemed to me this could break down the divisions among these people.gi"e them information, ami change their environment. Th e murals ha"ebeell clear forms of expression. renectillg the issues Illld needs as theysee t hem, I think decorative murals ar e a wllste of t ime in urban areas,The)"re urban decoration. Band-Aids on cancer,

FrOlll 19iO to 1914 tlwre was UII incredihle outgrowth of murals inEast Los Angeles, It waSII"t just IlIc-other pellplewere doing it . too, Till'East Side of Los Angeles ....as becoming fairl )' well known for muralilllabrcry. Sudtlenly there .....as fill upheaval in the barrios; )'011 could drh"tthrough thelll and s(:e gillllt pieces all Ol'er the "lace" They were powerfuland they w c r l ~ strong, und they were politiclI!. They talked about ",110those people .....ere. what they cared al>OlIt, and what they were mad aboUt.The)' talked Ilbollt the issueil in their cOJllmunity from police brulalitylfdrug ahuse.


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" , " , . C ; " , ~ .. .... ..~ A " d ; . ; - - - - - - - - - - - - - -k I u,ed to this black COllllcillllemher who hadI wenl Lac very ( lscour U "1 Ol\r-.1. II II , a : ' I ~ : t ~ s in their mural justI r . . ndhcin""aletoarhcuaestye 0 conung II Ia.. II ck mural that cameturnet.l (Iff nt) laff, ....ho wanted III \t'to every I athrough.

. , were cultural killlb of pieus;A lllt of the murals done II I t lat program ounce-for. r t ortant statements to aimC\'CII the tOllle (In" were, 10 ac ,lm!1 . I ere no one ","ouldh f F"lipino.'l II I a COlllmunllY w I hcll:all iple , t e presence (I I " the land in"" of Fil ip inos in t eacknowledge tlll:lII. There was a pu .C.e ~ I M:xican legend of tht

Philippine i!llallds, which ~ ~ \ " e r ~ , t : n t ; ~ a : " : I : l l h e a v e ~ I the idea aboutAzlt'cs arri\"ing in Telloclutlil ln. IS " r ' ,hin'" '''''oplecouldI " , ' ..h t t ha t was a Wall( er II .. , ,.._verlapping egellus. I O U ~ _see how they all conllectcd 1.11 Sante .....a}s. . d he 0 Jen ....orf.rtSome (If the pieces were about pohce b r u t a l ~ t y til o : l l m u ~ i t i e s . Soltltthat g o e ~ on belweell the police and ~ h ~ c o P t l . e 10 ; ~ ~ h ~ r i t i e s ",'ere d o i ~ .were about immigra lion , wha t the m l n l J g r ~ Ion bo I drug abu51',and the exploitation of iUegal worke.rs. Ot ; ~ S r : e : 7 n : o t ~ e C ( l m m l l " i ~ "including the government-suPP(lrted 1",fluX h ~ h r e e people were Imand the uu Tres issue in Los Ange es, were

Ilrisoned for shooting a narcotics agent who wu bringing narcotics int(lthe c(lmmunity.A lot of pieccil were on gentrmcalion and urban renewal. (In how thedevelopers' interests ar c taking (Icoplc's homes away from thcm. One ofIhe most cOlllrovel"Sial was a piece thai showed, on one side, an idyllic5cene in the Venice comnlunit)" done in the style of a Persian miniature:on Ihe other side were bulldozers wiping OUI the f(llk., knocking downIhe slllaU wooden houses on the canals to lIIake roolll fo r a Jllush condocit}'. In thecorner WllS a lil lIe guy spraying, "Stop the pigs. SaveVenice."Before the lIIural was pu t up . these words had heen llcrawled on the wallin four-foot red leiters. The guy who had done that came to (lurcommunit) lIIeeting an d said. "My graffiti is more impor tant than yourmuraL" People thollght that h e had sOlllething there and dec ided toincorporate it into the mural. So the lIIural was sort (If an illustration ofhis graffiti. The real tors picked III' 011 it a lld tried 10 stop us. In fact, justrecclllly they Jluinted half of it Ollt before the cOllllllunity found out. Tokeep the mural 1111, I had t(l go to ahout twenty meetings. all the ""ay upto Chief Ed Davis , and eXlllain l ha t i n t hi s c as e "pig" meant greed. notpolice.It wa5 truly IIIl flTlla::illg experience. We were dealing with problemslltot ar e munifestcd in the wlwle socielJ. going(lut into these communiliesand st. 'eing h(lw artists are treatctl. We did 250 murals (I probablydirled around ISO) and h ired (I\'er 1,000 people. It wore DIe oUI-todeath.We were pUlling these pieces up 1111 over the cil)", whidl WIIS al l fine

al1ll good" But al some poinl, heclluse of Ihe sun and t he IlOlIuli(ln. an dbecause the mural s were in poor communit ies that were s ub je ct t oredevelopment, the murals would be torn (/0\\.,.. Tllen the people would;el up in arms. For example. Iiolllebody would s tu rt to paint ou t a llIuralwhen a building OWIWI' hud chullgcII, lind fifty people would be Ollt therewith s t i c k ~ wallling 10 heat up the guy. We had organized wel l in thet'OlIlnlllnities. so Ihey protected their mu"rals. But ""e couldn't get moneyfor maintenance, and it was \'ery difficult 1(1 make buiJding owners keel)Ihe pieceli lip.I also saw a rt is ts do jus t flw[ultliings in the eOlllmuniticli, like cominginto all ethnically mixed Community IUld. becuuse the artist was ChieD-lto,p.unting a Chicano piece witll (lnl)' Chicano kids. Sometimes they wouldincite people to attack a police officer, everybody would be beaten upllId taken to jail-ell:CeIH the artis t. Terrible things!I Couldn't handle it anymore. I couldn't contl'Ol the qual i ty of thepieces. 1was t i red of liuPl'ortingolher people. breakjngmy ass an d kiJling

IIIYself, and being in lhis n(l-man's land position between lhe commllnilytnd the city. Th e COmmunit} perceh'ed me as being p ar t o f the c itybureaucracy, while the officials percei\ 'ed me as being Il flaming radicalfrom the community!


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" I P '"" ,. -" ' ..b._. i....A"u66 Dian.. "'rum.",.. . . . . , _ . . . . .xhausted by the end of il . I decidedII ....as '-cr)' hard. and f ....a.s Y e ~ Y h e d a sUPI)ort groul)operating for Ihe

10 start a nonprofit ~ r p o r a l J O n ~ I ~ n c w al some point the cit)' wouldCitywide Mural ProJC4:1 b t . ' C a l ~ e h . lieees ....ere lIery political. and Iwithdraw it s suppor!. S O ~ I l C t ese f I wsnl to stop me. III fact, theyexpected ,fHlt III some POlll! t ey "",011 (Th ' re were huge Imttlcs, Iclter" ' " I I ' ,I ,lI'O"rum tWice. ctried to I. IIC 1II11r '" h 'I I " cOllwlillces. I didn't wanl 10. "C'f s 10 Save I e r lira scampsll ;fls, I Il:en '" the t im e an ti no ! get to do my own" 'h'" I)'pe of strugg e a ( I Iconlmue... II" d'd ', I Uer than a 101 0 peop e wask iall)' lilnCe I a c l u a ) ' I I te d Th Gwor : s p ec . 5 . 1977 I left the mura l project to 0 e realllupportIng 10 do II . 0 InWall. I.. b lhat l ime-lhe Venice murab,I'd done a number of O l h ~ ~ ~ l I g 4 ~ ~ e l l t fon" Jliece and anOlher couplet he Eas l L.A. murals. I dl( 81 I O ~ 'd:e I h' k' that with each artist gI,'en tI originalJ)' hegan t he mura I III Ing wonde l' ful ieee ""ould corne" responsibilit)" fo r a segmcn,t of the t ~ a l J ~ t ~ s t s were not ~ willing to wor.togcther in sOllie way. Hut. III f . a ~ t , IC a v rail Jiece as I Ihotlght theywith each otller in the Composilion of Ill: 0 t' I I dOIl'1 feci that thewould he, Thcy created asel'ies of ell,s' PI"lll,"('O"",,' ,c"nlent is different. I Each IllII( re , - . . . . , "fir;st Ihousand feet IS a mural . f I tist and the ,)Cople in the arustand renects the personal stye 0 ti e ar .crew. No"," we're doing i t with an overall deSign,

Probably one of Ihe hardest things (or me 10 do is 10 recogni:l:e myleadenhip ability b e c a U i ~ e I've always been wanling 10 g iv e il awaywhenever possible. I Ihink it's part of my cultural thing that comes tip.In Ihe Chicano community, leader8 ar c wiped Ollt. People hate leaders .It's not a goolJ position 10 be in, Also, ii 's Vcry hal'(l to acknowledge thatf have to say "No," "Yes," "You do wha t I tel l you 10 do," or '" haveleadership011 this." Yet I would always take aU the responsibility: I woult!raise all the monc)'; I wou ld do aU the preparatory work; I wou ld be theone who would ultimalely anSwer to evcr)'one an d see to it that ever)"one",'as pll id-but I submitted to a collective process all the decision-makingpower ove r the planning of Ihe mur al , By 1978 I realized I cOllldn'1 doIhal again. I really had to decide whelher I wanted the piece 10 go pastwhat i t h ad been in that first summer. I had a vision for i l that 'Ihoughtwas l I Iudl more encompllssing, alld I realized if I r ea lly wan ted to sceIhat happen I hnd t o Irust my i,lell and trus t myself to know that i l wasgoing 10 he better (o r me to make those decisions. And i t was .The Ihing aboul murali!Rl, particlliarly in monumenlaJ pieces, is thatcollaboration ill a requirement. It isn'llike other ar l forms you might beable 10 accomplisli by Jourst:I(. I"'e s een a l ot of men in Los Angeles domonumenlal pieces on a IWO-story or eighl-slor,' building, by themselves,Bal The Creul Wall is b a S I ~ d 011 a different conceplioll of Whal ar t is for,The mural is nol j l ls t a big picture on a wtlll. The foclis is on cooperationin the prOl;ess U1ulcdying its cl'culion, I could probably go il l to IllY sludiofor a year in aJvance an d design it: b ll t. for one, there 's nol tha t k indoffunding tn SUpJ)(lrt III)' work for a }'ear, and, two, Ihe prOCC811 that weuse really works in with Ihe overall plall. Witli wlial the historians bringin we de,e!ol. images to I IU! hack into Jlulllie consciousness informationIhat hall heen losl. It's rl:ally incredihly slimulating an d exciting, TheDlural is a conceplual ar t piece all along, allfltlie finished painting is onl}'one pari of it,To bring t a l e l H I ~ d young l)Coplc into thc design crew fits the gOllls of t h l ~project. I t 's part of Ihe lelldcl"sflip dt:Vc!0plllelll a s p l ~ c l of Ihe program,gi\'illg kids more lllllllllore JJOWer to mcet lind cnhance their growlh, Also,

I think Ihtl mural ill bcller hecaust: it has II number of lIlinds working onit. The hardest part is making the design work as a unified piece, hu t Ihe(oUaborlttion On idea8 reall)" ill Wonderful.We s it w it h the hislorians ami do It "Ialk-through." We write ou l a5tory: -First there was this period ill which JH:ople IhougJII everylhing\fas fme ; i t was a ll 'illusion of prosperity. ' Whal was really going on wasProhibition, Ihe whole nappcr image, the COl/ling Crash .. . ., It gocli likethat. otllalk it through in a lileral way,which develops on ltttitude that

romes from people hashing it ou t togelhcr. In that way, people who ar enOI Ihe best al drawing don't have 10 be relied on for that. Jt'llllrchestrotingJH:opJe's hest skjJJs, usillg their betler abililies, pUlting theml ~ e t J l e r where they IIlliteh. It's geomelric ill proportion. II muhipliell the

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I, think the world is hecoming interested in what polilical nrlisls nrc.IolJlg , Polilical al'l is now perceived as "avant-garde or something andIke pwple trying to gel recognition in this way, I'm not focusing 00 ~ h a l~ e t l O 'h F 'm 0 It appe:ns. or eIample, a museum is going 10 be takin" The~ r ~ ~ t WoU Bnd blowing it up, doing a whole Ihing on all the sketch';: andludles we do 10 make il happen.I dOll't feci that Ihe mainslream ar t wodd is something I either wllnlloauacko C I .. h k, r court. f :r lam y, It IS allot cr IIld of audience alltll believeInaudi d I B h' 'eDce eve opmenl. ut I ere li a difference between public andJ'C'rsonal art, and I'm a public arlilil.

~ t l i t u d e s 10 thcm. That's how I feel I'm a leader, A 101 of times I can plug11110 ~ h Jsychology of a group, Ihe overriding feeling, what Ihe)"recreatlOg for thcmselves-and pull i t Ollt ane! say "Let', define il " 'I"? "TI ' , ' , latIS It. lal s part 0 m)' ~ o l . e as a I e a d e ~ . So much of i t is reall}' being al;ooel'5on-all those killds of Ihm?,Those ar e slereotypes about what a woman is if IIhe's a l eader. I IIIconlicious all the l ime of Illy own body. of whal il s ay s 10 p e o p l ~ " , . h ~ iI'm lalking to Ihem, of the way that I lllie my words 10 communicate..I h I mmunl-try to use al l those parhl and pllll them loget IeI' III a way t a co Icales from a sofl place in myself-nol Ihe defense/fear p l a c e - - w ~ t 11think and what I care abouI, whal I want olher people to do a n I ;and care aLout. The)' lIlay not care , bUI at least rill communicaUOI; r

po ...'e r that )'011 have by taking the best of other people aud putting ~ t , a l ltogether in one thing, Ho ....ever, one person nlllsl have the overall VISionf or it t o become a ....hole.When we get hung up, i t' s 01)' job 10 push things fo r ....ard to set ul> Isitllation in which people can be creative. AI this point I have the ultimateveto )lower when I think something i.s not working. I ha\'e to trust m)'judgement. The pcople who work wi th me understand Ihal I ha\ 'e to heableto say, " I jusllhink this is not working." ~ h h o u h the COllcc!)lualiza_tion takes place in a group, I appro\'e cvery lmage Idea before II goes 10thUlllhnail.After we develop the thumbnails, I ma) ' do as man)' as twent)' diffen:ntdrawing studies of Ihe woman carrying a chi ld in the Oust 80,":1 ~ c e ~ l e .Then I lake all the thumbnails and submil them to an overall diSCiplineof II musical division of space-ratio developmcnt, musical lime 3:5, elc,That's basically how I delll with Ihe overa ll composi tion . I also docorrectioll.s on everyone'll drawings if Ihings ar e nol anaIOmicall)' correclor whate\'er. This way there ar c many minds working on Ihe conceptiand one arlislic vision pulling il alliogether.

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Michelle Cliffbject Into Subject: SomeThoughts On th e WorkOf Black Women ArtistsIn Illy room there is a ,)()stcard of a 8culpture "by the Venetian IIrtil)anese Callaneo, done in the mid-16th eenturv-Blud. Venw. TIfulllength nude figure is bronze. In one hand 8 h holds a halld-mirr.ill which she is looking at herself. On her "ead is 11 turLan, around th..Iges of which he r curls ar e visible. In her other hand slle carriesduth-or at least what appears to be II cloth. Who was she? A lilavePerhaps in the artist's own househol.I, or maybe that of his patron---on,of the many Black wOlllen II ragged from Mrica to enter the service 0,,"hite [uropeolls. I have 110 idea who she actuaU,. ....as: she was an objectthen as now.Around thi s image ure other images of Diack women: Bernadell l"l'oweU, who kille{l the mall ....ho hca t he r and is now in Bedforrl Hil ls;

Fannie Loll Hamer; Billie Holiday; Eli7.aheth rreeman, who sued for he rfreedom and won it , in Massachusetts in the nilleh:cnth century;Josephine Baker: Harriet Tubman, portrayed in a linOCII! b) ElizabethCatlelt; womell studcnts nlaking basket furniture a t the Hamplon 111_~ t i l u t e ; Luc)" Parsons: Jdll B. WeUs-DanH:tt; Audrc Lorde; Phillis W h e l l t ~I.,)": two women in Bohwana seated arountl a gourd; Sojourner Truth;wumen in the Black Liheration MO\'cment ill EnglulHI: Betye Saar's AuntSally HooDoo; a girlchild balancing a luuin on her head in 80uthernMoca.M}"lIlovingtoward the study orthe ....ork-written and visual-ofRiackwomen has been II moving toward nlY own wholencss. /'II)' intcrest in thiswurk is a d eepl y personal interest, bf'CallSe through these words andimages r heb-in to capture par t of who I am.Iiihould begin wilh I l l }" t i t le-"Object into Subject." What does itmean?U'c Ii"e in a soc ie ty whose history is drenchefl in the phi losophy andI'ractice of racism, the oppression of Black and o th er Third World

1 ~ u l , l e s . This is the point at which Illy definition begins: if }'ou studyradsm_if )'011 understand tile history of the United States-you will find~ h a t under racism the person who is oppressed is turned into n il objectIn the mind of Ihe oppressor.The white antiracist sOllthern writer Lillian Smith was among the first

III offer a metaph)'sical and psycholok,rieal elll'l anati on of raciSIll as uI ~ ~ n o n a l aud political American practicel--

our people internal exiles

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