Student Interview Project: Magnetism

NSCI 231

Josh Paulisin, Weirong Huang, Nour Termos, and Emily Millazzo

Table of Contents

Part Page

Part I…………………………………………………………………………………….... 2

Part II…………………………………………………………………………………….. 6

Part III…………………………………………………………………………………….   11

Part IV……………………………………………………………………………………. 14

Part I

Ben:It came as a surprise to me that Ben, a second-grade student, had a decent amount of

background knowledge about magnets. He told me that objects can either be attracted or repelled by a magnet. I asked Ben if there would ever be a time that an object would do nothing when it was brought close to a magnet, he said, “no.”

When I placed the objects on the table and told Ben to sort the objects based on what he thought would happen to them if we brought the magnet close, he sorted them into two piles: attract and repel. Again, I asked him if there would be any objects that would not be affected and he said, “no.” In his attract pile, he placed the following items: paperclip, penny, nail, and aluminum foil. In his repel pile, he placed the rest: rubberband, toothpick, tape, and eraser. We then tested the materials.

The table below shows the results of our testing. Ben was extremely surprised that the aluminium foil and the penny were not attracted to the magnet. He said, “it looks like they should attract, but they didn’t.” He was also surprised that no objects were repelled by the magnet.

As a result of our experiment, Ben came up with the following rule:“If an object is metal, it will be attracted to the magnet. If it is not metal, nothing will happen.”

Object Prediction Result

Paperclip Attract Attract

Rubber band Repel Not affected

Penny Attract Not affected

Nail Attract Attract

Aluminum Foil Attract Not affected

Toothpick Repel Not affected

Tape Repel Not affected

Eraser Repel Not affected

Medo:Medo, a fifth grade student, predicted what was going to happen to the objects when he

gets them near the magnet. He got the chance to test each of them to see if his predictions were true. When he started testing the objects, he was so surprised that most of his predictions didn’t match what he observed as shown in the table below. For example, after getting the rubberband, aluminum foil, toothpick, tape, and eraser near the magnet, nothing happened. Medo was so surprised that neither the objects nor the magnet moved. These objects were not affected by the magnet as he thought. He was so confused that he said: “I thought that whenever you get an object near a magnet, it either attracts or repels!” Medo also questioned himself after observing what happened to the penny when he got it near the magnet. He was surprised that the penny wasn’t attracted by the magnet as he predicted.

At the end of the experiment, Medo came up with this rule: “Hard or metal objects will be attracted by a magnet.”

The rule that he came up with was a little bit confusing to me, because he tested some hard objects and they were repelling. But what I really think is that he was very confused at this point that he didn’t even know what rule he would pick.

Object Prediction Result

Paperclip Attract Attract

Rubber band Repel Not affected

Penny Attract Not affected

Nail Attract Attract

Aluminum Foil Repel Not affected

Toothpick Repel Not affected

Tape Repel Not affected

Eraser Repel Not affected

Noah:Noah is a second-grade student, and he does not know anything about magnets. When I

laid out the materials on the table, he was really excited. I asked him to predict what will happen to all the materials on the table. I also asked him to put the materials that will be attracted or repelled by the magnet on different sides of the table. He used his hands to feel each material and

predicted. He thought paper clip, nail, toothpick, and tape will be attracted by the magnet and put them on one side. Then he put rubber band, penny, aluminum foil and eraser on the other side.

After that, I gave him the magnet to test out all the materials that he predicted. Noah was so surprised that the toothpick and tape did not have any effect by the magnet as he predicted. At the end of his testing, he came up with his rule: “Hard objects will be attracted by the magnet.”

Object Prediction Result

Paper clip Attract Attract

Rubber band Repel Not affected

Penny Repel Not affected

Nail Attract Attract

Aluminum Foil Repel Not affected

Toothpick Attract Not affected

Tape Attract Not affected

Eraser Repel Not affected

J.Q. : J.Q. is a fifth-grade student with some background knowledge on magnets. He informed

me before we conducted our interview that he was gifted a magnet set for Christmas that he enjoyed playing with.  He had a basic understanding that an object containing metal will be attracted to a magnet.

When asked the questions, "What do you think would happen if I brought a magnet near all of

these materials? Which objects do you think will be attracted to the magnet?-Will the magnet be

able to pick up the object?-Which objects do you think will not be attracted to the magnet?-

Which objects will stay on the table and not be moved?" J.Q. gave the below predictions. He

predicted that any object made of metal would be affected by the magnet.

J.Q. then tested his hypothesis by moving the magnet over each material. He found that the only objects attracted to the magnet were the paperclip and the nail. He was surprised by this result. He thought the penny and the aluminum foil would also be attracted because they contain metal.

I then asked J.Q. if it was possible to make a "rule" for what kinds of materials are attracted to the magnet, and what kinds of materials are not affected by the magnet. He stated that the rule would be "The objects that are not made of metal, or don't have a lot of metal in them, are not attracted to the magnet."

Object Prediction Result

Paperclip Attract Attract

Rubber band Repel Not Affected

Penny Attract Not Affected

Nail Attract Attract

Aluminum Foil Attract Not Affected

Toothpick Repel Not Affected

Tape Repel Not Affected

Eraser Repel Not Affected

Summary:  The four kids that our group interviewed -- Ben, Medo, Noah and J.Q. -- all predicted that

the paper clip and nail will be attracted by a magnet, and they did predicted correctly.

Ben, a second-grader, has a decent amount of background knowledge about magnets and knows that a magnet can either attract or repel objects. He also predicted that the penny and aluminum foil will be attracted by the magnet. Medo, a fifth-grader, thinks when an object gets close to a magnet, it will be attracted or repelled. He also predicted that the penny will be attracted by a magnet. Noah, a second-grader, does not know anything about magnets. He predicted that the toothpick and tape will be attracted by a magnet. J.Q., a fifth-grader, has some background knowledge on magnets. He also predicted that the penny and aluminum foil will be attracted by a magnet.

After they predicted and tested their predictions, they did get some surprises and came up with their own rules. Ben’s rule is “If an object is metal, it will be attracted to the magnet. If it is not metal, nothing will happen.” Medo’s rule is : “ Hard or metal objects will be attracted by a magnet.” Noah’s rule is “Hard objects will be attracted by the magnet.” J.Q.’s rule is "The objects that are not made of metal, or don't have a lot of metal in them, are not attracted to the magnet."  

All of these rules are based on their testes and observations, they are not all exactly correct because they don’t know much about the magnet. They did learn some from their predictions and tests, and they did a good job. They will learn more about magnet in the following interview parts.

Part II

Ben:As discussed in Part I, Ben has pretty solid background knowledge when it comes to

magnets. However, I was surprised when he told me that magnets only attract and become attached to each other. He did not mention anything about magnets repelling each other.

For his test, Ben placed one magnet on the table and brought the other magnet close by. Sure enough, it attracted. I asked Ben to turn the magnet he was holding around and bring it close to the magnet on the table. When he did, Ben was shocked. “It won’t let me stick it!” I asked him why, and he said, “there must be a force in the magnets.” I asked him why one side attracts and one side repels and he replied, “each side of the magnet is different.”

At this point, I started asking Ben what is happening with the magnets when they attract or repel each other. He said, “there is a force inside the magnets. Each side has a different force. The force is a bunch of small lines in the magnet and it is very strong.” “The lines are up and down and then it will repel, some of the lines are side to side and will attract.” Following this discussion about the force, I had him draw diagrams about what happens with the magnets.

After discussing the reason behind the attracting and repelling of the magnets, I asked Medo to draw both magnets and try his best to draw everything that he mentioned during our conversation.

Noah:After Noah did the prediction and test out his prediction, we moved to part two to do the

investigation about how two magnets affect each other. I put magnets in front of him and asked: “what do you you think would happen if you were bring these two magnets near each other?” He predicted that these two magnets won’t go to each other. I was not surprised by what he answered, because he did not know much about magnets.

Later, I gave him two magnets and asked him to play with them for a while to see what will happen to these magnets. He was so happy that he got a chance to play and find out what will happen. When he put two magnets side-by-side, they were repelled. He said: “Yeah! My prediction is correct.” I said: “Great! Can you try the other way to see what will happen?” Then, Noah put two magnets face-to-face, they both were attracted. He was so surprised, and he said: “That was cool!”At last, he turned the two magnets to the opposite side and faced them together, they repelled.  I asked him: “why these two magnets have different reaction when you put them face to face in different ways?” He said: “they attract each other because they have a lot of small glue sticks inside the magnet, they repel is because they fight each other.” After our discussion, I asked Noah to draw pictures that he mentioned about why two magnets react differently: attract and repel.

J.Q. :   J.Q. and I then conducted the second part of the interview about how he predicts magnets

interact with one another. When asked the question, “What do you think would happen if you were to bring these two magnets near each other?”  he predicted that one side of the circle magnets would come together, and the other side would push away. J.Q. tested his prediction and found that it was correct. I asked if he was surprised by this, and he replied “No.” I then asked him why he thinks the magnets act in this way. He replied, “I know that there are N poles and S poles inside the magnet. I think when you put two N poles or two S poles together, they are attracted to each other. I think when you put an N to an S, they push away from each other.” After listening to this comment, I then asked him to draw a picture depicting his theory.

I was shocked by J.Q.’s explanation on how magnets work. His definition of polarity is incorrect, however, he has the basic knowledge of poles and that they interact with one another.

Summary: It was very interesting to read all these predictions and conclusions that these kids came

up with. Every child will take you to his own unique world of magnets, and what makes you enjoy the interview the most is when you look at their cute faces trying to explain to you why did the magnets attract or repel when they got them close to each other. Honestly, what we thought was interesting about our group project, was that we got the chance to interview kids who are in the same grade level, second and fifth grade. By doing this, we were able to compare how kids in the same grade level think about magnets.

If we want to talk about Ben and Noah, both of them are in second grade. But as you

notice, their thinking is different from one another. For example, Ben guessed that the magnets will attract if we put them close to each other. While on the other side, Noah mentioned that these two magnet won't get attached to each other.  Both Noah and Ben were surprised when they tested the magnets. When they were asked about the reason behind the interactions between the magnet, everyone of them explain it in his own way. Ben took us with his explanation to his own magnetic world where there is forces inside the magnet, and these forces are different from side to side. He described the forces as bunch of small lines that are very strong. Ben drew the two magnets attracting and repelling. He even drew the force inside the magnet which he believes it’s the reason behind this interaction. On the other hand, Noah believed that these two magnets have a lot of small glue sticks inside them, and the reason behind their repelling is because they fight each other. Listening to this, might make sense to other kids at his age, because everybody knows that when you fight with someone, you don’t even feel like sitting next to him anymore. Noah drew his magnets at the end of his interview, he also drew the small glue sticks. The thing that was interesting about his drawing is that he drew bunch of magnets

fighting on the side where he was suppose to draw the repelling magnets. So, I’m really curious to know why did he drew bunch of magnets instead of drawing just the two magnets.

Moving on to Medo and J.Q. our fifth-grade students, both of them had some kind of information about magnets. Medo guessed that the two magnets will attract if he gets them close to each other. He was very surprised when he switched the sides of the magnets and watched how these two magnets repel. He even tried to put them together but he couldn’t. Medo believed that the reason behind magnets repelling is that there are tiny particles on one side of the magnet more than the other side. So basically he explained that depending on which sides of the magnets we are putting close to each other, the magnets will attract or repel. Medo even drew his pictures that shows magnets attracting and repelling. He added the tiny lines to represent the particles inside the magnet. J.Q. a fifth grade student, had a different way of thinking about magnets. When asked about what will happen to the magnets if we get them close to each other, he mentioned that one side of the circle magnets would come together and the other side would push away. After testing the two magnets, J.Q. wasn’t surprised, He was so sure about his prediction. He believed that the reason behind this interaction between the magnets is that there is N and S poles in the magnet. He mentioned that when we put same poles next to each other magnets will attract, but when we put different poles next to each other magnets will repel. At the end, J.Q. drew his pictures about magnets attracting and repelling. He even shows the N and S poles.

Part III

Question: What will happen to the magnet when we drop it in water?We decided to ask this question because we figured the students would be amazed by the results. It also provides them a critical thinking opportunity as they try to rationalize how the magnets still work despite being placed in water.

Ben:After asking Ben our group’s question, he was absolutely sure that the magnet would no

longer work. He said, “the magnet will not work anymore.” I asked why and he replied, “the force lines in the magnet will become full and get squishy and break.”

We placed the magnets in water, quickly brought it out, and tested it. Ben was shocked. “No way! How does it still work? I don’t get it!” I asked him to think about why the magnet still worked despite placing it in water. He said, “I don’t think we put it in the water long enough. It has to be in the water longer then it won’t work anymore.” We then placed the magnets in the water and let it sit for one minute. After one minute was up, we re-tested the magnets. Once again, the magnets -- to Ben’s amazement -- still worked. “Wow!”

I asked him again how the magnets still work. He said, “the water is not that strong and doesn’t break the force lines. Maybe if we had salt water it would break the magnet. Or hot water. Hot water could probably burn the force and the force would never work again.”

Medo:

After asking Medo our group’s question, he answered: “ nothing will happen to the magnet, it will still work normally.” He was very confident about his answer. So, I asked him: “Why do you think that the magnet will still work normally as you said?” He answered: “The magnet is solid, and the particles inside the magnet will not get affected by the water.” So we decided to test the objects again with the magnet after dropping the magnet in water. At that point when I was looking at Medo, I could tell that he was testing the objects again just to show me because for him, he felt that there was no need for us to test the objects again. So, after testing all the objects again, Medo said: “See, I told you that nothing will happen to the magnet.”

Noah:After asking Noah our group’s question: will the magnet be demagnetized if we drop it in

the water? He said: “Yes, the magnet will lose all the glue sticks inside.” I asked him: “Why?” He answered: “Because the magnet is wet, and it is hard to attract or repel.”After we put the magnet in the water and took it out. I asked to check it out to see if his prediction was correct. I used the magnet to test with nail and paper clip, they both attracted to the magnet that were dropped in the water. He said: “What?” I knew he was surprised, and I asked him why the magnet still work. He said: “Maybe the water cannot go inside the magnet, so it cannot make the glue sticks wet. That’s why the magnet still work.”

After that I asked him to tested it again and put two magnets in the water for five minutes. He put two magnets in the water at the same time and I counted the time for him. After five minutes, he took out the magnets and tested both with nail and paper clip. He got the same result as before. The I asked him to test two magnets. He said: “Oh, there is nothing change for the mangetts. I got the same result from before putting the magnets in the water.” I asked him again: “Why does the magnet still work after putting them in the water?” He answered: “because the water is not strong enough to destroy the glue inside the magnet, if we use other materials, it might be able to destroy and make the magnet not working.”

J.Q. : After asking J.Q. our group’s question,“What will happen to a magnet if we drop it in

water?”, his prediction was that “nothing will happen to it.” I then asked, “Do you think the objects that were attracted to the magnet will still be attracted if the magnet is wet?” He replied “Yes.” I then set out a bowl of water and instructed him to put the magnet in the water, and then remove it and wave it over the paperclip and the nail. He performed this activity, and both objects were attracted to the magnet, the water had no affect on it. Next, I had him drop the nail and paper clip in the water and asked him to predict whether the water would affect the materials. He predicted that “they would still be attracted to the magnet.”  I asked him to test the theory, which he did, and his prediction was correct. I asked him “How did you know the magnet would still work even though it was wet?” He replied, “I know this because I have gotten magnets wet before and it has not affected them.”

Summary:

The group of students we interviewed consisted of two second-grade students and two fifth-grade students. Of this group, only one of the children had no prior knowledge of magnetism. Our group developed the exploratory question "What will happen to a magnet when

we drop it in water?" Prior to their interviews, our group predicted that the majority of children will say that the water will affect the magnet in some manner. We were surprised to find that only two of the four predicted that the water would affect it. These were the two second grade students. Both had very interesting explanations for their reasoning.

Ben believed that if we put the magnet in water, it would “disrupt the force lines and make it become full and get squishy and break.” Noah thought the magnet would be unable to attract repel if it's wet. Ben and Noah tested their predictions by placing their magnets in water. Both were quite surprised when the magnets were not affected. When asked why they thought the water had not affect on the magnets, Ben explained that the water was not strong enough, and if it had been hot water or salt water, it would have affected the magnets. Noah believes that there are small glue sticks inside of the magnet that are allowing them to attract and repeal. He believes the water had not affect because it is not strong enough to destroy the glue inside the magnet. Noah suggested that if we used other materials, it might be able to destroy the glue and prevent the magnet from working.

These explanations show that students will have different ideas as to how things work. As future educators, we should encourage creative thought, and guide students toward the correct answer. Self-discovery is the best way for children to learn new concepts.

The two fifth-grade students, Medo and J.Q., both correctly guessed that the magnets would not be affected by the water. However, neither one was able to give a correct explanation as to why this happened. J.Q. knew this because he played with his own magnet set and had gotten it wet. He couldn't explain what was happening inside of the magnet. Medo came the closest to the correct explanation. He stated that since the magnet is solid, the particles inside it will not get affected by the water.

Both of these students are in the early stages of learning about magnetism. While they have more developed ideas than the younger children, they still require further instruction.

Overall, this was an interesting aspect of the project and it was useful to hear the different hypotheses the children predicted. It is imperative that educators take into consideration a student's prior knowledge and allow them to expand on that information.

Part IV

When beginning the interviews, we discovered that our students had a wide range of background knowledge. The diversity in background knowledge is even evident in students from the same grade, specifically with Ben and Noah. Ben had some prior knowledge about magnets and how they worked. However, Noah had little to know prior knowledge about magnets. Meanwhile in fifth grade with Medo and J.Q., each had some background knowledge about magnets. When teaching about magnets or any other topic, it is important to remember that all of our students will come to us with a wide range of background knowledge and it is important to differentiate our instruction to meet the needs of all our students.

After our students tested the materials with their magnets, many were surprised at a few specific results. While majority of our students correctly predicted that the nail and paperclip would be attracted to the magnet, many were stunned that objects such as the penny and aluminum foil were not attracted. Some of our students were even surprised that if the objects did not attract, they did not repel either. No student predicted that any object would not be affected by the magnet. This caused some students to question their “rules” for magnetism. Despite some objects not attracting to the magnet, many of our students said that an object would only attract to the magnet if the object was metal. Some students also believed that an object must be hard in order to be attracted to the magnet. After testing the objects, our students worked with magnets interacting with each other and then they drew their diagrams.

This was the most interesting aspect of the project as all of our students had different ideas and diagrams portraying how magnets interact and work. Ben, a second-grade student, said that inside the magnet, there was a force. According to Ben, the force is a bunch of lines inside the magnet that either are “up and down” or “side to side.” Each side is different, the up and down lines mean the magnets will repel and the side to side lines will attract. Noah, another second-grade student, also believed there was something inside the magnets causing the magnets to attract and repel. Unlike Ben, who believes there are force lines in the magnet, Noah thinks that inside the magnet, there are a bunch of little glue sticks that make magnets attract. When magnets repel, Noah concluded that the little glue sticks are fighting each other.

Much like Ben and Noah, Medo and J.Q., both fifth-grade students, believed that there was something inside the magnets that caused them to attract and repel. For Medo, he thought there were particles inside the magnet as well as on the surface. For attraction, Medo believes that if the magnet has more particles on one side, they will attract. If both magnets have fewer particles on their sides, they will repel. As for J.Q., his diagram and conclusion about magnets was the most accurate of the four students, however, he is not quite there yet. J.Q. thought there were both N and S poles inside the magnet, but when both N poles are facing each other, they will attract and same goes for both S poles facing each other. J.Q. believes that if N and S poles face each other, the magnets attract.

Below is a table showing specific aspects of our students’ diagrams about magnets:

Student Name

What causes magnets to attract and repel? Inside or Surface?

Ben Force linesAttract: Side-to-side linesRepel: Up-and-down lines

Inside

Medo ParticlesAttract: More particles Repel: Less particles

Inside and Surface

Noah Glue SticksAttract: Glue sticking togetherRepel: Fighting each other

Inside

J.Q. N and S PolesAttract: N and N facing each other. S and S facing each otherRepel: N and S facing each other

Inside

Our question for Part III involved dunking our magnets in water and having our students predict and test whether or not the magnet would remain magnetized or not. Ben and Noah, our second-grade students, were fairly confident the magnets would no longer attract or repel after setting the magnets in water. Our older students, Medo and J.Q., predicted that the magnet would still work, despite placing the magnets in water.

It was interesting to see that our second-grade students, who predicted the magnet would no longer work, conclude that the water was not strong enough to change the magnet. Meanwhile, the older students were able to figure out that the reason behind the magnet still working is that the poles (J.Q.) or particles (Medo) were inside the magnet and the water could not affect it.

This project is a great reminder that students are extremely diverse and have different thought processes, no matter if they are in the same grade or not. Overall, this was a great experience that provided us with the opportunity to witness firsthand how students think and learn, specifically about magnetism.