fire brigades union

FBU – Pensions Update

Fire Brigades Union

Update on pension

proposals

Membership consultation Intro - 2012, - decision to take full and active part in the NPA

Review and the Opt Out review and,

Dependent on the outcomes and the government’s responses, the FBU would then determine our next steps

Those two reviews have now concluded so we are now at the critical stage of the campaign


Membership consultation EC met in February and agreed to: • Immediately consult with members and initiate meetings

(Brigade / Branch / Mass / Open)• We must have a consistent approach

• Lobbying MPs• Head Office attending regions• Speakers Notes/PowerPoint Presentation• Circulars and bulletins


Membership consultation

Going to cover 4 phases of campaign so far:

1. Where we have been 2. Where we are currently 3. What are we currently doing4. What next


Where have we been Initially coordinated with other unions (TUC)

• TUC agreed to go to scheme specific talksFBU disagreed with this – very confident we had

strong arguments re FRS schemesKey points

• Normal Pension Age (NPA) • Increased employee contributions

Our position- the proposals were: • Unsustainable, Unacceptable, Unworkable & Unfair


Where have we been FBU campaignEvidence based case

• Actuaries – experts in their field• Medicine / Occ. health – Academics / Professors

Lobbied Politically • provided MP’s briefings• EDM 2049

Consulted consistently with Members via;• Circulars• Briefings / 8 special pension bulletins • YouGov surveys


• High level talks – Fire Minister, CLG– Some movement - but not enough

• Delay in setting the cost ceiling = increased by 5%• 50% reduction in Year 1 contributions– this was

uniqueGovernment then agreed to:• Detailed review of opt outs

• Data collection• Face to face (Research Works) and Scottish

questionnaire • This review – also unique


Where have we been

Where have we been Other Unions are now in the Phase 2 stage of

their pension campaigns, the FBU are:• Only beginning – big fight ahead• We always knew our campaign would come to a

head in early 2013 when:• Both reviews were due (NPA & Opt Out) • Year 2 contribution Increase announced

• FBU Confident in our substantive evidence produced and arguments made


Where have we been NPA review:• Proposed by the National Employers • Review paid for by Government• Fire Minister appointed NPA Chair - Dr Tony Williams• FBU were Employees’ side rep• James Dalgleish, (HR LFB) Employers side rep

FBU only organisation to submit evidence to NPA Review.

Detailed evidence submitted.N.B. Williams’ review – not ours


Where have we been • Key that the NPA review took account of physical nature

of our occupation• Terms of Reference - agreed by all

1.To consider if age 60 was an appropriate NPA

2.Reasonable expectation that scheme members can work to, and retire at scheme’s proposed NPA


Where have we been The FBU• Set up our own NPA working Group• Researched all references to firefighter fitness and NPA

– UK and abroad• Developed arguments – experts, civil servants, ministers

employers and politicians• Throughout the full process No evidenced counter

arguments


Where have we been Tactics Utilised:• Evidenced based arguments• Already moved government• Different approach to other unions• Industrial Action alone has not worked• Others have already settled• Evidence to support any necessary action• Done more than others • Different timescale


Where are we nowContribution Increases• Opts out reviews finished• Part 1 Opt Out ‘numbers’ – Government saying their

assumed 1% opt out figure is still correctWe believe low numbers due to:• Members following FBU’s advice to to ‘stay in’ + the 50%

reduction on Year 1’s proposed increase• Part 2 and Scottish questionnaire• Research Works - Members attitudes: • Figures show increase in opt outs are seriously being

considered


Where are we nowContribution increases• To date, No indication of any reduction on Year 2

contribution increasesAssume Government position is:2013 - Year 2 • full proposed amount (1.3% FPS and 0.8% NFPS)• Higher tiers for higher earners• Increases justified as ‘Opt Outs’ still within their own

predicted levels of 1%


Where are we nowFBU warn• The number of opt outs wont raise savings sought • Professional advice – if Opt Outs are as high as surveys

predict it will result in cash flow problems, deficits in the schemes

• YouGov 2012 survey shows likely Opt Outs up from 27% to 54% - Scottish Fire Service survey shows this figures as high as 74%


Where are we nowNPA review report released in Jan 2013:

• Broadly supports FBU position• Does not support NPA of 60• Suggests that it may be attainable for future • Based on untried, untested, uncosted ideas• Moves away from govt policy on localism


Where are we now• FRS’s to provide advice to those recruited at 42VO2 -

recommended standard (NFST)- they will need to improve their fitness, make lifestyle changes or they wont reach NPA of 60

• Recommends option to retire from 55 - with actuarial reduction from NPA – no further details given

• Additional protection for FPS – no further details given• Review suggests 51% current firefighters between 50-54

below recommended fitness standard• Review suggests 66% current firefighters between 55-59

below recommended fitness standard


Where are we nowReview states:• Significant numbers of firefighters would be unable to

maintain required fitness standard to age 60, as such: 1.Forced to leave without pension 2.Dismissed on capability

• Women disproportionately affectedGovernment trying to spin that:• Firefighters are fitter than the general population – claim

made on limited evidence (4 out of 57 FRAs)• Report acknowledges previous studies say firefighters

are no fitter than the general population


Where are we nowReport states:• Stn Manager and above can maintain fitness until 60 • Flawed claim - based on acceptance of lower fitness

requirement for SM roles and above• Majority of FRS’s use same fitness level for SM’s and

above as firefighters• No agreed fitness standard for FF’s or S/M’s and above• FRS employers are not seeking this change


Where are we nowGovernment spin relating to report

Best case scenario only:• 15% of FF’s unfit by age 55 & 23% unfit at age 60 Figures are Flawed because:• Based utilising the higher entry standard of 47 VO2

N.B. This is not the real situationUsing the current entry standard of 42 VO2 (NFST) • 51% of FF’s unfit at age 50-54 & 66% at age 55-60


Current position• Significant numbers wont be able to maintain

required fitness level – leave without pension or capability dismissal

• Women firefighters will be disproportionally affected

• Reverse 20+ years of progress on equality within the FRS


Where are we now

• Legislation – going through the process (HoC & HoL) • FBU attempted for NPA clause amendment

• Asking for flexibility • Went through commons - no vote, resisted all way• Proposed in the Lords – moved by lord Kennedy• Met Lord Newby – Bill sponsor from treasury (Lib Dem)

• Recognised arguments – no counter arguments• Lords did not support


• Raising concerns with ministers and others

• Considering possible legal challenges

• CLG – still considering government response

• Informed them their interpretation is flawed

• Letters to Fire Ministers, Scotland, NI and Wales– Letter - Roseanna Cunningham to Brandon Lewis


What are we currently doing

Currently:

• No indication of any movement from government• Fire Minister’s letter states:

• 60 is ‘attainable’ – not ‘appropriate’

Remembering the ToR of the NPA review stated:• To consider if age 60 was an appropriate NPA


What are we currently doing

Next stepsFBU:• Awaiting official government response to NPA review• Awaiting official response Year 2 contributions• Public Service Pensions Bill – is proceeding

Government may:• Ignore all of our arguments & their own review and push

on with NPA and Contribution increases• That position is unacceptable to us


Next StepsOur position on the ‘Proposed Scheme’ must be that it

is: • Affordable• Sustainable • Fair

NPA: must take account of the physical nature of occupation & scheme members should reasonably expect to work to and retire at NPA

Current proposals don't do this


Next stepsUnacceptable because:• Significant numbers of firefighters may have to leave

without access to a pension or face dismissal on capability

• Currently - 66% of 55-60 year olds below recommended fitness standards

Evidenced by the FBU, Professionals and by their own NPA Review findings


Next stepsConference decisions2011Annual Conference - Continue negotiations, explore

all avenues, lobby, look at legal challenges – if campaign is not successful prepare for national strike action

2012 Special Conference EC Policy Statement - Pensions

• FBU made it clear to ministers we would initiate strike action if not sufficient progress on negotiations or there was imposition

• Conference supported taking full and active part in the two reviews (NPA & Opt Out) prior to balloting


Next steps2013 Position – 2 reviews concluded – no indication of

government moving their position;• Prepare to ballot for strike action

• Evidenced reasons why the current position is not acceptable – our own and theirs

• FBU have utilised professionals – Professors, Academics / experts in their field (Pensions / Medical)

• Their review – We can’t let them ignore its findings


Next steps2013 Position – doing nothing is not an option

• No scaremongering, no spinning, no false promises,• Realistic expectations – massive fight ahead, FBU will

continue lobbying • There are risks of division – protection offered / differing

schemes• Bigger risk if don’t take action• Crunch time – mass meetings needed prepare members

for a ballot for strike action


Questions?


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