episode 244: debunking probiotic myths with just thrive founder … · 2019-04-01 · 1 episode...

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Episode244:DebunkingProbioticMythsWithJust

ThriveFounderTinaAnderson


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Child:WelcometomyMommy’spodcast.

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Katie:Hello,andwelcometothe"WellnessMamaPodcast."I'mKatie,fromwellnessmama.com.AndI'mheretodaywithafriendandsomeoneIlovesomuch,TinaAnderson,whoistheco-founderandCEOofJustThriveProbiotics.Andwe'regonnajumpintoalotofprobioticmythsandunderstandingtoday,butTina'sjourneyisreallyfascinating.Shegotintotheworldofhealthwithsomeunusualturns.Shebeganhercareerasatriallawyerwhospecializedinsettlingcasesbybringingbothsidestogetherandunitingthem,whichisapersonalpassionofhersandsomethingshe'sverygoodat.

Butonceshehadhersecondchild,likemanyofus,shewantedtochangeandsheleftherhigh-stressjobsothatshecouldfocusonfamily.Andshewasstillabletouseherlegalskillstopointhercareerinanewdirectionasin-housecounselforherfamilybusiness,afamilypharmaceuticalcompany.Butwhatshesawtheremadeherchangedirectionagain,andsheeventuallyturnedtowardthefieldofnaturalhealthandfoundherlife'sworkandpassion.She'snowchanneledherenergyintolearningallthatshecanaboutdiseasepreventionandgoodhealthmaintenance.Andthis,ofcourse,ledhertodiscovertheimportanceofguthealth,andhowconnectedandcrucialitisforoverallhealthandwellness.

Toshareherdiscoverywiththeworld,sheandherhusband,createdauniquesupplementthatcontainssuperiorprobioticstrainsfromrenownedresearcherDr.SimonCutting.Andwe'regonnagointoittoday.IknowI'veheardsomanyquestionsfromallofyouguys.AndTinaisheretoanswerthem.Tina,welcome,andthanksforbeinghere.


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Tina:Hi,Katie.Oh,thankyousomuchforhavingmeontoday.I'msoexcitedtobehere.

Katie:Likewise,it'salwayssomuchfuntochatwithyou.AndIknowourinitialepisodewithKiran,yourmicrobiologistwassopopularandwehadsomanyfollowupquestions,andIcan'twaittojumpinandaskyousomeofthemtoday.ButItouchedonyourstoryalittlebitinthebioandI'dlovetohearalittlebitmorefromyou,becausethatseemslikeareallybigchangefromtriallawyertobeingverymuchanintegralofthisnaturalhealthworld.

Tina:Yes,itdefinitelywas.Youknow,essentiallywe,youknow,wewentinto,Iendedupgoingintothepharmaceuticalindustry.Andafterbeinginthepharmaceuticalindustryformanyyears,wejustnoticedsomanyabusesintheindustry,including,youknow,therampantover-prescribingofmedications.Infact,oneexampleiswhenourcompanywasawardedaverylargecontractforoneofthelargesthospitalsystemsinthecountryforacholesteroldrug.Andwewereallsoexcitedandcelebratingandthepharmaceuticalmanufacturer'srepcameintoourofficeandsaid,"Oh,thisisgreat.Wewonthiscontract."Andnowit'smyjobtogotoeverycardiologistinthesystemandgetthemtolowerthenumberthattheyprescribecholesterolmeds.So,inessence,theywereloweringthatnumberinordertoprescribemoreoftheirmedication.

And,youknow,whileapartofmewasshocked,youknow,anotherpartofmealightbulbwentoffinmyheadandIjustrealizedthatthiswashappeningallaroundus.Imean,wehadafamilymemberthatstartedononeprescription.Andthenthat'sledher,youknow,tostomachproblems,whichthencausedhertobeonanothermedication,whichthenledtojointissueswhichthenledtoanotherprescription.Andbeforeyouknowit,withinsixtoeightmonths,shewasonoveradozenprescriptionmedicines.So,youknow,wealsosawitwithourkids,antibioticafterantibioticforearinfection.Andwealwaystrytousenaturalremediesbutwestillheardthatmessageoverandover.And,youknow,believeme,unfortunately,mykidshavehadtheirshareofantibioticsbeforeIlearnedaboutthedevastatingimpacttheyhaveonourguthealth.And,youknow,theironicthingisthatwhenwestartedinthepharmaceuticalindustry,welovedknowingthatwewereinthehealthfieldandweweredistributinglife-savingmedicationstopeople.

Andthere'snodoubtImean,Ithinkyouwouldagreetoo,thatthere'sabsolutelyaplaceforpharmaceuticals,especiallyinemergencymedicaltypeofsituations.Butwejustdon'tfeelthatitwasaplacetotreatchronicconditions.Andwesawthisfirsthandwithoverprescribingofmedications.Andwestartedtorealizethattherewas,youknow,virtuallynoemphasisonpreventionanditwasjustfocusedontreatment.Andwejustfounditveryfrustrating.And,youknow,I'maprettydeepthinker.IreadalotofWayneDyerandNormanVincentPeel.AndbothmyhusbandandIjustbelievedthatweweren'tdoingourlife'sworkanymore.Sowedelvedintoresearch,startedlearningmoreaboutnaturalhealth,andparticularlyguthealth.Andwewere,youknow,frankly,wewereblownaway.Imean,thiswasshortlyaftertheHumanMicrobiomeProjectwasconductedbytheNationalInstitutesofHealth.Andwow,didwelearnalot.

Andwhatwelearnedissomethingthatmuchofyouraudiencealreadyknowsnow,butthatguthealthisrelatedtovirtuallyeveryaspectofouroverallhealth.Andthenjustbykindofbeingattherightplaceattherighttime,sayingmydailyaffirmationsandmeditatingandlotsofprayer,weweregiventheopportunitytolicensetheexclusiverightstothesebacillusspore-basedprobioticsfromLondonUniversity.Youknow,oneof


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thetop,youknow,leadingprobioticresearchersintheworld.Andfromthere,that'swhereJustThriveProbioticwasborn.Andit'sbeenthemostgratifyingandrewardingjourney.AndI'mevenmoreexcitedforwhat'sahead.

Katie:Iloveit.AndIlovesomuchaboutyourstory.Thefactthatyouhadwhatsomanypeoplestriveformultipletimes,youhadthisamazinglegalcareer,andthenyouchosetotakeanewdirectionforthesakeofyourfamily.Buteventhen,youhadthisamazingworkathomecareer,whereyoustillgottobeinvolvedanddothisworkthatwasprobablyI'msurefinanciallywonderfulandhadmanybenefits.Andyetyoustillhadthissearchforsomethingdeeperinhealth.AndIthinklikesomanyofus,beingamomandhavingthesegoalsforyourfamily,likereallyledyoutoanewpaththat'snowhelpingsomanypeople.

AndIjustlovethatyourmissionisnowonethatreachessomanyofus.AndIknowthatyou...soyoustartedtalkingaboutguthealth.Ithinkyou'resoright.Ithinkwe'reonlybeginningtostarttoscratchthesurfaceofjusthowimportantguthealthis.Butyou'reright.Weknowthatit'stiedtomentalhealth,toskinhealth,toprettymucheveryaspectofhealthandlife.Andfromourpreviousconversations,youguysactuallyhavestudiesrelatingcertainprobioticstoguthealth.AmIrememberingthatcorrectly?

Tina:Yes,exactly.Sowehaveapublishedhumanclinicaltrialonleakygut,themedicaltermmetabolicendotoxemia,andwehavenineotherclinicaltrialsgoingonrightnow.Soandwejustcompletedaroundupstudythatwe'rekindofstillgoingthroughthedataonandthatshouldbepublished,youknow,hopefully,inthenottoodistantfuture.Sowearereallyfocusedonresearch.Wethinkthatthatisamissingpieceinalotofthem,inthesupplementworld.Soyes.

Katie:That'sawesome.Andwalkusthroughalittlebitjustonthespecificsoftheleakyguttrial.Becausethat'ssuchabuzzwordrightnow,andIthinkmanypeoplearestartingtounderstandhowproblematicitcanbe.Butkindofjustgiveusahigh-leveloverviewofforanyonenotfamiliarwhatleakygutis,andwhatyouguysfoundinthatresearch.

Tina:Yep.Soleakygutis,thefunnythingis,it'sprettymuchwhatitsoundslikeitis,youknow,there'sholesintheintestines.AndwhathappensisthereisaproteincalledLipopolysaccharide.AndwecouldjustforthesepurposescallitLPS.SoLPSisatoxinthat'snaturallyfoundinourgutmicrobiome.Soit'sfoundinourgut,andit'snotreallyproblematicwhenit'sinourgut.It'snotuntilitseepsintothebloodstreamthatitstartstocreatehavoconourimmunesystem.Andsothestudythatwasdonetookhealthycollegestudentswithnoother,youknow,anytypeofhealthissuesandtheybasicallyfoundthatthesecollegestudentstheyfound55%ofthemhadaleakygutanddidn'tknowit.Andsothisisthischronicconditionthat'sgoingonallthetimethatwedon'tevenrealize.Andsotheydidatreatedgroupandthentheydidtheplacebogroup.After30days,theyfounda42%reductionintheLPSlevelsinthebloodstream.

Sothere'sahugefinding.There'snootherstudy,or,youknow,pharmaceuticalorsupplementouttherethathasafindingthat'sshowingthatwe'reactuallyreducingtheLPSlevelsinthebloodstream.AndweknowthatheightenedLPSlevelsinthebloodstream,therewasjustastudythatcameoutthatshowthatthenumber


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onedriverofAlzheimer'sisaheightened...isLPSlevel.AndsoweknowthatthesestrainsareactuallyreducingtheLPSlevelinthebloodstream.Andthereby,healingleakygut.

Katie:That'samazing.And42%inaclinicaltrialisreallydrasticforanyonewho'snot,IknowI'mintheliteraturealotofthat,butdrugscangetapprovedshowingjustminorimprovementsoverplacebo.Sothat'sreallyamazing,42%isahugenumber.

Tina:It'sahugenumber.Andwehave,likeIsaid,lotsofotherclinicaltrialsgoingonrightnow.Andwehadalongtermstudyoftheleakygutstudy,too.Soit'sgonnabeoverthatwasover30days.Nowwe'vegotanotheronegoingonover60to90days.Soimaginewhatcouldbehappeningafter90daysofbeingontheproduct.

Katie:Andit'ssoimportantandsoamazingthatwearenowbeingabletousethebestcuttingedgesciencetofindsolutions.Becauseunfortunately,Ifeellikewearelivinginaworldwherewehavesomanynegativeinputsthatwedohavetobeproactivetobattlesomeofthese,unfortunately.Likethereusedtobeatimewhereyoucouldprettymucheatareallyprettycleandiet,growalotofyourfoodyourself,getenoughsunshineandbeokay.Butnowwearefacingsomanyjuststressorsoneverylevelforthebody.Andespeciallywhenitcomestoguthealth.

AndIknowthatyou'vedonesomeresearchonthisaswell.AndIcertainlyseetheresearchwhenIlookforit,butjustallofthethingsthatcanpotentiallytriggergutproblemsandleakygut.SoI'dlovetojusttouchonafewofthese,especiallyforthemomslistening,ofthingsweneedtobeawareofthatcanreallynegativelyimpactourguthealth.AndIknowthatthere'saspectrumofeverythingfromthingslikeglyphosatetoevenjustfoodintolerances.Sowhathaveyoufoundinyourresearchonthisassomeofthemostcommontriggersthatwe'reseeingingutproblems?

Tina:Well,oneofthebiggesttriggersisantibiotics.And,youknow,wethink,youknow,alotofustrytoavoidantibioticsandallthat.Butthey'reinourfoodsupply.Andweknowthatthey'rein,youknow,ourcattleisbeingfedthem,ourchickensarebeingfedtheantibiotics.Soweareexposedtoantibioticslikecrazy.Andsoantibioticsisahugeoffendertoourguthealth.Theyarekillingthebadbacteriabutthey'realsokillingthegoodbacteria.Wealso,ofcourse,leakygutlikewetalkedabout,thatelevatedLPSfromleakygutisreallysuchahugedriverinpoorguthealth.

Likeyoumentioned,IthinkyoumentioneditRoundup,youknow,glyphosates,thepesticidesthatareonourfood,youknow,wedidnotseeany,youknow,wedidn'tseekidswithautismandallergies.IknowwhenIwasachild,Ididn'tseehardlyanyofthat.Andnowit'ssorampantandwe'reseeingitallover.AndwereallytheremustbeadirectcorrelationbetweentheuseofglyphosatesandRoundupandthisincidenceofautismandallergiesandotherbehavioraldisordersbykids.

Sowealsofeelthatstressisahugeoffendertoguthealth.We'veseenitallthetime.Youknow,notjustphysicalstressbutemotionalstress.Allofthesethingsarecontributingtowreakinghavoconthegutflora.


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Andthensugarisanotherone,youknow,sugarfeedstheyeastanditcausesovergrowthofyeastinthegut.Sowereallywannatrytoavoidsugaratallcoststoo.Sotryingtoeatcleanalwaysisveryhelpful.

Katie:Yeah,absolutely.AndIthinkalsothat'sverymuchwhereprobioticscomein.BecauseyoucanexplainthisbetterthanIcan.Butinpreviousyears,andthroughouthistory,weinteractedwithalotmoredifferentvariationsofbacteriainourdailylifeandthroughourenvironment.Andthat'slargelychanged.Socanyouwalkusthroughbasicallywhatprobioticsifthey'reworkingcorrectly,whichwe'regonnagointosomemythsinaminute,butifthey'reworkingcorrectly,whataretheydoinginthegut,that'sbeneficial?

Tina:Well,thefirstpartistheyneedtoarrivealive.Sowhentheyget...whenthebacteriagetsintothegut,theyneedtoarrivealive.Andwhentheygetthere,theystarttocolonize.Andsotheyattachtheintestinalcellwall.Sotheyneedtoarrivealiveandthenconferabenefitontothehost,whichisthebody.Sowewantthemto,youknow,gettothat...gettotheintestinesandactuallycolonizeandstarttoshiftthatbalanceofgoodandbadbacteriasothatthegoodbacteriaisoutpacingthebadbacteria.

Sothat'sareallyimportantthing,isthatwhatourbacteriaisdoingishelpingbalancethegoodandthebadbacteria.Andwe'retryingtokeepthingsfromovergrowing.Wewant,therearecertainbacterialikeCandida,forexample,isagreatexample.Imean,peopleworry,theyeitherworryaboutCandidaovergrowthandallthat.Butwehavetorememberthatwedon'twannajustgetridofalloftheCandida.Wejustwantit...becauseCandidaisanormalpartofourgutflora.SoisH.pylori.Thesearenormalpartsofourgutflora.It'sjustwhentheybecomeovergrownthattheystarttobecomeproblematic.

Sooneofthebiggestthingswithahealthygutisdiversity.Soweneedadiversemicrobiome.Everyexpertouttherewouldagreethatinordertohavehealthymicrobiome,youhaveadiversemicrobiome.Sowereallywannamakesurethatwedoallthethingspossibletohaveahealthyanddiversemicrobiome.Becausewhenyouhaveadiversemicrobiomemeansyouhavehealth.

Katie:Thatmakessense.AndIalsonoticedwhenitcomestoprobiotics,thereissuchawidevarietyofdifferenttypes.Andsoifyoujustgoinanystore,pickupabunchofdifferentprobioticsandlookatthebacksofthem,you'llseeallofthesedifferentstrains.Socanyoukindofgiveusanoverviewofwhatthetypesofdifferentstrainsofprobioticsthatyoumightfindinsupplementsandhowtheymightimpactthebodydifferentlyorbeuseddifferently?

Tina:Oh,yes,forsure.Sothemajorityofprobioticsonthemarketaremadeupoflactobacillusandbifidobacterstrains.Andsothat's99%oftheprobioticsyoufindonthemarketaremadeupoflactobacillusandbifidobacter.Andreally,theapproachthatwastakenwithusingtheselactobacillusandbifidobacterstrainswasbasedonwhatweusedtoknowaboutthemicrobiome.Now,withthe,youknow,studies,thefindingsthatcameoutoftheHumanMicrobiomeProject,weknowmorethanweeverdidbefore.Andmanystudieshaveidentifiedalotoftheissueswiththeapproachofusinglactobacillusandbifidobacter.Andoneisthatthosestrainstendtobeverysensitiveorganisms.Theyhavetremendousdifficultysurvivingthegastricsystem,youknow,thestomachisknownasthegastricbarrier.Andtherehavebeenmanystudiesthathave


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actuallyshownthattheselactobifidostrains,likeIsaidwhicharethestrainsthatarefoundthemostcommonprobiotics,simplydon'tmakeitpastthestomachacid.Sotheyreallyneverarrivealive.

Andmanyofthestudiesthathavebeendoneonprobioticsactuallyhavebeenonthedeadbacteriathathavecomeintotheintestine.Soanotherissuewiththelactobacillusandbifidobacterstrainsinsupplementformisthatthey'reaerobicorganism.Sothey'remadeinalabutilizingoxygen,butthentheytrytoliveinyourgut,inananaerobicenvironmentwherethere'snooxygen.Soeveniftheycouldgettherealive,theyareveryunstablebecausethey'reinthewrongenvironment.Sothelactobifidostrainswere,youknow,fineformanyyears,itwasthebestthatweknewbasedontheunderstandingthatwehadbefore.Butnowthatwe'velearnedsomuchaboutthehumanmicrobiomeandourguthealthandhowitworkedfromtheHumanMicrobiomeProject,weseethatthereisamuchbetterapproachtothat.

Soanotherstrainthatisreallyimportant,ofcourse,arethespores.Youknow,thebigthingwefoundwiththelactobacillusisthatwhereinnaturedidweseethis?Youknow,youdidn'tfindlactobacillusandbifidobacterstrainsinourenvironment.Theonlytimeweactuallywereinoculatedwithlactobacillusandbifidobacterstrainswasthroughvaginalchildbirthorbreastfeedingandcloseskintoskincontact.Butafterthat,ourancestorsdidn'tgetlactobacillusandbifidobacterfromtheenvironment.Itwasreallyonlywhenweinoculated,youknow,duringchildbirth,vaginalchildbirthandbreastfeeding.So,youknow,thereisacompletelydifferentcategoryofprobioticstrainsknownasBacillusspores.AndBacillussporeswereabundantlyfoundintheenvironment,andourancestorswouldgetthembecausetheyateofftheland.Andunfortunately,nowoursoilisoverfarmedandcontaminatedandnolongerhastheBacillusstrains.

Youknow,ifyougotoatribeinTanzaniaandsomeotherlesspopulatedareasoftheworld,youwillseethatthosebacillusstrainsstillexistandyouseethatthere'svirtuallynoincidenceof,youknow,Crohn's,colitis,IBD,foodallergies,autism,nothinglikethatisrampantbecausethey'reeatingofftheirlandandthey'regettingtheseBacillusstrains.So,and,youknow,asImentioned,theHumanMicrobiomeProjecttoldusmoreaboutthegutthanweeverknewbefore.So,youknow,theprobiotics,thesporesarereallywereformulatedbasedonwhatwenowknowfromtheHumanMicrobiomeProject.

Andoneofthebiggestadvantagesofspore-basedprobioticsisthattheynaturallysurvivethegastricsystem.Sosporeshavethis...they'recalledsporesbecausetheyhaveanendosporeshellaroundthemselves.Sotheydon't...it'snotlikeamushroomsspore.Theyhaveanendosporeshellaroundthemselves.Andthatshellallowsthemtosurvivethegastricsystemandgettotheintestines100%alive.Sothisisanaturalprocess.Wedon'tentero-coatthemoranythinglikethat.Thisisjustanaturalprocess.Sotheygetthereandtheyarealive.Andoncetheygettotheintestines,theygointotheirlivevegetativecellstate.Andsoit'sinterestingbecausethesporesareactuallydormantinthecapsule.Sothey'renotliveorganismswhenthey'reinthecapsule.It'snotuntiltheyhittheintestinesthattheyrecognizeitasitshome.Andthat'swhenitcomesoutofitsdormantstateanditbecomesalive.

So,it'savery,verydifferentapproachthanthemajorityofprobioticsontheshelves.Andthebestwaytodescribeitisbasically,Ilovetousethisgardenanalogybecauseit'sreallythebestwaytodescribeit.Ifyouenvisionagarden,andthegardenhasbeensteppedonandtrampledon,andthere'sweedsgrowingalloverthatgarden,thelactobacillusandbifidobacterapproachwastore-seedthegut.Sotheywouldthrowthe


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seedsinthegarden,mostofthemnevergottherealive.Butlet'ssaytheydid,theyjustwouldpassthrough,theywouldmaybeplantaplanthereandthereinthegardenbutthentheywouldleavethegarden.

Withthespores,it'sverydifferent.Youthrowtheseedsinthegarden,theygetthere100%alive.Andtheyactuallyhavetheabilitytoattachtothesoil,andtheyhavetheabilitytogetridoftheweeds.Andthentheyhavetheabilitytobringthoseplantsthathavebeensteppedonandtrampledonbacktolife.Soifyoubringthatbacktothegut,thesestrains,thesporesareactuallygoingin,attachingtotheintestinalcellwall.Theyhavethecapabilityofgettingridofthepathogensinourgut.Andthentheyhavetheabilitytocreatecompoundsandnutrientstogrowourgoodbacteria.Andthisishowwereallycreatediversityinthegut.Sothesporesareavery,verydifferentapproachtoprobioticsandreallyfarmoreeffectiveandreallymeetthedefinitionofwhataprobioticis.

Katie:That'ssofascinating,Icouldgeekoutonprobioticandguthealthallday.AndIknowthatbecauseI'veactuallygottentoseesomeoftheresearchfromyou,thatyouguysactuallyhavedemonstratedthatsurvivalabilityof,Ibelieveitwas1000times,upto1000timesasmuchastheprobioticsforinstanceinlikeyogurtorfermentedfoods,amIrememberingthatcorrectly?

Tina:Yep,youabsolutelyare.Yeah,therewasastudydonebySilicaLabs,andtheytooktheleadingsellingprobioticthatsoldonthestoreshelves.AndthentheytooktheleadingsellingyogurtandtheleadingsellingGreekyogurt,andallofthemdied99.99%bythetimetheygottothegastricsystem,orbythetimetheygottotheintestines.AndthestrainsinJustThrivesurvived100%.Andthat'sprofound.Imean,absolutelyprofound.

Katie:Andalso,evenathightemperatures.ThatwassomethingthatIfeltlikealsowasreallydifferentiatedwithyouguys,isthathowhighIcan'trememberexactlyhowhighoftemperaturestheycansurvive,butit'sevenlikecookingtemperatures,right?

Tina:Yep,exactly.Wetestedthemupto455degreesandtheysurvived.Soyoucould,youknow,throwtheminyourkidscookies,youcould,youknow,bakewiththem.Yourkidswouldn'tevenknow.Iusedtoputitinmyson'soatmeal,pipinghotoatmeal,andyouknow,hedidn'tevenknowitwasthere.Soitwasperfect,becausethey'retasteless,colorless,andodorlesstoo.Soyouwouldn'tevenknowit'sthere.

Katie:Andtocirclebackalittlebit,justtoputabookend,Idon'twannathrowfermentedfoodstotallyunderthebusbecauseIgetthatquestionalot.Fermentedfoodswouldhavethemorelikelactobacillustypestrains,andthosearepartoftraditionaldietsthroughouthistory.AndIdon'tthinkthere'sanythingwrongwiththat.Ithinkwenowunderstandthatthoseprobioticsandthosestrainsinfermentedfoodsinteractwiththebodyalittledifferentlythanwethoughttheydid.

AndIthinkwe'realsostartingtounderstandthatwhilewethoughtallthebenefitsoffermentedfoodscamefromtheprobiotics,actually,there'salotofotherwidespreadbenefitsandthefermentationprocessitselfmakesnutrientsalotmoreavailable,forinstance,createsbeneficialacids.SoIdon'twannalikethrowthe


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babyoutwiththebathwaterwhenitcomestofermentedfoods,butIthinkit'simportanttoseparatethosestrains.Haveyouseenanyofthatinyourresearchaswell?Orwhatdoyoudowhenitcomestofermentedfoods?

Tina:Oh,absolutely.Icouldnotagreewithyoumore,Katie.Iamahugefanoffermentedfoods.Andlikeyousaid,it'sthefermentthatreallyiscreatingthebenefit,andit'sallowingustoabsorbnutrientsbetter.SoIdefinitelyeatfermentedfoodsquiteoften.I'mahugefanofthem.IthinkIwouldneverwannaencourageanybodytonot,youknow,continuetotakeortoeatfermentedfoods.WhatIdowannaexplainthough,isthateveniffermentedfoods,you'renotgettingyourprobioticsnecessarilyfromfermentedfoods.You'regettingthebenefitfromthefermentbutyou'renotgettinglivemicroorganismsthatarearrivingintheintestinesalive.So,butIcouldn'tagreewithyoumore.I'mahugefanoffermentedfoodsandIwouldencourageeverybodytoeatfermentedfoodstoincreasenutrientabsorptionandincreaseguthealth.

Katie:Yeah,absolutely.Andsuchanimportantdistinction.Sototransitionalittlebit,IpostedonInstagramthatIwasgonnabeinterviewingyouandaskedmyfollowerswhattheywantedmetoaskyou.AndmyInstagramblewup.Sofirstofall,theyloveyou,whichisawesome.Butalso,theyhavesomanyquestionsaboutprobiotics.AndIknowfromtalkingtoyouthatyoucananswerthemsowell.SoIwannastartgoingdeeponsomeofthecommonmythsandmisconceptionsrelatedtoprobiotics.

Andtostart,specifically,IwanttotalkaboutCFUsbecauseitseemstomelikewe'realmostinanarmsracetothehighestCFUcountrightnow.Andeveryotherweek,Iseeanotherproductonthemarketthat'stryingtoone-upthepreviousproductofhowmanyCFUsitcontains.Soforanyonenotfamiliar,canyouexplaintouswhataCFUisandthenwhatweactuallyneedtoknowabouthowthoseinteractwithourbodyandhowmanyweneed?

Tina:Yep,soCFUsarebasicallythecellcountthatisintheprobiotics.Soweseealotofprobioticsnowthatare50billionCFUs,250billionCFUs.Imean,thenumbershavegottenoutrageous.Andsothebiggesttakeawaywiththatisthat,youknow,thebigmythisthat,oh,50billionisbetterthan,let'ssay,4billionCFUs.Andreallywhatwefoundisthatmoreisnotbetter,youknow.Having50billionCFUsinaprobioticisreallyonlyhelpfulifyoucouldconfirmthat50billionCFUsareactuallysurvivingthedigestivetract.Andwe'rereallyfinding,Imean,wehavedonestudiesoranindependentthirdpartylabactuallyhasdonestudiesonmultipleofthe,youknow,lactobacillusandbifidobacterbasedprobioticsthatareshowingthattheyarevirtuallydying,but,youknow,99%ofthestrainsaredyingbythetimetheygettotheintestine.

So,it'sreallyimportanttofindstrainsthatactuallygettotheintestinesand,youknow,focusonthequalityofthestrainratherthanthenumber.Anditreallyhasbecomeamarketingtoolthat,youknow,thatthey'vebeenusingtoincrease,youknow,thehighertheCFUcount,thehighermaybewecouldaskforaproduct,youknow,price-wise.AndsoIwouldnotfocusonthenumberofCFUs.Iwouldfocusonthequalityofthestrain.

Katie:Thatmakessense.Andfortheaverageconsumer,istherereallyanywaytoknowifyou'rejustlookingatanyprobioticofftheshelf,whatthesurvivabilityisgoingtobeorhowmuchofthatpercentagewiseisactuallygonnareachthegut?


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Tina:Well,theonebiggestthingtodoistofind,makesureyourprobiotichasgastricsurvivabilitystudiessothatthattheyknow.Andyouneedthegastricsurvivabilitystudytoshowthatit'sa1.3orhigher.Sowehaveonourpackagingthatit's,youknow,independentlyverifiedtosurvive.Andwewouldjustsuggestthatyoulookforasymbolofthatshowingthatitsurvives.Infact,ifyoulookcloselyatalabel,alotoftimesit'llsay,50billionCFUsattimeofmanufacture.Well,thatdoesn'tdousmuchgoodwhen,youknow,yougotothestore,youputitinyourcar,youbringithomeandthenyou,youknow...afteracouplemonthsit'sbeensittingthereandyou'retakingit.Sothe50billionattimeofmanufacturereallydoesn'ttellyoumuch.Somakesurethatitdoesn'tsaythat.Youdon'twantittosayatthetimeofmanufacturebecausethenthey'reprettymuchguaranteeingit'snotgonnabetherewhenyouactuallytaketheproduct.

Katie:Gotit.Thatmakessense.Whataboutwhenitcomestorefrigeration?BecauseIknowmanyprobioticsrequirerefrigeration.Andthiswasaquestionthatcameupwiththeaudiencequiteabit,thatthere'sthisconceptionthatyouneedtohaveaprobioticthatrequiresrefrigerationandthat'showyouknowit'shighquality.Sowhydosomeprobioticsneedtoberefrigerated?Andisthatactuallyagoodmetricofifit'sgoodornot?

Tina:Oh,I'msogladyoubroughtthatupbecausethisismyfavoritemythtotalkabout.Becauseitactually,whenyouthinkaboutit,itdoesn'treallymakesense.Youknow,aprobioticneedstoberefrigeratedinordertobeagoodprobiotic.Butyet,that'sactuallyasignofaweekprobiotic.Becauseifaprobioticneedstoberefrigerateditmeansthatitcan'twithstandtheroomtemperatureofthestoreshelf.Soifitcan'twithstandroomtemperatureofthestoreshelf,youknow,howisitgonnasurviveyourbodytemperature,whichis98.6,letalone,youknow,gettingtotheharshenvironmentofthegastricsystem?

So,Ithinkthatstarted,that,youknow,mythaboutprobioticsneedtoberefrigeratedstartedwiththereweresomethatweredeadbefore,youknow,onthestoreshelf.Andsothentheideawastoputthemintherefrigeratorbecausethentheywerealiveandtheywerestayingalive.Butitjustdoesn'tmakesensefromascientificperspectiveatallthatitwouldneedtoberefrigeratedbecauseifitcan'twithstandtheroomtemperatureofastoreshelf,itcan'twithstand,certainlyitcan'twithstandamuchhottertemperatureof98.6inyourbody.SoIwouldsayit'sasignofaweekprobioticifitneedstoberefrigerated.

Katie:That's,yeah,sological.Itmakessenseandalsosomuchmoreconvenient.Iknowforawhile,yearsago,Ihadalltheseprobioticsinmyfridgeandtheytookupsomuchspace,soit'sgreattoknowthat'snotrequired.Anotherthingthatcameupalot,andwetouchedonitalittlebitinthebeginningbutwerequestionsrelatedtocandidaandifpeoplehavecandidaovergrowth,cantheytakeprobiotics?Iknowsomesourcessayifyouhavecandidadon'ttakeprobiotics.Whathaveyoufoundinyourresearchoftherelationshipbetweencandidaovergrowthandprobioticsandwhatdoweneedtoknowtobeaconscioususerofprobioticsifwehavecandida?

Tina:Wellthebiggestthing,likeIhadmentioned,isthatcandidaistheovergrowth.Soit'stellingusthatwe'reoutofbalanceofsomesort.Soweknowthatthesporescouldgointhereandactuallyrebalancethatgut.Imean,thesesporesareactuallygoinginandtheyreadthemicrobialenvironment.Sooncetheygetinthere,theyrecognize,sothey'regonnabedoingsomethingdifferentinyourgutthanthey'regoingtodoinmygut


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becausethey'relookingtoseewhat'sgoingon.Andsoiftheynoticeanovergrowth,they'regoingtoactuallycompetitivelyexcludethatovergrowthofcandida.They'renotgonnagetridofitentirelybecauseit'sanormalpartofourgutflorabutthey'regonnacompetitivelyexcludethatovergrowth.Sotakingsporesisprobablyoneofthebestthingsyoucoulddoforcandida.

Iknowalotofpeopletaketheantifungalswhichisgreat.It'sjustthatit'snotsomethingyouwannatakeforalongperiodoftimebecausewedon'twannagetridofthecandidacompletely.Wewannamakesurethatwearekeepingthecandidathereandjustcompetitivelyexcludingitandgettingridofit.Iliketousetheanalogyoflikethebacteriaelbow,thesporeswillelbowoutthatovergrowth.Sothey'regonnacompeteforspaceandthey'regonnarebalancethegut.Sothat'sthebiggestthing.Ifyougobacktothatgardenanalogy,they'regettingridofthepathogens,they'regettingridofthingsthatareovergrown.Andthey'realsobringingthegoodstuffbacktolife.Sotheyreallydoanincrediblejobofreadingthemicrobialenvironmentandrebalancingthegutfloratothewayit'ssupposedtobe.

Katie:I'msogladthatwheretheresearchisnowshowingthismuchmorebalancedapproach.BecauseIthinkforawhile,itseemedlikeourapproachtoguthealthkindofmirroredourapproachtogermsinourenvironmentandwewerejustlike,"Killeverything,sanitizeeverything."Andtherewere,Iknowforalongtime,thereareallthesecleansesthatweresupposedtogetridofcandidaandparasites,allofthesethings.AndIwasalwaysleeryaboutthatbecauseIwondered,"Firstofall,throughouthistory,peoplehaven'tbeenabletodocleansesortosterilizetheirgutsatall.Andpeoplewereinteractingwithnaturemuchmorethanwedonowandprobablyhadparasitesindifferentwaysthanwedonowandwerefine.Andinfact,largelywe'rehealthierthantheoutcomeswe'reseeingtoday."

SoIalwayswonderediftherewaslikeasynergisticabilityofthesethingsthatweneededtheminsomeamountsbutitwasallaboutthebalance.Anditmakessomuchsensenowhearingyoutalkaboutthisandseeingthestudiesthatourbodyismadetobeabletohandlethesethingsbutintheproperamount.Andit'sonlywhenthatbalanceshiftsoronestraintakesoverthatit'sreallyproblematic.Sowe'renottryingtojustnukeourgutandkilleverything.It'saboutlettingthegutfinditsownbalanceandthenrecoverwhichIthinkissuchanimportantdistinction.

Tina:Yes,forsure.Icouldn'tagreewithyoumore.

Katie:Soformoms,especially,Iknowthatthere'ssomanyquestionsrelatedtoallergiesandeczema,thingsthatareverycommonamongchildrenandsomanydifferingopinionsaboutifprobioticsareokayinthosesituationsandwhatkind.Andespeciallybecausealotofprobioticscontaindairy,forinstance,theywouldbenotindicatedinchildrenwhohavecertainlyfoodallergiestothosespecificcompoundsbutalsoeveneczema.Sowhathaveyouguysfoundaboutspore-basedprobioticsandifthey'reokaytousewithconditionslikeeczemaandallergiesandautoimmunediseaseandanyimpacttheymayhaveinthebodythatcouldimpactthoseconditions?

Tina:Yeah,that'sanawesomequestion.Thanks,Katie.Becausenotonlyisitsafe,Imeanit'sprobablyoneofthebestthingtheycoulddoisusingspore-basedprobioticsto,likewesaid,rebalancethegut.Weknowthat


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sporesareactually,theyhavetheabilitytoactuallytutoryourimmunesystem.Sotheyactuallyhelptheimmunesystemdetectandattackpathogensandtoxinsinthebody.Sothesporeswillup-regulatetheT-regsystemand,youknow,whichofcoursewillsuppresssomeunfavorableimmuneresponsessuchasallergiesandfoodsensitivity.

Sotheothergreatthingisthere'snodairyinourproduct.There'sno,youknow...wehavenoother...it'sjustthestrains,nonuts,nocorn,nothinglikethat.It'savery,verycleanproduct.Andweknowwitheczema,samething.It'sanautoimmuneissue.Wealwayssaywithskinissues,Imean,skinissuesarestartinginthegut,whetherit'sacne,whetherit'seczema,it'sstartinginthegut.Andweknowthatthesestrainsarehelpingtocleanupthegutfloraandmakeamorefavorablediversehealthygutmicrobiomewhichwill,inturn,youknow,helpyourgutreactdifferentlytosomeofthese,youknow,allergensthatwe'reexposedtoandstuff.Sodefinitely,probablyoneofthebestthingstheycoulddoforanyofthoseconditionsistakingspores.

Katie:AndIheardfromsomanypeopleonInstagramwhohadstartedtakingyourprobioticandyourstrainsandnoticedactualimprovementsintheirautoimmunedisease.Socertainly,it'snotthatwecansayit'sgoingto,youknow,fixanautoimmunediseaseacrosstheboardbutIheardanecdotallyfromsomanypeoplewhodidhavethatexperience.AnotherquestionthatkeptcominguponInstagramwaswhatabouthistamine?BecauseIknowthatcanbeanissuewithmanyprobioticsandit'ssomethingthatthere'sincreasingawarenessaboutrightnow.Socanyoutakeusthroughalittlebitofjustkindofwhatthehistamineequationlookslikeinthebody?Andhow,ifanything,theseprobioticsinfluencethat.

Tina:Yes,Idefinitelycan.Ijustwantedtotouchontheautoimmunepeoplethathad,youknow,saidthatthey'vehadsomesuccesswiththeproduct.Sothanksforsharingthat.Butthebiggestthingis,ifyouhaveanautoimmuneissue,youknowyouhaveleakygut.Sonowwehave...thereasonthey'reprobablyhavingsuchgreatsuccessisbecauseweknowthatthesestrainsarestoppingthoseLPStoxinsfromgoingintothebloodstream.Andnowyou'renothavingthatconstantinflammatoryresponsefromtheLPSlevelsgoingintothebloodstream.Soit'sreallyexciting.Youknow,ifsomebodydoeshaveanautoimmuneissue,weknowyouhavealeakygut.Andsonowwe'vegotsomethingthat'sactuallyhealingthatleakygut,and,youknow,sealingupthetightjunctions.Soit'sveryexcitingwiththespores.

Andthenforhistamineintoleranceit's,what'sgreatisweknowthat,wellit'snotgreat,butlactobacillusandbifidobacterstrainsweknowcansometimesactuallycause,producehistamine.SoweknowthatthestrainsinJustThrivedonot,thesporesarenotproducinghistamine.Sothisisreallyexcitingforpeoplewho,there'ssomanypeoplewhowouldsay,"Ohmygosh,Ican'ttolerateprobiotics.I'vetriedthem.Iknowthey'regoodformebutIcan'ttoleratethem."AndthenIsay,"Welljusttrythespores.Thesporesareadifferentapproach.Trythat."Andthen,sureenough,theytakeitandthey'refinewithit.Soit'sgreattotakeifyouhaveahistamineintolerance.

Katie:Yeah,I'mgladtoknowthere'sanoptionforthatbecauseforsolong,peoplewouldaskandIdidn'thaveanyresourcetosendthem.AndI'veheardthesamethingnowfromreaders,especiallywhohavekidswithhistamineintoleranceandthey'reabletotolerateitjustfine.Whichactuallyleadstoanotherverymuchrecurringquestionwhichisarethesesafetotakewhilepregnantornursing?Andifso,arethereanyspecialconsiderationsaroundthosetimes?


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Tina:Wealwayssuggestthatyouaskyour,youknow,doctor,ifit'sokaytotakeprobiotics,whichIwouldimaginetheywouldsayyes.Andnotonlyarethesporessafe,theyareprobablyoneofthebestthingsthatwecoulddo.Weknowthatamother'smicrobiomeispassedontothechild.Sothatiswhen,thatistheonlytimeyourchildisinnoculatedwithlactobacillusandbifidobacter,whichareveryimportantstrainstogetduringchildbirth.Soitissoimportantforamomtotakecareoftheirgutmicrobiomebydoinglotsofthingsincludingtakingspores.Soyes,very,verysafetotakewhilepregnantbutofcourse,wealwaysrecommend,youknow,askingthedoctorfirst.

Katie:Yeah,absolutely.Thatwassomethingthatthroughouttheyearsandthroughoutmyresearch,IbecameincreasinglyawareofasIwaspregnantwithmykidsisjustthemorewelearned...therewasagreatmoviecalled"Microbirth"thatreallydelvedintothisprocessthatyoujusttalkedabout.Butjusthowmuchofourimmunesysteminourgutispassedonduringthebirthingprocess.Soasadoulaforyears,I'veactuallyhelpedfacilitatesomeparentswhowantedtoreceivetheirchild'sgutcorrectly,eventhoughtheyneededtohaveaCsectionforany,forwhateverreason,andjusttryingtocreatethatprocessnaturally.Butit'sjustfascinatingtheresearchthatwe'reseeingonthat.

AndIthinkaswecontinuetoresearchthismore,we'regonnaunderstandjustincreasinglyhowimportantpregnantmomsneedtoreallyfocusonthatgutbacteriabecausewehadsuchashortwindowthathaslifelongeffects.Andthankfully,likeifwedidn'tknowthat,IknowIdidn'tknowthatwithmyfirstfewkids,therearesomanythingswecandothatstillhelpbenefittheirgut.Andit'snotallislostbyanymeansbutIfeellikeit'ssuchagreatwindowoftimethatifyouknowthat,thatyoucanreallyoptimizesomuchthroughyourownlifestyle,yourowndietandthroughmakingsureyourgutbacteriaisoptimizedlikethat.

AndIknowthatthenextlogicalquestionisthenwhataboutkids?Ihavegotteneveryvariationofthatquestionfromlistenersof,"CanIgiveittobabies?CanIgiveittotoddlers?CanIgiveittomykids?Whatdose?Cantheyoverdoseonit?"Sohowdoweknowwithourkidshowwecanimplementthis?

Tina:Greatquestion.Yes.Youknow,it'sinterestingbecauseIthinkit'smoreimportantthanevertobegivingsporestoourkids.WeknowourkidsarebeingexposedtoRoundupinrecordamountsthatnoneofuswereexposedto.Nottothatlevelatleastweweren'texposedtoyearsago.Andsoourkidsgutsarebeingattackedsorapidlyonadailybasis.Sothesporesareverysafetotakeforkids.Onourbottle,itsaysthreeandabove.Andthat'sreallymostlyforchokingpurposes.Youcouldopenthecapsules,likeImentioned,andmixitwithfoodordrink.They'retasteless,colorless,odorless,theywouldn'tknow.Soit'svery,verysafetotakeforkids.Youcould,andyoucoulddoafullcapsuleifthey'rethreeandabove.

It'sinteresting.Achild'sadult-likemicrobiomeisactuallyfullydevelopedbyabouttheageoftwoandahalf.Soyoucouldgowithafullcapsuleaftertheageofabouttwoandahalfaslongasyouopenitandmixitsotheydon't,youknow,haveanychokingissues.Butforbabieseven,youcouldstartout,youknow,justtakealittle,maybeaquarterofacapsule.Ifyou'renursingyoucouldsprinkleitonthebreastandhavethebabysuckonit.Youcouldjustputalittleonyourbabyfinger,letthebaby,maybeaquarterofacapsuleandletthebabysuckonitandthenjustslowlytitrateupastheycould,youknowhandleit.


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Sowewoulddefinitelysaythatwecoulddoatleasta,youknow,halfacapsuleforkids.Youcoulddoahalfacapsuleaday.Youknow,splititamongstyourkidsbutabouttheageoftwoandahalf,they'refinetotakeaboutacapsule,aboutafullcapsule.Andthenwhatwealsofoundiswe'vehadcustomerswho'vejustsaid,"My,youknow,mysonisdoingsoincredibleonthis.CanIincreasethedosage?"Andit'sfinetotake,youknow,twocapsulesadayifyou'rereallyseeingsomegreatresultsandyouwanttoseesomethingshappening.Imean,I'vetakenupto,youknow,fiveorsixadayifI'vehad,youknow,somethinggoingon.ButItaketwoadayifI'mtravelingorifIfeellikeI'mrundown,justtokindofboosttheimmunesystemalittlebit.But,youknow,mostofthetimetheyjustoneadayisfineorhalfacapsuleadayisfine.

Andit'salwaysbesttotakeitwithfood.That'sreally,reallyimportant.Alotofpeopleandformanyyears,peoplehavebeentoldtotakeaprobioticonanemptystomach.Butreally,thatwasbecauseyouwanted,whenyourstomachwasemptythepHofyourstomachwashigher,whichwouldallowforgreatersurvivability.WeknowfromthegastricsurvivabilitystudythatwasdoneonthesestrainsthattheysurviveatapHof1.3whichisthenormal,youknow,gastricpHofyourstomach.SoIwouldjustsaytakeitwithfood.Wehaveastudythatshowthatthesestrainsactuallyusethefoodtogerminatethroughouttheintestines.Sojustwaybettertotakeitwithfood.It'snotdangerousoranythingtotakeitonanemptystomach,itjustworksthatmuchbettertotakeitwithfood.

Katie:That'ssuchagreatpoint.Andafunnystoryalongthoselines.Myparentstakethesestrainsaswellandmydadwashavingtroublerememberingtotakethemwheneverheate.Andsoweactuallytapedthebottletothepeppershakerbecausehealwaysusespepper.Sonowheneverforgetswhenhe'seating.

Tina:Oh,Ilovethat.

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Katie:Anotherthingthatkeptcomingupwerequestionsrelatedtoprebioticsandthereseemtobeawidearrayofexperiences.Somepeopletookprebioticsoratefoodsthathadprebioticsandfeltbetter,somepeopletookthemandfeltmuchworse.Basedonthedatathatyou'veseen,wheredoprebioticsfitintothisequation?Andhowdowe,ifwe'regoingtousethem,usethemtooptimizetheprobiotics?

Tina:Yes,greatquestion.Again,thethingwithprebiotics,it'sexactlythewayyoudescribedit.Youknow,ifwehaveahealthygutfloraandyou'retakingprebioticsthenit'sgoingtohelpgrowthegoodbacteria.Butifyouhaveanunhealthygutfloraandyouhaveovergrowthofpathogenicbacteria,thentheprebioticswillfeedthebadbacteriaevenmore.Sothat'swhywewereseeingpeoplewhohavesuchdifferentresultswithprebiotics.

Andsowe,youknow,we'reveryfocusedonbringingproductstothemarketthataremissingandneededintheindustry.Andsowe,ofcourse,knewthatprebioticwouldmakesensetolaunchwithourprobiotic.Buttheproblemiswecouldn'tfindaprebioticthatwasreallyfeedingonlythegoodbacteria.Butwehave,sothat'sexciting.Sowe'reabouttolaunchaprebioticthatactuallyisonlyfeedingthegoodbacteria.Soit'smadeupofallofthesenon-digestibleoligosaccharidesthatactuallyincreasemicrobialdiversityandselectivelyfeedthegoodbacteriainourguts.

Sothebiggestthingwithprebioticsistheycanbereallybeneficialbyfeedingthegoodbacteria.Buttheproblemismostprebioticfibersouttherecan'tdistinguishbetweengoodbacteriaandbadbacteria.Soit'sjustimportanttofindaprebioticthatisonly,youknow,istargetedtofeedonlythegoodbacteria.Solotsofgreatfoods,ofcourse,withprebiotics.Youknow,we'vegot,youknow,onionsandgarlicanddifferentasparagus,apples,bananas,allaregreatsourcesofprobiotics.Butsomepeople,youknow,chicoryroot,Iknowsomepeoplehavedifficultydrinkingthatchicoryrootteabecauseitdoesendupfeedingthegoodbacteriaandthebadbacteria.Butit'sagreatsourceofprebiotics.Butwejustwannamakesurethatyou'refindingprebioticsthatactuallyarefeedingonlythegoodbacteriaandnotthebadbacteria.

Katie:Thatmakessense.AndIknowsomethingthatyouwouldprobablyechomeonisthatlikethe...Ifeellikeprobioticsaresomethingthatanyoneshouldtake.Butwhenitcomestoprebiotics,Ifeellikethat'snotsomethingyoushouldjusttakeasupplementfor.Likeweknowbasedonthedatathatyouneedavarieddietthatincludeslotsoffiberfromdifferenttypesofvegetablesandmicronutrientsfromdifferenttypesofvegetablesbecauselikeyousaidinthebeginning,thatbiodiversityofyourgutissoimportant.AndsoIfeellikethisisoneofthoseareaswhereit'sabothand.Youlike,can'tjustout-supplementaterriblediet.Youneedtomakesureyou'reincludingvarietyinyourfoodsandthenyou'regonnaseebetterresultsfromyourprebioticsaswell.Isthatkindofwhatyougetaswell?


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Tina:Absolutely.Andinfact,thatisoneofthethingsIalwaysencouragepeopletodoistoeatadiversegroupoffoods.Imean,weknowinordertohavediversity,andthesporesareveryhelpfulincreatingdiversity,butoneofthemostimportantthingswecandoistoeatadiversegroupoffoods.Evengoingtodifferentethnicgrocerystoresandeatingadifferenttypeof,youknow,cucumbersfromoneethnicstoreandcucumbersfrom,youknow,yourregulargrocerystore,orjusttryingtofindfoodsthatarereally,reallydifferentisreallygonnahelpcreatemorediversity.Soit'soneofthebiggestsuggestionsImaketopeopleallthetimeistryingtoeatadiversegroupoffoods.Youhelpcreatethatdiversitybecauseweknowdiversityiskeytoahealthygut.

Katie:Absolutely.Toshiftgearsalittlebit.Soyouguys...wellyoumentionedyou'regonnabelaunchingaprebioticandyoualreadyhavethisamazingprobiotic.ButyoualsohaveanothersupplementthatIalsotakeeverydayandthatmyparentstakeeveryday,whichisaK2-7.SoIwannamakesurewetouchonthatalittlebit.Canyoujuststart,justexplaintouswhatthatis?

Tina:Oh,yes.SovitaminK2isanessentialnutrientthatunfortunatelymostofusaredeficientin.youknow,theyaskedme90%ofthepopulationisdeficientinvitaminK2.Andyetit'ssomethingthat'ssoessentialforhearthealthandbonehealth.Butbasically,thejobofvitaminK2istotakecalciumawayfromarterieswherewedon'twantit,youknow,liketheheartandtoputitintotheboneswherewedowantit.Soit'ssoessentialforbonehealthandhearthealth.Andit'sliterallymovingthecalciumawayfromwherewedon'twantittowherewedowantit.

Andit'sactuallyinterestingbecauseK2...soeverybodyknowsthattakingvitaminD3isgreatforbonehealth.Butthere'sonebigmissingpiecetothatstrategy.AndIdon'twanttogettooscientificherebutit'sjustimportanttounderstandthatvitaminD3stimulatesosteoblastcellsinthebones.Andthentheosteoblastcellsreleaseosteocalcin.Soosteocalcinisthebone-buildingprotein.Theproblemisthatosteocalcinisreleasedinaninactiveform.Soit'skindoffloatinginthebodynotdoingmuch.

AndsotheonlywaytoactivatethatosteocalcinisbyhavingadequateamountsofvitaminK2.Andsooncethatactive,thatK2isactivatedbytheosteocalcinitliterallytakescalciumandplaqueandsticksitontothebone.Soit'sreallyhavingtheK2isthecriticallaststep.Youknow,andtheproblemisthattherearepeoplewhoaretakinghighdosesofvitaminDwithouttheK2.Andthenthebody,it'susingupallthebody'sK2whichleadstoaK2deficiency.Andofcourse,ifwehaveaK2deficiencythatleadstohearthealthorheartdisease,I'msorryandbonereabsorption.

AndtheotherproblemisreallytheonlynaturalsourcesofK2arefromorganmeats,Japanesesoy,aproductcalledmaddowandthensomefermentedcheesesinNorthernEurope.Sowe'rereally,wedon'thavealotofsourcesofvitaminK2intheWesterndietatall.AndwealsoknowandtherearesomecrazystudiesoutthereabouthearthealthandvitaminK2.Therewasastudydone,theycalledittheRotterdamstudy.Theystudied4,800menandwomenovera10yearperiod.Soit'saprettyprofoundstudyandtheyfoundthattakingaslittleas45microgramsadayofK2reducedarterialcalcificationby50%.Imean,thereisnothingonthemarketthatcandothis.Imean,anarterialcalcificationisthenumberoneriskforheartdisease.And,youknow,goinghandinhand,theyfoundthat,inthestudy,theyfoundthattherewasa50%reductionin


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cardiovasculardeath.So,obviously,becauseifyouhavereducedcardiacarterialcalcification,you'regonnahaveareducedcardiacdeath.

Buttheotherinterestingfindinginthisstudyisthattherewasa25%reductioninallcausemortalityascomparedtoalowintakeofdietaryK2.Soit'sliterallyshowingthatvitaminK2isincreasinglongevitybysevenyears.Andthestudywasvery,veryprofound.So,youknow,there'salotofotherstudiesonvitaminK2showntoreducediabetesby20%.Inanotherstudy,itwasshowntodecreasecancerrisk.So,therewasastudydoneon23,000GermanadultsthatshowedahigherK2intakewasassociatedwithalowerlikelihoodofdevelopingordyingofcancer.Soreally,really...it'scrazytheimpactit'shad.

Andthescarything,youknow,backtothepharmaceuticalsisstatinsareactuallythenumberoneprescribeddrugforheartdisease.Soyouwouldthinkthatastheamountofstatinsprescribedgoup,theamountofcardiovasculardiseasewouldgodown.Butthat'sactuallynotthecaseatall.Infact,theoppositeistrue.Andtherewasastudythatwaspublishedin2015thatshowedthatstatinsactuallyinterferedwithvitaminK2function.Andbydoingthat,itactuallywould,youknow,helpincreasetheriskofheartdisease.

Sothere'ssomanystudiesandthey'reevenmorestudiescomingoutjustshowingtheimportanceofvitaminK2.Andthey'reevenshowingthatvitaminK2isimprovingthemitochondriaofthecell,sothepowerhouseofthecell.Sothisisreallyimportant.Therewasastudythatshowedthatitactuallyishelpingreviveandrescuedeadanddyingmitochondria.Soreally,reallyimportantinformationandstudiesoutthereaboutvitaminK2andit'simportant.

Andit'ssomethingthatwejustdon'tgetfromourdiet.Andwedon't,unlessyou'reeatingorganmeats,ortheJapanesefoodnatto,whichissuper,superhealthyforyou,we'rejustnotgettingalotofvitaminK2.Sowe,again,wefoundthattherewasaneedforit.ThebigthingisallthestudiesareshowingthatweneedahighdosageofvitaminK2.There'sactuallynoknownlethaldosage.Sothere'sreallynotachanceofever,youknow,overdosingonvitaminK2.There's320microgramsinourformulationofvitaminK2andit'soneofthe,youknow,bestthingswecandoforhearthealthandbonehealthtosupportourbonehealthandhearthealth.

Katie:Yeah,it'samazing.I'veseenthatresearchaswell.There'sentirebookswrittenaboutthecalciumparadoxandtheK2connection.Andit'sjust,yeah,it'ssostaggering.AndI'vepersonallyeatennattoandIwillsayIdon'tthinkit'samainstayintheAmericandiet.Ithasavery,veryuniquetaste.There'sveryfewthingsIdon'tlikeandwon'teat,bananasbeingthetopofthelistandnattobeingsecondastoughthingsformetoeat.SoIlovethatthere'sanalternative.It'snotoneofmyfavoritefoodsatall.IfIremembercorrectly,butthere'salsoastudyrelatedtotheK2andsomethingtodowithathletesandoxygen.I'mnotrememberingthefullstudy.Butwhatistheconnectionthere?

Tina:Yes,thatisincredible.ThatstudyactuallyshowedthattheK2,thiswasdoneonourformulation,anditactuallyshowedanincreaseofcardiacoutputby12%.Sothisishuge.Imean,thisisincreasingtheamountofbloodflowinganditwasincredible.SoImeangreatforathletes.Wesayit'stheonlylegalsportsenhancing,youknow,supplementouttheresobecauseit'sactuallyincreasingcardiacoutputby12%.


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Katie:Whichagainisahugenumberwhenyou'retalkingaboutstatisticalchangesforplaceboinstudy.That'samazing.Iknowforallthemomslistening,we'relookingatthesamequestionswegotaboutprobioticswhichareisitsafewhilepregnantandnursing?Whataboutbabiesandkids,whocantakeitandwhocan't?AndIknowthatit'salso,it'sanutrientthatistalkedaboutduringpregnancyandit'ssomethingthat'sgiventobabies.Sothereisaconnectionthere.Butwhatadvicedoyougiveforthosestagesoflife,pregnancy,nursing,andchildren?

Tina:Greattotakewhilepregnant.Ofcourse,thesamecaveatistoaskyourdoctor.ButIknowthattheauthorofthebook,"VitaminK2andtheCalciumParadox",youknow,dramaticallyincreasedherdosewhileshewaspregnantbecausesheknowshowimportantitis.SogreatforbonehealthasourbabiesaredevelopingtheirjawstructureasDr.WestonE.Pricetaughtus.Andsogreattotakewhilepregnant,nursing.Again,Ialwayssaytoaskyourdoctorbutreally,reallygreattotakeinthosesituations.IgiveittomykidsandmykidsareoldernowbutIgiveittokids.Greatforbonehealthasyourkidsaregrowing.They'regrowingbones,superimportanttotake.

And,youknow,youcouldtakeoneaday.ThewayourK2isformulated,it'stwocapsulesaday.Oneinthemorning,oneatnight.Ifyourkidsareunderabouttheageof,youknow,maybesevenoreightyoucouldjustdoonecapsuleaday.Thatshouldbefine.Butusually,it'stwocapsulesadaybecauseyouget320micrograms.Andalsotakethiswithfood.Sofat,lotsoffat.Soit'safatsolublevitaminsoyouwannatakeitwithfood.

Katie:Gotit.Yeah,whenyoursupplementsarebothonesthatourwholefamilytakesandeventhekids.AndIlovethatit'soneofthefewthingsIcanrecommendthattrulydoesfitprettymucheverybodybecause,likeyousaid,it'shistaminefree,it'sdairyfree,it'sallergen-free,there'snogluten.Sowhetherit'speoplewithautoimmunediseaselikeIhaveorjustkidswhoyouwannamakesurethatthatyou'reonlyputtinggoodthingsintheirbody,there'sreallynocontraindicationslikeyouwouldfindinalotofsupplements.IlovethatandIcanrecommenditcompletely,wholeheartedlyforsure.

Iknowforanyonelisteningwho'sinterestedwhereasIwannamakesurewementionedthatthereisadiscount.Andsothewebsite,makesureIgetthisright,isthriveprobiotic.com/wellnessmama.We'llgiveyouadiscountpage.Iknowyouguysofferdiscountsforbuyinginbulkorforauto-ship.Andthenalsothere'sthediscountcodeWellnessmama15sotheycansave15%.AmIgettingthatright?

Tina:Yes.Thankyou.

Katie:Awesome.AndIcouldnotbelievewe'vealreadyflownthroughalmostanhour.AcouplequickquestionsIlovetoaskattheendandIcan'twaittohearyouranswers.Thefirstbeing,isthereabookorbooksthathavereallyinfluencedyourlifeandthatyouwouldrecommend?


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Tina:Ohyes,theredefinitelyare.IcouldprobablygoonandonbutIwon't.Sooneofmyfavoritebooksthathasreallybeenveryinfluentialinmylifehasbeen,"ICanSeeClearlyNow",byWayneDyer.I'vereadalotofWayneDyer,asImentionedinbeginningoftheinterview.ButIjustlovehisbook.Itjust,youknow,goesintohowyoudon'treallyknowwhythingsareputintoyourlifewhenthey'rehappening.Butyouknowasyougetolderandastimegoesby,youcanlookbackandeverythingissomuchmoreclear.Andyourealizethatitwasputthereforareasonandtoteachyousomething.Andit'sbeen...it'sjustagreatbook.Idefinitelyrecommend,youknow,peoplereadingit.

Ialso,Iknowyou've...I'veheardyoutalkaboutthisbookalotbutitisdefinitelyabookthatchangedmylifeandthat's"TheFourAgreements".It'soneofmyfavoritebooksbyfar.Definitely,Irecommendeverybody,youknow,anychildevengraduatingfromcollege.Ithinkit'sagreatcollegegifttogivetosomebodyandjustanyadult.It'sjustagreatbooktolookatyourlifedifferentlyandwithadifferentlens.Andlovedit,definitelychangedmylife.

Katie:Ilovebothofthose.Andlastly,iftherewasapieceofadvicethatyoucouldspreadfarandwide,whatwoulditbeandwhy?

Tina:Well,youknowwhat?IthinkIwouldsaytodoyourlife'swork.IthinkthatthatisoneofthebiggestthingsthatI'vetakenawayfromthiswholejourney.Ithasbeenthemostgratifying,rewardingthingI'veeverdone.Iget,IstillsaveallthevoicemailsthatIgetfromcustomersthathavehadlife-changingresultsandhandwrittenlettersfrompeople.AndIjustamsogladthatIdidmylife'swork.Ifinally,youknow,throughmywholecareerjourney,IfoundwhatIwasreallytrulymeanttodo.

AndIwouldencourageeverybodytoreallydotheirlife'sworkandencourageyourkidstodothattoo.Imean,Ihavetwokidsthataregraduating.One'sgraduatingfromcollegethisyear.AndI'vejustreallytriedtoencouragemykidstofindwhattheyloveandwhattheylovetodobecausethenitjust,itallworksandeverythingfallsintoplacewhenyou'redoingyourlife'swork.

Katie:Forsure.AndIshouldalsonotewhileIhaveyouonherethatI'vequotedyousomanytimesinpodcastinterviewsandotherinterviews.Butyoursayingabouteverythingwillworkoutperfectly,IhavetotallystoleninlovefromyoubecauseIfeellikeyou'reoneofthemostpositive,joyfulpeopleIknow.AndlikeIjust,IlovethatlinethatIthinkwetalkedaboutwhenwefirstmet.Sothat's...yougot,yourthesourceforthat.Iwannamakesureeverybodyhearsthatwhileyou'reonhere.

Tina:Oh,thankyou.Wesaythateverytime,everyday.Everythingworksoutperfectlyforme.I'dencourageeverybodytosaythattoo,everythingworksoutperfectlyforme.

Katie:Onemoretimeforanybodylistening,thriveprobiotic.com/wellnessmamatofindoutmoreanddiscountcodeWellnessmama15.Andofcourse,bothofthosewillbeintheshownotesatwellnessmama.fm.Tina,thankyousomuch.Thishasbeensomuchfun.LikeIsaid,Icouldgeekoutonguthealthforeverandthatyou'resuchawonderfulexpertandalightinthisindustry.AndIreallyappreciateyourtimetoday.


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Tina:Oh,thankyou,Katie.Itwasanhonortobeherewithyou.

Katie:Andthankyouforallofyouforlisteningandsharingyourmostvaluableassetofyourtimewithustoday.AndIhopethatyouwilljoinmeagainonthenextepisodeofthe"WellnessMamaPodcast".

Ifyou'reenjoyingtheseinterviews,wouldyoupleasetaketwominutestoleavearatingorreviewoniTunesforme?Doingthishelpsmorepeopletofindthepodcast,whichmeansevenmoremomsandfamiliescouldbenefitfromtheinformation.Ireallyappreciateyourtime,andthanksasalwaysforlistening.

episode 244: debunking probiotic myths with just thrive founder … · 2019-04-01 · 1 episode...

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