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  • Paleo Magazine Podcast Episode 101

    2015 Page !1

    Podcast Episode 101


    Tony Federico: Hey, Paleo Nation. I’m Tony Federico and you’re listening to Paleo Magazine

    Radio, the official podcast of the original Paleo lifestyle publication.

    Today’s episode features the Bulletproof Executive, Dave Asprey, a man

    equally known for Bulletproof Coffee and biohacking. Dave and I discuss the

    differences between his Bulletproof Diet and Paleo; examples of how

    technology can actually improve health; why avoiding anti-nutrients is a habit

    to get into; what mycotoxins are, and why you should care about them; why

    Europe and Japan send their reject coffee to the United States; and why he

    doesn’t like cheat days.

    In the second half of the show, Adam Farrah joins me for another installment

    of Big Picture Paleo. Adam and I are both big fans of foam rollers, so we dive

    deep into the benefits of myofascial release. So, grab a cup of buttered coffee

    and kick back in your sensory deprivation chamber. Episode 101 of Paleo

    Magazine Radio starts now.


    Tony Federico: Hey, everybody. Welcome to another episode of Paleo Magazine Radio. I’m

    here with the Bulletproof Executive, Dave Asprey. Dave, welcome to the


    Dave Asprey: Hey, Tony. Thanks for having me.

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    Tony Federico: Well, this is a pleasure. I certainly have been wanting to get you on the

    podcast for a while now. We had the opportunity to meet at Paleo f(x). And

    the reason why this is such a pleasure is, I was moderating a panel, and I

    believe it was on the subject of biohacking, or some such thing. But I think it

    was probably the most fun that I had moderating a panel thus far.

    And a big part of that is, your participation was great. I loved it. We did

    something which we don’t normally do, which was run the audience through a

    meditation experience, and you talked people through it, and how to do some

    deep breathing. And I just really appreciated your willingness to step up and

    make the experience fun and engaging and memorable for the people in

    attendance. So, ever since then, I’m like, man, we’ve got to get this guy on

    the show. So, I’m glad that we were able to make that happen.

    Dave Asprey: It’s my pleasure to be here.

    Tony Federico: {Laughter}. All right, man. So, as I said, first time on the program: I want to

    give people an introduction to Dave Asprey; to the Bulletproof program. And

    I think a good place to start is the Bulletproof Diet itself. And obviously our

    listeners are well-acquainted with the Paleo diet. They know about eating all

    their fruits, and vegetables, and grass-fed meats, and things of that nature.

    There’s a lot of overlap with Bulletproof. Where are the differentiators?

    Where are the things that really make Bulletproof different than Paleo, and the

    key things that you want people to take away?

    Dave Asprey: Sure. The Bulletproof Diet hit the New York Times best seller list—about

    100,000 copies of it sold. And one of the big differentiators there is that it

    derived from an anti-aging mindset. I’ve run an anti-aging nonprofit research

  • Paleo Magazine Podcast Episode 101

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    and education group for a decade; and also from a fertility perspective,

    including some Weston A. Price type of teachings, which are also precursors

    to the modern Paleo movement.

    Where it diverges from Paleo is in two big areas. One of them is that, I just

    don’t believe that cavemen had mass spectrometers…

    Tony Federico: They didn’t?

    Dave Asprey: …and microscopes and things like that. So, I think we can do better than our

    caveman ancestors. And one example there would be xylitol, which comes

    from birch trees. And xylitol is not probably something that our cavemen

    ancestors ate; yet, it’s a sweetener that doesn’t raise your insulin levels and

    allows you to have a full spectrum of flavors that are out there.

    I’m a huge proponent of Brain Octane Oil, which is not medium chain

    triglyceride oil; it’s a subset of medium chain triglyceride oil that raises the

    ketone levels in your blood much higher than coconut oil possibly can. A

    caveman in a tropical environment would have eaten, say, whatever—two

    tablespoons of coconut oil. But if, today, a biohacker on the Bulletproof Diet

    eats two tablespoons of Brain Octane Oil, that is the equivalent of about 36

    tablespoons of coconut oil, to get this kind of oil. You simply can’t get oil that

    raises the ketones in your blood enough in the presence of carbohydrate.

    So, what we’re doing is, we’re saying, we evolved to do these things; but, by

    using science and technology, we can actually take advantage of what our

    bodies were evolved to do, to make it do what we want, even though it’s not

    necessarily what it would have done if we were just eating what cavemen ate.

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    Tony Federico: So, maybe, rather than striving for an ancestral paradigm of health, you’re

    trying to take it beyond that into a technologically-supplemented or enhanced

    state of well-being.

    Dave Asprey: That’s a good way of putting it. And there’s also this viewpoint in Bulletproof

    that, actually, anti-nutrients are more important than micronutrients. They’re

    both important. If you have a long-term micronutrient deficiency, you won’t

    like how you feel.

    But if you’re doing something lame like smacking yourself with anti-

    nutrients, whether it’s from eating whole grains every day, or these other

    micro – or, these other anti-nutrients that come from Mother Nature or from

    manmade sources – one source of anti-nutrients is overcooking your protein

    and fats, which is very common in Paleo. So, you do that, and you’re like, oh.

    That’s not so good. It doesn’t matter that you made Paleo fried chicken. You

    still fried it {laughter}.

    Tony Federico: (Sounds like: That’s a shame).

    Dave Asprey: It still was going to be inflammatory. So, cooking techniques matter, and

    storage and processing techniques matter. And I’m one of the people

    sounding the alarm about mycotoxins in food. And I have 1,200 studies about

    one mycotoxin on the website here, and yet there are still some Paleo people

    who are like, mycotoxins don’t matter.

    I’m like, I just don’t get it. Because cavemen didn’t get mycotoxins. They ate

    fresh food, or they ate no food. Or maybe they ate spoiled food; got sick;

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    threw up. But they didn’t have a chronic low dose of these toxins. And that is

    endemic in our food supply now, and it is harming our fertility; it’s harming

    our cognitive performance. And it’s just bad for you.

    Tony Federico: Well, let’s zero in on that. Because I think that that’s certainly a big

    differentiator between Bulletproof and Paleo, is this discussion of mycotoxins.

    Can you give us a little mycotoxin primer—a little breakdown? And then,

    where are the most common sources, as you said, of these chronic exposures

    to them?

    Dave Asprey: Sure. Mycotoxins—it’s a fancy name for mold toxins. And whenever there’s

    a mold or a fungus present, it tries to say, basically, this is my cheese

    {laughter}. It says that by pumping out toxins.

    Tony Federico: It’s very territorial.

    Dave Asprey: It is. In fact, the first well-known mycotoxin is penicillin. And we discovered

    that on a cantaloupe. And what they found in the laboratory was, wow, when

    this mold is growing, it kills all the bacteria in the dish. Interesting. And what

    happened what, the mold penicillium – which, by the way, does make one of

    the really nasty toxins for humans; it also makes something that can save our

    life. It’s not like all mold toxins are bad. It’s that the ones that are neurotoxic,

    and the ones that cause oxidative DNA damage, and the ones that damage our

    mitochondria—like the one most commonly found in coffee—those are


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    And I’m working to eliminate those from our food supply as much as we can,

    recognizing that you can never reach a level of absolute zero. Because one

    part per trillion, one part per gazillion, is still going to be out there.

    But what I’m finding is that, when you look at a global map of mycotoxins in

    our food supply—and yes, we do track that, because all countries have limits

    for which mycotoxins are allowed. But some countries have some limits for

    some, but other countries don’t have limits for others. But we map this

    globally because it’s such a major contributor to cancer, and it’s also

    something that – the real reason we map it is that, if you want


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