Queensland

Parliamentary Debates [Hansard]

Legislative Assembly

WEDNESDAY, 20 OCTOBER 1915

Electronic reproduction of original hardcopy

1414 Adjournment. [ASSEMBLY.] Papers.

LEGISLATIVE ASSEIYIBLY.

\YED:\E~Jl.IY, 20 OCTOBER, 1915,

The SPEALER (lion. V\. ::\lcCormack, Cairns}· took th,~ eh~tir at half-past 3 o'clock.

QrESTION. IxcRE\~E TO FoSTER-)fOTHERS OF ::31.\TE

('HJLDRE:-i.

:VIr. COHSEH (Burnett) asked the Home s, ere·_al'y-

'· As the GoYr-rnmcnt haYe pro;-idcd. i1'2rcas: s to 1 ail way employees ovring to the in<::easocl cost of living, why have­tlH'Y not. for the ,~,atne rC'ason, n1ado, ~i;nvilar proYision in the Estiinates for Hu inere:1fie in the u.rnounts allo\Yed to fntcr-moth<>r, of children t!lldN Statf'· eontrol '.,

The HO.:\IE SECHETARY (lion. D. Bowman. Furtitud-: Fallcy) replied-

'· There \H.ts :no general request for an. increase. and the state of the finances docs not per,nit of any increase at the· l:rcscnt tinw. 1 '

PAPERS. BRISBAXE STRIKE OF 1912.

Th, HO:Y1E SECRETARY: In accordanoEl. ·with the answer given la3t '\Yeek to a ques~ tion by the han. member for :Vlerthyr (;}1r. McLachlnn) I now desire to lay on tho tabl<J· of tho Hou~c copies of all corrcs)londenc•' »lncil passed between the Commissioner of· l'olice and the BriFbane Strike Committe<', ancl the Commissioner <md tlw Employers' Federation, during tho currency of the Bris· L"nc strike of 1912.

Han. J. TOLlilE: Do yon moye that tho· pape~·~ be printr·d?

The HOME SEC'RET.\RY: Xo. nox. J. TOL:YIIE: I beg to lllOYC that tlvs.·

lrfiiJC l!. be printed.

Question-"-That tlw papers Le printed-· put; and tho Home clivided :-

:Jlr. Armstrong , BeJI

Bridges Corser

,, Grayson , Gunn

Rodge '' :Moore

Teller<:

AYEs, 16. Jlr. Petrie

, Hoberts ,, Pomersrt

Rtcvens Dtodart

, Swayne , To!mie

Yow lea }fr. Bell and ~fr. ewaynP_

~OES, :-':2. )Jr .. \cl'clli:."Oll }Jr. Kirwan

.-\rmfif'ld Larcombe , Barbe-r Lennon

BPrtram :.\fcLachlan· Ro1nnan l\icMinn Collins Jil cPhail Cooper , O'Sullivan Dunstan Jlayna Fihelly :; Peterson Foley Pollock Gillies , Ryan, D. . Hardacre Ryan, H. J. Rartlry, H. L. , Ryan, '1'. J. Hartley, W. , Stopford Hunter , \VPilingten. Huxham , Winstanley

Tellers: :>Ir. Dunstrtn and Mr. Pollock-

Resoh·ed in the negative.

Public Curator Bill. [20 OcTOBER.] Days of S£tting. 1415

RECE:\T PVBLIC APPOI:\TMENTS.

On the motion of ::\Ir. CORSER (Burnett), it \Ya" formally resolYcd-

.. That there be laid upon the table of the Home a return showing all publil' appoilltiHent"~· n1ade sincl' lbl June, 1915, the nnnrcs cf those cn1p1oye·d, and th.:_) nn1onrlts of tLeir incliYidual rennlnera­tions to d.nt-;."

PCBLIC Cl:RATOR BILL.

lNITIATlO!'f.

The PRE:\IIER (Han. T. J. Ryan, Barcoo), in rnoving-

.. That the House will, at its next sitting, resolve itself into a Committee of th•' \Yholc to consider of the desir­a.blcness of introducing a Bill to consti­tute a public curatDr, and to prescribe his powers and duties, and for purposes consequent thereon or incidental thereto,"

said: I notice that the leader of the Opposi· tion called "Nor formal" to this motion. For his information, and the infmmation of han. members, I may say that the purport of the Bill is indicated by the title, namely, '· to constitute a public cura.tor and to pre­scribe his powers and duties, and for purposes consequent thereon and incidental thereto." I think it is recognised by most peDple who have any knowledge of the subject that the proposal for the appointment of a public curator will be in the nature of a public trustee, who will fill a long-felt want in Queensland.

HoNOcRABLE ME:IiiBERS: Hear, hear!

The PRE:MIER : I do not know if the leader of the Opposition desires me to gD into an outline of the Bill. If he does, I may :-ay that power will be given to the Governor in Council to appoint an officer to act as public curator. The office of public curator, or public trustee, has been in exist­ence in England, New Zealand, and New South \V aies for some considerable time, where it has operttfed n1Gst succe;;_,,::fully, and in the drafting of the Bill advantage has been taken to consult the Acts of those dominions. Power will be given to the GoH:rnor in .Council to appoint an officer, to be called the public cumtor. He shall be giYen wid·· powers. The offices of curator of intostat0 estatcq) curator in insanity, official tn1stce in in~olven<T, and principal receiver in insolvency a.re' abolished, and the powers and duties of such oflicers shall be exe10ised and performed by the public curaL)r. He is constituted a eor11orat:ion t:ole vdth perpetual snccp;;sion and a sea 1 of o~ric-e. Rf'g,··rding thr, public <'Ur.ltor's po\Vf'r as t:·ust~t·-(a) "\\.,.here the Crown, Gove~'nor in CDullcil, court. judge, or any pc rson can appoint a trustee, executor, a_dYll~n;~trator, gu'.trdinns, 0tc., an;: of snrh appoint:nents may be made of the public curator if he consent'3; (b) where the Cro\vn, ct", CIE'~ir"'s to or can create any trust, then, unless exp;"f"··.]y prohibited. the Crown, etc., may apr.oint the public curator to be trustee; (c) trnst;;<'S m:1y nppoint th<: public curator in their placE'; jn son1c :instan(•f,~ the consent o£ the cDurt must be obhined; (d) th • public cu,ator mav be appointed new or additional trustcp. \Vide powers will be given to him in the administration of small estates. In administration of trust estate a' trustee, the

public curator may act with advisory trustees. He may also be appointed custodian trustee. He may be appointed gua1·dian of infants. When acting in any capacity under and for thP purposes of the Act, he shall have the Mme powers, dutin~, and liabilitie,, and be c·ntith7d to tbo Pame rights and immunities, as an individual person acting in the sam& capacity. It is abo proposed to give him power to institute a safe deposit office where· an:y wilb, cLbPntur-,s) etc., may be kept for safe custody. In addition to any other power:; in the Act, the curator will have wide powers of dealing with trust property, such as selling-. leasing, exchanging, bringing or def9ndmg actions, etc. He will also be given certain po\vers with respect to un­claimed prop'~'rty, including unclaimed land, other propery, and unclaimed money. Powe1· will be given to make regulations providing, inter alia. for legal aid in anv legal pro­ceedings by or against poor pcn·sons. The purport of the Bill is to ensure stability in the administration of trn-;ts, investments, etc. combined with ecDnomy, and also to seem·~ the speedy and cheajJ administration of estates. I do not think at this stage I need add anyt.hing further. The Act has been Yery successful in its operation in England and in New Zealand, and I might say that we have taken advantage of a close study of those measures in their operations with the view of making this a complete measure. I am sure that it is one that will be hailed with a good deal of satisfaction by the public of Queensland, because it will do a great deal of good, and it will do it ;vi~h'?ut expense to the taxpayers, because II; IS mtended that this office, although it may haye some highly paid Dfficials, will b0 •<elf­supporting, even i£ it does not producP son1e small revenue.

Mr. ARMSTEONG (Lockyer) : On behalf of the Opposition, I wish to thank the Premier for the information he has given us_ I think the Bill will fill a long-felt want. As far back as fifteen years ago it was suggested by the House that a Bill of this nature should be introduced, but effect was not given to that suggestion. Although there may be some question of detail in regard to the measure that the Opposition may have to differ with the Government I think we can agrPe to its introduction. ' I thank the Jeqder of the Government for his courtesy in giving the information he has given and in having initiated a course which I hDpe we mav oxnect to se~" followed in future by the front Treasury bench.

A GOYERX)IEKT ME)!BER: No lectures­(Laughter.)

Question put and passed.

DAYS OF SITTING.

T:,e PHK\IIER, in moving-" That. unlc--'; otherwise ordered, the

Home will meet for the despatch of busi-11058 at 3 o'f'1ock p.r-1. on Friday in each week. in addition to the days already JH'o\·ided hy Ses;ionol Order, and that GoYernnH:·nt bu-siners do take precedence o£ all other businf'"<::, on that ·day,"

s.1id: Ti1e object is that .we may increase the nun1ber of sitting dnys, because, uniess 've do, unfortunately, I am afraid we will have to sit Dv!'r Christmas, and I am quite sure that no hon. member desires that that should happen. If the Opposition-perhaps, I

Han. T. J. Ryan.1

HlG Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

should say hon. members-<HC reasonable, •ve may be able to get through early in Dere1nhrr and g·et through the progran1me of legislation we propose and aho dispose of iho EstimatJs in that time.

Ho~. J. TOLMIE ('l'oo1"oomba): The reason I called .. Not formal " to this motion was not for the purpose of delaying bnsiness or obstructing it in a.ny way. I ma.y say that as far as the Opposition are C'oncerned, 've are quite agreeable to assist the Government by sitting on as many days as the Government think it ie. requisite for tno business to be carried throus·h, and if thev feel it nocesH;,n to sit on Monda v or Satur·day we shall be quite agreeable: I rose to my that I have been informed that quito a large number of members on this side of tho House-and probably members on the other si·de. teo-have made engagon'iont.; for this comin<r Friday. I hcwe been dis· cussing the matter with them, and they say that it will be a very great inconvenience to them if the Premier asks the House to sit on the coming Friday. If the hon. gentle· 1nan can soe his \Yay to aJstain h·o1n sitting on this coming· Friday, he will assist n1emR 1F:rs on this side very much.

The PREMIER: I will let tho hon. member know a.t the adjmnnmcnt hour.

Ho~. J. TOL:'\IIE: "\Yo m<ly t1lk it over before the adjournment hour.

Qm··lion put and nassed.

SUPPLY. Frx l:.)ICIAL SrATE~rr-;-.;T~--J{Es-c:\~:r,~-L)~ u1: lJEBATE.

(~~lr. Coynr, 1r~arrcuo, in the chair.)

Mr. PETRIE (Toombu/): There seems to be ;l_ disp{;:::it!on vll the l_lart of hon. lll0l1lbers sitting on the other side• of tlw House to dis. Cllfj thi'.i Financial Statmncnt. Although they aro evidently undo' the "hip. the very doqucnt sper<'h delivered ;n .,terda~· by the hon. me1nber for ~1urrun1ba on thP Fin-ancial Statcmcnt-th(· IJe,t speech which I ever hf'ard him deli ll'r-brought fen' -ud two d!e,Inpiont' frmn the other si~le-the hon. member for Fitzr?y and the hon. member for Bowen. I do not think "e often hear the hon. memlwr for Fitzroy c,xrept in some -of l1is gramophone oeleetions that he hurls acroes tho Chamber b~· way of interjection. Then, we had the hon. member for Bowen, who is alway> up against the capitalist and private enterprise. He is going to kill private enb~rrn·jSe, .and he i~ going to kill the capitalist. I-Ic has a certain rcrnedy, as the prof3S'Dr of chemistry on that side of tlw 1-Iouse, in \Vh·tt he c,, lls " econornic~." But th:.ct. LO far, ho.s not ber'n able to kill either p;·ivate enterprise or the capitalist, and probably the han. member "ill have to add ~omething c]s,c to that mixturn; and I would suggr3t that he add the drafts out -of the Bills that "e havCJ had before tho I-Iousc so far: mix the-m ur wi~h E~1so1n e<tlts, and if he )ll'l''·Crihes that medicine three iirnes a day--a tables,Joonful each time-he will blow tho capitalist and private enkrpri,e to pieces. I do not b•ow that I can cong-ratulate the Tr<>asurer on the Financial s·tatement. Siner I have had the honour of being a member o£ this House this i3 the first time-of course, I do not blame the Treasurer-that we have had a portion of the Financial Statement only. Of course, we know that the Loan Estimates

[Han. T. J. Ryan.

have to be tJostpon0d until such time as the Government know what they are going to do in the way oi getting financial assistance. To a certain extent the Government have mv svrnnathv. because we know in times like tl;is · a~d ~ith the great war cloud still han~ing over us. it is almost irnpo ·,sible to obtain monev. I agree with tho han. mem­ber for Murrumba that there is no necessity for the TrC'asurer to itnpose further taxation on tho people of Q.uoenslund at the pr·esent tim<'. The hon. gentleman states, in the first part of his Statement, that-

" The -'3U0CC&:3ion o£ good sea;;:,ons vvith which Q'1censland "as b'essed during the last decade, unha)))lily culminated at the end of last vear in a vi~it<J.tion of one of the most ~evere droughts experienced in the history of white men."

In another part he refers to the losses that the pastoral industQ· has suffered through thi·, most unprecedented drought, and at the same tinF he cxpr"""' his sympathy by clapping on additional taxation in the way of extra income tax and a land tax. If the expenditure was kept within ~h_e revenue there would be no need for addrtwnal tax­ation. Last vear the c•-timatcd surplus was £1,756, and the actual surplus was £3,259. Now, the Treasurer. according to his own Staten1Pnt. has a great deal 1norr i'evenue this year than I.ut, a part altogether from

HF· new taxation. but including [4 p.m.] the increase in railway fares and

fr·•ight,. He expects' a revenue t.his :ve c~·, without the extra taxation, of £7 312,755. That is £110.097 more than the re\;enue last year, and I maintain that in .-icw of the sm·plus of £3,259 last year, f1crc should be no need for any further re><'Hlll'. ::\'evertheleos, the 'rreasurer cal­culates :hat there will he a deficit of £370,564, and he' is going to make up that by putting on a land tax, to produce £165,000, and an i ncrr:tse in the incon1e tax funounhng to £110 000. I think that at a time like this that 'is verv imprudent financing. The addi· tional rc,v0"ntH is not required for any pur­po.s+J c·onr;c·ctr(l \vith the \Var, but. n:-erel_:~ to me1:t the additional cost of adn11nistrat1on. I think that the aut0mc•tic inceeasee ou,.ht to have been naid. But there are other in­crease' which· the Government. propos<e to rrive to the Raih•·ay Dep"lrtment. They might jmt as well have told the employee> th~t when circumstances permitted after the \Var, and \Vhen good seaSons C'ame agaii_I, their claims woc!ld be considered and thmr wag,vs "'auld be made up to them at that time. Hill. e"t the last election on the 22nd 2\fa.y, the C+overn~ent made a promise in reg3rd to thonc. Incre:ises, a,!ld, of course, they have to fnll11 that prom1se. There are other incr<'··l.Ses in the other d('nartmPnts, v:;;, for instance, in the I-Iome Secretary's Department, where it is very largil. I do not ao-ree with the han. member for Jl.,fur­rnrr,h:" in obiwting to onn particular item. I think the incro;,se which has been granted in the allow.1nce to natural mothers to bring iJ, up to the g:,me as the allowance to foster­mothPn is onlv fair and reasonable. (Hear, ]per!) Xotwithstanding all these amounts. [ thir,k thrtt if economy was practised and cur 0xpcnditure kept down, •:·e would .have no r0ason whatever for puttmg addrtronal bnrduns a.l the people of the State.

Mr. H. L. HARTLEY: Do you think 7s. 6d. is a living \vage?

Mr. PETRIE : I do not think anything about 7s. 6d. being a living warre, but in

Supply. [20 OCTOBER.] Supply. 1417

times of stress people sometimes have to put up with a great deal and have to sacrifice a great deal, and probably many of us in Queensland will have to sacrifice n. great deal more before this war is over. In re­gard to the increases in the railway fare.s and freights, I would like to refer to the statement said to have been made by the Minister for Railways, in which hP remarked that tho increases, if unpopular, had never­theless been found to be necessary. He went on to sav that in 1902 the then Minister, the Hon.' J. Leahy, who, I think, was one of the best Ministers we had, a man who knew what he was doing, had to increase tho rn 'h' ay rates, and if it was justifiable the>n it ·""·a~. more so no,v.

lYlr. KIRWAN: He >w,nt in for retrench­ment, too.

Mr. PETRIE : The Minister goes on to give a,; the reason-

" As the revenue of the State is suffer­ing, not only from the effects of the drought, but from dnnression of tra& dtw to t\e v.·ar."

Those statements are not in accord with the facts, because, ·during the year 1914-15, the railways earned sufficient to pay the whole of maintenance and running costs, besides th<'· interest hill. and the Commis­sioner then handed over a surplus of £48,650, which went into the consolidated revenue. The earnings for this year, according to the Treasurer's Statement, promised to be larger without the proposed increases in fares and freights. The returns from the first quarter show a sum of £971,830, as against £935,800 odd l•ast year. In 1902-6 there was a deficit in the railways accounts of £489,538, and after paying running and maintenance only £370,448 remained to meet the interest bill on the loan expendi­ture, which, at that time, aihounted on tlw railways to £859,981:. So that the Min­ister, at that time, was perfectly justifie·Ll in increasing the fare's and freights. The loss had to be made up out of consolidated revenue, which ihelf was short by £191,341. Not only that, but that was the third year. 'Three years running the railways showed a shortage, the total being £1,151,469. Dur. ing the Ja3t cloven years the revenue has heen more than enough to meet the expen­diture, and for the year we have just gono through the Railway Department is being made profit-earning. I think we arc to be congratuhted on having such a good rail­wav sr>rvice. As has be0n ,,tated bv thP hon. member for Murrumba, it is a ni:ilwa~ service of which w" should be proud. \Vc have a lot of money sunk there, but it is a splendid asset, and in present and former Commissioners we have had very good men !'nd we have also had very good employees 111 the various grades as well as at the head of affairs. Tho cities are not going to suf. fer comiderablv bv the increases 'in fan-s ·and freights. Thei·e is one class that goes ~··ot-frr·"'. Tn 1- 'vaY, I :1m not ~orrv that they should, .but '1\:e are told that 'return fares are to be abolished, In fact, I think they have already started the new system, although return farpo, <ere to be grant2d to Ipswich and Sandgate and Beenleigh, but not to Southport. Wh:v Southpm·t is ex­dueled I do not know. We are 'lot to inter­fere with i;he workmen's weekly tickets or anything in that direction. · I am a believer­in the one-cJ.ass svstem on the railways, and I hope that I will yet see all our suburban

1·aihva v :) run under the electric systen1. I hope, t'Lo. that thP day is not far distant when we will have all our trams and railway~ runninrr under the one· r8girne. But tbP Govern~ment are not satisfied that the farmer should be making losses. They have hit him under the Control of Pnces Boards Act, and they have commandeered his pro­ducts, and have dealt with him in a very harsh way indeed, so much so that the poor man on the land can in some cases scarcely live. We have the Governme_nt com­mandeering their butter and everythmg el~e they can get hold of. We wer~ told .m the Barcaldine speech that the pnce of hv· ing was going down. At that time we heard nothing bnt the bread, bee~, an_d butter policy, so much so that I thmk, If hon. members took a run round my elec­torate they would still see the placards of my opponent and his friends-" Vote for Petrie und Dear Butter, 2s. per lb.," ~nd all that stuff. But people are commencmg to see that, notwithstanding the fou~ or five months that this party have been 111 power, instead of living being cheaper, it is dearer to-day than ever.

Mr. KIRWAN: You have not read the latest statistics.

::Ylr. PETRIE: The hon. member will have an opportunity, ;yhtn he gets up, of ('Orreet­ing· me in any statement I have m~cle. I think that the hon. member for E nzroy made reference to the Goodna Asylum and the inquiry which has just beer< held .. I think that tho ex-Home Secretary dealt wrth that matter prett5· thoroughly last night. In mv opinion the State of Queenslnnd has done "more fo;. charitable institutions than any other State in the Commonwealth, and no matter what might be said about the late Liberd Government, they did a l.ot fm charity. If my memory serves me rrghtly. no le'9 a sum than nearly £100,000-at all evente, about £99,000-has been spent dur­ing the last six years on the Goodna Asylum. BP•ide> that, thou"ands of p~mn?s J:ave been spent on other charitable mstrtutwns, and altogetbor the figures sh<;w that the late Government were a mermful and humane Government which did all they could to assist the charitable institutions. Of cours0, we admit that· a iot more has to be done in that wa''· I believe ti,at th.e pre.ocnt Goyernn1cnt · are e1'r'cting son1e bu1lchn.gs by the day-labour system. No doubt. rf. we had the money, we could do lots of thmgs which it is imnossible for us at the present time to do. ~

Mr. H. L. HARTLEY: Your Govemment did have the money then.

)lr. pH;rrnTE: Our GoYC'rnnlC'nt we'l·e living within their income.

Mr. H. L. HARTLEY : And also si'arving· iP~titutions Eke Gocdna.

Mr. PETRIE: They were not starving everything else. The hon. '!.ember would like to seo the money lavrshcd on only one class. I believe in a good living wage, but, from our experience lately, we know that there are a good many unemplo.yed. on the market, ,and I fear that tJ:e leg;slatwn which the Government are passim; Will tend to increase the unemployed tenfold br _more. I hope not•. I hope that avenues Will be opened up whereby all the men and women out of work will be enabled to earn a

Jlfr. Petrie.]

1418 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

decent -living. The late Liberal Govern­ment have been blamed for low wages in the State.

Mr .. H. L. HARTLEY: Quite right.

Mr. PETRIE : Perhaps mv friend cannot carry his memory back to 'as manv Years ago as I can, when the conditions' of the people were probably not '•O good as .they are to-day, and yet men managed to exist and rear large families, and the members of their f:'milies ar<; !o-da;,: occupying some of the highest positions m the land. I remember ihe tir1e when we could h:udly get butter her0. I do n•)t know whether the case \va~ a shortage of co\vs or unfavour­able we,,ther, but I know that manv a time I have had to eat breai and dripp{ng; and I should be glad to eat that to-morrow if I could not get butter.

l\L. H. L. HARTLEY: You did very well on it.

:\Ir. PETRIE: Yes, I did very well on it. I suppo'e that the health of a person de­pends a good deal upon his disposition. I regret very much indeed the incidence of the taxntion which is pronosed, and which is uncalled for. At "- time I ike the pres0nt th" Government should have b"en satisfied with passing the Estimates and such legislation as is necessa.ry and urgent, and if they had confined their energies to work of that kind I aPJ. suro they would have received the assistance of the Opposition. I should like to refer to a good many matters connected with the Statement, and to some local mat­ters" but I suppose I should be out of place in mentioning them now. and that I should defer them until the loan proposals are bPfor!l the Committee. For s~me time past certam work has been promised mv elec­t~Jrate-namely, the duplication of the railway hne from Eagle Junction to Ascot or Pin­ken,b:t- That work has been long promised enc 1s V<'ry urgent, and I hope that the Go ven:ment will car~y it out when money is available. I have m my hand a letter dated ]5th April. 1915, rec'.'ived from the d<>nart­ment. hut I do not know whether I shall be in ord~r in reftdin!;' it. At any rate I'll take thl' risk. The letter is as follows,__:_

" Sir.--\Vith ro'Prence to the dupli­c.<ttion of the line bp,tween Eagk ·,Junc­tlOD and ~\s('ot, and to in1provement~ at Baglc ,Junction station, estimates have been prepared for both these works. as tlwv :tr••· both pre,>oinQ· m'ltters. "nrl thev will be amongst the first to be includPd in my cc.timates for t~e n8xt financial vear. whnn I trust th'lt tl7c nec-~ssary funds will be provided.

" I have, de., " (Rgd.) 0HARLl.S EYAXS,

" Comn1ie9ioner for Raihvays."

'l'h0 f'i~UlETARY FOR RAILWAYS: \Vhv don'l you wait nntil the loan proposals cmne on?

:\fr. PETRIE: I intimated that this is "' mottter which can be better dealt with when ,,.c have lonn proposals before the Com nuttep, and l. sh~ll, thPrefore, defer further r0fer<'nr·' t<; 1t tdl a lakr stage. There is onf:\ "~:ery , Import"lnt mR:ttor affecting my <'lectora.te tlnt I should _like to bring under tliC' not,ce of the Comnntt0e. From Hamil­ton right down to Pinkenba there is a lot of .srrounr1 in posse~sion of thn fi-ovcrnrnent "h1ch h«s heen resumPd for harbour pur­T10ses, and I 11nderstand that a scheme· has· hPPn prepared for the construction of docks

[3£ r. Petr1.e.

and wharves at. that part of the river. I nresume that there will also be a park there· ~vhich can be used by the families of the employees. The loca'l authority desire to· see a park established in that part of the town, and a deputation from the Hamilton Town Coun~il will probably wait on the Treasurer with reference to this matter be­fore verv long. Similar deputations have waited on the past Government, and asked for an area of some 30 odd acres opposite ::-ludgee ro.nd for park purposes, but so far they have not succeeded. I hope that the Government wi]l give this matter considera­tion, and see their \Yay to meet the vi~·''7S of the town council, who contend that If the GoYernment resen·e the land for a certain number of c1Iains bo.ck from the river front­ege, the use of the remaining land for park purpose'• will not intE'rfei'e with their wharf and dock scheme or '"'ith th" running of any railway which thev mav build in future. There ·is one other rnatte!: on whiPh I should like to C".flv a fe"~ \Yords. and that is our Rwings B.mk. I am glad to see that the_ 'rreasnrer is going to increase the rate of interest allowed to d0positors to 3~ per cent. I;f cntion has "lreadv been mad<' of the valu­able services whic·h' the Hon. W. H. Barnps· rcnclered to the State in connection with the Savings Bank. Bv his ac~ion in op<>ning branches of the bank in every portion of the' State whE're it was possible he prevented the Commonwealth Government .commandeering the Saving-s Bank business, and in doing that he did a very good thing.

Mr. H. L. HARTLEY: Give him a monu-­ment.

:Ylr. PETRIE: The work he accomplished' is a monument to hio. memory. The money deposited in our Savings BR.nk is used to make adv-anct·s under the \Vorkers' Dweli­ings Act and i:he Agricultural Bank Act with· the Yiew of assisting n1cn to erect worker"·'· dwellings and snttlers to improve theil­homes, and I think it is desirable that the· business of the bank should be reta;ned by the State. I should likP to see the Treasurer· increase the rate of interest on dE'posits to more than 3b per cent. I understand that in New South \Vales tho Government gi.-e 3~ per cent., and that they are now talking of increasing the rate to 4 pel' cent. I believe that- we could easily do the same thing, and that if we did we should get a grent deal mor0 money deposited in tho· Saving~~ Bank 'Thcr;__~ was a little bit of a ~care SOll1C tin1e ago, and the rrreaSUf(r

had to in,ert an acl.-ei'tisoment in thn nc ws­rapers to preycnt that scare snreadiEg. \Yha­was rcspon· ih]p f.,, the· scare I do not know, but I was Yl·rv gl>d th:1t it was stopp<:>r1. P0opl0 ar•· sometimes kd away by th0 fool­ish ren1arks of others, and if thern '\Vn.:' a widespread PCare, a g-reat deal of dan1'J::;'C might be dono to the bank. I tn·st f 1t the Treasurer will con"idcr the advisahle­ne:::Ps o£ incrPn ~ing the rate of intere:3t to 3~' per cent.. ii Pot to 4 per c-•nt. I notic•' that thf' GoYPrnn1ent are going to ~tart a State-owned sawmill. I am very g'ad to know that they are going· tD conserve our timbers, because I think that in the past our timbers have hc--'n very badly dealt with, and it is about time ;omething was done­in the direction indicated. But "-hether a State-owned sawm'll will be profitable­even with the extra privileges the Govern­ment will cnjoy-rem:tins to be proved. Rome hon. members opposite have suggested

Supply. [20 OCTOBER.] Supply. 1419>

that by cstabli,,hing a State-owned sawmill the Government will be able to provide eheaper timber for those who erect workm·s' dwellings. I ha vc no obj oct ion to people \Vho erect \Vorkcrs' dwellings g( tting timber as cheap as they can, but I do not sec why they should get timber cheaper than an~­body else. \Yhon the Railw~y DcpatmcLt

· installNl breaking-down plant. so that they might have a plant of their own to cut their timber, with the view of stacking it and allowing it to dry, in order that they might be able to turn out good work when building carriageo and wagons, I advised them to cut the timber long before they re" quirod it. I believe they are doing that, and I hope that if the Government establish a State sawmill they will do the same thing dwre, so that they will be able to supply a better cla-s of timber than is generaily avail­able. Timber dried in an artificial way is not alwavs as dfecth·elv dried as it io when exposed to a natural drying proce,s. But \Ye must remember that sawmills will be prepar0.d to dry timber in that way if the purchasers of the timber do not obj<•ct to P""ying fDl' it. Any timber that is stacked and stored is worth more than timber which is sold soon after it is cut, and it is onlv fair that the sawmillers should be recouped the additional expeme incurred in drying the timber. \Ve have timbers in Qucem­land equal to any in any part of the world, if not better. When I was in the building trade we had Sydney architects specifying pitch-pine for flooring. I got some of our mountain pine prepared in widths of 4 inches by 1! inch and dressed, and I took it down to Sydney to show it to the architectc. I had the greatest dif!iculty in getting them to accept it, though I conld at the same time have :d10wn them floors which had hePn laid with that timber for thirty years. After I had convinced them of the value of tlw timber, they asked what reduction w ouH be made in the price. I replied that no reduction would be made, becausp· if w• got permission to use that timber it would have to be stacked for eighteen month•. be>fore it wae put through the planing mill. and that builders had to pay for the benefits \Yhich this long drying ensured. But I would say that if members oppo<.ite think they aro going to give a cert3in section o1 the community cheaper timber bv est tblish­ing a State sawmill, they are wor-kinu in thu wrong direction. \Ye have already g~t BLtto building, and we arc to have State coai­Inint·s. Later on we f-lhaJl see hd\V thc:,e enterprif:.C'i tut·n out. \Ye hnxe a Ycry vood staff in the Public \Yorks Department, 'and there are E"omo works ':,-hich can bu carried out bett0r by day labour than by contr.cct. So far as I a·11 CJnc'.:'rned, I 'von1d r~thcr see tho \Yater and Sewerage Board carry <l'lt the \\hole of these \Yorks th01nselvf ~, as thv~: arr; carrying out the section to Lnr:-gage l'omt tlv·msclves, bee da3 labour. 'fhat jc;

a vNy difficult work to do. [4.30 p.m.J and it would be much better

for the board to curv it out thcmsdvcs. (Hear, hear!) \Vc havp tho eongc·:.ted traffic and narroY\' str('ets to deal with thor(', and I know that there has been a lot of filling-up stuff put into ihose strcj·h;. T n.n1 a natiYo n£ Brisb\u1c, and I have bEc>n herC' oYer Fix:ty years, ai!d I know with all the fii;ing-up sbff that has been put into the streets there will be a lot of dif!icLtlty in tunnelling and putting

down shafh. I rlo not say anything against the present contractors, because they ure gnod, .capab1o n10n and undcr:dand their­work; but the c>xpense of carrying out that work is much heavier; and seeing that the Viatcr and Sewerage Board have already done one portion, it would bo far more atif­factor; if tlK\ carried out the whole of that' portio~ thcmselvrc. I do not intend to take up any further time. I thank hon. membots for tho natient hearing they have ginm me. I trust -that mv rcmt1rks will be trrkon in the spirit in wh-ich they were given. I ant to s<:>e this hir Shte of Queensbnd t:,e brighto .. t star in the constellation of the· C:oLlmonwealth. I want to see Queensland go ahead by leaps and bounds. This is tho bept State in the Commonwealth, and I am proud to be a native. I was born in Queen street v;hcn it- was a part of New South \Yales, so that I can claim to be both a eornstalker and a bananalander. I hope the Government will not destroy tlw founda­tions that have already been laid down in this State, but rather make it a prosperous State a.nd a prosperous people, and then we will all be proud of the country we live in.

::.Vlr. VOWLES (Dalby) : In d~aling with t.lw Financial St1ttement generally, I \Yould like first of all to congratulate the hon. member for .:'.1urrumba on the excellent address he gave to this Chamber. I also con­gratulate the Treasurer on the concise St~te­ment which he has put before us. In dealmg with finance we are dealing with the most vital part of the business, because the whole of the machinerv of the State is wrapped up in its finance. 'If our finances are not in a lwalthv condition we cannot hope for the State to prosper. In the earl~- part of the Statenwnt the Treasurer says-

.. The drv season and the dislocation caused bv 'the war have combined to mak" a financial situation the difficulty nf ,~·hich has never been equalled in preYiou3 scars."

\Yh(•n the Treasurer lllit.kes that statement he puts his fin~:er on thP keynote of the whole situation. It seen1s rather strangG, though, when one studies tho figures that follow, that tht•re is reference to dislocation of trade c:nLl the drought. I cannot for the life of me, though. see how the fina.nces of Queens­land are affected by the war. On the othe1· hand I think the finances have gained con­sid?r~blv on account of the war. It is quite true that our goods haYe not been transhipped across tlw s2a, but haYe been brought as far· n-" the raihvov \vould carry thr-n1. So far aR

the money tl1at is goir.g out cf the countr.Y for t h0 l\ ar is concerned, that n10ncy IS found hv the Co1nn1oinvealth Go\~ornnH~nt. and the' Commonw-:•alth Government ha.ve to credit our Railway Dcpartn1ent with the f:.rc~. of the r-oldi ·"rs and other per,ons travel­ling on our lines, consequently \ve arc reaping· " benefit in~•·ad of suffering any loss through tho w.u. \VhPu the Statenwnt wa« presented laf't vcar a corbt.in an1onnt \'i as csti1nated for taxation. but we find that taxation brou12;h+. in £299,100 more than was anticipated. Xot­withstancling that iarge amount which was nroduced fron1 our raihvays and other ~L•UlCf''-. tho GoYernn1ent, more particularly thi; Goycrnment. since tho Denh~:Cm Gm·ern­Jnont went ant of office. have succeeded in ~pending eYer~· penny of it. Although the Trca8urer sho\YS a nominal credit balance-

Jlfr. Vowles.]

H::lO &up ply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supp!y.

o' £3.259 on the vcnr's trcnsactions. we arc told further on, 01~ page 2 of the StatPment. :that-

.. Tho great exeC'·~ of expenditure in th., departments, ho\YeYer, wa-s to son1e extent counterbalanced by the saving of £18.389 under tho heading of · Schedules.' am! £~J. 713 on interest on the public debt. Part of ihe forn1cr itcn1 ''us sa YbJ by tile non-payment of sinking fund duc>s on £8,106,400, being for short-dated securities which do not carry a sinking fund obligation, and the latter by the saving of last year's interest bill of one­quarter's interest on the portion of the £11.728,800 loan which waq conYerted during the year."

If that £68,713 had to be met, then, instead of there being a nominal credit of £3,259 there would have bven a deficit on the :vear's tramactions of £65,000 instead. \Ve 'know tha.t there are rocks ahead, because that is admitted on all sides. We· know that the <:lrought is continuing and that losses are being suffered in every direction, more par­ticularly from the bigge~t wealth and revenue produring sources from the land, both in produce and stock. \Ve know, therefor,,, that the shortage must continue, because it can on!:-· be made up by the natural increase. n nd there is no natural increase now. Seeing that that is the sL>te of affairs at the present time. v;e would m:nect to find the Govern­lllt•nt acting as sane business men 'vould do. \Ye >vould expect them under the circum­Rtancc, to go slow in times of stress, but. imtcad of that. we find tho Go.-ernment launching out and spending money-for what purpos·. ? They arc going to spend large sums of money.

:\lr. PETERSOX: You "a.nted us to pa v it to the Jimbour settler•. ·

. :\Jr. VOWLES: I was only asking you s1mph· to make a credit. Kotwithstanding that the revenue of last year was £7.202.658. it is proposed to place additional burdens on the people by proYicling taxation to bring in a renmue of £7.683.319, bf'ing an increase of upwards of £480,000. Again the burden is put on one section of the communitY. For the first time in the hisbwy of Queensland Vi,',? aro going to ha Ye a land tax in1posed. \Ye already have a form of land tax in th0 I,ocal Authorities Act, and this will also be incrPased. \Ve have also another land tax which affects our people, in the form of a Fc·deral land tax.

:\lr. COOPER: I a.m g-lad :wu said "our" peoph'.

:\Ir. VO\YLES : I do not suppose it affects the hon. gPntleman, lwcaLFO he has not got £300 worth of property.

:\Ir. CoOPEn: I wish I had.

::\lr. VOWLES: Then, in addition to that. !hey have to find the money to pay a Fede,·al 1ncoe.:"l tax, and \YO are going to have a war tax on top of that. Notwithst.:tnding a.ll iheso burden>, especially as we know tha_t th~ tir_ne is not opportune and the con· · dttlons m l:fe arc not such as to enable us to moot such demands-notwithstanding that we have a Government which should be re­trc_nching at the present time, what are they domg? They are launching- out and finding large sums of money for the benefit of one

'dass of the community at the expense of another.

Mr. COLLINS: What class?

[ilfr. Vowles.

::Yir. VOWLES: The claES the hon. gen­tleman reprPsents, simply for the purpose of gaining political kudos and making one sPction pay for the upkeep of another .

;\lr. CoLLINS: It is a long way from an e1e<~tion.

:\Ir. VO\VLES: It is a pity WP shall not have an election soon. If we had an election in a month's time, hon. gentlemen opposite would chang·e their scats. There is a lot. o.' talk about the Government not havmg finances ready to squander. \Vhen they came on the Treasury bench at the end of Juno, there was a matter of £2,150,000 left for them to play with. They have been getting rid of it all.

The f'ECRETARY roR RAILWAYS: There were £10,000,000 to be spent on railways.

Mr. VOWLES: That ,,-as for railwayo passed vears ago. You will find railways passed twenty yca~s ago included in . that. It is not the commitments of one particular Governrnent.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: It is a good thing to tell us what to do when we came into office.

:\lr. VOWLES: It waB part of the pro­gre· .. sivc g':ng-forward .. railwa;y policy, ar;d all these hue;; had to be bmlt. A ccrtam nmount of money had to be expended in c,tch vear until such times as the loan money gave vout.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: \Vhat about the sixteen railways pa&oed last year?

:\Ir. YO\VLES: They are not all to be built in the one year. The hon. gentleman knows that a; well as I do. \Vhen they came into office tho Government had £2,150,000 to play v ... ith. At the preo,ent time we are not being favourably considered in the money market at home. What is th·.' rec,son of tha.t? Is it because of the legislation we arc intra· ducing? It is all very well to say the other StaJe·' a ro in the 'ame po>ition. but they rPpresont the same body of politicians ~" pmYer in tho other State .. ~ as they do 111

Qurnnsland, and they do not me0t with the approval of the financier> of the old country. I sse the Treasurer proposes to increase the inter0st to 3~ per cent. on th 0 Savings Bank deposits. ~ ew South \V a leo has been paying 3~ per c('nt., and is contemplating a further ri ..... 'The Savings Bank returns on page 6 show the increase in the deposits from 1903 to 1~15. \V c must alway' recoll;·c1; that the Savings B.,nk is the poor p .. oplc's bank, and >vhen you find that 1he deposits increase you Hnut ('OJwlul1e that there i.s prosperity in tlw State. In 1903 the total amount at the credit of depositors wa~ £3,741,967. In 1914-lR the amount at credit was £10,663,856. That f'hows the prosperity there is amongst the working classes and the money they have sa vecl up. If yon look at the other side and see the figures in connection with banking

Pnorally, ~von will Ff'P the fol1o\Ying :-

"For the twelve months ended the 31st March last the deposits with tlw banks in the Commonwealth (excluding the Commonwealth Bank and the Savings Banks) showed a.n increase of only £1,888,445, as against an increase of £7,985,473 for the corresponding period of the previous twelve months, while advances increased b:v £4,965.186 for the year as against a decrease of £1,865,889 for the previous corresponding period;

Supply. [20 OCTOBER.) Supply. 1421

and during the holdings of the £1,482,441."

same time the cash banks decreased by

You see there that the deposits ha Ye been drawn against by the producers. 'l'hey have ha·d to borrow to carry on. Now they arc going to ha.-c further imposts in the for,~tl of taxiuion bol h in the form of land and inc01nc t(}x and in other direction'S directlv and indirectly. The people who ha~l £10,663,000 stowed away-the priYileged clafs~once n1ore arc 11ot going to bo taxed. Thit< is cia•·~ legislation in the extreme. If you uro g·oing to have taxation-if it is EI:C''" <Jary unc.ter present conditicns, then eYer,~.<' Inan in tho conlnJunity should bear hi~ rcoportiv!l. D•·.tling with the .'ubject of hcnd scttlcnu:nt: tlw to{·.:_l area avaiL1ble for ~d~-'' tion chll'iHg the financial } ear was 9.322.233 ac,·cs, as against 11,151,010 acrt'' du:·ing the pn~vious year, in 1vhich is in­c;udcd 75,000 acres open to petpetual lc.~'"e sclcn.ion, and 7,840, 712 acres fo1' grazing ~ekctiou. We are constaut ly hearing of the bins of the past Government, an 1 one of !bose sins is tlwt they did not open Janel for sdcction. Here we have the Treasurer ~hewing that t.hry opened no lc:-.1 than just ur ,ier 10.000,000 aens.

Mr. COLLIXS: How much was taken n;1?

:VIr. VOIVLES: The area, selected Wds

7,607,307 acres, leaving 1,200,000 acres un­selectc-d.

The SECRET.\RY FOR RAILWAYS: And you know there were a lot of people in <'Yery district who could not get land.

l'.Ir. VOvVLES: The •area selected was 7,607,307 acres, which included 500,000 acres of agricultural farm', 11,000 acres uncon­ditional selection, and only 15,000 acrc5 per~ pdual lea•.' ·· clect.ions-that is the Govern­ment's popular perpetual leases-and the large amount of 6,4'13,530 acres as grazing selection. On ih0 question of close,· settle­ment, we have heard that Jimbour has made n.J P"ogre'" owing- to the drought. There is no need for mo to emphasise th,_tt, be~ cause I think evervbodv in this Honse-in fact, e.-erybody in· Queensland-realises the trials and tribnl·~tions of the people of Jimbour since thcv have been there. Of course, they are some of the persons who have not pejd, and it will be necessary for the Government, sooner or later-the sooner the better-to introduce some scheme b.­which tbe troubles of those people will be overcome, and if they cannot overcome them permanontly, then the people wiil h~tve to accept what temporary relief can be given in the nwantime. I '"Y that a matter like this shonld be dealt with once and fDr all. Tempornry expedients are no good. \Ve do not. v; ant to have the Jin1bour q11estion, or nny other question, constantly before the House. vVe want to put it on business linu and have done with it.. In the paotoral in­dustry we are told that-

" II0avv losses have occurred of ,-heen and cattle 'generally throur;-hout the State, and further losses may be expected until the advent of heavy general rain". There will be only a small branding."

aJJd eo on. The Treasurer also says-

" 'The position of the pastoral indus~ try would he extremely grave but for the prospects of the incr·easing \ alue

of its products and the correspondingly high prices which must rule at the termination .. of the drought."

In nwnv instances in the \Vest there has been ,, 'full 50 per cent. loss, and in some c,•,P- a 75 per cent. loss has occurred.

)lr. KIRwAo;: Is it as bad as that?

::i<lr. YO\VLES: In some cases, absolutely. There hu> been a total loss in some caseo, vet \. o arc told that the increase in value (,f rhe products wili make up for those losses. \\'hat j .. , tho inc ca"c in the value of pro­due.,'? 'What is tl'o increa;;ed value of Lutter. wheat or meat? \Ve were not ,d!o'.. cec1 to re~p th8 bei:'ciit of the markets. Th,,re is no '·~lch thing as increv~c.cl value t~Jt 2_·e at all; tho G-overnment regulate~ it, and if tho GoYPrnnient is going to regulate iu i'-O n-·. to t1·y and give cheaper food, "hcthcr it b·c butter, heat, or beef, how o,, earth c.~tn they justify the statement that tho inc:ca-... e .. in value of tho products and the coTreF ;ondingl~, high priees \Vhieh nn1st rule a · t:lC t~. "llliuation cf tho drought 1vill com­!JCL,,tte the pustoraii;;t, and Queen .. .Janel for the h:1g·c Jc ... •;cs that bave occurred during the l-ast few months?

~.L·. STE'..EXS: Rank hypocrisy.

::\lr. YO\YLES: Hypocrisy once again. A11d it nn1st Le kno\Yn to n1cmbcrs on the other side that it is so much ',\·ind putting i'1 a stat< :ncnt like that. It means nothing at all. Xow, on the tmbjcct of agriculture. lt wi1l Le remembered that the Denham Go­Ycrnment, by way of inducing people to put lmger ar:-as under "~heat lor the purpose of getting an extraordinary yield this year to a;.-;ist our Imperial troops, financed the farm~rs by finding soed wheat, and in many instances finding· the money to culti ,-ate the la'rd.

Mr. COLLIKS: :More socialism.

Mr. YO\VLES: :Wore socialism. and un­fm·tunately, like the Western Australian wcialism. it was a failnre.

l\lr. KIRW\X: ::\ot the fault of the Govern­ment.

Mr. VOWLES: Not the fault of the Go­vornlnent but the fault of the clenwnts. Dnring- the y~ar £13,205 were a.dvancf'~l . by the Govcornmcnt to farmers, and in adclltwn .s0c·rl "heat costing £2'1,781 has bce:t di, .. tri­buted to the farmers. Tho Treasurer S<lys-

" Repayment is to be made from the proeeeds of the crop."

There is no crop, and how is the repB~Y­mcnt going to be made: V\' e find that the Department of Agrieulture now is sending }Jruni•',,,ory-notes to those farmers and ask­jug thern to sign the pron1is3ory-notes falling· duo at the end or the year-in a couple of months. How on earth can men who have lost everything they have got-they have lost the ''C·d "hich rhey put into the ground and they have lost thB labour in putting it the!" --how are they going to meet thoo,e prOJms­,,,orv-nDtcs unless the G0vt~:tn1nent. con1e to the~r nH~cue and supply them, this t_O<.tson, with further seed wheat and also assist them to put their land in order? If the Govcrninent a-re :;oing to do that, I tdll congratulate them. because it is necessary. It is ext,emely mi'cessary in many districts with '' hich I am acquaintc·d, bec,wse with­out assistance from the Government-they cannot get it elsewhere, bec~use they have· no security that tlwy can offer to anybody; they have not even security of tenure in

Mr. Vowles.]

1±22 Supply. [AI::lSEMBL Y.] Supply.

manv instances, let alone a tangiblP security t•} hand DVer for the purpose or a loan, and un]e,s the Government come to their rescue t!J8 land will have to n•main idlP. Th<' whole Df their agricultural machinery and 1llant will have to remain idle, simply be· eause they will not bo in a pc sition to ti11 the soil. I sincerely trust that the Govern­ment will give them every consideration, and that they will do fo1· the farmer thP same as the Denham Government did for them la;;t year. If they like they can go a little further in their socialism. At any rate, they should give them an oppor· tunity, and give Queensland an opportunity, of getting th" return whrrh, in the law of averages, they should get this year from th:e land. As far as the promissory-nDtes are concerned, I would suggest that those that

. are due now, or will become due iri Decem-ber, should be deferred for twelve months, and then the cost Df the wheat Olnd the cost of ploughing necessary to b<> found bv the Government this year should be p•J•st'­poned a further twelve months, because ·it is impossible for a man to make the tw(\ payments clear and the cost of living out of the land in one year. The figures in respect to the export of butter overseas, I think, arE' well worth mentioning. Includ· ing hams <and bacon, the annual value of th.' export has gone up to £2,500,000. The Q)lantity of butter made in 1914 was 37,230.240 lb., being an increase of 2,030,835 lb. over the production of 1913. The value of the export Df butter alone waY. £1,077.202. In addition to that there is all tho making of cheese, all the local consumption of butter a11rl r-hc, ,;,; ', and the ~,~tlr~ of milk and ~ vC'rv­thing elso to be taken jnto con-:;ir1eration in estimating the value of the indu>trv. Tho dairyin;s industry is one which has hr0n· ju•·t as h:nd hit as the cattle-raising in­dustry, if not more ~o. The lD·,s, ,, 'have not ar ·· ,.'.lly occurred i here, bec.1use the owners of the stock have b.ocn in a position to g< !· fccd t0 keep them alive, but thcv have lost their increase: thov hqve lost their money, and in many cases thev hav6 lost their h0rds became the;· could not supply the nece•sary fr:'d. Thev have lost practically all the profit that shonlrl come from them for the year, and, in addition to that, the Government has stermed in and t:lken away the profit that would h"ve given them an opportunity to carry on. \Y e know very well that, in certain districts on the Downs, the cost of producing butter is actu­ally more than i he people get for it, to

nothin<T ot a 11 nf the intereet on their land", on their herds, and on their plont. It is a losing concern for the men in thet class of business, but they are faced with th;s '1C .. jt;Dn : for thf' Ba lee of the future, for the sakb o£ kBeping t.he cows in p~cfi+ they muet feed them and must keen them going. The farmer is forced to do this, Dtherwise it means complete ruination and the destrucotic.n of his property. He h forc-~d to do that or to get out Olnd let Bomebodv else come in. At the present time you cannot get out if you want to. Legis­lation and departmenta 1 actiDn whi0h io going to affect and is affecting an indu,try such as this-action that will mean th'e cripnling of the induRtrv-crinnling- thr: in­du.trv Ol.S far as the owner is conc<'rnPd, and cert"inlv crinnling it as far "''· its labrmr­produ0ing powers are concerned-will ret"rd the whole State, and I sav tho Gnvernm"nt ~hould go slow in their administr'ltion. 'They should look before they leap. On the

[.Mr. Vowles.

subject of mining, I would like to refer briefly to this. The Treasurer, in speaking about stimul•ating production, refers to the imprDved price for certain minerals. We must recollect that these are extraordinary price,, and they are not g'oing i.o continue. We all hope that the prices will drop to­morrow, because a drop in prices would mean the cl0se of the war. But while funds are placed in the hands of the Treasurer £or the purpose of developing and prospect­ing mineral areas, to my mind, that money is not being distributed over a large enough area. It has happened-! know it from the department, ·as I have been there-that large sums of money have been spent in one locality to the prejudice of every other. I had an instance of it yesterday when I was in the Mines Department in reference to a very desirable application in connection with a coalmine on the Western line, one which is ·a payable proposition and which is in the hands of the worker, as they have the controlling interest. This mine is produc­ing coal of such quality that the Railway Commissioner will tOlke every ounce he can get. It save' the Railway Commissioner 70 miles' haulage one way ·and 70 miles back. In addition to that item alone it saves him £-tOOO or £5.000 a vcar. 'J'be coal is there: it is a going conce1:n, but water has go+. in, and it is nece··,ary to go further down to v:d a largor seam, ·and wh0n we go to the department we find that the whole of the cr;dit thev have tO\I'ards developing the wh0k of Queensland at the present time in this connection is only £1,700.

The SECHET.IRY FOR RAILWAYS: The han. member for Nlurrumba said it was too much.

Mr. VOWLES: I do not think it is. I se,, the pr,actical side of it. I know the po .ition there, and these pe<•ple should get tssi,tance-it is nCJt nssistance such as has bPon giYen in other instances. It is not in tho nature of a grant; it is simply in the nature of temporary accommodation '"hich can be taken back o•1t of the coaL The money is secure. 'Tho i\1inister is pre­p,ued to give it. bnt the money is not there. On the Supplementary Estimates, money should be found for cases such as this, be­cause, if that mine has t0 close <lown, it nwans that the workmen who nut the whole of their life's savings into the mine will lose everything. and somebody else will come along, exploit th(J mine, and get the benefit of the labour that thev have put in. This grant should not be given for the purpose of assisting big financial institutions. but for the purpose of developing new areas, and giving desirable persons an opportunity of carrying on their shows. I notice that the Government intend going into the oil b•rsiness, and I mav congratulAte them. If t.he Govornment make the nil business a Stnte matter. and do not a l!ow privote com· petition. there is no intPrference with exist­ing rights. Thore is onlv one oil arf'a that we know of in Queensland, and that is about Rom a.

Mr. APP~L: The late Government ordered that plant.

1\fr. VO\VLF:S: I know the latE' Govern­ment did.

The SECRETARY FOR PUBLW LANDS: That is not Po.

The PRE?'IEH: Tho mc·nber for ).fnrrumba· bl:•med us for ordering it Ia t ni:rht.

Mr. APPEL: I ordered it, as a matter o£ fact.

Supply. [20 OCTOBER.] Supply 1423

~Ir. VOWLES: I sav that it would be a ·o~candalous thing if the· Go,-ernmcnt wont to the expense they are going to for the pur­pose. of developing that oi:field, and after­wards anybody could come along and bore down alongside them and suck away the oil

. they had found. I am glad to see that they are going t0 keep it themselves.

[5 p.m.] I hope the Government will spend a lot of money in develop­

ing that district, because if they have the . good fortune to strike oil, they will revo­lutionis" tho \V b3t of Queensland, particu­larly with regard to carriage. Then we are told we are to have State sawmills. \Vell, if the Government intend going in for "·socialism in our time," I lwpe their ex­perience will not be what the Government have expericnctcd in \Vestern Amtralia. At .any rate, I hope that they will have more fie~ancial ability, and that the results here will not prove as di,astrous as they were in that case, and th:at, at any rate, they ~\vill be able to carry it on as a business proposition. \Y c arc told that this extra ,·evenuG is to be raised bv increased ta,a­tion. 'fhe income tax is· to be increased, and a land tax, with an Pxcmption of £300, i .. to be imposed, "·hilst ther€' is also to bG an increase in freights and the co't of tickots on thz· raihYay linos. I cannot s~e why the working mcm in the country should be placed on a different plan0 from the 1vorking n-:an in the citv. If '.-o~: ar g:::>inu­:.:> let the '"Jrking r:-wn~ have ..,2~a~ou ticker~ here at reduc,.d rni,'es, wh;.~ ~1· Hlld not the ;·,l.lTif' thing appl;,T to \,or king n1en in the

·Country?

OPPOSITION ]\1E~IBERS: Hear, hear !

Mr. VOWLES: Why discriminate? Is it hcc .tusc the hig Yuting po,vcr is here, and L!Je Goverument must keep these gentlem<>n in hand 1\ ho e.re their supporters in the mdro;•olitan ar' :-L? \Vhy should th'y be specially cxc:udcd, or why should they be excluded in any ca o,e? \Vhy should there be class legi -lai ::m? \\Thy should one sec­tion be favoured as against another? It has been made po-,.;ible to protect that same section pr~ctic.·tlly by wuges boards and all cla<>,os of legislation in order that nobody shall infringe on their rights.

Mr. APPEL: The Minister for Railwavs <loes not care a pin about the farmers. •

Mr. VO\VLES : And then we: turn round and give them conc,.esions in the form of exemption from taxation, while their fello".-men in other wnlk' of life have to suffer. The Financial Statement says-

" In the Home Secretary's Department the expenditure for this year is expected to exceed the actual di,, bur ,ements fo1· last year by £31,000. This is accounted for by the general expansion in the affairs of the Sl-ate and the increa•.ed popula­tion."

That seems to me a most remarkable state­me?t. :rhere has teen an mcrea 'e in popu­lation smce the 30th June last, althouzh we know that thousands of men have left their State. The Treasurer goes on to tell us that this expenditure is necessary on account of the increased expenditure on police prisons, health, hospitals, asylums, and charitable institutions-all since the Ryan Government came into power. It is neces­sary to have more l?risons, more hospitals,

and n1ore asylun1s l'::Inc~ the Ryan Govern­ment came into power. That is not much of a co,nplimcnt to their administration.

The SECHETARY FOR PunLIC LANDS: The late Homo Secretary told us last night it was absolutc•ly necessary .

Mr. VOWLES: 'Ve haYe been told that a large sum of money has been obtained by the Railway Department thwugh the freights on stock, and I think that i£ han. members will compare the receipts for these last three months with the receipts for the three months of the previous year. they will find that there is something between 40 per cent. and 50 per cent. increase in the stock revenue. That revenue is dcri.-ed from the misfor­tune of the people in the country. It will not be recurring, and hon. mem':lcrs will find that "hen the drought is oYer there will not be so much freight fat the railways, because tho stock will not be there to go to market.

The SECRETAF!Y FOR RAILWAYS: What about the prices. the cattlemen have got?

:\lr. VOWLES: 1 am dealing with Ereights. I waut to point out that if we had had a link bd;,veell the coast and the \Vestern railway lines-if ihe stock from Dalby and Bell C\>nld have gone across to the Nanango line, \Yhich is only 40 n1ile~, and there are very srnall l''rlsineering ~ifticultios, instead of having to g ') to TooV\'00111La and travel 300 rnilr'- in order to get to tlE- relief country­an enorn1ou.~ amount ~~ ould have bt en sa \7 ed.

'Ihc S~"HETUW ron RAILWAYS: \Yhy did not the late Governnw·nt do it ~ong since':

:\lr. \. 0\VLE ': They had been de'> ·)loping the Llil \rny s~ ~t; nL

rrlw SECRST.c:nY .FOR R,A!L1SAYS: They \Yero i.hL_:_'e for iiity years.

1\Ir. -VO\VLE8: Th_ lle~l Railway line has been t~H~re fol' onlv thu last f'"'W ·L~~n·s. That little 40 mik" without a rail\, :.tV- means that the stock h,',V(; to go fro1n t.hG Ro1na, and fron1 the ~~ iurilla, ctnd 1uy o'vn district .all tho way round to Toov oomba and L.i,,bane to get to Gympie ;,,nd the coast. Tho other day a friend of mine show~d me a cheque which he had "" p;,y for the return of his stock hom the coast. It was onh- £ :-tO­extraordinary revenue that the Gv;•ermnent got simply b•ccause th<l sheep were too weak to walk and had perforce to be sent hy train. This is not a local matter. 'I'his link would be a very great advantage to my own district, but it would be an extreme advan­tage to the people "' ho Jiye further out in the drought-stricken districts, because in the sixteen yoar·s I have been out there there have been three drouQ;hts. I have sePn sheep go out in three different years, and I do not remember haying seen many stock c<Jm­ing back. I£ we had a railway line by which we could take them to relief country, we would sa.-e in one drought double the cost of the railway. I hope that matter will be taken into con•ideration. I do not want to work the parish pump wh0n I know finances are cramped. but I want to put it plainly before tho House, because l say it is not a local matter-it is a national matter. It affects the Burnett and all the coastal country, beemsc the people could get their produce across the range so much cheaper. We get produce in Dalby where it costs just exactly doubl•J what the producer gets, simply because it has to go round by Thee­bine, Brisbane, and Toowoomba, whereas

Mr. Vowles.]

1124 Supply. [~\.SSE:.\IBLY.] Supply.

1t is only 60 1uilcs arro:-:s. Surely, as business men, the GoYernulCllt \'i ill apt_;reciato this. The Minister for Railwn · s has told me that he \vill take a trip "'res's that route. and I think th>~t when he docs :so, he -will come back jn:.t as big an ach-ocate of the con­struction of the lino a:::; the 1TI8lnbcr for ~•mango anrl tho member for Burnett and IllYf,.elf, beeau~e eycr_y 1nen1ber who has been across-including members on the opposite side-all agr• e that tho country is magnifi­~P;ot, and that it i·.· a dhamc that a line is not built and facilitir>s gi \Ttl to t),e people who are rrlr·· "dy there. It is Crown lands on ihe other .. ide, and nob1dv can sav that you arc fatteaing an_,-body in 'particul~r. ~\.ll yon are doiug· is t·o clc•velop tho cnuntry­giYing an opportunity to people to got their ~tcck to roLe£ country, and to produecrs on the coast side an opportunjty of getting a quick and now mcrket. I sincerelY trust tha' this awful w;.r will com•e to a speedy elose .·and that this dmught \vill break, be· eau:3E', unt.il s~tch ti1ne as tho.3o things happen, no Govcrnrrtent can fn1d it ca:::~,~ to finance. \\" ... cannot ccpcct tho Govcm~Pnt to find 1nor~ev whPn -;:o know that fr.•1anciaJ insti+Ju­tiom r •-nnot find it. \Yc appreciate the difficulty there is eyerywherc, nnd \YO giYe that C'rcdi~ to :i11C'n1bl•rs on the Trer1 ... sury bench0i3; but, although their fi~ures speak eloqnentl:. of !he potentialities of the State, they speak no Je,s eloquently of the taxing poY. ers of th•c Govcrnmc·nt of the day. I sincer~·Iy regret tbat it should be necct':arY to incr0ase the i·nposts at surh a tin1e as thiF. There are too n1any outgoings. BYery­thing i~ slackening off, and tho rt \7 cnue­producing pov. ers of the country arc dec! in· in g. In every direction there are huge losses, and wlwn the people \Vho arc the backbone of the country-who produce the whole of its weaith-m·e in the throes of a drought and suffering a 1! sorts of trial-., it is not an opportnn0 tin1o for increrrsing raihva:v freights or ta':ation, when that class of legislation is affecting only certain member> of the community.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS (Hon. J. Adamson, .llDckhampton): Let me say at once that, in listening to the speeches of hon. members on the other side of the House, one cannot help feeling that they arc almost playing the part of the prophet Jeremiah.

Mr. APPEL: You are on the Treasury benches now.

The SECRE'I'ARY FOR RAILWAYS: \Vhether we are on the Treasury benches or not, at any rctte, when we were on the other side, we did not always try to paint things the blackest so far as Queensland was concerned. 'We always had faith in our O\~-n country.

Mr. APPEL: Still, there was a lot of Jere· miah about it, you know.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: I do not remember much of J eremiaoh about it. so far as I was concerned. At any rate, I think that there is already a sign of coming prosperity. The droug-ht in some places is breaking up and splendid rains are falling, and, despite all the darkness there is in relation to some things. we ought to strike a note of hope rather than a note of despair-and it 'eems to me that that is the note that has been struck by speakers on the Financial Statement thus far on the other sid0 of tho House. I am quito at one

[1!1r. v owl es.

with the han. member \Yho has just resumed· his seat in saving that Government is finance and finance is Government, and that when we cannot have tho finances in proper condition, it does not matter much what else we may huvo. So far a·· the hon. member for Mar­rumba is concerned, while I have goneraily to disagrEe with many of his conc;usions, I always gi ~ t.: hi1n credit, at any rate, for· trying to uncierst&nd finance.

:VIr. _\.PPEL: Ho doe' understand it. The SECRETARY FOH RAILWAYS:

l will sav that ho tries to make us under­.tand it il1 the light in which he looks at it, n~though 1ve do ILt absays agree with hin.~. and with his ,~,,t,'mcnts; and I think that, in-ltcad of b,,_:ng in a{',;ord~lnrc with fw.:ts, and in•,te:td of being plac·ed fairly before the~ I-louse, ~-orne of his .argurnenb: v;ere not pl:tccd fairly before· the :House last night,. and 1 shall show before I sit down that some of his statements could be· looked at from anotlwr standpoint.

~lr. ArPEL: no generous.

The SECRE'l'AHY FOR R~\ILWAYS: The hon. mc1nbet· ·who has just sat down ::-aiel that the raihrays \Yere rnaking n1oney out of the carrying of ioidiers. Let me say that we giYe free p:·5ces to tho soldiers from tho can1v to the city. \Ye giye frue pa·'ses \Yhcn they go to Yi:cit their home.J. \Ye give free pa~"es to vrour th·d soldit,rs v, ~wn tlu :return, and v:.·C' charge tho Federal Govern­ment only for those who go from the camp to \Y a lhngarra. :\loot of tho soldiers go away b,v boat, and instead of n1aking n1oney out of t.he1n vre are 1naking nothing out of them, but rather. if anything, a loss.

:\lr. APPEL : iYhy not carry th2m froe ?

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: Ro far as I am concerned, we do not want to Inake anything out of them, and we are­vrepared to make sacrifices for the Empire, and in relation to that matter we are pre­pared to help the Commonwealth. One hon. member who spoke about the finances suggested that they \H·re in a deplorable condition.

Mr. APPEL: They arc not; that is why 've object to taxation.

The SEORE'I'ARY FOR RAILWAYS: He said that the~· were. He spoke about the awful things that are going to happen because we are not going to get revenue, and because we are getting revenue in the ways he thinks we ought not to get it. \Vell, othe1· Labour Governments have had to face difficulties and deficits, and the Victorian Government-which is a Liberal Government and has alvcaY·' been a Liberal Government­has a deficit 'of something like £1,000,000 or £1,250,000, if not mora, staring them in the face at the present time.

Mr. APPEL: You do not decry Mr. Holman like mw of your supporters last night.

Mr. WINSTANLB'I : Who 1s making this speech?

The CHAIRMAN : Order ! Mr. APPEL: Not you. 'I'he CHAIRMAN : Order ! I must ask

hon. members to obey my call to order. I have called "Order!" and interjections have continued, and I am not going to allow it any further.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: When the hon. member for Dalbv, Mr. ·vo-wles, wa:-; adYocatlng that somethin"g more

Supp!y [20 OcT:JDER.] Supply. 1425

should be proYided for mining, the hon. memb::r for ~Iurrumba said th<'l'c was too big an incrcas(' in the arnonnt set down for 1nining.

Mr. FORSYTH: This year. The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS:

That was the hon. member's particular cry with regard to every department-that th& increases were too groat, and that the Go­vernment were not conserving the interests of tho State in the way thov were dealing with the finances. The hon. member uttered a Jeremiah wail in connection with the finances. Three years ago that hon. member and the hon. member for Townsville held that, in times like the present, we should spend more monev rather than cut down expenditure, and yet, because we arc trv. ing at this particular time to spend mon;v in order to give work to men in different places, and in one pl~ce particularl:v whore the hon. member has earnestly advocated that money should be spent.. we are told that we arc 0xtravagant and incompetent, .and that we are not conserving the interests of the State.

.Mr. APPET·: . I hope the hon. gentleman Will address hi· remarks to the Committee gen0rally, and not to an individual membet of the Committee.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: I think I have a perfect right to make my speech in my own wav.

Mr. APPEL: Be fair.· The SECRETARY FOR RAILvVAYS:

I am dealing with the remarks which have been made in relation to matters concern­ing tho Railway Department, and I wish to speak about railway matters particularly this afternoon. I am of opinion, and I suppose everyone Plse is of that opinion. that railwaYs and railwav construction should be a non-party questio"n because rail­way construction is essential t~ tho develop· ment of the country. Rn.ilwavs should be built wherever it is possible, and they should be constructed on principles which will guarantee the proper and equal develop­mBnt and progress of everv part of tho St.ate. ·

Mr. c\PPEL: Hear. heart The SECRET .\RY FOR RAILWAYS :

I ,am glad the hon. member says "Hear hear," because those members who are sit: ting on that side of the House never tried to do t~at durin!' the many years they were supportmg a Liberal Government on this side of the House. They benefited one part of the State at the expense of other parts.

Mr. APPEL: That is not correct. The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS :

I shall quote figures to prove that state­ment. Out of the large sum of money that we havA borrowed for railway construction no less than £20,671,725, or 58.29 per cent: of the whole, has "?een spent in the South. The amount spent m the Central division is £6,973,697, or 19.66 per cent. of the whole, and the amount spent in the Northern divi­sion is £7,819,348, or 22.05 per cent. of the whole.

Mr. APPEL: Now give us the population basis.

The SECHE'rARY FOR RAILW-\YS: The population basis in an unfair basis. While population has a right to be consid­ered ir: the matter, it is not the only basis on which the expenditure of loan moncw should be allocated. The great need for tl{e development of the country should also be

1915-4 T

considered ; WP 'hould consider tho dm·elop­rncnt of lands in outlying parts of the State with a view to establishing a population upon them, and I say that members oppo­site have not given due consideration to that aspect of the matter.

Mr. APPEL: Give us the population tables as well.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: I have not got the population tables here. Among other things that the hon. rnembPr for Murrumba said in connection with rail­ways was thot the expenditure had gone up by leaps .and bounds, and that it made a great jump last year. Let us look at thf> ligures, and see what actually occurrt'd in that particular. 'I'he expenditure in 1912-13 was £2,037,037, and in 1913-14 £2,250,084; an increase of £213.047. The expenditnr& in 1914-15 was £2,387,500, or .an inCl'''a-'e ot £137.416 on tho previous year. The ex­penditure in 1915-16 is £2.675,220, or an in· cre·ase of £287,720 on the previous year. Let us ~ee now what is tho cause for the increac;es this year. If, as I said last night, the Liberal narty had dono their du.ty by the men who are workers on the railwavs ""nd in the public service, there wou1d n;t have been such a considerable increase in the expenditure as there is this year. From the figures whicl: I chall quote it w;ll be seen that we are puying a groht deal of money that should han' been includr d in their Estimates of last year.

~1r. APPEL: Ar(e you doing now what you think ought to be done?

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS : I am, and I shall prove it.

Mr. APPEL: Are you giving them what you think they ought to get?

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: Yes, decidedly. The railways should be run, not in the interest of one section of the com­munity, but in the interest of all section~ of the community. Hitherto, squatters and cattlemen, sheep and wool kings, and land speculators have benefited most by railway construction in Queensland. That statement can be proved right up to the hilt. The La"bour party are out to alter that, and see that another section of the people get some benefit from the railways as well as the men who sell cattle and wool and speculate in land.

Mr. APPEL: Well, incrense the vVestern freights. Do you propose that?

Th0 SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: 1f thP hon. member will give mE' a chancG, he will see that as far :1s passengm· fare' ~.nd freig-hts are conct'rned we have done tho fair thing. How arc the increases which th'J hon. gentleman cried out so much about last niQ"ht brought obout? The in('rcases in the railwav expenditure are due to various cans""; £23,393 are due to the expa.nsion of traffic, and there is a sum of £5.000 for compensation under the Workers' Compen­sation Act which has never been paid be­fore. There is also a new item of payments for overtime, amounting to £5,000. which hon. members opposite are rPsponsiblc for. .Just before' they went out of office, and after they had ':efused . the request for years, they gave the r1g-ht fo the men to have every dav considered by itself, and to be' paid overtime for working after eight hours.

Mr. APPEL: You do not object to that? The Sl<;CRETARY FOR RAILWAYS:

·I do not object to it, but though the hon ..

Hon. J_ ~do.msan.1

1426 Supply; [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

gentleman applauds it now, the Government of which he was a member refused that right to tho workers.

Mr. APPEL: I do applauu it; I have always advor•.tted it.

The SECRETARY FOR R~UL WAYS : 'fhat shows how easy it is to make a political St)mers'l,ult.

:Mr. APPEL: You are making a somersault to-day, and you know it.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: I am making no somersault in the matter, but am quite consistent, and am doing now what I have always advocated should be done. For the Innisfail Railway, not previously provideJ, we have a sum of £6,704, and for the Mount Garnet Railway, not previously provided, we have a sum of £4,277. I "ish now to de:tl particularly with matters which prove that the Labour part:.· intend that another section of the community, as well as the land speculator and the cattle king and wool king, shall receive some benefit from the increased ra.ihva\~ revenue vYhich has resulted h;om the expansion of traffic

)h. APPEr~: \Vo have al"·ay• rec 'gnisod tl-: l_t.

Th' CIL\IR1\IA1\: Order ! Tho cECRE'l'ARY FOR RAILWAYS:

Hon. members opposite should have faced this matter.like men; but what did they do? They simply refused to pay the juel wages whieh they were under contract to pay to the m< n in the raihvay service. For deferred classification increases for 1914-15 we had tn pay £4.7,051. for cl ,, .. ificatiorr ;,-creases up to :8200 we had to pr,y £31,3.J3, for ex­pcn':+'S in cu~1nr~tion "\Yi th the expansion of traffic in 1914-15 we had to pay £23,393, and for 8 lj3rd p~r cc·nt. of wages we had to pay sums which amount to £121,500. About £170,000 or £180,000 of the amount c '1Villed at by the hon. member for ~1ur­rumba. is money which hon. members on the other side of tho Houc'e consi. tently re­fllsed to pal when they were in po-.c·er.

Mr. FoRSYTl;: You haYe still £100,000 to the good.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: I will deal with that, too.

Mr. APPEL: Well, I commend the ::Ylinister for doing that.

The SECRETARY FOR. RAILWAYS : 'Then the hon. member for 11urrumba spoke about an increase of £100,000 in conn~ection '' ith the I\Iechanical Engineer. How was that increase brought about? What did the previous Government do in conncufion with the making of loc·omotives and wagons the previous year? In 1912-13 they built 970 loco111ot-ivc.'·, carr1ages, •Yagons, and vans; in 1913-14 they built 909, and in 1914-15 they built 572. In my opinion they were starving the rolling-stock last year, and that is tho r0ason th<>ir expenses were so low. \Ve had to face that busin<cJs, and pav the increa;·ed wages for the work done. There have been ver:- serious complaints in dif­ferent parts of tho S1ate regarding the shorta 0;c. of ro1line;·- .tock; there has been a fallin<r off of 40 per cent. in the construction of rolling-stock.

~1r. BooKER : The rolling-stock is better to-rLy tlum ever before.

The SECRETi~RY FOR RAILWAYS: ·whatever the condition of the rolling-stock at the present time may be, it is not ade­quate to supply the needs of some places in the North. and there haYe been very grave complaints from time to time concerning

tB®·n. J, Adamson.

the lack of trucks. \Ve have to build trucks equal to what we have done in previous years. and now the hon. member complains because we have an increased expenditure in that item. I shall show exactlv how the total of £111,000, not £100.000, in the Mechanical Engineering Branch has arisen.

Deferred classification increases, 1914-15 .. . ...

Classification increases. 1915-16, up to £200 ·

8! increase to wages staff Expansion of traflic J\'"ew lines ... Stores. fuel, etc.

£

17,760

8.000 33.774 14,353 8,553

29.022

Total £111,462 AnyonE' who considers tbis matter will see that the increase has been brought about in the most legitimate way, and that it is a very desirable thing that more money should be spent in that direction.

Jl.1r. FoRSYTH: \Yhen you have the money, spend it; but when .;ou have not got it, go slow.

The SECRETARY FOR RAIL'VVAYS: The hon. momb~r for Jl.1urrnmba also re­ferred to thf' loan cxpendi~nro. C'\o one kno1' s bPth·r than the hon. mf'rnbc·r that this is not the time to discuss the loan proposals. and y t in onkr to make a bit of political capite! he drnqrcd th<tt matt0r imo his sper· h la,.t night.

),1r. APPEL: Be generous. The STCCHETARY FOR RAILWAYS: I

de,•linc to disen··' the Loan Edimates until they arc before the Committee, and they "re not yet before the Committee.

Mr. APPEL: On t 11c Financial Siatcment r:lembrrR arP justified in discu:,, :>ir1.; anything in connection 1-vith the: fi"~lUllCA''',

The SEC'Rl\TARY FOH RAIL'iVAYS: h1 1911-12 the loan expenditure for the three months. J nlc- to Septcmbn, lYa.s :851LS73. tlw avPrage an1cunt i"pr-nt per n1onth being :.C170.oo~. In 1912-13 the loan expendi­ture' for the ccame period was £609,694, the avm·age amount spent bein;:; £203,000. In 1913-14 it "'"'" £478.~22, the an rag8 amount 'pent being £159,000. In 1914.-15 it was £4(''3.177. the averar_,, being £136,000. In 1915-16 it was £453.599, the average amount spent being £151,000.

::\ir. APPEL: You approve of the recom­mendation of the Railwav Commissioner and you will not go hr wrong.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILW.AYS: vYnll, "" were told that we were i·.pending more than we ought to spend ; but we were &pending it to promote the welfa.rc of the country. A requeBt came to the Rail··.-ay Dc:Jartment that the Mc:mt Cuthbert line should be pushed on to keep men at work; we did c,o. and what \\·as the result? Last year the Government spent £55,000. Dur­ing three n1onths on that particular "\vork we have spent £54.000. and the han. g•cntlo­rnan gets up and tells us we arc cpending far more t!Jnn they did, and he W·,;s among t:hof'e \Yho a-sk~:d for this ex:-wnditure.

Mr. APPPL: You did not spend enough. The Cf-L\IR::YlA:'\1: Order! I try to 'Je as

rr,onerous ao I can in the way of permitting interjectioJ13. Interjections. tlS yon all know, arc di·>onler]:v, but I have a com­plaint from tho " Hansard" staff that O\"Ting to ,'he frequent interjC'rtions it is imnossible for them to hear the speaker. I think hon. members should now cease to

Supply. [20 OCTOBER.) Supply. 1427

int<>rject. ThPrO ar(' sixty-two members who can yet speak on this question. and anything ·that any member may say can be refuted later on. Therefore, I think that you ought to be generous to the speaker and have some re,pect to the calls that I make so frequently.

Mr. APPEL: I agree with you. Last night I could hardly get through my speech owing to interjections.

An HOKOURABLE MEMBER: You are making up for it this afternoon.

Mr. APPEL: Oh! they know that my inter· jcctions are not <J.nt,lg{:mi .. tic.

The SECRETARY FOR R .. \IL'\VAYS: Now, I want to deal with the question of increas<> in wages. ·when I took the port· folio of Railways, after having bcen elected by my matz·;; to that position, I found that the railway service was a mass of s<>Pthing diJcontent.

GOVERNMENT MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

Tlw SECRETARY FOR RAJL'\VAYS: .l\.nd it \\ ao. Q, lllass of Geotlllng ·disCOllttJnt because of ,,,hat had been done bv the Den· hatn Govern1nent tho previous V('·Ur in 'l;/ith­holding auto1natic inc-1\_an s and rPfusing to recognis·· the new cla-s~~ification asked for a. long time, and because of low wages and bad conditions. \Vhen l s.'W tha,, I felt it was 1ny D.uty to inquire into it <:>S rrrueh n~~ po;;--,ible.

J\1,._ APP>OL: I know the ::\iini_,tc;· io honest.

The SECRETARY FOR RJ,IL\YAYS: I hav-e here a nw1noranduu1 '' ritteu bv tho Uointni( sioner for l{ail\yay,s v-.-hich sho\\~:J tho po--ition at that tim;,-

.. In ihc Quc-:YL~land r __ ihr.u\' f'Cn~ice th--..ro are nine bl'J)a·. a.tc c1nploy~•cs' assv~ ( ·tations, :1.nd each and all o: t,}- :_• [1_~:-;ocia­tior, ha.vr, either Ov dcn~ut~ttion or p -;~tion, plaLcd Lcforc·~ 1:· .:: dc _ _._l1J J._s. for in re.1sed re1nuner.1tic.a and 0~1 i1nproved c' '"iftc:ction. I h<tYe )pel thPir r<>qtwsts t arefnlly gone into, and the approxi1nato C'cst o£ con1plyi11g ' ith thmn totals £501.000, vrhich i:; equal to "n -=-tdvane' o; L ... ~ })Cr cent. on ... the nr,~:::;( nt rate-s of 1 ·Y· Cf thi' £5ol:ooo. ·£327.ooo n )re-

the cc ~.t of :inel't. ascs, and the of ;r;174.000 tbo a;Jproximate

rnonetary expend1ture to the ·departrnont :or tho irnproved cundition,,, ,desired."

Thar was what tho different associations in tho Railv: "Y Department met w ask the Comm: -sioner in :March hst year. 'The Den· h:::m Government was in power then.

:.\1r. FoRSYTH: A fair an1ount.

The SECRETARY FOR RAIL\YAYS: Yc· It was necessary to raise £500,000 more revenue to meet it. The Denham Go· vcrnment raid they could not give that, but they pmcticdly ,,aid they would give an incr< of £150.000. Thev went out of ofiicc, and just before ·they· ent out-as a last dying kick-they g.a Y-e the increase in overtime. But they were not prer ared to face the matter of automatic increa ·.es, and they Jid not fulfil thei1· contncts with tlH men. They "ere not prer Hred to do any· th1ng in relation to the ne\v 'ClassiHcation asked for, and I will provo that this new cla~~ificaticn-on the ground of equity, on the cround of fair play, on the ground of n1akinr; the position of our 1ncn in Queens­land erwal to that of the men in the other States inside and outside tho raih·a.y service -was justified and should have been 'granted, and an attempt is now being made to grant

them. (Hear, hear !) But we are now told that because we have tried to m<>ct these men in n fair wav that we are spendthrifts, and that we have' benefited one section at the ex]PnBe of another when we h·av~ tried to raise the freights upon the farmers. When I found that this "as the <'•aSP, and that tncn were threatening to Btrike in every part of the State, I rec;eived many <;lel?uta­tions, and in company >~Ith the CommiSSlO':er went through their claims, and talked with them as man to man-(hear, hear !)-let them feel that they were as good as I, and I was as good a,, thcv-and wlwn it was necessary to stand firm: I stood firm, and when it was right to conc·ede things I conceded them.

GOVERNMENT MEMBERS : Hear, hear! Tlw SECRETAHY FOlt RAIL\VAYS:

'Whell I w<'nt 2\'orth to Town,;ville, somo of the newspapers said, '·, Adam··on has Tgoi~o to Townsville to rncct n1s rnasters. :fie IS t!w servant of the ml n... '\Yhat did I fin~'! I lucked into the',C 1ncn~s ·denl.ando5, and 1n talking w:th them I found thoro \Yas a gre-at jus~ificat~1Jll in a::~king for a n'storation oE the~ auton1atie inC'rea•es. a gDod n!,l.~·0Il for t:1o n~ \V cL.t' ~;ifi{'ation, and .a YPry l.:;Teat Yt6-'>)n for bPttrr conditions of \.Drk, and 1 found tlu~-t. -) fur a:;. thl~ To\nlsYill~- ,; ork~ &~lops are conc':"'rne-d, they an"'. a .di~g,-raco ~o the Tiailv:ay Dt:'par'-n1cnt-that 1t Is. a dlS­~-<tact• :11L•n shculd ln.Yc to VYork In such place;:;. That i h·uc', _too. of ether pl.-wc-:::J-of Ron1a ancl otlrPl' pLH•os. \YH.l1ts

a ~ot of rnon'-.:'Y SlJPUt. on thu::;o plac:c: :\lr. .RoK'R~S: \Yhat abont i.hr, clerk's

Cfl' ~-:.·tel in rrooY.TOOillba? Tb SECRETARY FOR RAIL\VAYS:

T0owootni.'a i·< a cli>;;rare, too. _\Yhen. l f~uud thn .lc coHditicn·,, .. , ·=' ._nTallf::;cd ~o gn-e L110111 their nuton1atic incrc "~-'s-£-~<:.000-8I~cl a new dncoiilcation equ!tl to £.120,000. mnkm)S a total of £168,00~]. <: nn that 1~ "\YhP~ the otner side· hare bcPn ho,,' 1) nruch about tl~elast fLvi:: W( 'k::. NoF, I\"\ to pro\TC that tlns \Yas justified. I am going to ack lcaYe to ~c excu 0d from reading 1 he ' hole c f. th.B od10dule and will . sk that it b:; c<.1bodi:d m "I:-Ian~ard." But there a.re a .fC>·w ~:ems th:lt J 1Yi·h to nu:ntion :-Eng'lH?-drivers. first-cla", in Queens] and, £4 ls. ; m South .. \nstralia, £4 lOs. Firemen. in New South Wales. £3 6s.; Victoria, £2 17c.; Queenoland, £2 14s.; South Australia. £3 6s.; Wester_n Australia, £3 6s.; and the. l'!we·-t IS Tasm_ania, and even Tasma.nia rn son:e res peeL is higher than Queenslan9. So m relation to the porters, shunters, signalmen, and in every class excppt one--flr,,t-class guards-we are infinitely below what they pay in other States.

J\Ir. ROBERTS: What abour their privileges?

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: They haYe priviL ges in the other State- ..

::VIr . .ROBER'rS: Not to compare with Queens­land.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: I would like you to prove that. ·The men say, ''Take away the privilc6C'S and g'ive us incn1 as.:d wages.''

J\lr. ROllE~ TS : You take a Yo to on it.

Tlw RECRET~-\RY FOR B AILWA YS: Now. I wish to refer to other thing·•. I had to go X orth to i1 rtuiro into r yery sPr1ous situatwn. I met the men, and I compared what men were getting out··ide t.he Ptilway service, according to Judge Maecmughton's award, and what men were getting inside

Han. J Adamson.]

1428 Supply. [ASSE'..\IBL Y.] Supply•

tho railwav service. Fitters and turners in """"· 1 district, under Judge ~\1acnaughton's a" a rd. received 15s. 2d. a day in tho North; we pt' y lls. 9d. In No. 2 district they re­Cf'ivc> 10 outside; we pay 12>. In No. 3 district 17s. 4d. ; we pay 12s. 3d. and 12s. 6d. In :'\ ''· 4 ,:i trict thPy g-et 18s. Sd.; we pay 12 9d.

:Mr. BARXES: Is that permanent work?

The SECRETARY FOR R.ULWAYS. Yes, a.nrl the Australian Society of Engineers' rncn statf' thc,ir l11Pll ar0 gr-tting pcnnancnt work. Jli.;cbmitL; outside get 16s. 3d. in No. 1 district; we p;,y 11>'. 9d. Tn No. 2 di.trict they get 17s. 6d.; >ve pay 12s. In No. 3 district the:· get 18,;. lOd.; wo pay 12s. 3d. a.nd 12s. 6cl. In No. 4 district they get £1 C 2d. ; we pay 12.. 9d. In some <·as " the1c is as much G., 7s. lOci. ditiercncc bcbvcon nwn working outside the dcpartn1cnt ~nd insicl<.; tlw de;1artment, and the average lS 5s. 4d. a cbv in favour of the m2n work ing out.:idt• the~ dcparb:1ent. Comparing the

rates paid to mechanic.s by the Q.ueen.sle.,,.{ Haih;a.y Dc:pcrtmcnt w1th the rates pa1d b:-· the New South \Vales Railway Department u~1der \Yap:es boards awardR, \Ve find that fttters in Queensland get lOs. 9d., in New­Sou.th \\y all'S 12s. ; coachbuilch:r~ in QuePns­land 10·. 9d .. in Now South Wales lls.; \Yagon-bnilder~ in QncC'nt:land: 10~. 3d., i:1 New South \\Ta1cs lls.; borler-n1akPrs 111

Queensland 10, 9d .. in New South \Val~'· 12s.; tinsmiths in Queensland lOs. 3d., m N •w South \V alu lOs. ; painters in Queens­land llk 9d., in Xcw South Wal~:s. lls. 4d. I think it ie patent to everyone here that Queensland is the SY\"eating State. go far as "-\~orking- 1ncn are concerned. Every other Sb1te is paying better wages and giving better conditions. I ask that these scheclnles be a1low'-~c1 -~~) app('ar in ··HanseL d.''

Tlw CILURMA:N: Is it the pleasure of l:hc Cmmnittce that the schedules be printed in .. lLmsud."

IIoxoc-c 1BLE ::\1DIBERS: Hear, hr>ar!

EXTRACT FRO::'.I TIIF. O:FrrCL\L YEAR--gooK or l'HE Cm;·~,roxwEALTII o:F A D~TnALIA, P.\.Gr:s 1028-9. \lJ!.EKLY R..tTES OF W .\c; !:s.

--------~,~---~- ---~--~---------

! Xew Sonth 1 ~·cto .·, I West Australia. Industry aud Ot'cnpation 1 \Vales. . vl lla. QurenRlaud.

~onth :1 u::.t ralia.

---- ------ --Railways*--Engine Drivers (Loco.)t-

11 't class) {2nd class) (3rd class) t4th cl EOs)

, (5th class) Firemen (1st class)

(2nd class) , (3rd cll1f:.\')

Guards (lst class) ... (::!nd class}

, (3rd class) Porters ... Shunters (1st class)

{2nd class) . , (:Jrd class) , (ordinar\)

Signalmen (special) (1st class) (2nd class) (3. d class) (4th class)

P6~. Sis. 8ls. !lOs. !=lOs. fllls. Bls. 78s. A4~. H4s. 8i~. 69s. to 75s. 73g. ed. 7~s. 78s. 7Rs. 60s. 67s. 6d. 72s. 72s. 72s. 63~ 66s.

:~X~: ~~~: \ 19~:~:d. 61~~86d. ~~~: 5'i~. 5ls 45s. 1 57s. , 57s .

... ,.. 72s. 69~. a11d 72s. i 72s. to 78s. 1 ?!ls.and,.?3s.~d.i) ... .\ o;s. to 69s. 5's. to 66s. 1 6ls. 6d. to 69s. ,o7s. to ;Os. 6cl ..

5, 6Cs. to 7os. 1 5J.s. to 60s.[ 5h. and 51<s .. 4Ds. 6d to 58s. 6ttl5~s. to 5R~. Bel \..

48s. to 57s. . 45s. to 57s. -15s. i 48s. and 5ls. 54s. 6'ls. to 78s.l 66s. to 69s. 69s. to 78s. 37s. 69s. to 75s. 66s. to ~~s. 60s. and 63s. ?~s. 6d. to_~64s. 6d.: 5J~. oas. and 66s. 57s. to 6~s. o~s 6d. & o5s. 6d.] 3 Is. ...

54s. I 5ls. to 57s. ·1's. 57s. and 60s. ... 72s. and 75s. 63~. ! [ 78s. and Sls.

i5s. and 78s.l 66.;. and 6\)s. 57s. and 60s. 60s. and 66s. 69s. to 7r:~. 72s. I' 60s. and 63s. 5ls. and 54s. 1 5-1-:. i 635. and 66s. 69s. 57s. 48s. 5ls. 1 57s. and nos. U6s. 54s. \ 5-:!s. and 57s.

-----

75s. 69~. and 7'2 66~. ~nd 6£Js.

G3s. 60s. 54s. 5ls.

t5s. and 48s~ 6tis. and 72s. 57~. and 63s-. 4Ss. to fi.J.s. 42s. to 5ls. 54s. to 57s~

51s . 18s.

04s. ~.;{d 57s. ·15s. to 5ls.

* 'l'he hours of labour for Railway employees ».re 48 per week (in Xew South ·wales 96 per fort.njg-bt) exf'cpt in the following cases :-New South 1-:rales porters, 108 to 120 hours per fortnight; Vietoda porters, 48 to 6t) hours per wePk; South Au~tralian porters and si::rnalmen, 4" to 57 hours per week; and Tasmania, guards and ~hunters. 54, and porters 48 to 5·1 hours per week, Owing to the d fference in the cla~sification of grades of railway employees in the various States, only rninimlnn and maxim11ID rates are quoted, excluding those of foremen.

tIn New South VVales the rates of wages for first-cl ss locomotive drivers corre~pond to thnse fixed for drivers driving express passen~er or mail trains; second to fifth-clHss correspond to the rates of wages fixed for­different lengths of service. ThE' clas .. ification of locomotive drivers and firemen employed in the Victorian railn'ay service fixes different rates of wage..; for the following grades of service :-1 Country patt!'ler~ger ~<ervice. 2. First gr;.~.de suburban -passenger service. 3. Secoud grade p 1ssenger service. 4. Goods or switching service. The rates of wages for tlle.;;e services have been taken as correS'ponding to the first, second, third, and fourth cla::<s classification jn the other States, with the excepUon that firemen for only three classes of servict:J are graded.

Position.

Fitters and Turners

:Brass Finishers, Planers, Shapers, Sloters, .Borers

Blacksmitts, CoJCPersmitbs ...

· [Han. J . .Adamson.

2 3 4

Do.

1 2 3 4

,Tudge :Macnaughton's

Award R~te.

I " . I

Railway Rate in<'lnding ~ g "\''l estern Allowance. g A

1

---------·--- _:___

15s. 2rl. per day... lls. 9d. per day ... ...[ Same l"s. Od. , , ... 12s. Od. , , ... ... 1 .. 17s. 4d. , ., ... i l2s. 3d. and 12s. 6d. per day i lBs. Sd. , , ... i 12s. 9d. per day ... 1

Ditto... . .. I )To employees with designat!ion

16s. 8d. per day ... \ns. 9d. per d"Y .. I Same 17s. 6d. , , ... ' 12s. Od. , .. ... ... 1

I lRs. lOcl., , ...

1

' 12s. 3d. and l?.s. Gd. per day 1

120s. 2d. , , ... , 12s. 9d. per day ... . .. i

Supply. [20 OcTOBER.] Supply. 1429

CouP.\RisoN oF RI\Tgs PAID To :Jh;cnA~Tcs BY R>\TLW.\Y DEPARTMENT, Qc.KEXsL,\ND, WITH RATI<:s PArD BY HAlLWAY DEPAR'D1K\'T, XEW SOl:Tli \'VALJo:to, UND.ER \\~AGES BO-\Itl> AWARD~.

rosi.tioo.

:Fitter::; ...

CoaC'hbuilders

\\~agon~builders

Boiler-nutker-5 .

:\Ionlders

'Tinsmiths

Painters

I think I have proved up to t 1Je hilt that these figures were justified-if we :eire pre­pared to fulfil the pledges that. we have, given to the men at th~· elections: if we are prepared to deal fairly by them· as they are being dealt with in the other States, and as they are being dealt with outside the !l::tilway Department. Now. I found, on attammg office, that, as a result of the war and th<' lo -e> through lhe drought. there might be a serious falling off in revenue, and we had to face that. Let me tell you that there will be no she-ep alive by n(•xt year if tho drought continues, and theFeforo ther.e will be nothing to carry. I behove there IS a better time coming. Thera are washaways on the Central line· rain is falling splendidly, a,nd there is a r:ew hope .altogether that there will be a better time 'bnt \Ve have to face the matter of a possibl~ falling revenue, and so '' e had to cast round to see what was the best thing to do.

Mr. FoRSYTH: We all said there would be a falling revenue.

Th0 SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: Yes. but you cavil \'cry mtlch at the wa'l ·we .are trying to raise revenue in the futur~. Reluctantly, it is true, but we had to comQ to the conclusion to increase the railwav revenue, if it was PO''iibl.e.. Speaking genel:­ally. undp·r norn1a1 cond1t1ons. the be ~t wav to increase railway revenue is to make the fares as lo\v as pos~-ib1P ·tnrl to n1ak{' the freights as low as possible. Trv to benefit the people in every way you poesibly can by cheap fares and cheap freights, ,·md there is nobodv .Ldvocates That more than the Minister for Lands. Evervbodv knows that he has done that in seaso,; aiid out of season, and yet he has cone.onted to thio increase. There has been no man more re­lucta:1t to allow this to be brou"ht about ·than the Minister for Lande., un"'d though we were reluctant to do it we huve to facr. the evidence. '

.Mr. RoBERTS: Are you an apologist for h1m?

The SECRETARY FOR RAILVi'AYS: I a!!' not apologising for him. I am simply statmg the truth, and doing justice to a

·m.an I have some respect for. Of conrse. it ma;y be said that1 by increasing wageo at a tnne when there 1s a decreasin" revenue ··we are doing a very foolish thing.p '

Mr. FoRSYTH : Quite so.

The SECRETARY FOR .RAILWAYi:l: It might be so from the standpoint of the bon. member. but I believe we will be able to meet it. and I believe. when the end of the year comes, it will be shown that the

Queensland. Xcw South Vfales.

8. d. 8. d.

10 H 12 0

10 11 0

10 ll 0

10 9 12 ()

10 9 1'2 0

I 10 10 0

I lll 11 4,

rate w.as perfectly justified. As far ao this raising of rates and fares is concerned, it is only a matter of history repeating itself. I know all about · what occurred in the droug·ht of 1902, .and I know all about the deficits, too, on the previous years : and I know-living in Boonah-how the '"ttle died and the men had nothing, and how they had to beg food to carry to the settlers, and all that kind of thing, and I deplorp that as much as anvbody here. And I re­memb<er hon. members on that side putting a poll tax on at that time. They put a poll tax on, and men had to pay lOs. a vear whether th<>v had any income or not. (Hear, hear !) Also, they raised fare.> and freights, and it has been said again and again that th0~e fares and freight · should never have been reduced in 1907. Some of your own men sa) that tlwy should not have been reduced. But the hon. gentle­men did more than raise fares and freights : thev retrenched the public Gervants right and left.. and I believe that some of those nublic servants have never got back what ihev were retrenched of even to this day, and that party has been in office all this time.

:Wlr. FoRSYTH: You forget to tPll us about the revenue tumbling away £1,000.000. while last year we had a. surplus of £240.000.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: I know Pxactlv all about that cr:ticism and the ccndition · of things clurins: the years preceding 1902. \Y e· Jraye to provide that the ll1·Cll who are "\Yorking for u..: haYc fa1r wages. and the ('attlo tPan1S and "\Yool t0arn~ Fhall p,-~_y p.omcthing- tcnvards that. so we decided Hui+ the fnrc~ and frL'ights han• to be in­crPasecl. V\e cono.ider0d,- too. what should be thP i:nc ;clc~nf", of thc":r' fare;;; and frE'ights. and we are aware (1£ the opinicn that the incidem • should fall upon thos!' who are hcst able to ra."··

Mr. FoRSYTH : The poor farmer. The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS:

The cattle king. the "-ool king, und the iimber king·.

GovER'-'}IENT :YIE:'IIl!imS: H<:'ar. hPar! Tlw SECRETARY FOR R"\ILWAYS:

T'hosP are the men v ho ha vc> to pay rnost, and if ;.-au care to go through the rat•-·' Y'?U will find that thosP are tho JH'll who w1ll pnY the mo-t.

Mr. FORSYTH: They always h::ve paid the most. \Vool has always been the highest rate we· have.

The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: Now. I will give the figures to. show what we ar<:> trying to get from each particular

Han. J. Adamson.]

1430 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply,

department o( the railw,ly, which are as follm•, o :-

J~stimated Jncrea!'e.

Sea.,·on tick('t rates for <'Oinmercial .£ trave1l.erP.~ tradt·rs, etc., and issue of single tickets only 30,000

3.000 7,000 8,000

Pare. ls C0a1 and cokP Other min(lrah Log timber Sa·wn timber Firewood General merchandise ..

19.000 9.000 1.500

7o:ooo ButtPr, cheese, and other agricultural

JJroduce Live stock \Vool

15.000 40.000

7,000

Total estimated increase . £209,500 h thne anybody on that side of the House who h.t' tlw hardihood to sav that £15.000 ::proad ovc1· Uw who]p of Qu0cnsland is going t{) lv r. rrreat hardship to the agdcu1turish ·: \Vhy, it is only a fleabite. and they knmv it. l\{nv. I an1 going to giye a fe\v facts· in r· lation to freights. too. and, with the con­·•E>nt of tlw Committee. I w0uld like this schNiulv printpd in "HaCJsard."

The ClL'\.IR:'tiAN: I- it thn pleasure of the Committc•p thd the " hcdule be printed in "Hansard'~?

Tlw SECRET_\RY FOR H~\ILWAYS: 'fa In• tlw country fare's in the different Statrc. Th0 figur0s ar<' as follows:­

FARES.

Country l?111'rs.

Qucenslan;l (?\ew) New S{mth \Vales ·victoria

Queensland 1?\ <'W) XP.\Y ~outh \ra1f's Yicroria

QtH'Pn:c\un<l t?\ew) ~{ \Y SDnth \Yales Vieturia

50 Miles. 1st Singh•. 2nd Single.

s. d. s. d. 8 2 5 5 G 7 4 5 8 0 5 4

100 ~!ilcs. l't Single. 2nd Single.

s. d. "- d. 15 4 9 11 13 2 8 9 15 10 10 6

200 l\.Iile·;. ht Single. 2nd Single.

t. d. s. d. 29 10 19 0 26 3 16 5 31 ij 21 0

5 ::\1i!C' Sin':'·lc. Rrturn.

lot 2nd 1st 2nd Qnfam.Ja,}d 3d. 2d. 6c1. 4d. J\Tpc·· So•:tl, \\'nlc•s !' 1. 4cl. 8cl. 7d. \ 7ictori:1 5d. 4ft Sd. 6~CL Sonth Ausrra1ia 6d. 4d. 9c1. 6d.

PERIODIC'l.L TICKETS. 5 miles.

::VIonthly. Quarterh·. Sing1e. Return.'

1st 2nd 1st 2nd

Queenf>L> td s. d. s. rl. s. fl. ·'· d. 13 0 8 6 33 6 21 9

Ne>w South \Vales Vict<Jria

16 0 10 9 38 6 25 9 15 0 10 6 40 6 28 6

QueemL,nd ... 36 0 New South VI ales 30 3 Victoria 31 0

20 Mil0s. 24 0 92 0 20 3 72 6 23 0 84 0

100 ::\file-. Queensland .. . 61 0 40 9 152 6 New South \ValC's 57 0 34 6 138 6 Y ietmia .. . .. 70 b 47 0 169 0

['Hi,:<. J. Adamson.

61 3 48 9 62 6

101 9 82 9

112 6

FREIGH'rS. Wool.

Queensland-1Iiles.

100 200 500 600 Cl0an G1 3 85 5 119 7 128 1 Gr0vw 41 0 68 4 95 8 102 &

?\c"' s,;-nth \Yales-Clean 29 2 52 1 75 0 '79 2 Greasv 25 0 45 10 68 9 72 11

\~i('tori~- · Clean 38 6 54 3 Grcaey 33 6 49 3

Li!'Cstock. Tlw fo-llowing is. a con1pari~orJ of the ehaTgc

1"'" head in the different States:-

0 ·~

0 oD ~

,.,s

.--:; "" 0

0 -"" ~

" 0 ~ 0

"" ,_. "' ;:...

,_r. ,__

;.;:; ;:; ,-'1

1 0

R; ,_.

" '-C) ..::1 c N

::..;

"" o:> rl

~r-.-:lt"\:i I

,.j LO

~· ~-C\i~ "''"' .., '""

rl"" ..,.,

.. ~~rl C\10 I rl I

. rn C") :r,: rl rl

("CJ) C<JC\l

-: . ~~t-: '- N<::::~CJ:l<:::;;l'"<:::ti'<"J

:;,...o...or<:IC'Jo:::::t"'t-r-l r--1 C\l (.'\}OJ C\J

: :

-=:::t·C\JNt-

~;::::t-=~~t---=m :_;l'lJ K'l r:- ....a rn ro

• .--!,........; ,_.; rl.,.....;,....,

: :

N~~ -..c:~~ ..... ...oool'<:loN ,.., ~

~CoOJ,......o:::::tl'l":'l rl rl -rl rl r-1 rl

~ ._o;.CC\J ::-

C...--icio::io::::tt-.: ::r: rl

...0\.0t-t-COt-

"'"" t..") ey

00 I

o:::iO i

"""" "''"'

-.a rn LOt-c:ic:i 0..0 ri .-1

L(") <.0 O:l<::::t lO t-=t--=.-i0o:).-;

LO-f'()o:::::::i'f'C)lQC\1

--io::ir:---=0--i~

K'J N') L.() L'":)

.-:rl1"'""1CGr-i

O:)t.()L') ~

c-:rocOcot-t-

T.

~~

~l~lJ!j ·:-o-z > ~.;.. r.::::

(-! r ~ ·T~d Jlr 'cluuulisc.

s. d. Qn0cn 1 u nd :·O 7 Nc•\\- :-'outh \\'al·•s .,g 5 Yic:tPria -+4 3

Quc••r:,]nnd

[ :,-, Stock. 100

n,i]c··

X ('\V 8-outh \Y al('·s 'Victoria

9 2 4 2

14 11

300 500 rnilL·.~. s. d.

200 0 109 0 114 3

300 n1ile::-:. ·'· d.

20 1 11 6 30 11

rniles. ·'· d.

200 0 127 4 166 9

500 mile·_,,

·'· d. 28 10 15 8 44 6

So far as general n1erchandisc is concerned, \Ve

(20 OCTOBER.] Sitpply. l43L

have to admit that things are high in Queens­land, hut in Kew South \Vales and Victoria they hav.e bigger engines, a bigger population, and the.v are in every way at an advantage so far a·· this is concerned. In regard to mmeraho, I wish to say that, with tho excep­tion of :'\ow South 'Wales; the QueenBland rate is cheaper than any other State. It has been oaid "'gain nnd again in this debate that "\Ve fayour one section of the con1n1unity, that is the trad<··, unions. If the men who eon1pc~,'"' thj·,, Govern1~1cnt "\Yould no~ be a lot of ing1·at~, then they should favour th~,, unionist•. 1 believe in prefpreneo to unionists because the unionists have done more to dm·elop manhood and independence of thought than any other class in rhe com­n1unity _ In reLttion to n1 .. n being good workmen, that tho men who have fought for bei :Ce1· conditions for the worke:·s and bcttt>r CO!Klitions for the country in which thcv live, the trade- unionists ha ~·e ahv,:, •.::;. doi1e it. Ber·msP I bc<ievc that I ,ay we 'should give preference to unionistc,. I hold tl·at trades unionism has done more for the world thaa anything else so far as material things 6re concerned, and, believing tha! , I think that f'Vfr)~ \vo_d-unan should be a trade unionist; and it is cdsy to do away with preference to unionists by cwrybodj,' becoming unionic-ts. and then evervbodv would be treated <ilikc. I say the• m'an ,:ho is willing to h~C thr~ othel' 1nan fight for bE'tter condi­tiom and never lift hi,; hands: take all the other men fight for-take it while at the ~[!.n1e tirnc he is betraying the l11JH who is fighting for better conditions. while he is a traitor to him-well, he is a poor sort of man, in my opinion. \V e often find the word " PrusGiunism" hurled at thi., side of the House. I P~y men of that kind are the true Prussians ~ 1nen vrho take everything for thmns'Jives without even thanking the men who fought in every way fer the benefit. :Hcmbers' on the other side of the House are the true leaders of Prus:;ian<, It hae been said that the men in the Rail>~ et; Depart­ment should get their wage; raised in the same ·.vay as the men do outside· tho depart­m0n, and we ar<J trying to do that. (Hear, hear!) \Yith tho passing of the Conciliation and Arhirrcction Bill the public ···ervants, in­cluding the railway men, will be able to go to the Industrial Court and gd their wages fixed by thd court, and then, whether there i~ a Libent] Government here or a Labour Government, they w if! ha '~" to pay the awud nne! fi~ed a way of raising the money. When the--e is a more <'';ual distribution of wen.lth, when the men who , it on the front Oppc·:ition benches nt the nrescnt time are not getting as big dividend~ and •Jre paying better \vages to the jnen \Ybo toil for then1, Gnr/. all C'OHntrit are 'doing· the ;;_·n.--~ t11ing;

11en the nlQl! arc (l,'C'!-ting Ow L r:.e re:ward and the just re,,-ard of their labour-when thie is hrou;;ht abont we wi]] have a more Christian world and a more just world, and 1nen Dn tlJj,: side of the House reC'ognise thot tbe men "who toil not neither do they spin," ehould not have all the wealth and 61! the "ornfort, but that th<- toilers, at any raft:~, sl1uuld havo 1vhat is fair. wb.1t. is right. and wh"t is just, so far as lifo and so far U"3 conlfort is concerned. GovEnN~IENT .MEMBERS: Hear, hear ! The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS: I

'vant now to pay a fail' tribute to the Com­nliss1oner and officPrs \vho ar0 \Vorkin~ the cl<-oa1·1 m0nt. And I r e,v the Commi,-ionn, the Recrc·tary. and ot!w'r office1- al'f' capqbJe und courteous men. I would like hon.

mc"mbers also to notice that the gross revc!me earned last year was £3,843,112;

[7 p.m.] and the ·gross expe-nditure £2,413,143, being a not revenue

of £1,429,969, from which interest on the capital coet ha.< to be m0t. At ~ow_ns­Y illc I netic·- j a meeting of so1ne un1on1sts said that >Ye· had a net rrnmue of £1,500,000, and thcv did not understc,nd that >;·e h;.d to 1neet the int"- .;; bill out of the net rcy0nuc. I explain~d that to thcrn, bur Sinf'c then I f-inU f.hat a grLater pPr­bona~e altogQthrr n1ade a sirnilar stvJc­mcnt at a function not far from Brisbane. That gentleman is not in Queensland, and I will not refer to his name. Hon. vwmbers will have noticed from the Railway balance­sheet that the not revenue last yer,r was £48 651 in excess of hat was required to mee't tho interest on c,1pital <·'<'ponded on unopened and opened )in0s. I should like to point out that the ddferonce bet>~ een th1s result and the rl\·C':tsurcr's Fin&.ncial State­meEt which sho~os a loss of £1,963, is due to th~ Re.i[,; a:v Department basing its figures on actnal oarll1ngs in accordance '' ith com­mercial practice, while the Treasury tables are b-;sod on cash received only, The balance of the cash, of course, is rec•3ivcd at the Trc -1sury during the wco.eeding financial vcar, The revenue per tram mile last year lvas 6s. 4~d., while in the previous year it was 6s. 5~d., a decrease of ~d .. Tho31gh we did not earn so much per tram m1le, tho cost of working per train mile was less than tl1e previous Year by 2.\d. ; tJ;e net revenue per train mile therefore bemg H~. n:ore than the previous year. I would hk~ JUSt 1·o notice the amount of money pard as wages, which is £1,744,000. _The foll'?wing percentages show the proportiOn v;hrc_l t11·1 various expenses bear to the gross revenue, for the vcar ended 30th J nne, 1915. Sala­ries and. wages to gross revenue, 45.38 per f'ent. ; stores, fuel, etc., to gross revenue, 17.41 per cent. ; interP~t to gross revenue, 35.94 per cent. ; profit to gross r_evenu<-, L27

. ])Pr cent, There was another th1_ng I woul:f like to notiCe, and that is that m. com parr­son with the other States the rarlways of Queensland are managed. a great d<;al more economically-too economically I believe, be­cause I think we ought to P!'Y .moi·e than the wages which have been p111d m the past, and if that were done our expenses would be r.r,reater just in proportior: RS we ha-d come near to the other Statng m the payment _of '·'ages. I would like hon. members to notice th ·t last year the cost of management was 62.67 per cent,, in N'ew South Wale-< 69.73 per c:?: t., Yictoria 72.36 per cent , So~th \ustr>'lia-the ftgurea arP not a':a1lablc ror

iho last year but for th0 previous yea!~--64 . ..i2 !W;. c~nt., in \Y0stcrn Austra:lia E'\65 prr eont., tho figures . not being available for last veEn~; 'J:asn1an1a, l:1st year, 68.6 per,,, nL and New Z~aland 71.41 per cent., .co thnt 1f >ve spent a little more money in "a;;c' and •lid c: litt!C' bit more for the v,ror~;:ing raan in Qupensla.nd v.,re \vould only be doing v·hat thc:v arc doing in New Zea­knd rrncl XPw South \Vales and other pkces. And tho working men of the, Que.cr:s­land R,tilwa:cs showed more gratitude m mans wavs as I met them in one place and anoth0r, because I was prepared to mee;t the men ,,nd digcuos every aspect of rarlway wco·kinC!' with them, their wages and work­inc: <'>ndit.ions. and in different place-' they passed resolutions F:tying t~at:, at any rate, there was one Railway !Yhmstcr ·who was JWepnrcd to meet them as a man, and I say that cvprv m'm on the front TrP'tRlHc' bench,

. Hon. J. Adamson.]

143:? Supply [ASSEl\IBLY Supp''

no matter to what party he belongs, whether Liberal or Labour, ought to be prepared to go to the working man and talk over his work with him, make him feel that he is in­terested in him, and by doing that he will ·win the men and get more out of them and save a great peal of unplmcsantness and <strife, and avoid strife and other things which disturb industrial peace. If that had been done last year in Townsville, there 1•·ould have be0n no trouble; but simply because the officials said, " The men will have to do what we t,,]] them" they re­•belled, and if I was told that and I th01:.;;ht .it was not right, I would fight the man who told me so to the last. GovEHX~TENT ~1E:I1BERS: Hear, hea•· r The SECRETARY FOR RAILWAYS :

And I say that is the proper spirit so far as the men are concerned-to stand fo,· their rights and against men who won't treat them as reasonable human beings, and won't do the best they cRn for them. A good deal has been said about unionists and disloyalty, about unionists and this war, and it has been hinted more than OJH'P that the men on this side are not as loyal as they ought to be. It has been thrown at us that some people have not gone to the war, and all that kind •of thing. I say that the loyalty of unionists has been proved up to the hilt, but the loyalty of wealth has not been proved up to the hilt, and there are lots of men who sit ·on that side who are prepared to get all the money it is possible for them to get ont of the men, to get all thP mone:.· it is possible •even out of army contracts-the men repre­sented by the Liberal party in the old coun­try a,nd in this country-and if n1en are pre­pared to g-in' up their lives, by the state­ment of the Groai:est that ewer lived, that a 1mman life is more valuable than all else that is in this world, then the men who have got wealth should give up th0ir wealth, and when thty give np their w<:•alth in the wav they should, thpn, and not bnfore then. ha YC they the right to begin to c.,·iticise men on thi.' side [l!ld elsmvhore b~causo thPv do not ·do all that thev think thev should'. I be­lieve that a man should gi,:e all thRt he has to the Empire at the prose"~ time. I be­lieve that my life is a small thing in com­paricon with the w01·th of the British En1·pire and thn ini.ltitutions \Yhich are sym­bolised in its flag, and, at any rate, so far as I am concerned-whatever anvbodv else Is prepared to do -I would g-o to' the· front io-monow with my lad to lay down my lifo for the Empire, and be glod to do it, and I have offered to do it. And for men on that side· to teii ns that we are disloyal, .and fo1' men outside to do the sa>ne--

1\fr. GRAYSON: 'Who says so? The SECRETARY FOR JL\ILVL\YS:

Tt ha ., been said a::·a:n and agaiu. It has lo0en hinted at. It )- lB been thrown at us in the forn1 of innuendo("· They are not gan1e to bJ.V vdutt thev \Yant<l to f-X\T. "Knibb:::)" ·Bhowed at the 'beginning of this war that wan for man the unionists did more than ·t!w non-unionisL. cu1d I sa v that it is not a hir thing that we should he eharged ''':ith dis]nyalty when \Ye know. und I knovv, ·at any rat~, that the men who have returned mr- and other men are anxiou, to do all Lhey can for the Emnir~·. There may bE> some hlack sheep. There .are some black sheep in eyer:' fold. There are some black ·"heep over ther'', and I say that, eo far as the war is concerned, everyone feels-at any rate, I sp<1ak for a very large number of men who I know as unionists-they feel that

[H on. J, Adamson.

tlw British Empire with its institutions i" better than the German Empire, and it would he a bad day for the world if the latter should gain the a~ccndancy; and be­cause I believe that the British Empire stands for a free -democracy and rcpresenta­tiye insi:itutions and that in the British Empire wB haye a chance of altering the Constitution from time to time and making it better, because I believe that, notwith­standing all i~<S imperfections, because I be­lieve it is altogether a better Empire than the German Empire, I say that everyone of us, Liberal or Labour, ought to be willing to see that the Empire which stands for free democratic institutions, which stands for a broad franchise, which stands for repre­sentatiYc government, should have a chance of bciniT in the ascendant rather than a o-reat h~.re militarY ·despotism that denies liberty to" its subject'. that denies a proper franchi'e to the workers of Germany-the Germanv which has been spoken of as, per­haps, the most enli~htcned nation in the world, and because I say that Ger!":"'n culture is not to be compared with Bnbsh culture. thPn I think that every man, unioni,ts especially, should desire to see the British Em1 lire in the as~cndant.

Ho;;-m.'RABLE JYIE11BERS: Hear, hear!

:VIr. CORSER: I do not know why the P.eer-etarv ~or Railv, avB went to such a l-ength t-o apolo"'gise for incr~'t'tsing the \Vages of the raihHtV employees. I am sure that an expression of opinion from him would have been sufficient for this side. \Ve are not con­demning that under existi";g circumstances. The increased cost of food smcc the electwns ma;: be a reason for increasing the pay of the nii\\.lY ;;en-ants. \Yhcn th0. pr< ~ent Go­vc:nment ""'" to power, they found low rate., on ncce,c.;ary foodstuffs a- compared to other t\tates. The Government are paying those increases from monev which docs not belong to them. The present Government an-d its supporters are not the people who arc contributing that money; the people who. will have to pay the increased taxation to pav those increases are the people who are responsible for making up the deficits. The Government have given £168,000 to the wages 1nen in our Railway Dcpartinent, and thev claim that that is necessary because of the increa,ed price of foods. They ~ay that. it is absolutely necesf,ary to brmg the wages of the railway servants up to the pay -that is received in other States, hut th"'Y ha vc not crone to the san1e l0ngth i...1 Jnec='t'ing the ('lai~s, of the fo3ter-nlo~h.ers of Queensland, to sec that ~hey arc rrc;::1vmg fair remuneration for the 1n< rcased prrce of necessary food. If the railway servants are to have 'their wages increased by 8~ per cent., so are thE> natural mothers and fostd'-mothers entitled to the 'itnlc consid~'ration: but simply because they are custodians of those -who cannot record a- vote? ·:lnd l1ccaus~~ those \Yon1~n ar.P not 'l)OWC'rful enough in Queens­la•1d to pu·h their claims. '"" do not h€·ar anv advocacv of it from the caucus Gon'rn­Jn0nt. That GoYernmont can p;iYc th0ir hundre<c,·. of thousands of pound& of the JWOplP's mon,·y to sections of the community who '·':ith thPir wives and ·daughters ean vote for thPm. and by handing over that money they are 1nakin g it necessary t;> increa::n: , taxation. Th~ Secretary for Railways d1d •· n0t like the referf'nce which '""s made to him to the effect that he was oheving his nla'3ter" when he wellt to Tov,7 nsville. We ali know that it 'vas his master's voice that

f3uppiy [20 0CTO"CER.~ Supp!if . 1433

.. ~-s:.::-oke, and it was hi:; 111a:-;tcr's Yoice that ~poke ·when he gaYC' thrs€' inf'~f'1SC>S and ether increases that we "vill be asked to vote. The hnt' i!Pntlenlan had to obev th!-" voice ·of his nw.sters, the Trades Hall unionists, whose commands arte Yoiced through their agitators. Tha.t is what he ha·d to bend to. ··and that is what evBrY member on that side oi ·:tne House wi1l have' to bend to before very long·. The Secretary for Railways claimed that the increased rates would not hit the produrer-that they would only strikB the producer to the extent of £15,000-and he went on to sav that there will be an increase ·in the tax on· timber. Is not timber wanted loy people in the bush as 'veil as by people i!l th,· city i' The Government are about to ·establish a State sawmill, <md to requisition a ::ltate timber resene to feed that •sawmill. 'For what purpose. That sawmill is to cut timber for Government works and for \Vorker~' <hvellings in the city. not fo!" the agricultural labourer or thB agriculturist who is struggling on the land, or people living in our country towns. According to the ·Government, the people in the country do not want sawn timber or houses. and theY arc~ going to tax thP tim bPr sa '"n ·by private mills and sent to countrY di·st!'icts to build houses for Httkrs. That· is what the Finan .. -cia! Statemc·nt says it i, their intention to do. There is also to Le on increased t-:J.x 011 cattle and on the creJ.m of the small man ·\vho is struggling for ~an f'Xi'.~tenco on a selection. The Govern1nent ar? going· to m:tke the selector pay for a f:.tll can when it h impossible for him to put more than a !{'.\\' :::·allons of ('tt-Jlll into the c>an. lTnder the :;.pgu:ation- of thC> .Ag-ricultural Depart~ nw11t crean1 n1n-Bt b-e- ~--Pnt to the faetorv a

·certain number of time" a we •k, so that {'l'C'arn sappiiers will be PLnali .,ed in <'Very ·direction. During thi... h ct weather it is llCCC\c;-,:'rV to sPnrl the erean1 to thC' faC'torv ·at certain inten··J.ls. and selectors will no't "!w able to kt•c•p their cream lHck to fill tLc•ir cans. A ~a in. the GoYernrnent expect to get £75,000 <'xh'a rPYenue from .an in·

·creased tax on merchanrlisc·. 'iYho frets the merchandi•·e? Is it not the man en the land who g •ts it and has to pay for it?

:Y1r. H. I~. HARTLEY: The storekeeper will pay for it.

Mr. CORSER: \Yho pays the storekeeper~ Is it not tho man on tlw land? That inane interjection is ,.-orthv of the hon. me·nber.

''The fact is th:1t th.it £75.000 will be paid by the producer in the countrY. lhen if the inductrial worker it:> the cmintrv consumes the goods, the tax wm be paid JJ,v the man on the lane!, as it is throu~h his labours that the worker, the blacksmith. and tho store­keeper arc able t.o f'alTY on thei1· busin(~;;;scs in the country. The ·han. gentleman did not make reference to the land tax which will hit tho producer in everv di~eetion. The Minister for Railways con'-tes b:wk to his old grievance that the Central district has not received that consideration in the past which it ough• to receive in the matter

•of railwa:.- construdion. The hon. gentle­man has n<·ath· tabulatcJ the railwa1s under construction at the pt"' ent time in t·lw para­graph with regard to railway;; included in the Financial Stute>1wnt. In that hble we .are told that 88 miles of railwav an• under comtruction in tlw Southern • dictrict. 25 miles in the Central dietrict. and 42 .'niles in the Northern dic·h·ict; but underneath the table there i-< a sta tci>;cnt showing that 1.41 1niles of the Great \Y c~ten1 Rnil" ·ay are

under construction at the present time. Th<' greater part of thot line is in the Northern and Central districts.

The SECRETARY FOR RAIL WAYS: In·the South.

Mr. CORSER: Winton is not in the South. The next railwav mentioned as under con­struction-the North Coast Railway-is wholly in the Northern district, and the length of line under contruction is 121 miles. The han. gentleman knows perfectly well that if he tabulated those railways in a way which would show what proportion was being built in the ~ orthern and Central districts, thE' tablo would show that the Government had more than done it duty to the North in the matter of railway construction in the pad. 'rhere are c0rtain short lines of railwav in the North, "·hich I trust the Government' will construct Ycry f.:1tJOn; but to say that past Governments han• not dealt fairlv with North Queensland in the matter of 'railway construction is not corrent, as members will see if thev analvse the table in the Financial Statement. Thv hon. gentleman made no reference to the unemployed that we had in Queensland at. the present time. He re­ferred to the increased payments to raihvay employeec and made apologiee for making thoee increased pa.,·mcnt~. but he did not rder to tbe fact that. whilst he is making these increased payn1cnts to raihvay cnl­ployces and that whilst he is reducing their hour-s of \York, thcrP 2 ~e lll_.lHl~x·rs of un~ r-n1ployC'd in yarious parts of Queensland. He is giving increased ''"ages to those who in the past have done very well. bttt he is doing nothing for the hundreds of people who are walking about the streets of Brisbane unemployed.

The SElRUARY <'OR R_\ILWAYf\: :\Ir. FoH~-th ~aid \VC v. ~..·rr doing too n1uch.

Mr. CORSBR: .\lthoul'h the h•m. gentlc­n1an is not tt!sponf'ibl0 for the '\fr.h" nent. YCt SU')nDrtC'r- of t11e Governrnent haYP foid. b:,- inccrjcction and otlwrwis2. that the mn­porter• of the memlwrs on this sick of. tlw Home have not gone to the war, and such ;.tatement·. hav0 aron···•J the feelings of mcm· bers on this <ick ..,f th·~ House. I -would a,ck these memlwrs if the:-' find amongst thP nn­emplo;vl'd hank ch·rk-- public scn·ants, profes.•.ional men, school teachers, and bushmen? Nn; shnplv becau'-0 that C'laH of ]abonr bas bocn denleted, o-vrinr; to the pumber of men followhw; the"<' occupa­tions who havP gone to the war. The p0ople von find on thC f,trcct are those v;ho haYe ;1ot gone to the war. ;,nd who ca:mot ftll the places of thosP who have enli ·ted. Th.1t i> my reply to hon. members who, bv tht'ir inlluendoC>s, tn~ to (lo an nnfai.r i·hing- to men who han· ,1mw th~;r duh to t!w Stnh•. when thev k::ow tlw war cannot be won till union.i•,ts, too. do their share. I con­gTat.ulate· Quern"1rnd on her nropProus condition. as shown in the Finanrial StJ.t.c. mont. anrl I trn• t that she will continue to nrosper in ~~'"'itf' of the legi!3lation ,vhich is !wing brought forward by the rm··ent Go­yornmcnt. Last ve;u we had the larght reYenuo on rc>rord for this Statr, and I bclieYo that nndu thC' administration of the latt~ Govc\rn1nent the revenue \Vould have still continued to increase. and that there would haYe been no frc ch taxation. TherP has been '"' fre"h taxation in Qupenslancl sir,ce the> time of the :I\Iorgan Government. On the presu1t occasion. the Government have intentionallv underestimated tl10 revenue for the cniTol't :--ear. in order that

llfr. Corser.]

1434 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply•

t.hev n1av have an excuse for in1posing fur­the-;. taxation. There is no nece,sity for increasing taxation, but the Government han' faked the Financial Statement in order that they may haYe an excuse for the new taxation they are imposing, and to be able to fulfil the promise thev have made to in­creas~ the wage' of tnany public seryants. The statemen'; of th,, loan expenditure for 1914 shows that the total amount expended was £2.638.000, and :V"t the Government say that the late _\dministration ha vc not done their duty. \Vhen tho present Govern,Iwnt came into power, thov f<lUnd that thev had a credit balan0e of £-2,157,557, so that 'mem­bers opposite cannot say that they have 'tepped into the breach with empty coffers. For the b 't two years it has been the policv of the LibPra] Government not to spon;l more than £2,000.000 in railwav construction in one year, end when our fri'ends opposite come into nowc.,_· thev find more than £2,000,000 to- tho crNlit ·of the loan fund to ~tart operations with. The late Tr<'asurer collected a sum of money amounting to over £300_000 in sovereigns, so as to make it po~sible-if the pomiso of Mr. Fisher still stood good-to secure another £1.000,000 by making a depoeit of 25 per cent. in sove­reigns. That provision made it possible for the present GovC'rnment to start with £3.157,000 of loan money.

Mr. APPEI": Hear, hear! £5,000,000 would not be enough for them.

::\ir. CORSER: Tho Labour Government of ::\ew South \Vales spent £10,000,000 in 1914, and yet _the Labour party say they are a non-borrowmg party. :Y1embors who were fortunate C'nough to be in the House in 1910 will remember that it was stated here that the policy of the Labour party was a non­borrowing policy, and that we should not borrow money fOJ: reproductive works. They said that borrowing wa' agairst the plat­form of tho Labour party. At page 1243 of " Hansard" for 1912, the present -Tr8asurer is rrportcd to have said-

., If our taxation was adjusted a little better we would be able to raise suffieient re-venue to co_--ry out the necessary public works out of n, enue at the present tin1e."

Why cannot he do it now? It is since our friend has come into office that he has changed his policy. As soon as he has seen that his ::\ ew South Wales brothers - had ~pent £10,000,000 in 1914, these non·borrow­mg Labour people have decided that it is just as well to chuck that platform into the sea, and thev will throw much more of their platform ov~r, until they are thrown over themselves. !Hear, hear!) 'We should be J?erfectly ple , sed with the past Admin is· tratwn, who have spent in six vears no less tban £14.0GJOOJ in public reproductiYc works ar~cl £11.('---:J,OC"() in railw1.y con"·trnction, and yet we find the Government sa' ino- that the past Administration has not p~ovfded work for the workers. \Yho reoeiYed the work prO\-idcd with this moneY "?, It made unionism in Queensland prosperous. The Government have not shown in this Estimate that thev haye placed monev to the credit of a fund which will do away with wheat specula· tion. When they appointed their Royal Commission into the wheat specmlations thev found there had been no spoculation in wheat in Queensland. The Premier from bis piace in the House before the 'report was made available to' members, made a

[ i1f 1'. C 01"SeT.

statement which gaye the impression that it had been proved that there had been_ much speculation and unjust doings, as was­stated by the Labour party at election time. Instead of that, the Hoyal Commission ha& contradicted those statements, and has shown there has been no speculation in wheat at all. The only spe,"IIation, according to the Labour GoYefnn1ent's cornmission, was \vhen the late PlcmiPr found that his firm intended to speculate, and as soon as he heard that, he stopped them. (Hear, hear !) y.; e have in Queensland a Labour Government, and these people, as soon as they came into office, a' stated on page 4 oi the Finan­C'ial Statf·.mc_nt, realised the' imm·ediate necessity of raising mom•y at an early date, though the money left by the late Govern· ment was sufficient for them, during good times, not taking into consideration the bad times they were likely to face. To whom did thev go? They went to the Common­wealth "Labour Government of Australia, <Lnd although they put down concrete case& and made suggestions to them that should have been roasonab!P, yet that caucus Go­Yernment of the Commonwealth did not see the advisability of meeting the Labour Go­vernment of this State. If we cannot expect the Lahour Commonwealth GoYernment to do its duty to a Labour State Government, how is it possible for Queensland to do­better than it has done under a Liberal Government? ThE' Liberal Government lent the Commonwealth money, and they lent Victoria and other States loan money, and it was the onlv State that found it unneces-. sary to repletiish itself by short-dated loan& which t-he Commonwealth were making avail­able, at high interest, at an early period or the war. ~~·e have heard the storv of how the working men of Queensland have been bled by the small pay and the ever-increas­ing price of food. Yet we find that- in 1914 there has been no less a sum than­.£1,312,857 more placed into the Savings Bank of Queensland. How could that money be placed in the Savings Bank by the workers if they were not getting it? That money represents the savings they have not 1·equired to use, and during that time no other St-ate in the Commonwealth has made that increase proportionately: and, further, the Commonwealth Savings Bank and pri­vate banks arP operating ,and taking money that would have come to the State. What do han. members opposite say to that? Thev do not make remarks about the amount of 1;1oncv in the State Savings Bank, be­cause ihcv would like to leave the workers to imagine thev have been ridden to death and not paid sufficiently to compensate them for the increased prict:s of commodititJ>;, and they are ~~oing to penalise a fwctlon brca_use caucus, still wants them to fulfil the prmmses made at el0ction time. \Ve have nearly J:IO, 750_000 in the State Saving,, Bnnk to the credit of the ;,rorkcrs, and I am wrrv to sav there is not more money placed there ,£the hands of the producer. He has not had good times during this period of war_ If hA had anvthing to hi., credit, he wo'lld he drawing it out to feed his stock. He has vaid just as mLJCh proportionately for the increased cost of food, and he is now <'ailed upon to contribute more for his food b<'causP at the railway freights th"t are going to be increased. and bec;wse of land taxes and othPr taxes. These will haYe to be borne hv the nwn who <·an lenqt a-fford +o carrY them_ The Government are pavin,: 3~ per· cent. on the mmwy to the credit of

8npply. [20 OCTOBER.] Supply. 1435·

the workers in tho Government Savings Bank, and I doubt if that will b,• ··ufficient to keep the money there. I would now like to refer to the timbe1· mdustry. I see that provision i;:_; to be 1nade to get .cheap timber for the •wrkors' dwellings by tho c'tablishmt· .t of a State mill. But no provi­sion is to be made for the farmer, nor the men on prickly-pear selections-men who have to put up with all the increased cost of living r.nd the dieabilitics duo to tho war and the disadvantages of the drought. These people are to receive no assistance (HPar, hear !) 'l'here is no aesistanco provided for the pear farmer.

The SECRETARY J<'OR AGRICULTURE: Do. you not know that many of those farmers are al3o timber-getters?

Mr. CORSER: I would like to see the han. ger>tlcman timber-getting in prickly­vear country. (Laughter.) Reference is also made to the pastoral industry. At election time all sorts of promises were made to the people. A little while ago when Mr. Rya.n met a deputation, not at Parliament House, but at the Trades Hall, we are told that the han. gentleman was informed that there was a number of killable cattle sufficient to keep the meatworks open. The Premier promised to do something to assist them in keeping the works open, and he allowed the people of the Trade·~ Hall, as well as the people of Queensland, to think it was a meat ring that had kPpt the price of beef up, ar,d that he and his Government would reduce the price of meat. And yet in the Financial Statement we find it stated that "the position of the pastoral industry would be extremely grave but for the prospects of the increasing value of it.,; products and the correspondingly high prices ,,, hich must rule at the termina­tion of the drought." \Vhere is tho promise there to reduce the price of meat to our t:ongumers and others who were induced to vote for the Government? We find, also, that the agricultural industry has not received consideration from the Government. Even in 1914. v·hcn there was a fair season and only 1,500,000 bushels of wheat ere produced in Quppnsland-which is 2,500,000 bushels bPlow what is consumed in Queensland-we fiJ?-d that the Governm_cnt has not come along w1th any propo"tl to mcrease the produdion of wheat. Nothing is done to' as~ist settlers who wish to provide themselves with grain for ploughing. No provision is made to meet that £33,986 that is owing bv tho settlers to the Agricultural DE>pa,:tment. Tho Minirter for Agriculture has stated that it was his inte;>tion to st;cure repayment from those who still ov;cd thiS money, even though they reaped no wheat.

:\h. APPEL: Put in an execution and 'ell them up.

:\1r. CORSER: On pa~, 11 of th" Finau­cial Statemcmt it is "hown that rcp:>yment for the seed whed and cost of ploughing is to be m.:dc from the proceeds of tlw crop. \YlPn !lwse people ha':o no uop, he is going to force- thcn1 to pa,\ by m0ans of pron1is.sorv n~~ .

Tho SECRETARY FOR AGRICUL'rURE: If there arf~ no pro('eeds there can be no payrn0nt.

Mr. CORSER: The han. gentleman knows perfectly well that when the"e people have signed their promic,;ory note•', they ha.-e put themsdvcs into the hnnds of the Minis­ter. A dPputation met the Minister for .\.griculture this nfternoon in J'Pspect to this question, and I &m pleased to sa;;· he was

sympathetic and gave a reply which I was pleased to hear. The farmers will be pleased to receive any assi3tancc, although it is at, the hand<. of the Labour party, advocated b:;- the Liberal party, as long as th~y- recei v'l assistance. I congratulate tho M1mster en his reply.

;11r. BERTRUI: Then, why attack him? )lr. CORSER: I want to point out tha~

there ha ·· been no provision on these Esti­mates. The Opposition had to force the GovernmPnt's hands. There is no support either for wounded soldiers ,, ho aro to take up land, nor for any expenditure to make available suitable land to be handed in a ,uitable condition to suitable men. There · is no pl'Dvision whatever to e'·tablish in the huge are<c of the 1J pper Burnett an agri­cultur(l\ State farm, so as to show these people, who come to take up land, a farm in

]n'ogrc of development, producing something which the:c could afterwards produc-, them­selves. That would be something to the benefit of the people who would be put on the land, and something to the advantage of Quceneland.

The SECRETARY FOR AGRICULTURE: \Vhat about the J imbour settlers?

2\Ir. CORSER: Instead of that, our friends OJ'PO'ite refer to the J imbour settlers. No <•ffort "·as made for the Jimbour settlerc other than ,-h,,t tlPir awkward conditions justified, through the dry seasono. The Jimbour :::;-ttl~rs, in being offered three :rears' sus­pension of paymenb, were only bE'ing offered what they will take to themselves, because thr> Gov!'rnmont cannot force them to pay. The Government are not game to shove them off. Tlwy know they cannot throw them off, and the~~ are only ffOing to 1nakc eaf'ier con­ditions, by bringing forward a Bill and legalising what they know the· settlers will do for tlwmselves, became they cannot pay.

}11-. H. L. HARTLEY: You want repudiation. ::\lr. CORSER: It is not repudiation when.

nature has hit tho>G people to the extent it has. \Vhcthor it is repudiation or not, the Gm·ermnent should grant those con­ditions, became it is impo•.-;iblo for the settlers to pay. Then the Government should ac;>!st people in dry arc-tts, by making pro­nswn for v ater. \Vhen I asked that question of tlw :Y1inister for Lands he replied "\Vait till the .Estimates come forward ~nd vou

ill for yourself." iY e have seen that there no provision for \vater in dry areas for settlers who have been ,,-aitin" so long. Thn :\Iini·-tcr for i\griculture k~ows that tl·ere '' ·ro be:wccn 400 and 600 applicants for a water di'tiner to a•sicct in finding water and to place a certai11 sum on the Estimates for !JI'm:iding >ncter after it had been found. :1\othing has L•,en p]q,ced therr>, because the GoYe}~nnwnt is an unsympathetic Govern­n)"nt. The Pre1nicr says, "There are plcntv of killable cattle in Queensland," and y,;t the;<- tE'll us that thote is a 40 per cent. reduction from tho drought. But there are plenty of killable cattl" whi,n the Premier is bowing his knee and his head to his rr;asters up on the hill. \V c find h0re, undPr ' Trade and Commerce," that our friends st~te that in the near future ;,erlou~ rt~trictions in trade mlht necessarilv follow the loGses oe; wioned in th<' pac.tcml aEd argicultural inclu~.try. Th,;_t -is the n:ac,:0n thev hav·2 put on a land t:P: and iEcrPa.eed the fr0ic-ht·c, and fen'; on raihYays passing through· agricul­tuml and pastor::tl districts. The:-' are increasing- the cost of thP cattle traYelling ·

.:.llr. Corl'!'r.~

'l±3li Supply. [ASSE:.\IBLY.] Supply.

over tho::,-~ lines and increasing the cu.:;t of commodities ':md the necessaries of life. It is necessary for them to tax everything that might travel over those railways, because

. during tho elections they stated that it w~·· the action of the Liberal Government in supporting trusts and combines that kept up th, price of food, and yet we find, a. soon as they come down with their Statement.

·they say that restictions in trade will be> necessary on accrmnt of the los•:es occ1;sioned in the pastoml and agricultural industry, due to the drought and a condition of war. Kow, we find they am stepping into some other shoes. Thev have won by false statE'ments; lying statements, circulated by agitator, and ·circulated through the piffle that was printed by the Parliamentary committee; piffle that ·will in futur~ be printed by contributions ·from free and independent men who have> ·been forced to join the Trades Hall. Theso people will be contributing- to thP piffle to save members opposite their seats, which they have no right to occup,, at the prc<ent 1non1ent. \Vhile making r,:fer,,_,nce to par;P 13 and trade and commerce. it is jmt a' well to look at page 16 of the "'une Statc'­ment. where it is stated that the railwav re.-enuc for the year is anticipated to PxcPed th<> actual rec0ipts for last vear bv £1.57.P3G -to <"XC'Ped in a- tirne of chought' and in a time of "\vnr, because of the illC'1'nru~Prl taxntion. Those are the friends of tht:. producers. lYe arc told-

'' 'rhi~ inlpl'OYPd po•,ition hl'oug2lt about by C'erh1in r:rrwll incrp()~e-:. 1n frPig-ht~ and adjustments of fares"-

to tlw dr trimcnt of the produc~r. . "The return fares haYc llc0n nbol. 1shcd"

and nothing- i- done to the df'trinwnt of th~ ".1:ity '\~rke( .

Th1s doC's not :1nplv to Sf'fl!'-011 tld;;:Pt;:; in subnrban nreas." ~ -

:By tlwir unfair adjn hnent the,· hnYe plac0d th~:o \Yholo burden on th0 eonntr\· to thP bC>nc!it o:- thcii· f-ll')])Ottnr:- jl1 the j·~·;n:_

"This doc, 'r:Jt apply to fareo nnd season tiekcts in the sulmrban areas, or to worlnnen's weekh~ tiC'ket.::."

'That iR a.nother conccssi~n to workPrs in tlH~ cit:'-?· Xo incronsC>s ar0 to be nu1.cln on the tickets to Ivswich and SandD"n.te, and haek to :Brisbn1w.

" The long-distanc0 season ticket raH's for commercial traYeilers and oth0rs haY{' also been rm-ised."

\Yo objent h increased ratPs and farps to .~hE' ~ommercial traveller in thn bush. bPcause H will bn paesl'd on to the consumPr in th" bush. The· hon. g0ntloman knows that.

" There has be0n a. revision of tlh~ rat"s charg-Pd for the carriage of parcels" to tho bush.

" ... :\n~ a reYISion of freights, Yaryi11-:.; from. 2~ per cent. to 10 per cent. on prf'Yious rates. on wool, produee, C'oal an~ ('okc, miner,tls. ~eneral n1erchandisf'. ano on other r;oods ; and from 5 PE'r c:-nt. to 20 pf'r cent. on live stock and lo~· tunbC'r "~- "

and also an inC'rfla.se on th0 C'ream ran rate. ·The prp,cnt Minister for Lands alwao1" had B :-J_ar·din[.r motion on priYnt0 1nen1be~:s' daY that freights were too high in Queensland. and the.t a general reduction should be made.

~fr. BLBBINGTOX: I1c \VR~ <'~ltdlins:.r votr..;. ·then. ·

31r. C'OR'lER: It ·will lw ll<'C•">sarv for itiu1 to catd1 votp.-,. aftpr hp and hi~ ~party

[ilf r. Corser.

luwe subscribed to such a piece of scandal­ous legislation as we find embodied in this Btaten1ent.

The SECRETARY l''OR AGRICULTURE : Yon will have some' trouble in catching vore,, El'Xt election.

::\1r. CORSER: The wish is father to the thought. I am not .a vote-carcher. 1 notice here that a large mcrease has been made for hospitals, asylums, and chari(,ablc institutions. "\. largo mcrcase wi;l llo nc:ccBsary. The hon. gentleman has also nwdP provl'""ion for funeral t'X1lensccl, and nJ ·doubt they will be required after the present Parliament expires. Funeral ex­pen·sos have already been provided on the Estimate, so as io be ready fm the death o£ the caucus Government. vVe find that something that has been advc.cated by the LiLeral partv, and was intended to be placed on tho E,;tiil~ates had the Liberal party been r'.'tarnod to power after the elections, has lJL'Cll done bv the pr(srnt GovernrnPnt. Tlun is tlll' r11cdiCal insfH'Ction of cJuntry sc:HJol dn!dren. 'lhat is what I have al"""J' advo­e·ltt:. d. and also further a-~jstance in the way u£ dc<,ltal e'rarnination and treat1nent of chil~ ch·en in the country districts, which has not bPt n provided.

Tho i:lECRET.UW FOR ACRICCLTC:llE: Don't .01..: kn~1w that wo al'C' vroYi·dine; for that? . ~h. CORE'·l~H: l h,<Ye already. ccatcd that 1 notic,·d it. 1 am comnFmdiw• you for doing sorncth~ng th,_tt the Li.l:H~ral Go\rc.rn­!Hl'nt intcnd0cl to do-proVIdmg mechcal inspc~ctlon. rrhe future ex_istenee of the na twn dupends on the children who are gTo\\:ng~ up ~a-day, a_l(d the Governmept ,hould c;o all th·~y poss10ly can fot the elul­,]r.'n so th :t it will be pc,· .ible for them to llTow UJ.> a iJette:- and rnon~ vigorous pooplL~ ~ nd 1nc -:e \VOrthv of tho su:::lnY land which ~ \ L' e·n iov. The 'in ere a r .j u1x.a.tion proposed in thi~ Financial Stakmc'nt will fall on tlw eeuntrv .districts, and I f,iuce:-ely hope that during this time of drought we will not find thP lY'"·cscnt Governn1('11t in::i-sting upon tho ,,a,.1tion which tlwy haYc placed before u:;. \Yhl'n -.~,-~· fil;d then1 con1inf,' al<H1g at a time likP thjs and bringing fo:nYar.d .. a land t.ax

i1l1 £300 cxcmptio11, \YC can nghtly claun that they will be guilty of anything that is wwng. \Vhat is £300 Yalue to a f<lrmer?

Tlw SECRETARY FOR AGRfCULTl'RE: 'Cnim­)ll'OYed Y<llue.

::\1r. APPEL: You charg-t'd £4 an acre for t1~~· land.

:'vir. COHSER: A worke:· in the city n1i"' ht secur-e' his £300 a year or ruore for his~ \vork and is not taxed: and vet the man \JU the land \Yho own,. as a. rc':'i~ult of :~car::; of ''lYing, land to tho y;c_lue of £300 on whjch he hc/J to n1ake a hYing fro1n year to -·cur. is to be taxed. The tnan who is tnak­l.:_lg- v;ood ·wages in the city and liYing rh'Ca]wt· tlnn the man in tlw bmh is not to ~ll' tax~d at all. That is pr.'ference tn a das, that is supporLng our friend-s on thP other sidt~. If the GoYPrnnlf'nt intend to ! mt ·:! tax en land. then it will be neces,,;uy fm· them to provide· for <tSsishnr" to local rroYernmcnt·'· In th0 other State~ J.lssi:.,tan{'{) [, (riven by the Gov{ i'Dll1Pnt to local ;--,uthori­tie~ LJ assif't the1n in making n1ain roaU~ ~imply because the whole of the land taxa-1 ion has been vested in tho GoYe,·nment. V>hen you take awav from local authorities tlw rig:ht of taxing thP land, tlwn you must snbsidisf' then1 in some \vay.

Mr. PETER(-;ON : Did your Governm0nt do that?

Supply. [20 OCTOBER.] Suj_Jply. 1431

:VIr. CORSER: Our GoYcrnment alwavs YCsted in the local authoritir"' full right to tax the land, and now you are taking av.a.y onto of that power.

The SEC'RETARY, FOR ...:\GRICULTURE: You di'tl not giYc them full pmYcr to t:tx tho land.

~lr. COfLsER: You arc impo--lnrr taxation on l.:dtd. ''dnch po~.\'t.1 l' ri,vLUy belOngs to <'!.

local authofity, in ordel~ to enable thcn1 to raise rc·:enne tq caiTV out their \vork. The loc L,OVcrnments haZl the only right to tax land. That is tlw field of operation for local 'mthoritics to enable them !rom time to timP to increase their -revenue as rcquirLd. Yotl ~1'(' .tul:ing that aw.~y aad su1J{)1,\ing not1 1~~1; E1 J ts pi _1,(':-. Y (~: \VC find L10 lll-·Cl'S- --;ittin~

on the Government side holu>­L_: p.m.] Loins S~jl)~)Orting a r -~iUH;it!on

"'~ lE_ade a YC'tll~ Ol' t\YO ~1 r~·o tO thf> p;;2t Goyermnent, who did not take away that l>O\'cl' !roLe the io":al amhoriti< ,, that loc:d authcritic, ,,houkl l'CCL'iVe a lJrOportlon o: the u.n.oJUllt o:,t..1incd frorn tho H:I.le of l.t:nH_:; and thr F, lc of ti~ab-:·r frDiil ihe land. Tho;,(-~ g.._ nd( 1llf':Il bt'gan t h~~ requt.. ,t -'"~nat thz, whole of +he taxalJl.e Yahw o.i: lc.~al a,u:horitic· should be Yl-'<·etl in th.- lncal auti1oritie~ thc:n1' ('lvos. l..Jov~· they have taken awa.Y a propo don of that ,·1ght- '<- ~~-wd in the loc.~l tt.udHJr~! :t :- nnd th--y an~ not lH11.(bng ovr1· t\) ihcrn th:-~.t \Vhieh thc1 haYo uch·-cca.tt~d :-:-o often -"a proportion o± the Yaluattou o£ Crcn\ll laEtV .as w<·ll .as the nY••:alt~es. on timbCl'. u

OPPOSITION ::\IEMBEllS: Hear, hear ! ::\Ir. C'OlklElt: It is proof E'nough that on

cyery possibl-P occasion hon. 1ncnbcr~, oppo­site are prepared to take a" ay the rights of our tnrcnds 1n the bush, \lnd rn place of them impose a burden of <cxtra taxation. Whem ver it is possible to do it. they are only too pleased to do it. Thev 'have done ·-o in order to make possible a 'much laro-er estimate than is placed in this Stateme~nt simply because they want, at the end of the term, to do their dutv to those who have. su~ported. them by 'increasing their ,,alarli?S, mereasmg the wages that the Min­ister for Railways has apologised for. To do that they are actually prepared to put

, other burdens on those who are overloaded at the present time.

Mr. BERTRAM (1lfaree): The drought an_d the financial string!lncy consequent upon this war have made It necessary for this Government to impose additional taxation. We. have had nothin~ but a howl of indig­natwn from memhers on the other side be­cause the Government have been compelled to do that. I W'ts much interested in liswn­ing to the han. member for Murrumba last night. I am going to endeavour to show before I resume my seat, the inconsistency of the hon. m.,mber. He was very loud in his denunciation of this Governmerit because they have decided to impose a land tax, and "J:lecause they have decided to increase the mcome tax, but that hon. member was sit­ting behind the Government when there was a "drought in Queensland before and when the Government found it necessary to impose no fewer than five new taxes.

:Mr. FoRSYTH: You made that interjection last night, and I gave you the reason-huge deficits.

Mr. BERTRA:M: Of course there were huge deficits. There was a Liberal Govern­ment: in power, and we would expect hugo defimts. But let me say that circumstances then and circumstances to-day are, to somc>

extent, similar. They were faced with, drought conditions, and it "as found neces­"LrY to impose further taxation, and we are faced with drought conditions and financial stringency, and it has been found nee!ossar:r to i1nposo taxation.

}h-. FORSYTH: You have a bigger revenue tiw.n e-\-cr we had.

C;lr. BERTRAM: I am going to show that the hon. nwn1ber denounced this ~Govern­rncnt for taking ~in1ih.r action to the action·. the Government took which ho was support­ing in tho·,o clays and whose actions he con1~ mcrded. I want to show the clifforence be­cWef'rt our taxation proposals and the pro­posals which that Government• put into" operation.

:Nir. "FCLEY: There is no poll tax in ours. :\Ir. BERTHAJ\1: There is no poll tax,

as mv friend the han. member for lvlun­clingb'i.lrra rmniuds us, and there is no spcejal Tctrenchment of the public servants. I find on page 55 of • · Ham ard " of 1902 that these we1·e rhe finu>1cial propo,als of the Govern­Ineut--

" To providf' for this (that was, the" ''eticit), the follo•· ing Bills will be laid I ;efore you for your consideration, VlZ. :-

Tho Special Retrenchment Bill, The Finarce Bill, The Totalisator Tax Amendment"

Bill, The Port Dues Revision i)..ct Amend­

ment Bill. The Income Tax Bill."

FiYe avenuP- of taxation. And the han. member for lvlm·rumba then commended the Government for having faced the position in a straightforward way ,and having shown initiative. He "as quite satisfied with the proposals of the Government which sought to' imnose a poll tax compelling every man in the St~ttc to pay.

:\Ir. J\IoRGA:;: It was not a class tax. :i\ir. BERTRA).l: It was a tax \Yhich,

n" t• cl unduly heavily on the working man. As a matter of fact, most of the leaders or:. the othPr side of the House were then sit ting behind the Government-the leader of the Opposition, the hon. member for Mur· rumba, the hon. me!I'ber for Logan, the hon, member for Toombul, and, I think, the hon, memb<>r for Nundah; and they not only voted for the imposition of that poll tax, but also for the special retrenchment which affected 11,000 public servants.

Mr. FoRSYTH: Thev had a deficit of £1,154.000, and you 'have a surplus of £240,000.

Mr. BERTRA:M: Another colleague o± the hon. member, the hon. member for Too· wong, congratulated the Government on hav­ing had the courage to impose a poll tax, and" when this Government seeks to impose a tax, there is a howl of indignation from hon. members on the other si-de of th~ House,

Mr. FoRSYTH : There is no occasion f01 the imposition of fresh taxation.

Mr. BERTRAM: The hon. member said that last night. I ask him how he could" have provided for the additional interest burden on the loans of £+1,000,000 maturing on the 30th June last without the imposition o':f fresh taxation?

Mr. FoRSYTH: Bless your heart, we had" £14,000,000, and provided for it without· taxation.

lYir. Bertram.]

Supply. [ASSE:.VIBLY.] Supply

Mr. BERTRAM: The hon. member said ·that he would have put certain money into suspense account; he admitted that he would do a thing which he has admitted was illegal.

Mr. FORSYTH: Pass an amendment of the Audit Act, and the whole thing would be fixed up.

Mr. BERTRAM : The fact remains that, in consequence of the late Liberal Govern· ment not having made provision for meet· ing the loans early enough, they had to pay an additional ~ per cent. interest, which imposes an additional burden on the revenue of the State, which could not have been met without the addition of more taxation.

Hon. J. TOLMIE: How could they have made provision before the loans matured?

::Vlr. BERTRAM: Let me show the eli£. ference between our proposals and the pro· posals o± hon. members opposite. 'l'hey imposed a tax which hit eYery man. whether he could aJ!ord it or not. We impose a tax, with £200 exemption, and a further exemp· tion of £15 for evcrv child under sixteen :years of age, which "·ill not injuriously affect th<3 working man who cannot afford it, but which "·ill take from the pockets of the woll·to.do a little more for the U)k0l'[J of the State. Let me asl;: further, whcther this Goyerl1nwnt has dono a-.> that Goyern1~1c-nt did-i1n·)o e ~~c:cial r~'~renchrntut on tho pub~~c : TYttnts '! Xot at all. 00 generous has this GovcnJli.Jcnt b :en that they gave no Icjs than £56)020 inc ret· ~cs l~~st year.

.H0n. J. 'l'OL}UE: \';·e did that.

),Jr. Bl.RTitL\.JI: Of cour_,,c, hun. n1ein­b~.-rs OlJ:i)O··it~J \\OEld c!ai1n that. but the fact r0~.dUCJS that tbe Govenln .. ,__;·c..t o.f ·which he W<L a llJ,,mber e~uly hl''t yea' dPciC:, d 1 ·) stop lhc automatiP i.; cn-,1.,e~. and this Govc.L':~n:.e:r:- \1-:1r n it e.~cJne iEto po\'\·cr felt that. ar1 inju·-ti\'c had beon done, anU ve:·y rightl,__. gave cbu public sern:tnt.:J thoh· in­crec:t- of £5J 1 000. ....\.nd in ~Y:.ld oi pro­posing, as v:as done in those day.-·, to inb·o­ciuce a Spcci:.d Hetl·c:cchmert Biil, this Go· ver~une11t is propo8ing to give increases to underpaid public borva~t~ It is true that they a~·e uot giving increa<;es to scnw-which some people desire should bo given-but tho fact re1nains that instead of in1posing re­trenchrnent this Govm::nmont are giving incre.LSC-J in weges.

Hon. J. Tor,3IIE: \\·here are they getting the n1oney?

Mr. BERTR:\M: 'rhq propose to got the money by way of land tax and by an increaee in tho income tax, \Yhich, I say again, will not injurim1 ~ l:; affect those who cannot afford it, but will take a little more from the pockets of the well-to-do in Queensland.

Ron. J. ToL:\'IIE: And do not forget the men who arc out of work. ,

::VIr. BERTRAM: I will deal later with the unemployed. The hon. member expresse·; a great deal of ~•olicitude for the unemployed. Not on:y are we giving the public servants their incre~sc ~, but we are putting money on the Estnnatcs for such dr".CrYinQ; institu­tions as the hocpitals, tho cho.ritable ;n titu­tions at Duuwic:1, dnd ~iving an increased amount to the State Children Department.

Mr. FoRSYTH : £40,000 a year.

Mr. BERTRA:VI: I am glad· of the inter­jection, became it reminds me to say that

[Mr. Bertram,

1 do not think I ever heard a more callous ,tatement than that made by the hon. member, when he eaid last night that he did not approve of the natural mother being given the samo amount for the upkeep of her child as was giYfln to the foster mother.

:&Ir. CARTER : Shame ! Mr. BERTRAM: I care not whether it is

£40,000 or £140,000. I say that the sum that has been paid in the past to the natural mother, who by force of circumstances is compelled to como to the State and seek aid for the upkeep of her child-namely, 5s. a week-is altogether insufficient, and I know that repeated efforts were made by myself and the other membero of my party to got the late Gon~rnment to increa 1e the sum that is paid to natural mothers. Immediately this party came into power, following their humanitarian policy, they increased the amount ; and I want to repeat that I do not think any more callous statement could be made than that by the hon. member that he would not have given that increase to tho natural mother.

Mr. FoRSYTH: I said that £40,000 was too rnueh.

Mr. B:F;R'l'RA;\l: His concern is that these taxation ln'UDO~als of ours arc going to affect the polit"cal friends of the hon. members on the front Opj;'l<ition bench. Had our taxa­tion propu: 1ls been tillr:lli:: r t .J tno3e ll!_l­

po ~<>d by tho Liberal Govn·nn10nt in 1902, there '' ouJ.d have been no howl o£ incligna­bon; Lut it is lwcau~c this Govc'rnnwnt has s,,_en tho \Visdo n of cornpc~hng thrJSe who are ~ ~<t able to vay, to hell} to bear the burden, that \1 o ha"', G thJ::> ho1.l. I urn proud of the G.Jve1 nn1cru.. that in a ti1no oi stre.;:s lik~ this h~u t~w courage to fa,Jc the pc Jition rnan­fully, and ca:~ that '~hcse chantablc mstitu­timu; should not Ftar·ye as tht havf· been .star', ,_Ll in dw P-' by Libe·'al L+ovL•rnrncnt·. _:\,o\v, h~t n1e LJUOte tv.-u or three sets of 11g,1.res to ho.,-,- ho..,Y t.hi:s Go\Tl'Illnen{~ i.s pro­Yiding fur sueh institutions. Last rear the .:-.nlO'...I.Dt approp1·iated for Dunv,{eh 1'-as £27,340, and this year a sum of £3.1,950 is asked for.

l\lr. FORSYTH: It is steacli:y rising every. year.

Mr. BERTR~I.M : Last vNr the contr-ibu­tions to hospitals "' e;·e £143,315, and this year £162,218 is asked for.

Han. J. TOL:Il:IE: \Ve spent £170,000 on the ho:·pitals.

J\:lr. BERTRAM: I ""s going to point out that in 1902, when the Government of which tho hon. member was a supporter found it necessary to impose the taxation to which I ha ye re:erred, they also cut clown the hospit?-l dubsidy from £2 to £1 lOs. per £1 subscnbed.

l\lr. FOR'lYTH: And the Labour party reduced it to £1 ls.

Mr. BER'l'RAM: The Liberal Government spent £140,000 last year, and this year the Labour part: proposes to increase it to £160,000. As far as hospitals for the insane are concerned, the amount appropriated last year was £84,666; thi year it i.s £10'.625. The amount appropriated for State children L't year "as £64.504; this year it is £104,31.5. Most of that money is required to enable the department to pay to the natural mother of a child the same amount as is being paid to the foster mother.

Mr. FoRSYTH: And you cannot afford it.

Supply; [~0 OcTOBER.] Supply. 1439

~Ir BERTRAM: 'l'he han. member says we cannot afford it; if the han. member had Jus way he would not have granted any in­·ereasc. vVe know very well that efforts wore made by this party to get the amount paid to natural mothers increased, and that the late Government refused their reque,t. ''l'he hon. member for Murrumba also said that there is no need to impose any addi­tional taxation. I disagree with him. I say that the additional interest which has to be paid in connection with the maturing loP.ns necessitates the imposition of further taxation.

:1fr. FoRSYTH: · £60.000 extra. Mr. BERTRAM: 'l'hat interjection only

shows that the han. gentleman has not given th<· matter the consideration he ought to have -given it, because the amount is considerably more than £60,000. There is an additional charge of ~ per cent. on £11,728,800 payable out of revenue in rc,pect of interest, and that amounts to £527,796 as against £ ;69.152 in previou,; years; and the charge on the re-venue: for the sinking fund in connection with that loan is £18,112.

Mr. FORSYTH: You could have dispensed with the whole of that.

:\Ir. BER'rRAM: If the hon. member had his ~'<~ay \Ye shonld never ha,~? had a sinking fund.

..\.n Ho"o'LRABLE J\IE1IBLR : \\'h .. ;.t is the use o£ a sinking fund" .. J\lr. B_ERTR .. \Th~: I cmnot reply to every mt~ rJedwn that rs made, because I should not ha VP tirno to n1akC' the rernarks I wish to make if I di<l so. Um1c,r the Ad of.1913, o.;hido p1·ovides for this n1atnrinp; ]o.\n, c0rtain :mon0~~s """ere raisPd by the i 'SUC' of de ben~ tnrcs-£8,106,4\:1-and inscribed stock­£3,622.400. The bttcr <arriecl ''· ,,inkin'C\' fund of £18,112 per annum. Th<•ri there w thf' qliartd''s inter< ;t-£68,71;';-dne on the loan, but not '1ayahlc until Scphmb0r of tl1is year.

II en . .J. TOL\HL: lou paid that out of our <:;urplus.

~'Ir. BERTR. \t~1: "Just so; that is to be pc_jf1 Ollt of l'C\'O:rlUC. rr}HJS(' figures make lll the aggregat~ an dditional charge of £145,..;69 on the rcvemw. How could the Government meet that additional inter;.'t burden without the imposition of further taxation? But, as the leader of the Go vernment reminds me, it is going to impose a greater burden than that, because in order to carry on public works it will be necessarv to borrow money, and the interest on that money will also have to be paid bv the Go· vernment. The 'Treasurer anticip'ates that the additional burden this year will be £280,000, and that being so, the Government have no alternative but to face the imposi­tion of further taxation, and they have done that in a way for which they are to be commended. Dealing now more directly with tho Financial Ste.temeni>. I think it is a mattm· for congratulatio;, and gratification that the State has made the progress it has done, notwithstanding the drought. As has been stated, the revenue for last year was a record revenu~. I also note that 'the chan;e on revenue now in re'·<pect of the public debt has decreased to such an extent that the money borrowed is scarcelY a charge on thP revenue at all. I think that the hon. mrml:~r for J\1urrnmba pointed out that in 1SJ6-ten year-J ago-the charge was 17.21 per cent., and that this year it is down to 3.72 per cent. That Is a matter for con­gratulation, but I would point out that last year it was lower than i.t would otherwise

have been in consequence of the quarter's interest on maturing loans not having been paid. But it would have been considerably under 4 per cent., even if that amount had been paid, and it seems to me that it is only a matter of a short time when the public debt will be no hurden on the revenue at all.

Hon. J. 'l'ouf;E: Not if you go ~n in the way you a:ro go1ng.

Mr. BER'fR.\M: We have had a great de,,J of criticism from members oppo3ite of this Government and of this partv, because we have not been able to do in fiv';, minutes, so to speak, what the Liberal party have not been able to do in fifty ye<>rs-; hat is, to re­duce the cost of living. I h;;ve been en­deavouring to show the difference between !he policy pursued by this part:.- and that pursued by the Liberal party when we are faced with the necessitv of imposing fresh taxation. It is a matter for congr"'tulation that the Labour party are in power at the present time. It is quite safe to assert that had the late Libual party be0n in power we should have had a roimposition of the poll tax, and there would have been no increases to public serv:cnts, and the £.56,000 of auto­matic increases would not have been paid. Nor would the unfor·,lmate mother who has to get assistnnco from the State for the rnaint~nance of her chi!tl had the allo-;· ;-nee made tr1 hc·r incrr-as,.:d. 1.,l1erf_· .,.,vould prob­ably have been retrer- hment in the public service again.

Hen. J. Toc.}l!E: And tlwre would have been no di·tribution d relief on two days a -~ pnk.

:\lr. BERTRA:\1: I "ish new to m:1ke <om(~ rpfer;·nce to the s{,vin:-; :C.t- \nJ to han king g-enl _·ally. It -')Clns~ ) tn· the GoYc:~n; ,)~nt rnight do so:nrrhi~' g tllP futnrc in the way of cstab]i;:;hing a tradin!.: bank. I am one of those wh<' think that if the Government had a monopoly of b~nking business. manv of our financial difficultieC' would va.nish. •

Hnn. J. ToL .. 'JIE: The Common,.· ealth have got that.

Mr. BERTRAM: They have a bank, and I propose to refer to that matter later on. I think the Commonwealth Bank has dono GXC<'llent service. But I de ire, fi"•·t of aiL to deal with the Savings Bank. I note with pleasure that the Savings Bank continues to make progress. 'l'he profit made lest yfar 1\'as not so gre::tt ?S in proyiows years. It was only £1,367 13s. 5d. a~ against £13,792 12s. 7d. in the pr.:vious ve;,_r. The balance-sheet shows thot the total profits of the bank have been £119,214. Of the monev deposited in the Government SeviPgs Bank the sum of £7,590,160 is invested in Go­vernnH'nt securities. and the remainder. £3,190.023. is in the Queensland :"l'ational Bank. I know very wpll that the"c . is not a sum of £3,190,000 in tho Queensland J'\ational Bank. I am going to point out what is the weekly average of the moneys ohtained in the Qtl8ens1und J'\ational Bank. and to show why I think that the Govern· ment shnuld keep lees moncv in that bank. The Queenf'land :-rational B<mk has been ;poon-fed much too long by Liberal Govern­~nents in Queemland. The mone;.-s belong­mg to the Queensland Government in that bank muet be a source of very great profit to the institution, and I think the Gm-ern­ment should take some ete:->s to establish a. hank of their own, or bank with thf' Common­wealth Bank. Much of the money belong-

Mr. Bertram.]

1440 Supply. LASSE:i'.IBLY.J Supply.

ino· to tl~c S.aYina Bank is hcin~ used for t,.;;"t purposes. About £1,000,000 has been advanced to workers undPr the V\r orlu'rs' Dwc;Jirqs Act, and anodwr £1,000,000 ha;; t>,•en ach·anced to scttlc•rs throngh the Agri­I'Uituml B·mk. That money ha.J been ad­V·.lP~!:'d for very usp·{'u1 purposes, but ,,,till a Y~~ry large suru ic:~ always l~'ing to the credit (;t thP Gove1nment S-::tYing~ Bank in the Queensland ::\Tational Bank.

\!r. Ai1'"'TROKG: Xot alwa'" there. :'Ir. BERTRA:\I: If the hon. gentlemcm

will take the trouble to look up the figu:es, lw will l[nd that for the last fiyo vears the aver.:tgL week!.) balance to the credit of the Go,·ernmcnt in chc Queensla.ncl )Jatiou~l lLcnk has bern nv ltss than £1,300,000.

_},Jr. AR1!fcTROSG: Xot ~lv:a: there.

),1r. BERTR<'i.::\1: It is nut ahvavs there, Lut the fact rmnain ~ that the a.verag8 \Ycekly haiance for the past iiYe :·•· ns has been £1,300,000. At no time has the ucnount boon lHs tlwn £800.000 accnrding to the half­yeariy balance- ;hoets i. ue :1 b:, the Queens· lanll _'\ational Ban:.:. T!1 .~,t n1oncy rnust be a s>nrcc d p cat p; )/it to the Qnc<:>nsland :\'ational Dank, and I think it could be ll(-'tter used 1n other way.-;. On the money so 'ying to tile credit of the Qoyernmcnt tho Queensland Xatiomd Bank pays only 1 per cent. on any amount over £100,000. In 1912 th:· QuerusLcnd Xational Bank paid int-C'rr-,q 111 rPSl)C'C't of thut monev to the ex­tent of £7,220, and in the '<lllle year the Treasurer paid to the Governrnent Saving.:; Bnnk no h·:s a Bum than £66,121 as interest, so that th<>y must be losing money in con­Lection with tlw SaYin((' Bank. The follow­ing y<'u, 1913, the intcrc<,t paid by the Qw'emhnd Xatione.l Bank was £11,595, and the Treasurer paid interest in connection with that same money to the extent of £67.595. In 191:c the Queensland Xational B.3nk paid £12,447, and the Treasurer paid on the same mono:; £80,227. I lmve not the f1gures for tho past ye11r as far as the Queensland ::\1 ational Bank is concerned, but l notice the Treasurer paid no less than ;883,536 in connection with that money.

::Vlr. AR)ISTROKG : Are you not going to give stabi!ity to the depositors? The de­pc.sitors must get their money.

Mr. BERTRAM: Having such a large amount of monev in the bank is a source of very great profit to that bank,

Mr. ARMSTRONG: It is at call. Mr. BERTRAM: Had the Government

a bank themse!Yes or banked with the Com­monwealth Bank, instead of the money derived from those sums going into the coffers of the shareholders and directors of the Queensland· National Bank, it would have gone into the coffers of the State or the Commonwe'l.lth. (Hear, hear!) I say the Queensland National Bank has been spoon­feel by the Liberal Government too long­I say that advisedly. Of ('Ourse, they had a large sum of money locked up for manJ years, and the bank got that on extremely favourable terms-I think they had over £1,800,000.

Mr. FORSYTH: That is all paid now. Mr. BERTRAM: It is all paid now, but

the fact remains that they had the money on exceptionally easy terms from the Liberal Government. One has only. to look at the balance-sheet of the Queensland National Bank to find that during the past five

[Mr. Bertram.

years the profits of th,'t bank have beerr no less than £486,396. They have buiit uJY· a. reserve of £178,000, and the total paid-up capital of the bank is only £480,00G a.lto­gcther.

:Mr. BARXES: What dividends did they pay in that time?

Mr. BERTRAD>I: 'Cp to 10 per cent. As a matter of fact, 1 believe they have paid the amount clue to tho Government in order that they may be able to pay larger divi­dends to their ,.hareholders, because I under­stand tho terms of the agreement were that they could not pay a diYidend over a certain amount until the whole of thf' money was paid up. To emphasise fnrther the point I am making of the profitable nature of the banking· busines·1 I flnd that as far as th,· banks of Australia are concerned-! ·am quoting no\v frorcl a return to.bled in the Federal Parliament in 1810 by the Common .. wealth Treosurer when dealing with the Ccmmonwcalth Bank-tho profit.'> made by the twentY-om or twentv-two brmks of' .\ustralia amounted to £30,530,183. The total up to the end of 191-: is £40,792.168. They have '" rcsene of £15,342,622. and the paid­up capital of the whole o( the banks oi _\ustralia is onlY £31.142,583.

Mr. Fom,YTII; Some of them have been. opcr;~tjng for seyenty or eighty years.

::O.fr. BERTRAM: Of course; and some of them have not been going many months; but tho fact remains that the banks I have· mcntior1cd have made proflts very much exceeding their paid-up capitaL Referenco3 was made last night by the hon. mombei­for Carnaryon to the Commonwealth Bank. in rather disparaging terms. I am ple;"ed to note that the Commonwealth Bank is a.t. last pa'ying its way. The profit last half-ye ,,r was £25,788 Ss. 5d. ·

:VIr. FoRSYTH : It is a good bank. ::Wr, BERTRA:\1: It is a good bank, and

it is a pity that the Government supported by the han. member did not give the Com­monwealth Bank a little more encourage­ment. (Hear, hear !) Of course, the Liberal' Government were hostile to the Common­wealth Bank.

Mr. FORSYTH: They were under agreement. with tho Queensland National Bank,

Mr. BERTRAM: The han. member is very much concerned ab.out tho agreement with the Queensland NatiOnal Bank, but he is not a.t all concerned about another agree­ment, when he talked about paying certain money into suspense account, although he knew he was doing something illegal and would require a. validating BilL Talking about breaking the a.greement with the Queensland National Bank is another matter, however. I want to quote what has been said bv the Prime Minister of the Commonwealth in connection with the Com­monwealth Bank, just to show what useful work the Commonwealth Bank is doing, He 'aid-

" The Commonwealth Bank has been of great service to the Commonwealth during the war crisis.

" It granted to the Government an overdraft in London during August last of £100,000 and during September, £130,000, at a time when all the banks in England, except the Bank of England and tho Commonwealth Bank of Austra­lia, were observing the moratorium.

Swpply. [20 OCTOBER.} Supply. 1441

" At the request of the Minister for Defence, the bank also arranged to pro­vide funds to pay for purchase of horses for the Expeditionary Forces throughout Australia, pending the pas~ing of a Supply Bill, which arrangement enabled the departmental officers to immediately proceed to purchase and pay for horses, without waiting for Supply to be passed. At the same time the Commonwealth Bank agre~rl to assist the State Govern­ments in London with their financial arrangements. The bank also assisted four banks in three different States in Australia and in London, and arranged to assist another if necessary.

" At a time when the other bankb in London were strictly observing the moratorium, the Commonwealth Bank did not do so. It assisted a large number of Australians resident in England and visiting there. Passengers who have since returned are loud in their praise of the action of the bank during the crisis. It need hardly be added that the pre>Jtigo of the institution has thus been considerably strengthened.

"'l'he bank continued uninterruptedly to negotiate in London bills on Australia, and many merchants in this country were glad of its assistance in transferring funds ·to London.

" The bank has on behalf of the Trea­sury continued to redeem Australian notes and silver in London, and owing to the despatch of the Expeditionary Forces, this phase of its transactions has assumed comparatively large proportions. It has during the war, and still can, help stranded Austra.lians at almost all places outside the actual theatre of war, a fact which may be interesting to many of our people in this country.

"I am glad to pay tribute to the excellent work of the bank's governor in the crisis. He rendered good service in the negotiations for assisting banks, savings banks, and States, and is still assisting the Treasurer with these and similar matters.

"I should like to refer to the assistance rendered by this institution to Govern­ment and semi-Government bodies in Australia at low rates of int'erest during the past twelve months, when the money market had become restricted owing to the war and other conditions. Since the 30th June, 1914, the bank has made the following advances :­State Governments Municipalities Tramway and harbou~· trust~,

&c.

Tota.l

£2,048,000 657,830 757,50.0

£3,463,330

All these loans have either been made, or are in course of payment, and nearly the whole amount has been lent at a maximum rate of interest of 4~ per cent., and in the case of municipalities, &c., is generally repayable by half-yea.rly instalments of principal and interest, covering periods of from ten to thirty years.

"At the same time the bank has continued to deal with applications for advances from constituents throughout the Commonwealth on normal lines, and practically every a.pplication has been

1915-4 v

granted where a proper and ample security has been forthcoming. The rate of interest charged on ordinary overdrafts has been kept at 6 per cent. throughout, whilst for adva.nces to churches, charities, societies, and unions, &c., who do not distribute their profits amongst their shareholders, the r.ate is 5 per cent."

I think tha.t is an effective refutation of the criticisms made here regarding the useful· ness of the Commonwealth Bank. I wanil now to makE) reference to railways. I note with pleasure that the Government propose to continue the policy for constructing rail­ways. I notice from the Commuei.oner's report that it is anticipated that 293 miles

·will be opened during the current year. La.st year the number was 268, and the year before 189 miles were opened, so that it appears that the Government intend to con­tinue the progressive policy of railway con­struction. I think, perhaps, it is necessa1·y, especially in view of the fact that there i& a good deal of .>nemployment, and, if they continue this policy, it will certainly ab•orb the unemployed. I notice also with plea.sure that the railways are almost paying, or are paying, interest on the capital invested on lines opened for tmffic. The amount last year was no less than £4 Os. 3d. per cent. That is higher than it has been for some years. It was higher in 1911, when it was £4 lOs. 2d. per cent'., but the following year there was a decrease. I want to make a point here which seems to me to affect the earning capacity of the railways. I notice in the 'l'reasurer's table that there is always a large ~um of money expended on lines not opimed to traffic, and I think that has an effect on the earning power ol the money invested. For instance, in 1911, when the railways were paying £4 lOs. 2d. en eapital invested, £1,389,263 had been expended on lines that were not opened, and the earnings of the railways were high that year. The following year, 1912, the per­centage was only £4 Os. 5d., but in that, year the amount expended on nilways that had not been opened for traffic increased to £2,308,664, and since then it has been on the decrease, and the percentage on the money invested has been on che incr'Olase. I made this point before, and I think it is worth reiterating, as it seems to me it would be better for the Government to con· centrete on fewer lines, and make them revenue-producing at the earliest possible moment. The position just now is that there are alwavs some seventeen to twenty rail­ways under construction at the same time, with the result that we have some eighteen or twenty supervising staffs, sometimes con­trolling only a handful of men, and the consequence is these railways do not become revenue-producing for an unnecessarily long period. It would be better to concentrate on fewer lines and complete them as ex­peditiously as possible. I think that would have the effect of making the railways pay handsomely on the capital inYested. I also .note with pleasure it is proposed to establish a State coalmine. I hope that will be dons as quickly as possible. I am of the opinion that large sums of money are wasted in the purchase of coal that is .anvthing but satisfactory, and I hope that this matter will be pushed on as expeditiously as pos­sible. I also note referenre has been made to th'l Astablishment of a power-house for electricity. I hope something will be done on those lines. (Hear, hear !) If it can be

Mr. Bertram.]

1442 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

done a.t the pit mouth so much the better, but I believe there are great poBsibilities in ronnection with the supply of electricity. I think it would be a. good thing if we could electrify our suburban ra.ilw.ays, especially ao the experience of other countries goes to show that electricity is much better than steam in connection with short-distance rail­ways. It is particularly necessary here, be· cause nearly all our railways into the metropolis run through tunnels, and it is most unpleasant in those tunnels from the heat, smoke, and dust from the engine. Therefore something should be done to elec­trify our suburban railways, and I hope the Government will not lose sight of the neces· sity of doing something in that direction. Of course, I realise that it all means the expenditure of money, and it cannot be done in a day. I noticed some time ago, in reading the report of the Commissioner for Railways in connection with his tour to the old rountry, that he speaks favourably of the electrification of the railwavs. In refer· ence to this matter he says- "

"The application of electricity t<> the operation of heavy trains, either pas­senger or goods, has been rather limited in Great Britain. The majority of vuch installations have been ma·de in tunnels or tubes or in congested terminals where the nec<'·'sity or de,irability exists for ·eliminating the smoke and gases inci­dent to the operation of a steam loco· motive. It has been found from prac­tical experience that in congested terri­tory electrical operation is much more efficient than steam. and it is a question which should reeeive serious considera­tion as to whether or not we should quadruple our suburban lines, as it appears to me that by electrification, track circuiting, automatic signalling, etc., we could deal with our passenger traffic probably 50 per cent. quicker than at present.

"While in I,ondon I travelled over most of the electrifie·d sections of subur­ban lines, and found the service to be a fast and clean one. 'I'he overhead troll:'-wire system is extensively in use."

At 8.50 p.m., Mr. FOLEY relieved the Chairman in the

'Chair. Mr. BERTRAM: I hope something will be

<lone in the direction indicated by the Com­missioner, because anyone accus.to1ned to travelling in the metropolis knows that in many instances the railway carriages are not fit to travel in, and hy the electrification of the railways all those troubles would dis­appear. I hope also, when the Government are pushing forward with State ·enterprises, that they will not lose sight of the neces­sity of doing something-and doing some­thing quickly-with regard to the Brisbane Tramways Company. A=rding to an '!l.rticle in "Truth," the profits of that com­pany for the past nine years have been no less than .£909,359.

Mr. ARMSTRONG: What rate of interest does that represent on the capital invested?

Mr. BERTRAM: Seeing that the total paid-up capital only runs into some £450,000, the hon. member will realise at once that it is a very high rate of interest.

~Ir. ARMSTRONG: What did they distri· bute during the fifteen years previous?

The SECRETARY FOR PUBLIC INSTRUCTION : About 20 per cent. of the true capital.

[Mr. Bertram.

Mr. AR:IISTRONG: It did nothing of the. oort.

The SECRETARY FOR PCBLIC INSTRUCTION : That is correct, as I took the trouble to work out the figuns.

Mr. BERTRAM: There is no gainsaying the fact that this company is doing exceed­ingly w :·ll, and there is no gainsaying the fact that in the intereots of the public the trams should be taken over. Public utilities of that kind should certainly not be in the hands of a company like the Brisbane :r"raf!l­ways Oompanv. In almost every CJty m Great Britain· of any size, public utilities, such as trams, gas, water, and lighting, are in the hands of the people-either in the hands of the municipality or in the hands of the State; and I say, without any hesitation at all, that the sooner this Parliament takes steps that will enable the municipalities or the State to control such public utilities as the tramways, ga,, and electric light, the better it will be for tho State and the people genPrally. The ex­perience of the old country goes to show that where these utilities are in the hands of thE' people, the people get a better service at a lower rate, and the profits, instead of going into the coffers of the shareholders, are going into the coffers either of the municipality or the State, and are being used in the in­terests of the people. \V e have heard a good deal of criticism from some of our frit3uds opposite conrBrning this party because we have not immediatelv reduced the co't of living, and the inconsistency of some hon. members is ;·emarkable. The hon. membe~ for _\]bert, last evening, condemned us in one breath because we had not reduced the cost of living, and in the next breath he condemned us because we had " robbed " the farmer of the price he could have got for his butter. Almost every member on the other side has done the same thing. '\V e have the leader of the Opposition condemn­iug this G,pvernment because we have not Teduced the cost of living, and we have the hon. member for Drayton denouncing the Government on every possible occasion be­cause we haTe a board of control which fixed the price of butter at 158s. per cwt. when the farmers could have got 196s. per cwt. On the one hand we are condemned because we ha.ve reduced the cost of living, and on the other we are oondemned bec~>use we have not reduced the cost of living. It seems to me that there is nothing we can do that will satisfy han. members opposite. I think the cause of han. members' dissatis­faction is that they are on what they con­sider t]:w wrong side of the House.

Mr. CORSER: You made certain state­ments at the elections and you have not ful­filled them.

l\lr. BERTRAM: We condemned the late Government because they had not taken any effectivE' steps to deal with the cost of living.

Mr. CoRSER: 'What have you done?

::\1r. BERTRA:flf: We have, at all events, prevented prices soaring up as they would have done had the late Government been orr the Treasury benches.

Mr. ARMSTRONG: That is an Aunt Sally.

Mr. BERTRAM: It is quite needless for me to reply to the han. member, as we are continually being condemned because, by fix­ing- the price of butter and cheese and other things-to use the words of hon. members on

Supply. [20 OcTOBER.] Supply. 1443

··the other side of the House--" we have :robbed the farmer." This qucsti.m seems -to be the bugbear of the hon. member for Nanango and the hon. member for Drayton .

. They unfortunately can only s<oe through the spectacles of the butter merPhant or the cheese manufacturer.

Mr. MOORE: They are the ones who are being robbed.

Mr. BERTRAM: And the hon. member for Aubigny. Unfortunately for the hon. member, he can only see through the viewpoint of the butter-maker or the cheese­

maker. While I admit that both butter and cheese are very useful articles of diet, it is unfortunate that the hon. member can

. only see through a box of butter or a loaf ·of cheese. One, in looking at things through .a loaf of cheese or a box of butter, gets an ·obscured view, and it is an unfortunate thing that the hon. member cannot take a wider

•outlook on things and look at them from the view point of all sections of the com­munity, as we on this side of the House do.

Mr. CORSER: \Vhy don't you reduce the ·price of bread?

Mr. BERTRAM: Because of the fact that the wheat that has been imported from the other side of the world has cost

. such that it is not possible to sell bread at a lower price. I am not

_going to say that the· price of commodi­ties should be fixed below the cost of pro­duction. The cost of production should be taken into consideration. This Government have been unfairly criticised because im­mediate effect has not been given to certain thing·s th1-'t we undertook to do when we were on the hustings. These things cannot be done in a day. I admit at once that the cost of living is a very important problem and one with which this Parliament will have to grapple. It is a world-wide problem and every Government will have to face the

'position. While it is true that wages ha¥8 risen considerably during the last few years, it is also true that the cost of living has gone up to such an extent that the effective wage to-day is less than it was five or six years aco. You have onlv to look at the tables provided by Mr. Knibbs, the Com·

·monwealth Statistician, to satisfy yourself ·of the truth of the statement so far as Aus­tralia is concerned. I was perusing a book written a few years ago by a member of the British House of Commons, in which h.., points out that a similar state of affairs existed in Great Britain and in other places. This cost of living is a very difficult problem to solve, and it C'annot be solved in five minutes. It c-annot be bolved by a pric0-fixing board. A price-fixing board may do some good but it does not solve the prnblem, and the problem will have to be solved in some other way. It means that we will have to produce more commodities and that we will have to effect economy in the dis­tribution of those commodities; we will have to eliminate the middleman and reduc0 the cost of living by a more economical distri­bution of food commodities. The Govern­ment are on right lines in that connection. \Ve propose to establish a State butchery, a State bakery, and State sawmills. We ore also going to have a State coalmine, a State fish shop, a.nd a State electrical supply institution, and I also note that the Govern­ment intend to pass an amending Gas Bill this se-;sion to prevent people being robbed by some of the ga•'' e:>mpanies. There is no

·doubt that some of th" gas <·ompmics are

charging an exorbitant price. I happen to be a rPSident of South Brisbane, and I know that the price we pay t,1r gas there is alto­gether too high.

Mr. CORSER : '\V e pay a lot for the gas here.

Mr. BERTRAM: It is most unfortunate that we have to listeu to so much of the gas generated by the hon. member for Burnett. The other evening, when we had an all-night sitting the hon. member for Burnett spoke no les~ than twenty-six times, and, unfor­tunately, as I happened to be in the cha~r during a portio?- of that trme, I l?-ad to srt and listen to htm, so you can qmte under­stand I do resent the escape of so much gas from the hon. member for Burnett. My time is just about expired, and I want to con-

clude by saying that in very [9 p.m.] adverse circumstances the Go-

vernment have done all they could reason:tbly be expected to do. I wi)l not ht·<itate to criticise the Government rf I deem it necdsarv to criticise thC'm, but I think that under all the circumstances they have done what could be reasonably ex­pected of them, and I think that, given time, legislative effect will be given to the splen­did programme enunciated by the leader of this party in March !ant, and I believe, fur­ther, that when lPgislative effect is v,iven to it the conditions of the people of Queensland will be very much better than they are to-day. •· Mr. MOORE (A.ubigny): I was very pleased to hear the arguments adduced by the hon. member who has just sat d~wn. It reminded me very much of a story I once heard of a judge who found fault with a man for backing up his wife. " I Ltnnot understand why you ehould say that. I don't believe a word she said," he said, a.nd the man replied, "You can do as you like, but I have got to." That is the way with the hon. member; he is forced tc be­lieve these things. And I beiieve that his statements are absolutely wrong, beca.uee we had a very clear exposition and a very good exposition of the position from the han. member for Murrumba yesterday of the financial position. I am sorry· that I cannot say that I .approve of the taxation proposals of the Government, because I think that, .at the present time, taxation is abeolutely unnecessary. They have £1,000,000 more estimated revenue than last year, and I think, in a time of stress like this, further taxation ehould be done without if possible. We want economy and thrift; we do not want generosity and extravagance. But that is what we are getting at the present time. I believe tha.t the position of the public servants should be made as good as po"sible, but I do not think they should get their in­creases at the expense of people who very often are in worse circumst-ances than they are. On page 4 of the Financial Statement we have the remark that-

" The present Government, on assum­ing office, re-alised the immediate neces­Ritv either to raise mone~~ at an earlv date or 'to shorten down expenditure on public works."

They have not been able to raise the money up to the present time, and, so far as clos­ing ·down on public ·works is concerned, they seem to have increased the expenditure. We all admit that it is necessary to provide work -as much as possible, but it should not be done at the expense of a class who are unable to find the money at the present

111r. Moore.]

1444 Suppiy. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

time themselves. A little lat€r on, the Finan-cial Statement says- .

" This also applies to the necessity of providing for harbour improvement and local government activity, .as well as of assisting and establishing enterprises for the purposes of increasing production. It would be short-sighted and unstates­m.anlike to adopt any policy which would have the effect of hampering progress or curtailing production."

Have we not had the Meatworks Bill brought in? Is that the way to increase production and stimulate enterprise? We have had the prices of butter and cheese fixed a long way below the cost of production. We are not .allowed to export and get the full value. I do not think that that is assisting an industry. Then we have-

" Since then the Government has been kept fully >lpprised of the conditions of the money market; but, although we have the sanction of the British Trea­sury to issue a loan, we have not yet found a favour.able opening''

And I am afraid that they are not going to find a favourable opening if legislation such as has been introduced is going to continue~if there is going to be a policy of confiscatiOn on the one hand and Govern­ment extravagance on the other.

OPPOSITION MEMBERS: Hear, hear ! The PREMIER : I am surprised to hear

"Hear, hear ! " to a statement of that sort. . Mr. MOORE: It is perfectly true. There Is barefaced confiscation in the Meatworks Bill,"' and it is unlikely that there will be an opening when such things go on.

The PREM!ER: It is a shame that it should be said in the House.

Mr. MOORE: It is .a shame it should be brought in.

The PREMIER : It is like! v to damage the State when we are going on the market.

Mr. MOORE: I was glad to hear, when the hon member for Bowen was speaking. that the Government proposed to make land available for selectors. We all know that food production is vitally necessary for Aus­tralia, and the more we can produce the bett-er. The hon. member said that land w'!uld ;pro_bably be given to farmers in cer­tam districts and to farmers' sons to en­able them to go on the land and produce. It .sounds very nice, and I only hope it is gomg to be carried out. In regard to closer settlement,. we have the question of Jimbour and Gowne. I was very sorry to notice that the Government, in a fit of pique, dropped the Bill to give relief to the selec­tors on Jimbour. \Ve all know that they m:rst have ,reli~f. and because the Opposition tned to get a httle more for the settlers than the tempora.ry relief offered, the Government dropped the Bill and left them in the condi­tion in which they are at the present time.

The PREMIER : You blocked the Bill· you stonewalled the Bill. '

Mr. MOORE: You would stay here .all night if you wanted it, but when it was a question of assisting the Jimbour farmers two and a-half hou;·s' discussion w.as enough: and they let the Bill drop.

The PREMIER: You blocked it. Mr. MOORE : How .much do we block

other Bills that you want to put through? The PREMIER: You admit you blocked it

somewhat.

[Mr. Moore.

Mr. MOORE : We wanted to make it re.a· sonable and good. \Ve know that there are· people in the same position as the Jimbour· settlers, and we thought we might be able to get relief for them at the present time. Then I notice that it is proposed to have a, State sawmill. It may be a very good thing. I only hope it will be managed so that it. will be self-supporting. Last night, the hon. member for Bowen said that it did not matter so much whether it paid; the only thing was whether it was going to give congenial employment to the worker. I. think more is required than that.

The PREMIER : He did not say that. Mr. APPEL: He did. (Hear, hear !)

The CHAIRMAN : Order !

:Y1r. ),100RE: It should be a self-support­ing prouosition. As to seed wheat, I was very pl~ased to see in the paper a couple of' days ago a report of a statement by the Minister for Agriculture, because I thmk it will relieve the farmers. He said-

" 'Cnfortunately, the weather we have had has been so disastrous that about 4(); per cent. of the crop will have to bo grazed, approximately 10 per cent. will be cut for hay, and the balance, it is estimated. will give about 8 bushels to the acre."

Of course, he was not quite correct, because there is about 40 per cent. which is not fit for grazing or anything else, but still we· will let that go. He goes on-

,, The settlero, consequently, are worse off than when they appealed for assist­ance before, so I am going to buy seed wheat and, in the hope that Providence· will be kinder to us, give the settlers a further lot to plant on their land. I will be on the lookout for wheat of good quality. Queensland-grown wheat is pre­ferable to foreign grain."

The PREMIER : Is not that a friendly act, to the farmers?

::\1r. :YIOORE: It is the one friendlv act that the Government have done. There· is not anDther. single blessed thing that ~-ou have brought m of benefit to them. A little further on in the Financial Statement, in the portion -devoted to agricultm·e, it savs. in regard to the sugar question- •

" This was chiefly due to the low selling priee of sugar fixed bY the Con­trol of Prices Boards in the Southern States, where the bulk of Queensland· sugar is consumed."

The Government are finding fault because the Southern States' boards fixed the price of sug-ar too low; and yet, in Queensland, our own Government price boards fixed the price of cheese and butter altogether below the cost of production. It is no more fair in one cas A than it is in the other. 'I 'he Statement also says-

" The increased price secured through­~he timely action of the Government will, m some measure, compensate those engaged in the industry for the partial failure of the crop."

The timely action of the Government in­connection with the dairying industrv is prettv well going to cripple the indust1:v. As a matter of fact, a large number of farmers have sold their cows because they are not going to be bamboozled in this way, and'

Supply, [20 OCTOBER.] Supply. 1445

'•have to sell at less than the cost of pro­·<luction. I do not wonder at it. It is not fair. The farmer should be allowed to get his wages, but he is sweated by the con­sumer. How n1any farmers in the State, with the help of the'ir families, are making 9s. or lOs. a day? The few that are strucrglino· to keep their herds going are to be ~bbed for the benefit of. those who are making those wages. It IS absolutelv wrono- that such things should. go on. '\Ye hav';, pro­posals for the beneflt of other people. We han• no proposals for the beneflt of the p_roducer, except one-. which I shall men­tion later on. Then we are to have a Go­vernment fish supplv. It mav be a o·ood thing, ~ut it is oniy going to benefit" the people .m the towns. I hope it is not going to be hke the sclwme in New South \Vales in regard to which I saw that £6 700 hacl been lost last year. \Ye do not w~nt that sort of thing, because the general taxpayer has to pay; and we do not see why the general taxpayer should have to pay in order that other people might get cheap' food. In the '' Daily Mail," the Minister referring . t~he railway revenue, said- '

" There ~vould be a howl of protest from a sectwn of the people. The :M;nis­try, howeve_r, do:1btless recognised that fact before rt deci_ded on the policy, and all the more praise therefore is due to the . members of the Government for havwg done something which thev knew would be unpopular." ·

'They. !~new it would not be unpopular in .the cities, where the people are not to be tax~d. a_nd where the big organised vote is. It IS gomg to be unpopular m the countrv wh~t·e the vote is small. The Minister fo{ ll_mlways talked about cattle king-s and wool kmgs, and :yet we .see . a. little twopenny­halfpennx reference put m here to the effect tr~at the farmer .will have to pay on what his cream-cans will hold, no matter whether they are nearly empty or not. ·we know that. .at the present time the people are ge_ttmg very httle cream, and perhaps there rmght b,, only a gallon in a 5-g-allon can, _and ti:at farmer is g-oing- to be penalised by havm!l' to l?ay for? gallons. It may mean that he IS gomg to l<eep it until it is full .and that he is going to send second-clas~ cream, so that you will get second-class butter. That may suit the Government .because I notic_e that second-class butter may be exported without any trouble at all and som~ of the factories were talking ~bout makmg se~o:•d-class butter. iJ?- order to get over the difficulty, a" restrwtwns are placed on tl:e ~xport _of first-class butter. I notice that m tne Estim~tes an amount of £7,000 is s~t down f.or subsidy towards tho construction of roads m timber districts. After all the talk we hav~ had of what the Labour partv would do with regard to the construction o'f roads, wE' find that all that is to be done is a s;nall sun: f'?r the maintenanc-e of roads in timber drstrrcts where the Crown timber carters ~~t up the roads. So they are gener­ously grvmg an amount of money to repair the roads .. It sou':'ds nice, but it will not be· of an:· assistance Ill the matter of road con-

. structwn. Absolutely none. We are going to have an adjusted and increased income tax and a land tax. I believe that a farmer is ,(l'Oing to have the privilege of deducting his mcome; tax from his land tax. I do not ~now If any farmer this year will have anv mcome tax to deduct from the land tax. but

if he has not, he will ha v0 to na v the land tax, and so ha n• to pay "here' he can least afford it.

An HoxoDRABLE l\IE}!BER: It ,,.ill hit the monopolists.

Mr. MOORE: \Ve know that the tax will hit the land monopolists, but it will hit the farmer too. Take a lot of the land on the Gowrie Estate. which has a verv high unim­proved value placed upon it by' the Gm·ern­mcnt. The owners of that land have at the prPsent time to pay shire council t,1xes and other taxes, and upon the top of thosE' the Government are imposing a land tax. It is absolutely paying rent, not paying a tax at all. Yet when a Bill is introduced to re­lieve settlers who have to carry these heavy burdens tho Government throw out the mea­sure.

The SECRETARY FOR PcBLIO I}[STRcCTION : What is the low<'st land value on the Gowrie Estate?

Mr. MOORE : I suppose the lowest unim­prcvced value of the land held by any ~ettler will be about £400 .

The SECRETARY FOR. Pt:BLIC lXSTRUCTION : 'I'hen he will have to pay £1 a year under the land tax.

Mr. MOORE: ·we have not been told what the land tax will be. 'l'he Government have really introduced no measure to benefit the man settled on the land. Thev have intro­duced an Industrial Arbitration Bill, an Elections Bill, a \Yorkers' Compensation Bill, a Machinery Bill, and a Scaffolding Bill, and not one of those measures will help the farmer-. to produce a single thing.

Mr. CARTER: The Regulation of Sugar Cnne Prices Bill-does not that help the farmer?

Mr. MOORE: 'rhat will help a certain dass of fanner-the protected sugar-gro,ver­but I think that at a time like this some­thing should be done to help producers generally. \Ye have g-one through a very bad time and \YC have probably a worse time! before us; we have had prices fixed to the detriment of the farmer and the benefit of the consumer; we have to pay a sp<~oif!,,,d rate of wages under the Arbitration Bill whether the industry can stand it or not ; we have .to pay an income tax, and now we are gomg to have a land tax, and an Amending Local Authorities Bill under which there will be no limit to the taxation that may be levied on the land. The farmer is taxed twice through his co-operative com­panies by the income tax. \V e have to pay for guaranteed railwavs,. and all the Govern­ment do for the counh:y is to place an amount of £7,000 on the Estimate's for the mainten­ance of roads in Crown timber area,, Everv­thing else -is given to the other side. Bu.t the matter of the carriage of cream is a bit too rtbmrd. \Vhen the farmer has hardlv anything to send to the factory, the Govern­ment como along and say they must cripple him a little further.

The SECRETARY FOR PcBLIC lNSTRcCTIO}[ : SIJ.'?uld he not pay for space as well as we"ght?

Mr. MOORE : The space occupied by a 5-gallon can is no more when it is full than when it is empty. The Government have dis1:lay~d an _ingenuity amounting almost to gP:liU& m thmr efforts to catch the farmer at PYery possible point. Thev have done noth­ing for him, but they have overlooked no way of getting at him. Anybody can see

Mr, Moore.]

1446 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.]

that. the cost of living must be inerc~sed by incrcaeing thP railway freights just in the EalUC' wa.1 as the cost vf produC'tion is in­cr~:tcoed by increa·,ing wage,•' and the limit­ing of output increases production. All thes .. , things are, of course, o.:>lf-evident. I think the Government must be living in looking­glass land and ceeing everything backwards. Thu Govc·rnmcnt S<Jem to think that the con­sumer is the• only person to be humoured, and that the unfortunate producer must be taxed off the land and out of existence. The farmn has no prices fixed for the articles he has to buy.

Mr. CoLLIKS : Yes, he has; the price of sugar is fixE·d.

Mr. ::\~l:OORE : All the machinery and all the household requisites and clothes that he has to buy are sold without their prices being fixed by a control of trade board. The fixing of the price of sugar will be an advantage to a <·ertain number of producers, but they are the only producers who have received any con­sideration, and that is possibly bec~use there are members on the Government s1de of the Houge who are interested in the· sugar industry. I do not object to the sugar­growers receiving consideration, but I do object to the dairy farmer getting no con­sideration. I hope that Supplem<mtary Esti­mates will be brought forward by the Go­vernment to redeem the promises they have made outside that consideration would be given to the farmer. Every measure brought in so fa1 has been to the detriment of the farmer, as its provisions will tend to make conditions harder and to harass the industry at a time when it is abnormally difficult to carry on operations. Unless some altera­tion is made it will be impossible for farm­ing to be carried on in Queensland. We know quite WE'll what are the difficulties in connection with wheat-growing in Queens­land. I have grown ,.;:heat in Victoria, and I can tell hon. members that the con­ditions there a>re absolt1tely different from those which prevail in Queensland. The cost of cultivation and the risks with respect to crops are far greater in Queensland tha.n in the other States.

The SECRETARY FOR Pl'BLIC' INSTRUCTION : \V e are going to break up some of those good lands on the Darling Downs.

Mr. MOORE : The land on the big estates is no better than the land we have under cuhivaiion at the present time. Land is offering on the Darling Downs to-day at the <arne price as was paid for it thirty years ago. You can get land for £1 lOs. an acre, the price which was paid for it thirty year; ago.

The SECRETARY FOR PUBLIC INSTRUCTION : Thirty years ago they got land at 5s. an acre under the pre-Gmptive provisions of th· Land Act.

Mr. MOORE : The difficulties inseparable from farming are quite bad enough owing to climatic and other conditions, without having legislation passed to increase those c'i:fficulties:

Mr. McPHAIL (Windsor): I congratulate the GovGrnment upon this, their first Finan­cial St"tement, which is given to the country at a time the like of which we have not seen in Queen·•·land before.

Mr. FORSYTH : Do you think it IS as bad no·.v as it was in 1902?

Mr. McPHAIL: \Ve had a very severe drought in 1902, but at the present time we havE' a drought linked up with a very great

[Mr. Moore.

war, and the han. member who has just interjected must surely knmy that as a result of the war there arc restnctwns 111 the money market. Considering the time the Labour party h.:~·,-e been in office I think they have shown ,tatcsmanship in introducing a Finan­ciaJ Statement which proves that they are· prepared to meet expenditure fr~:nn reYenue. \V e continually hear the same !me of argu­ment from members on the other side of the House as that advanced by the hon. member for Drayton about taxing the other fellow but I would point out that if you search~d the statute-book you would find that during the last fifty years it was always the other fellows, the labouring classes, who had to pay the biggest share of taxation and everything else. Yet now, beca)lse we· have a Government who arc trymg to equalise matters and give workmen a fair deal which they have not had in the past, me~bers of the OJ?p~sition are rising_ in their places and makmg loud protests agamst. the statesmanlike manner in which the Go­vernment are endeavouring to make condi­tions more equitable than they have been in. the past. This Financial Statement is not· able from the fact that the Government are· striving to make reven~e balance expendi­ture b:- proper and fmr methods-n?t by introducing an amendment of the A'!-d1t Act which will enable them to do somethmg that cannot be done under the law as it stands at present and I think it comes with very bad grace from a financier to ask the Govern­ment to do something which is practically illegal. The methods which they have·· adopted are such as the country generally will be quite prepared to endorse, because· the people will recognise that they are fair and equitable to all classes.

l\1r. BEBBING~'ON: Do you say "equit-· able"?

Mr. McPHAIL: Yes; I maintain that thev are equitable. The hon. member for· Mu'rrumba has- displayed a remarkable sym· pathv on this occasion for the farmer. He· stated that the Government should go care­fullv and not adopt a policy of extravagance, and' he argued that under their policy they were going to penalise the farmer. Tha· hon. member referred to the way in which· the railway rates would hit the farmer. Let us see what the han. gentleman said in 1902 when speaking on the Financial Statt>­ment delivered bv Mr. Cribb. On that occa-· sian the hon. gentleman, speaking on rail­way ra+e·< said-

.. -N~w, the people of Gympie and on the Downs have bt>en howling for the last week with regard to the excessive· charges put on their lines, but I think that anyone who listened to the remarks. of the Minister, in his very able speech, will acknowledge that he completely demolished the whole of their arguments, and I think we should be convinced that the rates in Queen.sland arc not tc>o high· under the circumstances."

Y<'sterdav the same hon. member criticist>d this Government for readjJ'sting the rates in a wav which I believe any fair-minded man will admit is fair and reasonable.

M". BEBBIKGTOl'i: How can they be fair when they benefit only one class?

~·fr. :\icPIIAIL: What is the use of the hon. nwmhcr continually prating about one· particular class? We are here to legislate for all cla5ses, ,and the hon. member knows that we are legislating for all classes. If he were not unreasonable he would see that;

Supply. [20 OCTOBER,] Supply. 1447

the farmers are receiving from this Govern­ment fnirer treatment than they have re­ceived from past Governments.

Mr. BEBBINGTON: All you have done for them is to rob them straight out.

Mr. McPHAIL: The heaviest burdens under this Financial Statement have been put upon the right shoulders. We find that there is practically an amount of £3'75,000 of a deficit after the readjustment of t'he railway figures. Before those figures were adjusted, there was a deficit of £532,930. The Government, in considering the matter, con­si·dered the fairest way to raise revenue to cover the delicit was by increasing the in­come tax and by means of a land tax. "C nder the income tax they propose to raise £210,000. If we examine that income tax, we find it is an adjusting and an increas­ing tax, and included in it is a question of <t company tax, respecting which the State­ment savs--

" The rate of tax on the incomes of companies will be mcrea,ed and made progressive. A higher rate of tax will apply to companies controlling public utilities and monopoly companies."

V\e ha,·e to bear in mind that present con­ditions are abnormaL We see no light at present in regard to loan money, and there are some matters which were dealt with out of loan monev formerly which, on this occa­sion, must be dealt with out of ordinary rl?venue. Therefore, it is necessary to raise an amount to cover that deficit, and we pro­pose doing that by an increased income tax and a land tax. And will any member roy that the Government is not-adopting <t ~ound line of business in striving to see that the revenue for the ensuing year will cover the intended expenditure? :;\io business man would attempt to run his business, looking into the future and realising that at the end of a certain time he was going to be so many thousand pounds behind. Every com­pany prepares for eventualitiE's, and this Go­vernment has followed that line of business, and I think they are perfectly justified in doing so. I maintain there are no evidPnces of extravagance. We have heard in the speeches of hon. members on the other side that certain expenditure should not have been incurred. 'What line have Liberal Govern­ments taken in the past? Take the 1903 crisis. To meet the deficit, instead of acting as this Labour Government have done and putting the burden on those best able to bear it, they increaeed · railv .. ay rates-and '"'' find the ·Liberal partv to-da:- criticising us for doing sornething thev rlicl thctnsclves -they increased rates £138,000. They aln reducf'd endowments to local authorities by £30.000: they reduced •he hospital endow­ment from £2 to £1 lOs., and reduced the endowment to charitablp institutions. They introduced a Bill retrenching the public "' n-ants to the a::nount of £100,000. Is it right that at a time like this. when we see on ever:v hand signs of distress, when we realise that money will be hard to get, when we have from the Opposition the reminder that there are great possibiliti£'s of unem­plovment-i,, it right we should reduce? Rather we should make cYery preparation to keep men employed and to see that they get a fair return fr:r tiw labour they rPnder.

Mr. BARNr;s: That is what we say. Mr. McPHAIL: But you have not done

it in the past. You reduced men's salaries

rather than offend the particular class. bac~­ing von up and make them bear then fan share o£ the burden, •and you put the bur•den on the shouloders o£ those least able to bear it. And that is why I s<ty th\s G;ovo;rnment. is showing a spirit of humamtanamsm.

Mr. BEBBINGTON: To one class. Mr. McPHAIL: Compare the methods ~£

the late Government with the methods of thJs· Government, and I maintain that any rigf!t­thinking man will come to the conclusiOn that the methods we are adopting are more business-like and more reasonable. I am quite prepared to say that the working men are ready to support us, as they suppo.rted us on the 22nd Mav, because they realise­perhaps better than-.the ho!'· member does­the circumstances with whwh we are faced. And let me remind the leader of the Oppo­sition that the conditions to-day are even worse than on the 22nd May ; and I want to endorse what the hon. member for Maree said-that if the Liberal Government were sitting on the Treasury J:mnches to-day, things would have been ten times worse than they are. You would have treated the working class with no sympathy whatever.

Mr. BEBBINGTON : The workers in Queens­land have the best conditions in Australia.

Mr. KIRWAN: No thanks to your party. Mr. McPHAIL: This Government pro­

poses to make c<;rtain. contrib~tion~, or: in­creased contributwns, m certam directwns, and it always will stand to the_ disc!edit of the Liberal Government that m times of stress they cut down votes which should never have been cut down. We have had the experience during the last f~w .we<:ks ?£ an inquiry into one of ou~· p~bhc. u;stttutwns­an inquiry which I mamtam distmctly show:s that past Governments h':ve. be~n parsi­monious in regard to that mstitutwn. Any public institution of this kind should have all the money spent on it necessary to give all the comfort and kindliness due to those unfortunates who arc forced to be there, and the attendants called upon to look after those unfortunates should also receive th" pay due to them; and the inquiry distinctly shows 'that that institution in the past has been cramped because of the want of funds, owing to the parsimony of the late Govern­ment. It is our intention to vote further sums for the improvement of those institu­tions.

Mr. APPEL: The:: have l)(:en vot-ed already.

Mr. McPHAIL: It is all very well for the han. member to say they have already been voted. It is like the cry that they intended to give the public servants in­creases, but they did not do it. When the Labour Government came into power, I maintain that by their actions they have proved the be~t friends of the public ser­vants. In regard to education, there is also an increase. Every credit is clue to the late Minister for Education for what he did in that department. The educational system of

. Queensland is a good one. \Y e are proud of it · still there is room for Improvement. Scho~ls ar~ wanted in the outside districts. There has not been the attention given to these outside districts that there 'hould han> been: therefore, an increased vote is pro­vided for sehools in thPse particular dis­tricts, and T think ever: member will agree that that is wise exnPnditure. In regard to the State Children's Department, I main­tain that the attitude of the Government to bring the recompense to mothers up to t.h&

Mr. McPhail.]

1448 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply

same rate as foster-mothers is a wise one and a just one.

Mr. APPEL: Quite so. Mr. MoP HAIL: The han. member says

'' Quite so," but there was one han. gentle­man on the opposite side said they had no right to have it, and I say that it shows a want of " the milk of human kindnes;." 'rhose are chann8ls in which further ex­iPenditure is absolutely necessary, and I maintain that the methods the Government have adopted to meet this extra expendi­ture are wise ones and will not press too heavily upon the community generally. The Financial Statement shows that the Minister in charge, although he has not been there for very long, has a grip on the financial situation; and I belieYe that, notwithstand­ing the criticism levelled at him by the Opposition, the people of Queensland gene­rally will be well satisfied with the action that has been taken, and they will be quite prepared to commend us for the work that has been done.

Mr. APPEL: And to "foot the bill." Mr. McPHAIL : They will "foot the bill"

quite willingly, understanding the circnm­stances. There is one matter I desire to touch upon before I sit down, and that is this: The hon., member for Murrumba re­ferred to the question of the £2,000,000 refused by the Denham Government from the Federal Government. He commended them for their attitude, and said it would have been foolishness on their part to have taken such a short-dated loan-£2,000,000 for twelve month>. I find, however, that this same Government, in 1912, had a loan of £1,000,000 from the Commonwealth Govern­ment for twelve months, and at the end of the twelve months that loan was renewed. If at the end of the twelve months the £2,000,000 had been borrowed and they could not see their way to pay back that sum, terms, I suppose, would have been allowed by the F<>deral Gow;rnment, and they would have been quite prepared to n1ake an extension if necessary.

Mr. APPEL : They said they required the money, and that it would have to be repaid at the end of twelye months.

Mr. McPHAIL: The Liberal Govern­ment which was in power always had been opposed to the Federal Government, be­cause it was a Labour Government, and they did not desire to borrow that money because they had a few hundred thousands in hand, and wished to show that they were · abso­lutely independent. \V e could well do now with that £2,000,000 offered to us by the Commonwealth Government.

Mr. APPEL: The Commonwealth said they must have the money back.

Mr. McPHAIL : The Commonwealth sa.id, in the first instance, that the £1,000,000 had to be paid back at the end of twelve months, and they were able to make fresh terms at the end of that time. In the second case the Government did not give them an op­portunity, because, in a high-handed man­ner, they refused to ta.ke the loan, and I am sure they have regretted it ever since.

At fifteen minutes to 10 o'clock, The CHAIRMAN resumed the chair. Mr. McPHAIL : Reference has been made

to the fact that, in connection with the Statement, there is evidence that the Go­vernment intend to launch out into State

[Mr. McPhail.

enterprise, and I think they are to be com­mended for their action. The fact of the Government haviniT a State coalmine. from which they can s;pply their own railways, will mean a considerable saving to the State generally. I notice in to-day's paper that there are negotiations between a well-known coalowner and the Government with regard to a celebrated mine in the Bundamba dis­trict. I hope that that mine will be pur­chased, because the coal is good, and it will result in a considerable saving to the State generally.

Mr. APPEL: Why should the State· pur­chase coal areas when they have coal areas already?

Mr. McPHAIL : Then, in regard to elec. tricity, I asked a question in this House some time ago with reference to the elec­tricity on our railways, and we found 'out, as a result of the answers to those questions, that the Brisbane Tramways Company was recei,·ing a considerable revenue for light­ing the railway stations in the met-ropolitan area. I am glad to know that the Govern­ment intend establishing' an electric plant which will supply not only the metropolitan stations hut the Ipswich and other stations also, and I am quite satisfied that that will also be a good investment, and will save the Government a considerable sum of money. Reference has been made to the timber business. We understand that the Government• are making arrangements to cut their own timber and make their own furni­ture for the different departments, and also supply the timber needed for the construc­tion of buildings under the Workers' Dwel­linl!'s Act. That is a commendable act on their part, and I am quite satisfied that the reserving of Jar ge forests for the purpose of cutting timber for the State sawmills will be not only ·a benefit to the Government but will mean cheaper timber for the man who desires to build his own home.

Mr. BOOKER: Like what> happened in Western Australia.

Mr. McPHAIL: The hon. member and others always refer to other States in re­gard to State enterprises. I am quite. satis­fied, if you anal} se the St.at~ enterpnse of the different States of Australia, that, gener­ally speaking, you will find that they have all been successes, and I am satisfied that, with the class of man we have in charge of affairs in Queensland, that the State en­terprise here will also be a success. There are memben on the other si<;le who, because of private interests, would like to see these things fail. I notice that a number of rail­ways are under construction, and a number of railways have not yet been opened. The hon. member for Burnett referred to the Government having an amount of .£2,157,000 of loan money 'at the end of June, and he Rel'mNl to think that. this money was to last for ever, and that we could do all things with it. I would like to point out that the previous Government committed us to hundreds of miles of railway just prior to their leaving office, and if these ar.e to b<e carried nut it will mean that consider­ably more than £2,000,000 will be required. In fact, this money already is earmarked for railways now building, and some of it no doubt has already been spent, and there­fore it is necessary for us to borrow money to build the railways which they passed before they left office.

Mr. APPEL: Nobody is objecting to that.

Supply.; [20 OcTOBER.] Supply. 1449

Mr. McPHAIL: The han. member for Burnett did object to it, and he condemned this Government for having such a large amount to the credit of loan, and he must ·have known all the time that the £2,000,000 ·was earmarked. Those are the statements that mislead, and hon. members should be fair in tbeir cnticls!n. and sny and ·do those things which they know ar·e correct. In regard to production, the Statement says that, -::tlthough then"" ~.vtrr> fewer frctories

·operating during 1914, the aggregate of wages paid was greater than in any previ­ous year, .and the aggregate value of the

•output was also a record. That provPs that, when you pay a man well, he will give the very best of his services. There are those on the other side who, by their actions in

-:this debate, have shown that thev do not desire men to be paid well, and yet the evidence clearly shows that where men are p-aid "ell thev p:in.' a better return and ·the record of business done is greater, and so the Government are to be commended for striving, not as much as we would like, out still to the best of their abilitv with the money at their command, to increase the wages of their workmen. I congratu­late the Government upon their Statement. I believe that the country will endorse it, and I trust that, before very many months nave past, the drought which at present is raging in some portions of the State will have passed away. Already we notice that in the Central district they have had some nice rains, and I suppose members on both sides of the House are in accord with the desire to see the whole country benefit as a result of a downpour of rain, and if we get that, then things will certainly improve, .and I trust that the time is not far distant when the war clouds and the drought clouds will have past away, and when Queens· land once more will be progressing at a rapid rate under sound and sane legislation.

Mr. BOOKER (1Fide Bay): I do not intend to keep the House any length of time. I do not blame the Government for anything. It is so well known to everv bod v that it is not what the Government decide-it is the instructions they g-et from their masters at i:he Tra,des Hall. The Premier onlv a few weeks ago received his instructions on a very important business from the Trades Hall. It is just like this: It is " Does Mr. :Mulvey know, doe' iYir. Mulvey agree? " I happened to read the utterances delivered ·by Mr. Mulvey when I was discussing the Industrial Arbitration Bill and Mr. Mulvev told the Government, and told the Treasure;, who is re.sponsible for the discussion to-night, 'that havmg the Treasurer and the Govern­ment under their control they could dictate to the G?vernment anything they particu­larly desired. Knowing the Government individually and collectively, and knowing the forces outside. I can quite understand the incorporation in this Statement of class ·legislation. Then we hear from hDn. mem­·bers who have spoken that for fifty years back-the hon. member for Maree stated it-­that for fifty years back Australia has been governed by Liberals. It is well for Austra­lia and it is well for Queensland that this {)OUntry has been governed by capable busi­ness men for that period-men who in their lives have been carrying on development work in the StatP. and who have been carrying on that private enterprise that the hon. member for Bowen so forcibly objected

to the other night. Where would Queens­land be to-day? \Vould hon. members oppo­site be sitting on those comfortable benches if it was not for the men who carried on that private enterprise for the fifty years that hon. members have mentioned? There has been nothing wrong about the results of private enterprise in Australia. I do not think I can do better than quote here the Sa.vings Bank returns for the last eight years, showing that not only in Queensland, but throughout Australia, the wage-earners of Australia and the wage-earners of Queens­land have been doing remarkably well under the deplorable conditions of priYate enter­prise, when von come to consider that the great body of the people of this State are employed by private enterprise and not by the State, and it is also a well-known fact. and it has been constantly stated by hon. members opposite, that private enterprise. ninety-nine times out of 100 pay their em­ployees better wages and giye better con­ditions than the State. I quoted a case on the Addre•s in Reply where the Press organ of the workers of Australia-that is, the rail­way workers-stated that the worst employers in Australia were the Federal Labour Go­vernment. That was stated distinctly in that publication, and I h.ave not seen it contra­dicted. The wmst employers of labour in Australia were the Federal authorities. I am quoting from the " Australian Insurance and Banking Journal" of September. Speak­ing of the position of the savings banks they say-

" The total figures for the various State Savings Banks in Australia show that during the half-year ended 30th June the excess of deposits over with­drawals was £1,268,808. Interest added at 30th June amounted to £2,333,689. The total number of depositors on 30th June, 1915, was 2.011,947, and the amount­at credit, including interest, was £84.281,107. Adding the figures of the Commonwealth Bank Savings Depart­ment, a comparison with twelve months p:-eviously is as follDws:-

June 30, June 30. 1914. 1~15.

£ £ State Savings Banks 79,359,746 84,281,107 Commonwealth Sav- 4,645,268 7,420,647

ings Banks

Total ... 84,005,014 91,701,754 The increase in the total during the twelve months is £7,696,740, which fol­lows an increase of £8,756,811 during the previous twelve months. While the countrv districts have suffered from the unfavourable season, employment has been maintained, especially in the towns, by the heavy loan expenditure of the seven Australian Governments, including the war expenditure of the Common­wealth. The following is a comparison of total Savings Bank deposits in Austra­lia for the last eight years:-June 30, 1908 £46,147,472

1909 49,077 ,93g 1910 53.117.498 1911 59,393,682 1912 66,956,778 1913 75,248,203 1914 84,005,014

" 1915 91,701.754 In seven years the total has almost doubled."

What is wrong with the country? What is

llfr. Booker.]

1450 Supply. [ASSEMBLY.] Supply.

wrong with the enterprise that enabled the industrial workers to run the State and show

those splendid results? Thus it [10 p.m.] might be as well for me to state

what must be patent to every­body who knows anything about it, that the great bulk of that money that goes into the SaYings Bank of Queensland-beoouse, after all, our proportion is g-reater than that of the other States-is paid in by the industrial ,,,orker, by the wage-earner, and by the farmer who is in a small wa,v of business. The man who carries on a business does not put money into the bank, except on the rarest occasions-when he has a surplus profit a,nd wants it to earn interest. That is the best indication that the industrial condi­tions under which those people have had to live ha.ve not been too bad under private enterpnse. And when I ·hear hon. members, like the bon. member for Bowen~an hon. member whom I hold in much respect be­cau.se he is a sincere man who says wh~t he beheves. although I cannot say the same of some of my hon. friends opposite-w'hen I hc•ard him condemning private enterprise and the man who owns land, it made me want to tell him that the men who •ac­quired large estates years ago lost them and the majority of them died poor men: And I might say here that I am the son of :>. man who acquired a big freehold after his strenuous li~e •. and who dioo poor, .as the result of acqmrmg that large amount of freehold land. At that time the Government ha.d very little other resources to offer and to use t<J carry on the business of the country. When the big movement for land aliena­tion took place in Queensland, there was no money in the Treasury, •and it was not oo easy to borrow in London as it has since I:J;'come. and the Government of that time md nothing else to do but to sell their lands. And an hon. member representing one of tne Darling Downs seats has told the Com­:qittee that land there is purchasable •at £1 ~Os., the price. t~at was originally given for It, and the Mmister knows that that is oo, or ought to know it. Anyhow, the pro­"ess of acquiring land from the State at that time was a fair exchange. The man who had the money, or borrowed the money, was able to pay the Crown for it; ;md it was then-and has been since-unfortunate for t~e. ~nterprising men, who, through the VICISSitudes of the seasons, the low prices of ;;tock, and impossible conditions as to mar­ket, carried the burden that broke them down. And in another way the Government are on the road to break down the men who are carrying the burden to-dav-the men who are ca~rying the bnr·den of providing food for the people of Queensland. What is to be the result? It is not going to be , what the Govt'rnment set out to do--reduce the cost of living-but it is going to send up the cost of living. You can only give the people cheap food_ by producing; and I ask, Are any of our friends on the other side pro­ducing th.at cheap food? They have had the pleasure of consuming some of the cheap butter, bu.tter that was sold at below cost, butter which cost the producer a great deal more to make than he got for it. For the iast two afternoons and evenings the only part 'Yhich has been played by hon. members opposite has b~en the part o.f condemning prrvate enterprise and everythmg that mem­bers on this side are associated with-namely, the producing interests-that is the only part which the great majority of members oppo­site who have spoken have taken up. A

[Mr. Booker.

great deal has been said about the financial position and the difficulty the Government would ha.ve to carry on without any further tax:ttion. So far, there has been a good deal of innuendo from members on the other side that, when hon. members on this side question the necessity for further taxation, it is a want of patriotism-it is a matter of war conditions which is involved. This Chamber has nothing whatcvc:c to do with providing money for war purpos.cs. (Hear, hear!) It is the Federal authonties who are handling war matters in their entirety. As a Parliament, we are not helping the Fodera! authorities one bit, although the AdministratiDn should be doing so, so far as lies in their power. But we. as taxpayers, are finding th<) money to enable the Feder?-! authorities to do that, and not one man m the countrv has any objection to providing that monev for a specific purpo6P.-for war purposes. ·But the taxation indicated. in this Financial Statement is for domestic pur­poses; and, as the bon. mern ber f<;>r Mur­rumba so ably and e.ptly and lucidly. ~x­plained, there is a g<.'neral trend of w1ltul waste right through the Goyernment's P.ro­posale.. As a mattPr of fact. m a casual kmd of wav-without meaning to be at all offen­sive-the Secretary for Agriculture only within the last few days has mvolved the· country to the tune of a considerable amount of money.

The SECRETARY FOR AGRIOcLTURE: How· much?

Mr. BOOKER: The bon. member would interest me very much if he would lay the· amount on the table, say, to-morrow. I do· not disagree with th~ Mi!lister p~ere, because· I think if I were m his positiOn I would have called a conference, but it would have been a different kind of conference from that which he called. I might have had three· representatives of the great sugar industry, the most reliable agricultura.l chemist I could have secured, the man with the widest knowledge as a grower, and th~n the most reliable man in the manufacturmg part of the industry. I would have had three ~en instead of sixty. Nevertheless, I am with the hon. the Minister in his endeavour to get to the bottom of the economic conditions of the sugar industry. In anything that he can do to help the growers and the industry I am with him. I do not think I can do better than read a few lines from the same authoritv I quoted before, touching upon the financial condition of Australia, and the many difficulties that the Government wW find in getting the money they think they will get, at a reasonable rate of interest. This is, perhaps, one of the strongest and most effective articles I have seen on the financial position in Australia. The "Austra­lasian Insurance and Banking Record " says-

" Since last November the loan expen­diture of the States has been largely financed by advances made by the Commonwealth based upon the expan­sion of the issue of inconvertible notes. Assuming for the sake of argument that it was legitimate to make this use· of the note iMue, it is plain that a smaller prog:ra mme of expenditure would have enabled the notes to be spread over a longer period than is actually possible. As it is the arrangement will reach its limit about next ::'-Jon;mber, so that instead of using this resource with care, which might have enabled it to last:

Supply. [20 OCTOBER.] Su,pply. 1451

thr<mghout the war, the States are p;a1Joping through the money in twelve Inonths.''

I will just stay here to make a passing refer­ence to the comment that the money will be gallop0d away in twelve months. The hon. member on the other side who just a short time ago resumed his seat, made a very very severe stricture on the late Government-the lat0 Tre:ducer partic>u!arly-because he did not accept from the Federal Government last year the loan of £2,000,000. When a colossus of finance deaJs with a matter which has been pretty well worn threadbare for the last fifteen months, then I think it is hardly necessary to add much. But I can only say that it would have been a disastrous thing for the late Government-and conse­quently for the present Government-if the late Treasurer had a.ccepted that loan. It would have matured in November of next year, and that would have been another obligation for the present Government to meet, another provision for them to make. The late Government saved the present Government from a very serious obligation. Let me go on-

" Between the States' expenditure a.nd the use of the notes by the Commonwealth Government itself for the railway to Western Australia, the total amount of the note issue will be raised to about forty-five or forty-six millions, which the Commonwealth leaders are understood to recDgnise as representing the full limit consistent with any prudence.

"Hopes appear to have been enter­ta.ined that the British Government would be prepared to change its policy and to aseist the States with monev for public works. The grounds for these hopes are not very obvious. The British Government has expressed its views over <1nd over again, and after giving many refusals of permission to British muni­cipalities to borrow for improvements, and requ<>sting English banks to dis­courage- their ('Ustomers from borrowing for building purposps unconnected with the war, it could not consistently reverse its policy by itself providing money for Australia. Direct borrowing in the Lon­·don market bv the Australian States would be exceedingly difficult, if not alto­gether impossible, especially in view of the fact that England is now looking tn America. If an Allied loan is issued in New York, in addition to the Cana­dian a.nd other borrowings which have already been effected there, it is improbable that Australian securities would receive much attention from the _\.merican investor."

Now, I have read the utte~rances of the Pre­mier to the effect that this matter is under consideration, that some other matter is under consideration, a.nd that the matter of borrowing in America is under consideration. Is the leader of the Government a wiser authority than the editor of this paper? If the hon. member made inquiries from his financial advisers-probably he has already­he would find out what the editor of this paper, this fina.ncial journal, has stated, that the Premier of QuePnsland has no hope­BuckJ.,y's hope-of getting any money what­ever from America.

The PREMIER : That is all you know e.bout it.

Mr. BOOKER: Mr. McKenna stated in nw House of Commons a short time ago that the British Government were only abl~ to get million when they wanted consider­ably more, and that the rate of interest was 5~ per c~nt. We have heard members on the oth<'f sidE say that if the Labour party had been in power when the art'angements were marle for the loans maturing in June last year, the.,: would have saved tho State, tlwusands of pounds. :More utter rot I can­not conceive>. because they would have had to do their business through the same chan­n<>l as the late Government did theirs, and t~ have consulted the same financial ad­visers. To say that they would have done anything different is enough to make the angels weep. It has been the policy of the Labour pa,rty to do the business of the State, without b01:rowing. They have won t!;e support of many a hard worker by then· plat,forrn of non-borrowing. An unfortunate man who has borrowed and has gone down may hnve a, feeling that the State will do so too if it borrows, and so he supports the Labour party in their policy of non-borrow­ing. Referring now to another matter,. I would remind han. members that a umon supporter of the party ou~side made an l}n· seemly display at .a functw? connected w1th the party by refusmg to drmk to the health of the King, When a man so far forgets hims<?lf on an occasion like that as to sho~ that he is lacking in a sense o~ responsl­bilitv. what hope is there for h1m? That mano is t<J-dav the organising ,secretary of the Clerks' Union, and he is privileged' under legislation which we are passing to go into any public office in the State and waste the time of public officers organising the cierks. He can go into any man's business office and do likewise. Do members on the other siclE of the House endorse Mr. Foat? There is silence! "li\Thv have they not the courage to tell the p(wple of Queensland that thev do not endorse him? Does the, hon mm1bPr for Brisbane endorse him?

Mr KmwA~: No, I do not.

:!\1r. BOOKER: I appreciate the courage of the han. member for Brisbane. I assume that the occupants of the Treasury bench' are in accord with the sentiments of Mr. Foat?

The PREMIER: Do you get any satisfac.tiou out of that? You are a very hare-bramed individual if you do.

Mr. BOOKER: The han. gentlem.an ha.d an opportunity to deny syn:pathy w1th th1s man, but he failed to accept 1t. I am please.d to sen from the Financial Statement that 1t iB the intention of the Government to go as far as they can in connection with the de­velopment of tho mining resou;c~s o.f tho, StatP. At a time like this the mmmf.! mdus· try should be helped in every P'?ssible way. In Australia, and more part:cularly m Queensland, it has been found m the past that 'vhenever the country fell into a posi­tion of strain and stress, the mining indus-, try came along and helped the State out of her difficulty. Anything . the . Governme!lt may do to assist the n:mmg mdustry w1ll materially help the ra1lway rev.:;nue .. In 1903 the Government did a very w1se thmg, and subsequently thev did a wiser thing when they acted on the policy of Sir Robert Philp and built railways into mining fields. Those railways have done an immense amount of good. not only for people interested in min­ing but also for the State at large. Them, ha\.'e been heavy losses of stock caused by

Mr. Booker.]

]452 Supply. LASSEl\1BLY.] Supply.

+he drought of the last· four years, and if we do not get rain within the next few mDnths those lossE-s will be still greater, <>nd there will be less wool and live stock to ·carry on our railways. and a number c;f men will be thrown out of employment m the pastoral indus~ry. If the G~vernment pr_o­

,ceed with rarlway construction, that wrll afford a means ot giving work to those un-

-employed, and I am glad to see that it is the policy of the Government t-o do as Sir Robert Philp did. What is it that has enabled them to do that? It is the policy of the late

·Government in carrying railways into min­ing fields. The policy of railway construction pursued by the late Government is saving

-the situation for members who now occupy the Treasury benches. ·when the drought was on in 1901 and 1902, and our financi-al -difficulties were as bad as they could be, Sir Robert Philp, who was then largely direct·

.ing the affarrs of Queensland, l:tid down the policy of providing employment for the peo­ple as far as was possible, and it was his -endeavour at that time to keep the people employed that involved the State in a

· dE'ficit of £500,000; and. instPad of con­-demning the Government of that day for having done that, the present Government

•·should applaud them. because their action has given them the m1e as to what the pre­sent Government should do at this par­ticular time. If we were submitting the same Financial StatPment, with the excep· tion of the increased taxation proposals, membeN oppo,ite would receive it with the bitterest oppo,ition. They are to-day giving the people of Queensland the best element of

·-our policy with the element of confiscation which has been forced upon them from out­side. The statement has been made by the Minister for Railways that the rolling-stock is not sufficient to carrv on the business of the department. That is a very grave reflec­·tion on the managers of the railwa:ys: '!.'he

·.Commissioner occupies a position free from political control, and he prides himself upon the condition of his rolling-stock and the work he has done to keep tbat rolling-stock up to the mark. The Commissiom,r has

·done famous work in building up the rolling­stock and keeping it in the best condition possible, and I am sure that a return show­ing the amount of money spent on rolling­stock during the last three years would be interesting- reading. If the present occu­pants of the Treasury bench spend the same amount on rolling-stock during the next three :years, and spend it in the same effective way, I shall appreciate the fact, because it -will mean th<>t the railways will progress and progress. We have heard something from one hon. member about cattle kings

c and wool kings, and he might h-ave added coal kings.

Mr. COLLIN~ : And copper kings.

Mr. BOOKER: Yes. And I would say -political kings, for if there is a king in this country, he is not the {)attle king, or th.-. wool king, or the coal king; he is the political king-what we know as ''the poli­

·tical boss " ; and it is as certain as that I am standing here that, if there is anything which will make for the restriction and sup­pression of enterprise, it is the legislation which has been forced upon the Government by their political bosses. I say • " forced upon the Government," because I give some

'hon. members of the Ministrv credit for knowing that the great bulk of the legisla­

ction that has so far been introduced by ·them is legislation that they themselves, as

[Mr. Boo/;er.

ecnsible and steady men, feel is not in the interest of the country at large, but only in the interest of one set of persons. Is there any Bill which is in any sense a Bill dealing with industrial matters that doe,q not contain the vicious principle of honorary inspectors? {Hear, hear!) Is there one measure which does not give power to those men who are battening on the industrial life of the community. Every day the Press that is behind the Government contains men­dacity and misstatements, and flouts their power before Parliament and the . people. There is not one journal supportmg the Labour party that does not deliberately mis­represent e.very debate that takes place in this Chamber by twisting words or drop­ping out statements. I have read some of the leaderettes and paragraphs and reports in those papers with regard to debates that have taken place in this House, and though I have listened very carefully to the ~e­bates, I have not been able to re,ogmse them from the reports. I am pleased to see the reference here to the linking up of

the Central and Northern rail­[10.30 p.m.] way systems. That should have

been done long ago. From an economy point of view, the saving to the Railway Department will be enormous .. ~he exchange of rolling-stock, and the shrftmg of sheep vans .and cattle waggons fro_m_ ~h& Central division to the Northern diVIsiOn will save many thousands of pounds a year. The Government are wise in their gener::­tion in bringing that about. I take this opportunity of giving credit to the man who was responsible for this. That was the late member for Gregory, who is now Min­ister for Mines. I regret that he is out of this Chamber, but he is doing good ""£k elsewhere. (Hear, hear !) To the late mem­ber for Gregory I convey my appreciation.

The SECRETARY FOR PUBLIC LANDS : YOU are improving.

Mr. BOOKER : There has been a great deal said in connection with the robbery­! cannot call it by any other term-frC?m .the farmers of their butter. T)>e be•t mdrca­tion of the general prosperity of the man on the land and the men in the cities is to see their homes. Any hon. member who travels out west and sees t~e homes o_f t.he people out there will see, m the maJOrity of cases that farmers and other men on the land ar~ growing cheap food for t)>e people in the cities, and. at t-he same time, , t.hey are living under hard and harsh cond1t10ns themselves. (Hear, hear!) Why? Not that they like to do it. The hon. member on the. front bench smiles. The hon. member o-ets £1 000 a year, and his mode of life is better than when he was drawing £100. A man provides comforts for his wi-fe and family ·according to his means. . If the man on the land had the same finanmal resources as the man in the cities. he would have the same splendid homes that they have, be­cause the same heart is in the bosom of the man on the land as in the man in the citv, a,nd he likes to give his wife and family th.:i best comforts that he can afford. (Hear, hear!) You know, Mr. Coyne, that there are many perRons living in your c;wn di~­trict who have not got· the palatral reSI· dences that the workers in the cities have g·ot. Look Rt the homes of +he workers in Brisbane ! They have exceptional sur':ound­ings. They have the water and gas lard on, and the Government are going to give them electric light, 'and a sewerage system and

Supply• [21 OcTOBER.] Brands Bill. 145$

cheap food-all at the expense of the un· fortunate man in the country. It is a pathetic circumstance, but hon. members opposite can joke and laugh at the misery of one set of persons to the advantage of another set of persons. I cannot under· stand thu policy oi my friends opposite. They are trying to throw dust in the eyes of the people. Their troubles about the man who is battling along outside and who lives under hard .and harsh conditions-much harder than the people in the cities. They are more concerned about the city vote, where there is a large congregation of people. It is so much easier to get .tmong the city people and organise them and raise their passionb and their selfishness at the expense of the people who live outside. 'l'he people outside are not organised; they have not got the time to organise. They have not got the time to talk politics. That is why the men on the land have been penalised so much since hon. members oppo· site have got control of affairs in this coun· try. The man in the country is living under hard and harsh conditions, and is being penalised in every way.

Mr. COLLINS : You cannot blame this Go­vernment for that.

Mr. BEBBINGTON : Yes; your Government stole our butter. (Laughter.)

Mr. BOOKER: In olden times we used to heat about "the fat . man." vVe have only one type of fat man on this side, and he is rc<tsonably coyered because of his happy disposition and his entire desire to sene the people in ~he most generous way. The fat rr•en are all on the other si·de. (Laugh· tcr.) T remind the hon. member for Oxley, who is interjecting, that he is not helping to fatt>'ll anybody now, because the present price of bacon will not permit the average man to feed on the most relishable part of the animal-namely, the rasher of bacon for breakfast, and the ham sandwich for lunch. We at·c denied that privilege now, and by whom? By the bacon ring in Queensland, of whom the hon. member for Oxlev is the chi~£. (Laughter.) The hour is getting late, and, as I will haYe other opportunities of referring t.o matters that appear in the Statemont, I will put my notE's away. I only wish some of my hon. friends opposite would go into the country and see the condi­tion 0f things there, instea;d of staying here and enjoying thn luxuries that this place gives them. I spend mv week-ends in the country, and I am sure that my hon. friends opposite would be better employed if they also went into the country and saw the burdens that the man on the land is carry· mg. If they -'lid that, they would be ho\.d­ing their hands in regard to many of their proposals. \Vhen they realise how grave the position is. they will hold their hands, I a,m sure. There is time enough to take the drastic action the Government propose to take in many of their proposals here. It is a ra,re thing to see a Minister go beyond the railway into his own electorate or out­side of B1:isbane at the week-end. If they would only go up to the Darling Downs they would see men there trying to save the situation. They wou\.d see members from this side going to their own farms, trying to save them. Hon. members opposite do not see that, otherwise they would not bring forward some of their present proposals.

T'he House resumed. The CHAIRMAN re· ported progress, <tnd the Committee obtained lea,ve to sit again to-morrow.

TOOWO::\'G PARK BILL.

CoNSIDER.\TION IN CoJU:'IIITTEE OF CouxcrL'S A}IEND~1ENT.

(Jir. Coyne, 1T'arrcgo, in the chair.)

The SECRETARY FOR PUBLIC LANDS, explained that the Council had made a sli.ght amendment in the Bill to cover a clencal. error. He moYed that the Council's amend­ment be a greed to.

Questio!! put and passed.

The House resumed. The CHAIR}!A:<1 re­ported that the Committee had agreed to' the Council's amendment; the report was., adopce.d, and the Bill was ordered to be· returned to the Leg·islative Council by mesoage in the usual form.

The Hou£e adjourned at f.cventeen minutes. t<> 11 o'clock.