episode 3.10 a trickle of ladies with amber nash

Secret Feminist Agenda Transcript

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Episode3.10ATrickleofLadieswithAmberNashDecember7,2018

Hannah(Host): 00:06 [Music:"MeshShirt"byMomJeans]Hi,I'mHannahMcGregorandthisisSecretFeministAgenda.AndnowthatNovemberisoverbylogicalextension,wecanconcludethatitisDecember.We'redoingitfolks,we'recountingforwardthroughmonthsinsequentialorder.Whichmaybeforsomeofusisabettertimeofyearandmaybeforothersisharder.Iknowthattheholidaysarereallycomplicatedtime,andinhonorofthatcomplication,IhavejustresharedandaddedsomenewtunestomySadChristmasJamsplaylistonSpotify,whichIwilltotallylinktointhisepisode.AndmaybeIwillalsosharewithyouthatIamtryinghardthisyeartouseDecemberasanopportunitytoslowdownanddoalittlebitofreflectingonthisyear,andthinkalittlebitaboutwhatIwantnextyeartolooklike.Iknowthatthatisaprettystandardapproachtothenewyear,andIalsoknowthatthatapproachcanoftenbetiedintoreallytoxicideasofselfimprovement.ButIalsofeellike,especiallybecause,youknow,workingatauniversity,myyearischartedaroundthe,sortof,youknow,thebreakovertheholidays,thesekindsoflike,structuredmeasuresoftime.Itstillisanopportunityformetoslowdownalittlebit,thinkaboutwhatIaccomplished,revisitwhatIprioritize,thinkformyselfabouttowhatdegreethoseweretherightpriorities,andwhatIwant2019tolooklike.Andrightnow,cuzI'mstillcomingoffthatwildlybusyNovember,IkindoffeellikeIwant2019tolooklikeaverylongnap,butprobablyI'llhavetodothings.It'snotgoingtobealessbusyyear,butitmightbeamorebalancedyearifIcangetmyshittogether.Anyway,Idefinitelyneedtogodrinkanothercoffee.Sohere'swhatwe'regonnado.I'mgonnagomakesomecoffeewhileyoulistentothisepisode.Shh.It'snothowtimeorpodcastswork,butgowithit.It'stimetomeetAmber.AmberNash.JoshisbestknownforbeingthevoiceofPamPooveyonFXX'sanimatedcomedyArcher.She'sanactorandimproviserthatcanbeseenonstagejustabouteveryweekendinherhometownofAtlanta,Georgia,wheresheliveswithherhusbandandweirddog,Carol.AmberandImetoverSkypetochataboutfeminism,andimprov,andvoicework,andtragically,notatallherweirddogCarol,butitwasagreatconversationandyou'regoingtoenjoyit.SoI'mgoingtogoputthekettleon,youlistentothis.[Music:"VoodooLady"byWeen]

Hannah(Host): 03:04 Iliketorecordeverybodyonaseparatedevice,ideallyroutedthroughsixorsevendifferentprograms.


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Amber: 03:29 Soundsgreat.

Hannah(Host): 03:29 Becausethatwaythere'sthemostpossiblewaysthingscouldfail,andfailure'saimportantfeministact.Iliketoopenupmyselfasmuchpotentialforitaspossible.

Amber: 03:44 Sure,sure.

Hannah(Host): 03:44 Thankyousomuchforagreeingtochatwithme.

Amber: 03:48 Ofcourse!I'mexcited!

Hannah(Host): 03:48 WhatIwouldreallylovetochatwithyouabouttoday.Imean,it'sapodcastaboutfeminism.

Amber: 03:55 Right.

Hannah(Host): 03:55 SoI'mgoingtomakeyoutalkaboutfeminismifyou'recomfortablewiththat.

Amber: 03:59 Sure.

Hannah(Host): 04:00 Thereal,therealscopeofthepodcastistalkingabouthowfeminismplaysoutinpeople'severydaylives.

Amber: 04:07 mmhmm.

Hannah(Host): 04:07 Andsospecifically,Ireallyliketalkingtopeoplewhoworkinreallydifferentfields--

Amber: 04:13 Okay.

Hannah(Host): 04:13 --aboutthewayithasorhasnotplayedintothekindofworkyoudo.SoIwantustocomearoundeventuallytotalkingaboutArcherandaboutasortoffeministpoliticsofthecharacteryouplayonArcher.

Amber: 04:26 Okay.

Hannah(Host): 04:26 ButI'dreallyliketostartbytalkingalittlebitabouttheworldofimprov.

Amber: 04:31 Okay.

Hannah(Host): 04:32 Soyouare,youareanimproviserbytraining.


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Amber: 04:35 That'sright.That'showIgotintoentertainmentatallinthefirstplace.

Hannah(Host): 04:39 Andwhat,whatdrewyoutoimprovinthefirstplace?

Amber: 04:42 Iwas,Iwasstudyingpsychology,soIwasgettingadegreeinpsychologyand,Ikindofgrewupinaveryconservative,veryreligiousfamilywhereentertainmentwasn'treallyanoptionforacareerpath.Soitwasn'treallyanythingthatIeverthoughtthatIwouldbeabletodo.SoitwasneverreallyanythingthatIpursued.Imean,Ididlike,Ididlikedramainhighschoolanddidlike,youknow,aschoolplay.AndIwasalwaysalikeaclassclown,becausethat'showImadefriendsgrowingup.SoIwasincollegeandIwaslikereallyboredandIwasn'tbeingparticularlychallenged.Iwasstudyingbiology,whichwascompletelywrong,andthenIfinallyswitchedtostudyingpsychologyandthat'swhatIgotmydegreein.Andafriendofminewaslike,"Hey,haveyoueverheardofthisthingcalledimprov?AndinAtlanta,Georgia,cuzyou'reanEdmonton,right?

Hannah(Host): 05:31 No,I'mfromEdmonton.I'mnotfromEdmonton,that'salie.IwasinEdmontonuntilrecently.IliveinVancouvernow.

Amber: 05:38 Okay,great.

Hannah(Host): 05:39 Yeah.

Amber: 05:39 AndinCanadaIfeellike,especiallyIthink,IthinkyoungpeopleareexposedtoImprovsomuchearlier.Likeit'slikeasportinhighschool,IfeellikeinCanada.

Hannah(Host): 05:47 Yeah.Yeah.No,Ifeellikeit'sathingthatlike,everywhitedudenamedMikewhoIknowdoesImprov.

Amber: 05:54 Sure.Yeah,yeah.InAtlantainthe90s,especiallywhenIstarted,likeitwasn'tathing,so,somanypeopledidn'treallyevenknowwhatitwas.AndsoafriendtookmetoseeanimprovshowandIsignedupthatnight.AndIneverstoppeddoingimprov,becauseitwasjustlike,itwaslikesofreeingandI'dneverseenanythinglikeit.Anditwasn't,therewasnothingaboutitthatwaspretentiousorscaryandyouknow,theysoldbeerinbucketsandsoIjustkindoffellinlovewithitimmediately.

Hannah(Host): 06:22 Justtoclarify,isthatbottlesofbeerinabucketorjustafull,abucketentirelyfullofbeer?


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Amber: 06:28 [Laughs]Notjustabucketofbeer!Bottlesofbeerinabucket.

Hannah(Host): 06:28 Okay.Okay,cool.Justchecking.

Amber: 06:33 [Laughs]Goodclarification.

Hannah(Host): 06:33 IwaslisteningtoaninterviewwithGlenWeldonthismorning,ofPopCultureHappyHour.

Amber: 06:39 Yeah?

Hannah(Host): 06:39 Whohashisundergraduateandmarinebiology.

Amber: 06:43 Oh,mygod.

Hannah(Host): 06:43 Likewhat'supwithalloftheseentertainersstartingoffbywantingtobescientists?

Amber: 06:48 Iknow,it'ssoweird.IhadthisreallyamazingscienceteacherwhenIwasinmiddleschoolandIwaslike,"Iwanttobeabiologist."AndthenIwaslike,"I'mnotcutoutforthis."[Laughs]

Hannah(Host): 06:56 I,like,didyouwanttobeabiologistbecauseleaveswerecool,orbecauseyouwantedtohugadolphins?

Amber: 07:01 Iwantedtobelike,inthePeaceCorpsandlike,travelaroundandlike,youknow,likebeadirtyhippieandlike,saveanimals.

Hannah(Host): 07:08 [Laughs]That'sgreat.That'ssospecific.Iwantedtofightpeoplefortrees.

Amber: 07:16 Right.

Hannah(Host): 07:18 Great.Great.So,soimprov,atthatpointinyourlife,wasit,wasitthedifferencefromstudyingpsychology?Likewasit,wasitasortofnightandday,ordoyouthinkthattherewassomethingaboutpsychology,andimprov?Likewerethereconnectionsthereforyou?

Amber: 07:31 IthinkearlyonIdon't,Ididn'trealizewhattheconnectionswere.IthinkIjustneededacreativeoutlet,becauseIwaslike,studyingscienceinschoolandIneeded,Ineededtoperform,Ithink.Ijustdidn'trealizewhatthatwasyet.AndlateronafterIgotmydegree,Istartedworkingasacounselorwithteenagers,andthat'swhereIreallywasabletobringinalotofwhatI'dlearnedinimprovtotheworldofpsychologyandkindofmash


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themup.ButatthebeginningIdidn'tquiterealizewhatitwas,butobviouslyIwasbeingdrawntoboththesethings,youknowwhatImean?Sotherewassomethingthere.

Hannah(Host): 08:00 Yeah.Yeah.Imeanitmakesmethinkrightawayofhow,howoftenpsychology,orbeingpsychologized,that'showyousay,itishumiliating.

Amber: 08:12 Yeah.

Hannah(Host): 08:12 Likethe,the,thedemands.Ihavebeenaskedbypsychologiststodothingslike,likespeak,pretendthatyouryoungerselfissittingonthischair.Whatwouldyousaytothem?

Amber: 08:22 Right!

Hannah(Host): 08:22 Like,thereisareallyimprovisationaldimensiontoitaswellasareallyimportantdrivetotakeyourselflessseriously.

Amber: 08:31 Totally.Yeah.Ineverthoughtofthatbefore,butyou'resoright.That'ssotrue.Whereyou'relike,okay,I'mgoingtodothisweirdthingthatIdon'tfeelcomfortabledoing,butsomehowit'sgoingtohelpme.[Laughs]

Hannah(Host): 08:41 [Laughs]Yeah.Yeah.Andalongtheway,IhavetomaybetakereallypowerfulsensesofwhoIamandputthosetothesideforamomentinordertoplayaroundwithwhoImightbeotherwise.

Amber: 08:53 Right,right.

Hannah(Host): 08:54 Great.Sodoyoudoanyjustrecreationalhobbypsychologythesedays?

Amber: 08:59 Idon'tactually,otherthanlikebeingintherapy.[Laughs]

Hannah(Host): 09:04 [Laughs]Yeah.Everybody'sfavoriterecreationalpsychology.

Amber: 09:07 AndIreadlike,youknow,psychologymagazines.Andit'sfunnybecauseit'sbeensolong,Imeangraduatedfromcollegein2000.Soit'slike,Idon'tremembershitthatIlearned.AndanythingthatIlearnedbacktheniscompletelylike,nobodyusesitanymore.YouknowwhatImean?

Hannah(Host): 09:20 Yeah,it'soutdated.

Amber: 09:20 Soit'slikeImightaswellnotevenhavethatdegree.


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Hannah(Host): 09:25 [Laughs]Great.Okay.Iwon'tquizyouaboutpsychology.Soyou,yougotintoimprovinAtlantainthe90s.Doyouthinktheimprovscenehastransformed?It'sbeen20years.

Amber: 09:37 Yeah!

Hannah(Host): 09:37 Sorry,I'mjustgonna,I'mjustgoingtocrumbleintoapileofdustnow.

Amber: 09:41 Yeah.It'schangedsomuch.Likeit's,itwasreallysmallwhenIstarted,therewasonlythreecompanies,Dad'sGarage,where,whoI'mwithstilltodayisoneofthem.AndthentherewasLaughingMatters,whichwasagroupthatwaslike,kindofthecorporatefamilyfriendly,schoolshowskindofgroup,and,andthenanothertheatercalledWholeWorld.Andnowthere'slikesomany,likethere'stonsoftheaters,andthere'stonsofgroups,andthere'speopledoingimprovallovertheplace.Andpartiallybecauseallthosecompanieshavegrownandthentheyhavealotofstudentsthatgooutanddoimprovintheworld.AndIjustthinkit'sbetterknowntodaythanitusedtobe.Andsoit'sdefinitelychanged.Andthere'satonmorewomen.LikewhenIstartedatDad'sGarage,Iwasthesecondwomantoeverbeputtintheensemble,andtheensemblewas18people.Soitwasn'tlikeasmallensemble.Anditwasallwhitemalesthathadstartedthecompany,and,youknowhowitisandit'showitwas,especiallybackthen.Andtodayourcompanyissodiverse,there'ssomanymorewomen,andbecauseofthatwe'retellingalot,alotofdifferentstories.Like,we'renotjusttellingstoriesthatwhitementell.

Amber: 10:47 Yeah.

Amber: 10:47 Thefunnythingis,isthatalotofthatisduetomyhusband,who'sfromEdmonton,KevinGillese,whoisawhiteman.

Hannah(Host): 10:53 Imean,theydothingsrightsometimes.

Amber: 10:57 Yeah.Hewaslike,"diversityisreallyimportanttome."He'slike,"especiallyinacitylikeAtlantathat'ssodiverse."Andwehavesuchagiantblackpopulation,butweweren'tseeinganyofthatonourstage,andweweren'tseeinganyofthatinouraudiencebecauseaudiencemembers,like"IfIdon'tseemyselfonstage.I'mnotgoingtogothere."Andsothat'sbeenahugething.That'schangedalottoo,whichisreallymadeusastrongercommunity.


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Hannah(Host): 11:15 That'swonderful.Andit'sgottobeadeliberate.Likewhenyouareacommunitythatlooksthesame,tellsthesamekindsofstories,thennotonlydopeoplenotwanttocomeseeyouwhoaren'talsopartofthatcommunity,butpeoplealsocan'tseethemselvesassomebodywhomightbeableto,toenterintothat.Right?Like,you'regettingverystronglythemessagelike,"thisisathingforwhitemen."

Amber: 11:37 Yeah.yeah.

Hannah(Host): 11:38 Sowhat,what,whatwasthatjumpforyouintermsoflookingat,youknow,anartformthatatthetimewasadvertisedverypowerfullyasbeingathingforwhitementhatmadeyougolike,"maybeItoo,coulddothisthing."

Amber: 11:51 Youknow,Ithinkitwaslike,sheerdefiance.LikeI,I've,I,Iwasalwaystheonethatwaslike,"Idon'tdogirlythings.IdothingsthatguysdoandIcandoanythingIwantandI'moneoftheboys."AndlikeIwaslike,"Iwanttobethefirstwomaninthisgroup.LikeI'mgoingto,I'mgoingtocrackthem."

Hannah(Host): 12:12 Itsaid"Nogirlsallowed"onthedoorandyouwerelike,"overmydeadbody!"

Amber: 12:15 Exactly.Sothatwasverymuchlike,honestly,likethatwaswhatdrovemeandthatwaswhatkeptme,eventhoughIgotlike,IgotknockeddownabunchandI,IfeltlikeIwasn't,like,Iwasn'tintherightplacealot,butIlikefoughtthroughitbecauseIwaslike,thesheerwilltodefeatthemiswhatIwanted.And,anditendedupworkingout.Imean,thecompanylearnshowtoimprovisewithme.Theguy'sgotmorecomfortablewithme.Imean,Igotalotofflackfromladiestoo,especiallylateroninimprov.WhenwestartedtravelingmoretoCanada,honestly,andmeetingmoreCanadianimprovisers,wemetwithmorefemaleimprovisersandtheywerelike,"well,youhaveaman."AndIwaslike,"well,that'showIwastaught."AndsoIhadtolearnthatIcouldalsobeawomanandanimproviseratthesametime,andtell...


Amber: 13:00 Youknow?Sotherewasalotofthat.Like,Imean,IlikelearnedwhoIwasasapersonthroughdoingimprovandfiguringoutwhatweremygoalsinthisparticularcompany.

Hannah(Host): 13:10 Okay,let'sdrilldownabitonwhatitmeanstoimproviselikea,man.


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Amber: 13:13 [Laughs]

Hannah(Host): 13:13 [Laughs]What'sthat?Whatdoesthatmean?

Amber: 13:16 Youknow,IthinkthefirsttimeIheardthatIwaslike,"whatdoesthatmean?"AndthenIthinkwhatitwasisthattherewerewomenthatsawmeandtheywerelike,"youlooklikeonstage--"Andalsotheweirdthingis,isthatIwouldn't,Iwouldn'tparticularlydressfeminineeithercauseIdidn'tthinkthatitwaswanted.SoIwould,Ireallytriedtolike,doeverythingIcouldtofitinwiththeboys.AndsoIthinkthatitmeantthatIwasbig,andloud,androwdy,andIpresentedmyselfinaveryaggressive,masculinewayonstagebecausethat'stheonlywayIknewhowtobeheard.AndsoIthinkthat'swhatpeoplewererespondingto.

Hannah(Host): 13:56 Yeah.ThelastinterviewIdidwaswithacoupleofcriminaldefenseattorneys.

Hannah(Host): 14:01 Ooh!

Hannah(Host): 14:01 Andweweretalkingaboutthissensethatinordertoenterintoaspacethatismaledominated,thatyoubasicallyhavetodoyourbestimitationofawhitemaninordertoconvincepeoplethatyoubelong.

Amber: 14:13 Yeah!

Hannah(Host): 14:13 Andthat,that,thatmightgrantyouasanindividual,atemporarypasstooccupythatspace,butitdoesn'tbreakgroundforanyoneelse.

Amber: 14:23 That'sright.

Hannah(Host): 14:23 Yeah.So,sodoyoufeellikeovertimeyouliketransformedthatimprovisationstyle?

Amber: 14:29 Ido.Ido.AndIthinkpartofitwasthatanotherwomancamealong,whoendedupbeingmyroommatelater,andthenendedupbeingmybestfriend.Andlikeshe,andshegavemetheopportunitytoplaywithanotherwomanonstagethatIrespectedandfeltlikeitwasapeer.Andsothatkindofgaveme,especiallylivingwithher.AndIhavelike,Igrewup,Ididn'tgrowupwithboys,likeIhaveasister.



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Amber: 14:52 AndsoIthinkthatthatkindofsoftenedmeabit,cuzIwaslike,"it'sokaytobeawomanonstageandit'sokaytotellfemalestories,"andit'sokayto,youknow,there'swomenintheaudiencethatarerespondingtothis.It'snotlikeouraudienceisn'tjustdudes,thoughtherewasalotofdudesinouraudience.There'salotoflikecollegedudes,youknow?


Amber: 15:08 AndsoIthinkreallyhelpedhavingMeganandthenafterthat,likethecompanystartedopeninguplittlebylittle.Anditwasatrickleatfirstofladiesandnowit's,Ithinkwe'reprobablyover,maybewe'reclosetohalfwomen,whichisawesome.

Hannah(Host): 15:20 That'sfantastic,yeah.

Amber: 15:20 Sothat'sjusthavingotherwomenaroundiswhatenabledmetofeellike,okay,Icandothis.Anditwasscary.LikeIwaslike,Ihavetobevulnerable.IhavetochangethewaythatI'mdoingthingsandIhavetolearn.Andtheguysallwentwithme.They'reallalotbetterthantheywereinthebeginning.Itwasahardfight,butweallkindoflearnedhowtodoittogether.

Hannah(Host): 15:41 Yeah.Imean,I'vedefinitelyheardstoriesfrom,fromwomenimprovisersaboutthewaythatyougetconstantly,sortof,backedintocornerswhenimprovisingwithmenintermsofthepositionsthattheywanttoputyouin,orthekindsofstoriesthattheywanttotell.

Amber: 15:54 Right.Yeah.

Hannah(Host): 15:54 Anditdoesseemliketosomedegreeyou'vegottojustsortofmuscleyourwaythroughintermsofdrivingdifferentkindsofnarratives.

Amber: 16:01 Yeah.Andthefunnythingis,isIwouldalwaysplaymalecharactersalot,andfinallytheguystoppedlike,callingmeJanetandwouldbelike,"oh,AmberisplayingSteve."AndnowI'mknownaslike,Iliketoplayalotofcharacters.That'skindofmyfavoritethingtodoanimprov,andmyfavoritekindofcharacterplaysoldmen,likescaryoldmen.Andsoeverybodyknows,wellAmberisgoingtoplayanoldmaninthis,inthisscene,andthat'sjusthowitis.Andsoit's,it'sfunnynowthatthat'skindofmycallingcard,youknow?


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Hannah(Host): 16:32 Yeah.Butthatjump,right,thefactthatyouareaskingpeopletohearwhatyouaresayingandwhatyouaretellingthemaboutwhoyouareand--

Amber: 16:40 Right.

Hannah(Host): 16:41 Atleastforawhilepeopleweresaying,no,you're,you'realady.Icantell.

Amber: 16:47 Yeah.

Hannah(Host): 16:47 LikeIfeellikethere's,there'salinktobemadethereintermsof,Idon'tknow,maybealargerculturalshifttowardsjustlike,lettingpeopletellyouthingsaboutthemselves.

Amber: 16:57 Right!Yeah,yeah.Andalsolike,asyou'reteachingeachotherhowtoperformasperformers,you'realsoteachingyouraudiencewhattoexpect.Andthenyouraudienceis,istrainedovertime,andtheaudiencethatcomestoseeyourshowsknowswhattoexpecttoo,whichisalsokindofaninterestingpartofit.

Hannah(Host): 17:12 That'sareallygreatpoint.Likeyou,youbuildtheaudiencewhowillrespondtotheworkthatyou'redoing,inthataudiencereceives,Imeanthisiswhatcomedyislike,likeforthemostpart,basedonthehistoryoflanguageandhowwe'veusedit,right?Solike,that's,Ireallyknowhowtomakethingssoundextrafunny.


Hannah(Host): 17:31 Like,let'stakeapartcomedyandreallyunderstandhowitworksaslinguisticandsocialplay.

Amber: 17:36 Right.

Hannah(Host): 17:36 Butlikethebasicpremiseofsomuchcomedyisupendingexpectations,whichiswhywhenyougobacktocomedyfromthe70sand80s,thatoftenagessoverybadlybecausewhat'sfunnyaboutupendingexpectationsisbuiltonwhattheexpectationsare.Andsoyougobackandyou'relike,"oh,thisisreallytransphobic"orreallyracistorbecausethoseexpectationsarecodedwiththatsamepower.

Amber: 18:07 Right.Absolutely.


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Hannah(Host): 18:09 [Laughs]Yeah.Yeah.Thisisfun.Feminismisfun.Great.Solet'sgettohowyoumovedfromimprovintovoicework.

Amber: 18:20 Okay!Sotherewasaguy,actuallyfunnyenough,ourcompanyandisalotbiggerthanitwas,butbackinthedaywehadprobablyabout20ensemblemembers.Andalot,andstillalargeportionofourensemblearepeoplethatareinadvertising.Itjustmakesenseforadvertiserstoalsobeimprovisers,Iguess.Andoneoftheguyswasthedirectorofhisadvertisingagency,andsohewouldhirealotofimproviserstodovoicework,orradiospots,orjustlikelittlethingscausepeoplewouldcomeinandthey'd,they'dbetherein10minutesandtheydostuff.Andsoheneededsomebodytodosomeradiospotsthat,youknow,theywereeasy,andcheap,anddirtyandtheydidn'tevenairinAtlanta,theywerelikefordifferentmarkets.Anditwaslike$150bucksapop.Andso,andthiswaskindofwhenthevoice,voiceworkwaschangingfromlike,everybodylookingforthatannouncervoiceintomorelike,wewanteveryperson's.Andsoluckily,becauseIamstillcompletelyuntrainedasavoiceactor,andIgetthatnotefromagentsallthetime,they'relike,"thesesoundcompletelyuntrained."AndIwaslike,"well..."

Hannah(Host): 19:24 Youjustsoundlikesomebodywithascienceundergrad.Idon'tknowwhat'sgoingonhere.

Amber: 19:32 Andso,Ididafewradiospotsforhim,andIwaseasytoworkwith,sohewouldjustcallmeandIcouldruninanddosomespots.Andsohe'sstillhiresmetothisday;hestillworksatthesamecompany.Hisname'sMikeSchatz.Heactuallydoesalotofvoiceworkalso.He--

Hannah(Host): 19:47 Wait,is...

Amber: 19:47 Huh?

Hannah(Host): 19:47 IsheawhitemannamedMike?

Amber: 19:49 Yep.He'sawhiteman.

Hannah(Host): 19:49 Justchecking.Cool.Justmakingsure,justmakingsurethatmy,mybroadsweepinggeneralizationsareaccurate.Keepgoing.

Amber: 19:56 AndthenanotherwhitemaninChristian,whoisapartofourcompany,hehadjustgottenoutofartschool.Hewasagoodfriendofmine,andhestartedworkingwiththeseguysthatweremaking,theyweremakingSealab2021.SoitwasthesameguysthatendedupmakingArcherup,buttheywere


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makingitforAdultSwim,whichisatinylittlenetworkthat'sbasedinAtlanta.Anditwasjustlike,sixdirtydudes,likeinashittyhouseinEastAtlantamakingcartoons.And,improviserswereagreatpooloftalent--

Hannah(Host): 20:27 Sounappealingsounding.It'sagreatshow,butyoujustmadetheprocessofmakingitsoundlikeagoddamnnightmare.

Amber: 20:34 Itwas!

Hannah(Host): 20:34 Soimproviserswereagreatpooloftalent.Gotit.

Amber: 20:37 Wewouldshowupatthehousetorecordstuffanditwaslike,itwaslikegoingintolikeadormroomof,likeareallygrossdormroom.Justlikeabunchofdirtydude'smakingcartoons.Andtheywouldmake--

Hannah(Host): 20:48 Yeah,yeah,yeah.Andagain,peoplewonderwhywomendon'tgetintocomedy.Like,cool,cool,cool,youcanhavethisopportunity.Youjusthavetoenterintothisterrifyingspace.

Amber: 20:55 Yeah.Yeah.

Hannah(Host): 20:55 Okay.

Amber: 20:55 Itwasalwayssogrossinthere.Ineverwantedtousethebathroomatthathouse,cuzitwaslike,it'ssogross.Sotheyweremaking,afterSealab,theymadeashowcalledFriskyDingoandimproviserswerelike,justagoodpoolofpeoplethattheycould,youknow,thatcoulddoweirdvoices.AndsotheyusedusalotwhentheyweremakingFriskyDingoandChristianwoulddovoices,buthealsowasananimator.Soheworkedforthoseguys.Andsobecausethoseguyswereasmallgroupofartistsandwewereasmallgroupofartists,theywouldcomeseeshowsandwekindofknewthem,andwekindofraninthesamecircles.AndtheyneededsomebodyforFriskyDingo.AndIauditionedforarolethatwaslikeateenagerandIwascompletelywrongforit,andsoIdidn'tgetit.Butthentherolechangedandtheywerelike,"hey,doyouwanttodothisthing?"AndsoIendedupdoing,Ithink,likefiveorsixdifferentvoicesonthatshow.Andsoitwasmyfirstlikecharactervoiceworkjob.AndIcan'tdoaccentsatallreally,likeIcandolikeanasshole,butlikeI'msobadatit.Peoplealwaysthinkthatifyou'reavoiceartistyoucandoaccents,andI'mlike,"literally,no,Ican't."[Laughs]ButIcando--

Hannah(Host): 21:58 [Laughs]Maybeifyou'reatrainedvoiceartist.


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Amber: 22:01 Yeah,Iknow,exactly.IfIhadevertrained.Sothenthatshowgotcanceled,andIthinktheywerekindoflike,oh,that'stheendoftheroad.AndAdamcameupwiththeideaforArcherandtheypitcheditanditwentahead.AndIthinkforsure,theywantedtoworkwithmebecauseIwaslike,youknow,IwasalocaltalentAtlantathattheyliketoworkwith,buttheyhadallthesefamouspeopleonboard.Andsothefactthattheyevenaskedmetodoit,Istillamdubiousabout.Like,Ifeelliketheyprobablyauditionedabunchofpeopleandcouldn'tfindtherightperson,andthey'relike,"ah,fuckit.We'lljustaskAmbertodoit."

Hannah(Host): 22:35 [Laughs]Fine.

Amber: 22:35 Yeah.AndIdidn'tevenhavetoauditionforit;theyjustgavemethejob.

Hannah(Host): 22:37 That'sgreat.Andthenover,isitthe9thseason..?

Amber: 22:41 We'remakingthe10thseasonnow.

Hannah(Host): 22:42 Makingthe10thrightnow.Soovernineseasonsyoujustwatch,yougoingfrombeingsidecharacterlike,"Haha,idiots.NowI'mthelead."

Amber: 22:50 Yeah,it'scrazy.

Hannah(Host): 22:52 [Laughs]It'sgreat.

Amber: 22:52 It'sreallybeenlike,quietaride.And,andIstilllike,I'mlike,ohno.Likepeoplewouldbelike,"whatdoyoudo?"AndI'llbelike,"oh,youknow,I'matheateractor."AndlikeInever,nevertellpeoplethatI'monArcherbecauseI'mjustlike,it'sjusttoomuchtodealwith.

Hannah(Host): 23:07 [Laughs]

Amber: 23:07 Butit'ssofun.I'mso,I'msoproudoftheshow,andI'mreallyproudofthecharacter.Like,IthinkPamissoawesome.AndI'mlike,likeeverytimeshedoessomething,I'mlike,"waytogo,Pam!"[Laughs]

Hannah(Host): 23:16 [Laughs]Okay,let'stalkaboutthat.Ihavesomequestionsaboutvoiceworkingeneral.

Amber: 23:20 Okay.


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Hannah(Host): 23:20 Let's,let'stalkaboutPam,aboutlike,whatithasbeenlikeoccupyingthatcharacterforthepastdecade.Becauseshe'slikesortofafilthymonster--

Amber: 23:32 Yeah.

Hannah(Host): 23:32 --inallofthemostdelightfulways.But,butyou,soyoujustdescribedthatshesortof,shedoesthingsandyougolike,"waytogo,Pam!"Likeshe's,she'sa,anotherpersonwhoyou'relikeobservingthebehaviorof.

Amber: 23:44 Yeah,yeah.Youknow,just,becauseI'vewatchedherlike,growsomuchfromthistinylittlecharacter.AndIthinkthat,inthebeginningIthinkthat,youknow,Adamwasjustcreatingabunchofcharactersandthenheputabunchofactorsinthoseroles,andthenkindofletithappenandseewhereitwent.AndIthinkthatovertimehekindofstartedwritingeverybodymorefortheactorsthatwereplayingthecharacters,andthey,theyjustbecamemorefleshedoutcharactersovertime,becausetheactorswerekindofgettingintothemandAdamwas,waswritingforthem.AndIthinkalotofPam'slike,howshe'schangedisthatAdamwaslike,"well,Ineedsomebodythatcandothis,"or"Ineedsomethingthatcandothis,"andhedidn'talwayshavetherightperson,sohewouldjustlike,havePamdoit.

Hannah(Host): 24:25 [Laughs]Yup.

Amber: 24:25 Andthenhelikewokeuponedayandhewaslike,"Ohshit,Pamdoesallthiscrazyshitnow."She'sgotlikethislaundrylistofcrazyskillsnobodyelsehas.Andsoyeah,it'sbeenreally,andit'sbeenfuntoseepeople'sreactionstoPamlike,thefactthatshe'slikethislikesexsymbolinaweirdway.

Hannah(Host): 24:44 Uhhuh.

Amber: 24:44 Andlike,thefactthatthatshewasintheSportsIllustratedSwimsuitEdition.That'slikesomethingthatIgrewuplikethat'slike,itwaslikebeingaDallasCowboysCheerleader.Iwaslike,"what??"Itwassuchahugething.Icouldn'tbelievethatithappened.

Hannah(Host): 24:57 Yeah,itiswhy,Imean,theaudienceresponsetoherisobviouslyverypowerful,andthedegreetowhichsheseemstohavegivenalotofpeoplepermissiontobelike,publiclyintoafilthy,sexpositivefatwomanisreallyintriguingtome.


15

Amber: 25:15 Iknow!It'ssoweird.Iknow.Iwish,IwishsomebodywouldlikedoastudyandlikereallydigintoitbecauseItotallyagreewithyou.Becauseshe'slike,somanypeoplewerelike,"Iknowthisperson,"or"I'mlikethisperson."Orlike,therewasjustnobodylikethatreally?Thatwas,Imean,Iguesstherewaslike,maybeRoseannelike,inthe,youknow,theoldRoseanne,beforeitgotreally...

Hannah(Host): 25:34 [Laughs]Yeah,pre-whitesupremacistRoseanne.

Amber: 25:38 Right.

Hannah(Host): 25:38 Forsure.

Amber: 25:39 AndalsomaybebecausePamwasalittlebityoungerandlike,moreattractivemaybe,Idon'tknow.It'ssuchaweirdthing.I,itwasjustsuchaphenomenon.Idon'tunderstandit,butI'mhappyaboutit.

Hannah(Host): 25:48 Yeah.It's,it's,it'sanincredible,howeveronemightaccountforit.AndIdid,Iheardyoutalkingabout,sortof,howingeneralPamgetsawaywithsayingthethingsthatshesays,andyousortofhypothesizedbrieflythatithassomethingtodowiththeanimation,thatthere'ssomedistancingeffectinlikeitbeinganimatedcharactersthataredoingit.

Amber: 26:10 Yeah.

Hannah(Host): 26:11 Thatjustthe,justwe'reokaywiththemsayinglikereallyhorrifyingthings.

Amber: 26:16 Mmhmm.Yeah.Itriedtoexplainthattomymomandshedoesn'tquiteunderstand,likeshegetsreallyupsetthatI,asaperson,amsayingthesehorriblethings,andI'mlike,"butit'snotme,mom.Like,it'sacharacterthatyoucan'teven,Idon'teven,it'snoteven,youdon'tevenseeitcomingoutofmymouth."Andshe'slike,"Ijust..."

Hannah(Host): 26:30 ButIknow.ButIknowitcameoutofyourmouth.

Amber: 26:34 Yeah.

Hannah(Host): 26:34 AndImadethatmouth.

Amber: 26:36 [Laughs]SoIdothink,Ithinkbecause,becausethey'reanimated.Ithinkthat'showadultcartoonsbecamesopopularinthefirstplace,cuzitwaslike,howcanwesaythethingswe


16

wanttosayandgetawaywithit,orputsomekindofdistancebetweenusandthewords.AndIthinkthatthat'swhy,youknow,SouthParkandsomanyotherthings,cuzespeciallytoo,becausetheyhavetheotherlayerofitbeingchildren,whichmakesitevenanotherwaytogetawaywithit.

Hannah(Host): 27:00 Yeah.Uhhuh.

Amber: 27:00 Youknow?Soit'sa,it'safun,powerfultoolthatIthinkthatwefoundtojustdealwiththeworldwelivein.

Hannah(Host): 27:06 Yeah,Imeanit'sgreat.It'sabsolutelythecase.I,Ihadn'tthoughtofthatintermsoftheriseofadultcartoons,buttheydoletyougorightuptotheedgeofkindsof,ofhorrifyingideas.

Amber: 27:19 Right.

Hannah(Host): 27:19 Andinformslikein,indifferentcartoons,levelsofviolencethatwouldbeunacceptable.Butalso,youknow,playinguppoliticalscenariosindifferentwaysandit'san,it'sanincrediblemedium.Asanactor,whatisitlike,sortof,workingexclusivelywithyourvoiceratherthanwithyourbody?Likedoyoufinditliberating?Limiting?Justdifferent?

Amber: 27:42 Becauseit'sthe,the,thethingthatIfoundthemostsuccessindoingsofar,it'sbeenlike,it'sthejobthatpaysmybills.

Hannah(Host): 27:50 Gotcha.

Amber: 27:50 Andso,youknow,Ihavethemostexperienceandtimeindoingstageacting.Andthat'ssobig,andsousingeverythingyou'vegot.Especiallydoingimprovbecauseyouhavenothingbutyourbody,youdon'thavecostumesandsetpiecesorpropsusuallythatyouhavetouseeverythingaroundyouand,butalsoyouhavetousealotofyourbody,andyouhavetousealotoflike,youknow,ifyou'replayinganoldcharacterthenyouuseyourbodytoportraythat,thatoldperson.Andwithvoiceactingyouhavetogetallofthatoutthroughjustyourmouth.

Hannah(Host): 28:23 [Laughs]Uhhuh.

Amber: 28:23 AndI'velearnedonthejobreallylikeI,Ireallylike,Isaidlike,Archer,well,wellFriskyDingowaskindofmyfirst,myfirststabatit,andatleastthatthatoneIgottoplayalotofdifferentcharacters.Butsolike,tryingtogetallofthethingsoutwithPamandallthedifferentincarnationsofher,andlikehowphysicalofashowArcheris.Like,there'salotoflikeaction


17

scenesandpeoplegettingshot,andpushingheavythings,oreatingstuff.Like,sothere'sjustalotofstuffgoingonthatI,thatI'vegotto,it'sgottocomeoutinmyvoice.AndsoI'velearnedalotaboutthat.AndsowhenIgetintothebooth,IcomeoutandI'mtired,andI'msweatyandlike,youknow,myhair'sallovertheplaceandittakesalot.


Amber: 29:04 It'salotmorephysicalthanIeverwouldhaverealizeditbeingbecauseyouhavetodoallthesameamountofacting,butyoujust,theendproductonlyhasyourvoice.

Hannah(Host): 29:13 Oh,youknowwhat,thatneveroccurredtome,butitdoesmakeperfectsense.

Amber: 29:17 Yeah.

Hannah(Host): 29:17 Thatlike,youwouldbeusingyourbodyinthesameway.

Amber: 29:20 Right.

Hannah(Host): 29:21 Youjustnot,youknow,peoplejustaren'tseeingit.

Amber: 29:23 Yeah.AndtheothertrickthatIkindofcameupwithyearsagothatreallyhelpedwas,Iwouldlookatthemicrophoneandpretenditwasmyscenepartner,andsoIcouldactuallyhavesomebodytointeractwith.DoyouknowwhatImean?Thatkindofhelpedtoo.

Hannah(Host): 29:36 Yeah.Doyoualwaysdoalloftherecordingandtotallyseparate?Likeareyouonyourownwhenrecording?

Amber: 29:41 I'mnotonmyown,butwe'reintheboothallseparately.AndsoI'mintheboothandthenontheothersideoftheboothislikeinthecontrolroomisthedirectorandusuallyoneortwoproducers,andthenliketheguythat'stheengineer.Sothey'rethereandIcanlike,Icanreadwiththemandplayoffofthemalittlebit,butthey'rejust,youknow,sittingontheotherside,eatingcandy,givingmenotes.

Hannah(Host): 30:04 [Laughs]Like,"Ineedmore.Ineedmoreenergyouttayou.Comeon."Yeah,thatdoessoundlike,like,harderinalotofways,tobegeneratingalloftheenergyoutofyourselfratherthanbeingabletoplayofftheenergythat'scomingfromotherpeopleandamplifyitthatway.


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Amber: 30:18 Right.Andit'salwaysearlyinthemorning,it'slike,"guys,whyarewedoingthissoearly?Comeon."

Hannah(Host): 30:23 That'sareally,that'sareallygoodquestion.Whyareyou...

Amber: 30:24 Yeah.

Hannah(Host): 30:24 Isn'tthewholepointofbeinganartistthatyoudon'thavetodothingsat9:00AM?

Amber: 30:29 Exactly!

Hannah(Host): 30:29 That'srude.It'sunreasonable.Yeah.Iwasthinking,youknow,intermsof,of,sortof,voiceversusstagework,aboutaninterviewthatIreadwithLupitaNyong'o,afterTheForceAwakenscameout.Whenshewastalkingabout,remembersheplayedthatlikecomputeranimatedcharacterinit?Didyou--

Amber: 30:50 Ididn'tseeit.

Hannah(Host): 30:50 Didyou,haveyou,haveyoubeenkeepingupwiththe400newStarWarsmoviesthatcomeouteveryyear?

Amber: 30:56 [Laughs]No.

Hannah(Host): 30:56 Anyway,sheplayedthiscomputeranimatedcharacterwho'slikethiselderlyalienandshe's,youknow,doingafunnyvoiceanditlooksnothinglikeher.Andpeopleaskedher“why,youknow,she'sabeautifulA-listactress.Like,whywouldshetakeonthisrole?Andshewastalkingabouthowliberatingitwas,asablackwoman,toplayarolewhereshewasn'tbeingablackwoman.

Amber: 31:18 Wow.

Hannah(Host): 31:19 Particularlyintermsofthesortofopticsofherbodyonscreen,thatshe'salwaysawareinwhateverrolesheplays,thatpeopleare,arelookingatherandinterpretingherbodyinparticularways.Andthatto,youknow,asanactor,togettoplaywithacharacterinwhichpeoplearen'tlookingatyourbodyorreadinganythingintoit,feltliberatingforher.AndsoIwaswonderingaboutthattoo.Like,istheresomethingaboutgettingto,toactandperforminacontextinwhichpeoplearenotlookingatyourbody,orformulatinganyjudgmentsorideasaboutit,oraboutyoubasedonhowyoulookthatis,thatopensupwhatyoucando.


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Amber: 32:02 Yeah.Youknowwhat,Ineverthoughtofthat.Butyes,justhearingyousaythatof,yeah.Like,ofcourse!That'ssogreatbecauseit'snotme.Again,likeit's,it'snot,it'ssomebodyelseandIdon'tevenhavetoworryaboutlike,whatmylegslooklike.YouknowwhatImean?

Hannah(Host): 32:16 [Laughs]Uhhuh.

Amber: 32:16 Andontopofit,Pam,Pamwouldbelike,"comeon.Areyoukiddingme?Like,you'resoyou're,you'resofinelooking."Butyeah,causeIthinkabouttoo,likewhenIdoImprov,andlikewhenyoungwomenarecomingupandlike,it'salwayslike,"whatdoIwear?"Andlike,youknow,Iwanttobeabletoexpressmyfemininity,butIalsowanttobecomfortableandIdon'twanttomakepeopleuncomfortable.It'sjustlikethere'ssomuchthatgoesintoitthemenneverhavehadtothinkabout.AndIknowformelikeifIwere,ifI,ifI'mplayingacharacter,andatthetheaterweworkat,notallimprovtheatersdothis,butwedoalotofshowswithcostume.Likewedosoapoperasthatarecostumedandmurdermysteriesandthecostumeandstufflikethat.AndifIeveramplayinganugly,orcharacterthattheirvaluedoesn'tcomefromtheir,theirattractiveness,thenit'salwayssomucheasierandI'msomuchhappier.AndifmycostumeislikebigandbaggyandIdon'thavetoworryaboutlike,itpinchingorlikearollfallingout,ifIlikebendover,youknowlikestupidshitlikethat?

Hannah(Host): 33:16 [Laughs]Yup.

Amber: 33:16 Likehe'ssomuchhappierandIhaveamuchbettershowandIfeellikeI'mabletoperformsomuchbetter.Andit'sthatexactthingthatyou'retalkingabout.Andit'sbecauseI'mnotworriedaboutpresenting,butagain,I'llplaycharactersthatarelike,youknow,ingowns,orveryfeminine,orwhateverandit's,itcanstillbefun,butit'slike,itisawholedifferentsetofthingsyougottoworryabout.

Hannah(Host): 33:39 Yeah.Youhavetothinkaboutwhetherornotyou'regoingtofalloffyourhighheelsallthetime.

Amber: 33:43 Yeah,yeah.

Hannah(Host): 33:43 Likeit'sreallyrude.Yeah.ThatIhavetobeoutdoingthesamejobandalsoworriedaboutfallingdownbecauseourshoesaredumb.

Amber: 33:51 Totally.Yeah.


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Hannah(Host): 33:51 Imeanwe,Isay"we,"butIhavenotwornahighheelinseveralyears.

Amber: 33:55 Iknow,Ineverperforminthem,butyouknow,Ididdoashow.Wedid,wedoChristmasCaroleveryyear,andwe'vedonealotofperiodshowsandsoI'vedoneshowswhereIhavetowearcorsetsandit'slike,"whatthehell?Likewhyonearthwouldanybodyhavetodothis?"Butithelpedme.I've,Ihada,Iwasclimbinguponstage,andIwaskindofrunningandIjumpeduponstageandItripped.AndwhenIfell,andbecauseIwasinthiscorsetmybodyfeltcompletelyflat.SoIthinkIwasabletonotinjuremyselfbecauseIwaswearingthecorset.Soitendedupworkingout.

Hannah(Host): 34:26 [Laughs]That'sgreat.Betweencorsets,bustles,hoopskirts,it'sjustprotection.

Amber: 34:34 Yeah.That'sright.

Hannah(Host): 34:34 It'sprotectionforourdelicateladybodies.Can'thelpourselves.It'sokay.Thinkingabout,togobacktothat,thatquestionoflike,youknow,howyourbodyisandisnotbeingreadandwhatyousortofsaidoffhandaboutlike,whatPamwouldsayaboutthat.Iamreallycuriousabout,Imeannottoimposeidentitiesonyou,butIwoulddescribeyouasathinwoman.

Amber: 35:03 Thankyou.

Hannah(Host): 35:04 AndI,well,IamafatwomanandIdon'tlike,it'snot,it'snota,avaluejudgmentonewayortheother--

Amber: 35:11 Right

Hannah(Host): 35:11 --asfarasI'mconcerned.ButIaminterestedinwhatitisliketobemostlyfamousforplayingsomebodywho'sbodyispoliticizedinawayyoursisn't.

Amber: 35:21 That'sreallyinteresting.AndIfeel,Idon't,Ihavestruggledlikemanywomenmywholelifewithweight,andsoit'slikeavery,Idon'tknowifI'vecometotermswithit.SoIdon'tknow.Ithinkthatit'sniceformetobeabletolookuptoPaminthatshe'slike,"I'mfatandI'mbeautifulandIdon'tgiveashit."Like,shedoesn'tgiveashitwhatanybodythinksabouther,andIthinkthat'soneofthethingsthatwhenIsaythatI'mproudofPamasacharacter,it'sbecauseshedidn'tlearntodothat.Shejustisthat.YouknowwhatImean?Andshe'salwaysbeenthat,ifwegivePamalonghistory.


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Amber: 36:02 Soit's,it'sto,andI,thereareplentyofpeopleoutthere,andIdefinitelydidnotcomefromthatplace,andIdidn'tcomefromthatfamily,andIhavesomuchbaggagewhenitcomestothatkindofstuff.Buttoknowthattherearepeoplethatarelike,"ohmygod,finallysomebodythatlike,isn'tsoworriedaboutitallthetime."Soit's,it'ssomethingthatIlookto,IlooktoPamto,togivemestrengthonoften.

Hannah(Host): 36:26 It'samazingtothinkaboutthatintermsoflike,again,she's,sheisnotrealandisbeingwrittenbyaman.

Amber: 36:34 Iknow!

Hannah(Host): 36:35 Right?Likethat'ssointerestingthat,thatthroughtheprocessofplayingher,it'sactuallypushingyoutothinkaboutbodypoliticsindifferentways.Butlike,youknow,she,she'safont,afontofwisdominventedbysomebodywhoalsodoesn'thavethatidentity.

Amber: 36:52 Yeah.

Hannah(Host): 36:52 Andyethasbeenso,soforsomanypeople,IseethisallovertheInternet,isthedegreetowhichshematterstoviewersasanopportunitytoseethemselvesonascreen.

Amber: 37:03 Yeah.Andyouknow,Ithinktoo,Ithinkthatinthebeginningherbeingfatwasajoke.Andthenthe,itwasn't,somehowthroughAdamtakingwhatpeopletookfromPam,asanaudience,butalsokindofPamgrowingoutsideofwhatAdamwaswritinginto,kindof,thisothercharacterlike,itjustwasn'tallowedanymore.Youknowwhatdoyoumean?

Hannah(Host): 37:26 Yeah

Amber: 37:26 Whichiskindofweird,butit'slike,itjustbecamesomething.Ittookonalifeofitsownandbecamesomethingdifferent,whichIthinkissocool.

Hannah(Host): 37:34 Yeah,ImeanIsee,youseethatacrosstheshowandIthinkyouseethatacrossactuallyalotoflongrunningcomedyseries,isthatcharacterstartkindoftwodimensional.They're,they'reajokeaboutanidentity,oranideaaboutakindofperson.Butifthewritingisgoodandtheactingisgood,overtimetheyturnintofullyfleshedoutcharacterswhothe,thejokehasgottostopbeing,"It'sfunnycuzshe'sfat."


22

Amber: 37:59 Yeah.

Hannah(Host): 37:59 Becausethat'snotgoingtolastnineseasons.

Amber: 38:01 Totally.Totally.Like,it'ssoboringafterawhile.Absolutely.

Hannah(Host): 38:04 Yeah.Sobut,butsheisalso,sointhelastcoupleofseasons,whichhavetakenarealfunturnintosomesortoffeverdream,isspecificallyinthelastone,whichIjustfinishedwatching.Inseasonnine,she'snotfatanymore.She'sadifferentkindoflike,she'sthismassiveAmazonianfigure.

Amber: 38:25 Yeah,yeah.She'sgiant.She'slike,whentheyshowedme,theysentmeasketchbeforetheshowstartedairingandtherewasthere,there'sstillkindofanimatingit,andwe'ddonealotoftherecordingsalready.AndtheysentmeapictureofPamstandingnexttoCyrilforscale,soIcouldseehowbigshewas.Andshe'ssostacked,likeshe'ssomuscular.[Laughs]It'sreallyfunny.

Hannah(Host): 38:49 It'samazing.

Amber: 38:49 Yeah.Andthereasonwaslikewhattheyhadintendedwasthatshewas,shewastheChewbaccaoftheshow.Right?

Hannah(Host): 38:59 Ooooooh!

Amber: 38:59 Soshewas,shewastheChewbaccatoArcher'sHan.Isthatright?Idon'tknow.I'mnotaStarWarsperson.

Hannah(Host): 39:07 [Laughs]Yeah,sure.Imean,probably.

Amber: 39:10 Yeah.AndsoIwaslike,oh,okay.That'sgreat.And,andthegreatthingtooisthatnobodyreallythoughttwiceaboutit.They'relike,"ohyeah,Pam'sdifferentagainthisseason.Shenowshe'sjustagiant,likesevenfoottallperson."

Hannah(Host): 39:23 Doyou,doyoufeellikeyou'redoingordidthevoiceofdifferentlyinthatseason,thinkingofitascomingoutofadifferentbody?

Amber: 39:30 Youknow,aftergoingbackaseasontoDreamlandwherethecharacterwasPoovey,anditwaskindofagender-neutralcharacter.AndtheytoldmethatthatcharacterwasbasedonRussellCrowe'scharacterfromLAConfidential,whichIthoughtwassuchagreat,whatagreatthingtogetasanactor.


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Amber: 39:48 AndsowhenIwentin,Iwaslike,"doyouwantmyvoicetobeanydifferent?"Andthey'relike,"Nope.Nope.You'restilltheexactsameperson,theexactsamecharacter,you'rejustinhabitingadifferentbody."Andoneofthethingsthatwhentheyweredesigningthecharacternewfortheseason,becauseyouknow,theydotweaksdependingonhowdifferentpeopleareindifferentwardrobeandallthatstuff.Andtheycouldn'tgetitrightandtheywerereallystrugglingwithitandtheycouldn'tfigureoutwhatitwas.Andtheywerelike,"youknowwhat,shejustneedslipstick."AndsotheyputlipstickonPooveyandtheneverythingwasfine.[Laughs]


Amber: 40:19 Like,that'sallitwas.That'sallittook.Soyeah.Soyeah,sowhenwegotthisDangerIslandandPamwassobig,Ididn'tevenaskcuzIwaslike,they'regoingtosayno.

Hannah(Host): 40:31 Yeah.Imean,partofthecomedyofthe,oftheselike,reworkedseasonsisthatitisthesamerecognizablevoicecomingoutofanunlikelybody,likeKriegerasaparrotnamedCrackers.

Amber: 40:43 Right!

Hannah(Host): 40:43 Whichisjustthe,thewordplayofKriegerandcrackersmademelaughformaybefiveminutes,cuzIhaveasimplemind.So,soI,Ihearthatandthenitisalsosortofpleasurabletohavethosevoicescomeoutofthoseunfamiliarbodies.

Amber: 40:57 Right.

Hannah(Host): 40:57 Andthen,andthentoseethedegreetowhichtheyaregettingplayedsimilarlylike,AmazonianPamisstilldefinedbyaverypowerfulsenseofoccupyingherbodycomfortably.

Amber: 41:11 Mmhmm!

Hannah(Host): 41:11 That'struenomatterwhatthatbodyis.

Amber: 41:13 Yeah.Yeah.Andit'sfunnytoobecauseit's,it'sreallywhatisthehookthatkeepstheshowsimilarenougheveryseason,isthatthatthecoreofeverycharacter,they'restillthesameterribleassholetheyweretheseasonbefore.Theyjustlookdifferentandinteractmaybealittlebitdifferentlywiththeir,withthe


24

othercharactersbasedonwhatnowthoseothercharactersdotoo.


Amber: 41:36 Soweallstilltreateachotherthesameterribleway,butit'sjustwithadifferentfilterbasedonwhatwe'redoingorwhatourcharactersuptothatseason.

Hannah(Host): 41:45 Soistherelikeacertainpleasureinplayingsuchanassholeallthetime?

Amber: 41:53 Ithinkplayingbadcharacters,andIdon'tthink,Idon'tthinkPam'sabadcharacter.Ithinkthe,alotoftimesshe'sweirdlyliketheheart.Attheendofthedaywhennobody'sanygood,it'slike,"well,Pam'sstillalittlegood."

Hannah(Host): 42:06 [Laughs]"Good"mightbethewrongword,butshe'sgotsomesortofstrangemoralcompass.

Amber: 42:11 [Laughs]Someheart.Yeah.AndsoIthinkthat,yeah,Ithinkplayingcharactersthatarebad,likewhenI'mdoingimprovthat'salwaysmy,playingvillainsissomuchfun.WedidashowforawhileatDad's,Dad'sGaragethatwasawrestlingshow,andalotofuslearnactuallyhowtowrestlefromprofessionalwrestlers.And--

Hannah(Host): 42:28 Soundssodangerous.

Amber: 42:30 Itwasverydangerous,andIdidnothavehealthinsuranceatthetime.

Hannah(Host): 42:33 Good.Great.

Amber: 42:34 Right?Bestwaytodoit.Buthey,Iwasinmytwenties.Whocares?

Hannah(Host): 42:37 Oh,you'retakingyourartseriously,it'sfine.

Amber: 42:38 [Laughs]Totally.ButIwaslikeaheelanditwasreallyhardbecauselikeyouusually,whatwe'retryingtodoisgetaudiencestoloveus,butmyexpresspurposewastogettheaudiencetohatemeandboomewhenIcameout.



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Amber: 42:51 Anditwassuchapowerfullessonto,youknow,figureouthowtodothat.Anditwasendedupbeingsolike,oneofthemostfuncharacterI'veeverplayed.

Hannah(Host): 42:58 Uhhuh.

Amber: 42:59 Yeah.SoIdo,Idoloveplayingabadcharacter

Hannah(Host): 43:01 Andtobringthatinevitablyjustbacktofeminism,cuzI'mreallyjustabrokenrecord.

Amber: 43:06 Yeah.

Hannah(Host): 43:06 Idothinkthatthere'salsosomethingreallyexcitingabout,aboutwomenwhoagain,inperformancesettings,aresooftendriventowards,Imean,notjustinperformancesettings,inourlivesdriventowardslikeability,right?

Amber: 43:18 Yes.

Hannah(Host): 43:18 Yourjobistobepleasant,tosmile,tomakepeoplecomfortableandthatsortofradicalmoveofbeinglike,"actuallymyjobhereisnot,nottomakeanyonelikeme.It'sactuallytomakepeopleboome."

Amber: 43:30 Yes.

Hannah(Host): 43:30 Like,howfreeing?

Amber: 43:32 Totally.Andalsoontopofthatbeinglike,fromtheSouthandfromaconservativeChristianfamily,it'slike,goodgod.Like,theonlythingthat'simportantisthatyouarea[ironicSouthernaccent]likable,nice,verycompassionatewomanthatjusttakescareofeverybodyandhasabunchofkids.[Naturalvoice]AndthoseareallthingsthatIdidnotdo,andmymomdoesn'tunderstand.Soyeah,likewedon'ttalkaboutmycreativelifebecauseit'ssooppositeofwhatmymomwantedmetobe.Thatshe'slikeproudofmeandI'mherdaughterandshelovesme,butlike,wejustdon'ttalkaboutthat.

Hannah(Host): 44:05 Gotcha.

Amber: 44:05 So,cuzit'sjustlike,shedoesn'tunderstandwhyintheworldIwouldevermakethesechoicesandbelike,dirtyand,youknow,especiallyinfrontofabunchofpeopleonstage.



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Amber: 44:14 Tobeknowninthecityforbeingsuchabadperson.


Amber: 44:18 AndespeciallywithArcher,Imeanlike,herfriendsatchurcharelike,justlike[disapprovinghuffs].Theycan't.

Hannah(Host): 44:26 [Laughs]Soalotofliteralpearlclutchinggoingon.

Amber: 44:28 Yeah.Lotsofit.So,soyeah,it'sveryempowering.AndI,anditwasn'teasy.Like,youknow,it'shard,itwashardtomakethosechoicesandbelike,I'mgoingtogoagainstmyfamilyonthisandthenallmyteachingsanddowhatIwantandbegross.

Hannah(Host): 44:43 [Laughs]Yeah,itis.Itisbecausethatstuff,Imean,inawaythatit'sverysimilartothebodymessaging,likeallofitisjuststuffthatyougetfedallthewaythroughyourlifeandthenasanadulttobelike,"Iamgoingtodeliberatelyrefusethis,"Ithinkit'shard.Thoughitalsobringsusbacktoeuro,yourclaimrightatthebeginningthatwhenpeopletellyouyou'renotallowedtodosomething,youwanttodoitmore.

Amber: 45:08 Yeah.Yeah.It'spushingthatbigredbutton.

Hannah(Host): 45:10 Yup.

Amber: 45:10 And,youknow,asI'vegottenolder,I'vestartedtobe,youknow,IthinkeverybodykindofmellowsoutalittlebitandI,Isometimesamlike,"man,Iwassuchabadass10yearsago,or20yearsago.Like,maybeIneedto,youknow,maybeIdon'tneedtobeinthebathbynineo'clockeverynight."YouknowwhatImean?

Hannah(Host): 45:29 Inthebath?

Amber: 45:29 Yeah.Igottahavemybathatnineo'clockeverynight.Nottrue,butIdoliketakingbaths.

Hannah(Host): 45:34 Thatsoundsgreat!Thatsoundssosoothing.Iwanttobeinthebathbynineo'clockeverynight.

Amber: 45:39 Itis!It'ssogreat.Butyeah,soitmakesme,itmakesmesometimesbelike,"youknow,I'vegottokindofkeepbeingabadassandpushingthoseboundaries,"butyouknow,sometimesyoujustgottosettledownandgetmarriedandchilloutalittlebit.


27

Hannah(Host): 45:50 Imeanthere'sprobablyamiddleground.

Amber: 45:53 Yeah,forsure.Forsure.

Hannah(Host): 45:54 It'slike,canI,canIbeinthebathbutnotgetmarried?

Amber: 45:57 Exactly!Yeah.

Hannah(Host): 45:57 Cuzonesoundsgreatandtheotheronesoundsexhausting.

Amber: 45:59 Ordoashowandbereallygrossonstageandthengetinthebathatmidnight.

Hannah(Host): 46:05 [Laughs]Getinthebathatmidnight.Allright.That'sagood,that'sagoodshowtitle.It'seitherthatorgoingtobe"atrickleofladies."


Hannah(Host): 46:10 Whichisagreatturnofphrase,alsoreallygraphic.[Music:"VoodooLady"byWeen]

Hannah(Host): 46:32 Ifyou'dliketohearmoreaboutAmber,youcanfollowheronvarioussocialmedias@ambercnash.YoucanfindshownotesandalltheepisodesofSecretFeministAgendaonsecretfeministagenda.comyoucanfollowmeonTwitterat@hkpcgregor,andyoucantweetaboutthepodcastusingthehashtag#secretfeministagenda.Andofcourse,youcanreviewtheshow,whichpeopledidthisweek.TherearenewreviewsfromAshraCole,whoismyIRLfriend,MinimumHeadandGoodGollySmally.Thisissomeverygoodusernames.Everybody'sdoingagreatjob.Thepodcastthemesongis"MeshShirt"byMomJeansofftheiralbum,ChubRub.Youknow,Icouldjusthaverecordedthisonceandusethesamerecordingattheendofeveryepisode,butInevergettiredofsayingChubRub.Youcandownloadtheentirealbumonfreemusicarchive.orgorthemonFacebook.Amber'sthemesongwas"VoodooLady"byWeen.SecretFeministAgendaisrecordedonthetraditionalanduncededterritoryoftheMusqueam,Squamish,andTsleil-WaututhfirstnationswhereI'mgratefultoliveandwork.ThishasbeenSecretFeministAgenda.Passiton.[Music:“MeshShirt”byMomJeans]

episode 3.10 a trickle of ladies with amber nash

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