ohio south youth soccer association board of directors ... 032117.pdf · ohio south youth soccer...

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SHELL COURT REPORTING(937) 855-3406

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OHIO SOUTH YOUTH SOCCER ASSOCIATION

BOARD OF DIRECTORS MEETING

ROBERTS CENTRE

MARCH 21, 2017

6:30 P.M.

- - -

ATTENDEES

John Ruffolo, PresidentMike Martini, Vice-President

Craig Manahan, SecretaryGeorge Sauer, TreasurerJim Sturm, Registrar

Jeff RossiKen BaldeosinghSteve Blieden

Sean CookSean Palmer

Rich MulvaneySolly HiltonBahia SalahTim Feldman

Mohamood Razack

Bud Manley, Vice-Chairman of Region II andState Cup Chairman

BJ Jabbari, State Youth Referee Adm.

Tom Frisbie, Executive Director and StateCommissioner

- - -

Scott RodgersBrian BerningLesh Shkreli

Michael Cockerell

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MR. RUFFOLO: We'll call the

meeting to order at 6:30. Can I have a

motion to adopt the agenda?

MR. STURM: I would like to --

it's my understanding that we're going to

have a presentation from an organization that

would like to talk about their State Cup

forfeiture.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. Before we

get to that, do we have a motion for the

agenda?

MR. MANAHAN: Motion to approve

the agenda.

MR. BALDEOSINGH: Second.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay, second.

Now, what do you want to change?

MR. STURM: I would like to

modify the agenda to allow a discussion from

the organization, which we believe is here,

to allow them to play in the 2017 State Cup.

MR. RUFFOLO: I will move that

into, right before old business.

MR. STURM: I think that would

be an excellent plan.

MR. SAUER: Also, I'd like to

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add an item under new business, the report

from the Financial Committee about Gordon

and --

MR. RUFFOLO: Yes, that will be

at the end, make that 6 (h) because that will

be executive session.

MR. MANAHAN: I have something

to add as well.

MR. RUFFOLO: What do you got?

MR. MANAHAN: I have a proposed

rule change for the State Cup rules, it's

really actually a pretty small one but need

to add that.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. Under new

business we'll make that (h), and then we'll

make the executive contracts (i). Any other

changes? All in favor?

(WHEREUPON, a vote was taken.)

MR. RUFFOLO: Thank you. We

passed out the minutes from the last meeting,

do we have any comments, concerns, or

anything like that? And if not, can I have a

motion to approve?

MR. MANAHAN: Motion to approve

it.

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MR. RUFFOLO: Second, Kenny.

All in favor? Anyone opposed?


MR. RUFFOLO: Thank you. We

have a new Treasurer.

MR. SAUER: Yeah.

MR. RUFFOLO: You got a report,

George?

MR. SAUER: Well, yes and no. I

mean, we've sat here for many years on these

reports and nobody's ever asked any

questions. So I thought my first part, A,

everybody's got the paper here, is, what are

we looking for as a board, what information I

can bring to every meeting to you to help us,

guide us?

I mean, we all look at these and

we all kind of stare at them and, oh, okay,

we've got 1.5 million, this year we had 1.6,

and we go over them all, but is there

anything I can do to help us have a better

understanding or does anybody have any

specific questions they want to have about

the Treasurer's reports? And that's going to

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be part of my report.

My other part is, everybody got

the review from the lawyers -- I mean the

accountants. There was one sentence, I don't

know if anybody else caught it, and it talked

about we draw your attention to the summary

of significant accounting policies noted in

the financial statements, and it says, which

is a basis of accounting other than the

standard accounting principals generally

accepted in the United States, is what we

use.

So I had Tom research it with

the accountants, and they responded basically

that we don't do accrual accounting. And

that's typically what we're doing in the

United States.

So I just wanted to enter that

into the report of what their accountant said

so that it's in our record, so if everybody

else looks at the review they'll see what, I

mean, so -- but everybody can review that. I

just made five copies, I didn't get one for

everybody.

MR. RUFFOLO: We'll just pass it

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around and then we'll just keep one for you,

Tom, I think.

MR. SAUER: But basically most

businesses, which we're not a business, use

accrual. And it was just kind of weird to

see that statement, it's not generally in the

United States, so that's why I talked to Tom

about it.

But other than that, if there's

anybody -- what, you know, please email me or

email the board, what information, I mean,

looking at all these numbers sometimes we

just, we say, oh, you know, let's go on. But

is there anything we can do better to help us

understand what's going on financially in the

business --

MR. RUFFOLO: George, when I

look at these things what I'm looking for is

any big changes in income or losses, okay?

Why do we have increased expenses, what's

going on if we had losses on income, okay?

If we have increased income, I'm loving that,

but that's usually not the case. So that's

what I'm looking for when I look at these

things. And if I see we're on the same page

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pretty much each time we meet, I'm okay.

MR. SAUER: Okay.

MR. RUFFOLO: Anybody else have

any comments?

MR. MANAHAN: Just anything

that's outside the budget, you know, that's a

strange amount budget-wise and, you know,

what John said is exactly. Other than that,

my eyes just glaze over.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. We've got

your income statement and your balance sheet,

is there anything you want to indicate on

that other than what it says?

MR. SAUER: No, I just want you

to say that, speaking of our assets, I think

our assets are up 1.6 versus 1.5 at this time

last year.

MR. RUFFOLO: Tom, is there a

reason why we're up? We didn't pay something

that we paid early last year? Because that's

a significant amount.

MR. FRISBIE: We are looking at

an increase in registration fees over last

year.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. Anybody

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else have any questions on that?

MR. MULVANEY: What did Tom say?

MR. FRISBIE: We increased

registration fees this year and they're going

to be increasing again for the recreational

side for fall.

MR. MULVANEY: Oh, okay.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay.

MR. SAUER: Thank you for your

information and we'll do better next time.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. We did

fine. Our guests, Mo, do they want to come

in and make their presentation?

MR. RAZACK: I couldn't find

him. They're not out there.

MR. RUFFOLO: I could have sworn

he was right out -- okay, we'll push him

back. There he is.

(Lesh Shkreli and Michael

Cockerell joined the meeting.)

MR. RUFFOLO: Lesh, why don't

you grab a couple of chairs right over here.

And, Lesh, I hate to call you on

the carpet now, but we're ready for you. If

you want to introduce yourselves and then,

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obviously this is the board, if you want to

have us ask you any questions, we'll be happy

to do so. But right now if you want to make

your statement, and go forward from there.

MR. STURM: Just for the sake of

brevity of the meeting since we have a full,

full agenda, I would like to ask that the

presentation by them be limited to about five

minutes, with about five minutes set aside

for questioning as appropriate.

MR. RUFFOLO: Is five minutes

enough for you to make your presentation?

MR. SHKRELI: I mean, I got

30 seconds.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay, well, then

we should be okay.

MR. SHKRELI: My name is Lesh

Shkreli, this is Michael Cockerell. You know

what -- you want me to stand up? Okay.

The issue I have in a little bit

is with the decision with the U17 State Cup.

You know what happened last year. Our

intention was never to cheat, to get the

upper hand on the State Cup.

Our administrator made a

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mistake, she forgot to put the player on the

roster, but the player belonged to the team.

That's the argument we have and we feel that

that's our case.

MR. RUFFOLO: You're saying the

player belonged to the team?

MR. SHKRELI: Yes.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. Why wasn't

he on the roster properly?

MR. SHKRELI: She just, somehow

she just -- I don't know what happened.

MR. RUFFOLO: He was not

included on the roster?

MR. SHKRELI: He was on the

roster, but not on the blue roster that day.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay.

MR. COCKERELL: Hi, everybody.

I'm Mike Cockerell. So the admin last

year -- and I'm the admin for the team this

year. I was the U16 admin last year. The

U15 team was the team in question.

The player was on the roster,

the regular roster, she forgot to put him on

the blue roster. And what happened was it

got overlooked the first game and he played,

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and the second game is when the refs saw it

and, you know, they said you can't play,

you're not on the blue roster.

And the young man said, well, I

played last game. So then they said, well,

okay, well, you'll have to forfeit the games.

And this is the understanding I had from the

team admin from last year.

So it was just an honest mistake

that she forgot to put him on the blue

roster. It was a kid that, you know, was not

a starter, was a sub, he didn't play, and I

think essentially we just kind of felt that

the punishment didn't fit the crime. It

wasn't the intention, it was just kind of an

unfortunate incident that we didn't see it

until it was a bit too late. They didn't

catch it at the first game and they caught it

the game after.

MR. RUFFOLO: You guys are aware

our rules indicate that when a forfeit occurs

I believe the next year --

MR. STURM: I have the rule

verbatim if you would like me to read it.

MR. RUFFOLO: Why don't we do

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that.

MR. STURM: Ohio South By-Law

10.5.2. Any team where it has been proved

that they used an ineligible player in

District, State, Regional or National

competition is not eligible to compete

further in the competition in the current

seasonal year and shall not be allowed to

compete in the following year's State Cup or

President's Cup.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. My question

to you is why was this not addressed until

right before applications went in?

MR. SHKRELI: Honestly, I really

don't know.

MR. COCKERELL: From my

understanding --

MR. RUFFOLO: Go ahead.

MR. COCKERELL: -- the team

admin said that when she went to the tent

last year on the Sunday, and I don't know

who, and again it's hearsay, she was told

that it won't count against them for the

following year.

She -- they understood it was

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just a simple mistake and it would not count

against him the following year, especially

since, you know, they, you know, said what

happened, they, you know, said that they

forfeited the game, which she understood

because of her mistake.

And we went ahead with

everything and we figured everything was okay

because, I mean, we essentially were in the

initial seedings or at least on the list for

the seedings, so there was nothing that was

ever -- and plus because the team now, since

it's, you know, the age groups are different,

there's only I think four or five kids from

that team on this team, a lot are still from

last year's U16 team. I think there's nine

new players and maybe five existing.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. Jim?

MR. STURM: This was addressed

in part at the State Cup seeding meeting on

February the 20th. And in that meeting I did

ask Bud Manley as the State Cup Chair

specifically when this rule was shown, was it

proved that they had played with an

ineligible player. Bud, would you relate to

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the board your statement?

MR. MANLEY: Yeah. And I can

really can attest to this because at that

particular time I was at the field when the

boy played the self-schedule game.

And as I put on the original

memo that you guys got for the, for the

telephone vote, what -- and I'll correct one

thing. When the administrators came to the

tent, I told them that I would take it to the

State Cup Committee. At the State Cup

Committee I was -- the committee said that I

didn't have the authority to take it to that

committee. So I made an error.

But that being said, you know, I

felt it was an honest mistake. I mean, Tom

was there at the time that she came. She

was, she was pretty upset that all this

happened, but, I mean, I knew the kid played

because I was there at that same

self-scheduled game.

Now, a couple things that are

probably a little bit in mitigation,

obviously the referees did not check the

roster for the match, so that was kind of one

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mistake.

MR. BALDEOSINGH: At the first

game?

MR. MANLEY: Yes.

MR. BALDEOSINGH: That's why

they allowed the player to play?

MR. MANLEY: Yeah. So then, I

mean, at that point if that would have

happened then they would have, you know, saw

that the boy was not on the roster, you know,

it could have been a moot point at that

point.

So it was, you know, so then Tom

and I -- and that's exactly what I told them

when they came at the second match in the

Round Robin, that we, we told her, you know,

hey, can't play, you'll forfeit your matches.

And I told them I would take it to the State

Cup Committee, which is what I did, you know.

MR. STURM: But my question is,

on February 20th, didn't you tell the State

Cup Committee that it was proved they played

with an ineligible player?

MR. MANLEY: Yes. I mean,

that's in essence what happened.

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MR. STURM: Tom?

MR. MANLEY: Not an unregistered

player.

MR. STURM: No, I said

ineligible.

MR. MANLEY: Right.

MR. STURM: Tom, when you were

part of that decision on that Saturday, at

that time did you tell people from the Blast

organization that they couldn't play anymore

in this year's tournament or they had to

forfeit their games in the 2016 tournament

and they would be ineligible for the 2017

tournament?

MR. FRISBIE: I read all the

by-laws, State Cup by-laws pertaining to that

exact situation regarding forfeiting of that

game due to using an ineligible player,

forfeiture of the rest of their games due to

forfeiture of any game in State Cup, and the

inability to participate in President's Cup

or State Cup the following year.

MR. STURM: At any time since

then did they file an appeal as required by

the Ohio South rules?

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MR. FRISBIE: Not to the best of

my knowledge.

MR. STURM: You and I have

talked about this situation, did you reach

out to anybody else to get their

interpretation of what should transpire?

MR. FRISBIE: I did. At that

time Bud and I worked with Jim Martella, the

National Championship Series Chair, to make

sure the decision we were making was correct,

and that was verified by Jim Martella.

MR. STURM: So the National

Chairman of the National Championship Series

thought the player should be -- was

ineligible and the game should be forfeited

by the rules?

MR. FRISBIE: Correct.

MR. RUFFOLO: Tom, did they

forfeit the rest of the games then?


MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. Anybody

else have any questions or comments?

MR. MANAHAN: Is there a

specific decision that you guys are looking

for from us on this?

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MR. RUFFOLO: We're not going to

do that at this point.

MR. MANAHAN: I'm just asking

the question.

MR. RUFFOLO: We're just, we're

hearing what they have to say first.

MR. STURM: I do have one other

question. Tom, has play already started in

the 2017 State Cup in that age group?

MR. FRISBIE: It has.

MR. STURM: So if they were

allowed back in, we'd have to restructure the

play?

MR. FRISBIE: I would have to --

I would probably have to verify with the

National Championship Series Chair to

determine if that's applicable.

MR. RUFFOLO: Can they do a

play-in game with the team to get into a

spot?

MR. FRISBIE: Well, the teams

have already seeded and teams have already

started playing games. Completed games.

MR. SAUER: They were seeded,

what, originally 12th, I think?

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MR. FRISBIE: I don't remember.

MR. SAUER: But if the 12th

seeded has not played a game then they could

play in the 12th seed?

MR. FRISBIE: I don't know how

many play-ins there were but there are

already play-in games being played, so

theoretically you'd have to re-seed.

MR. RUFFOLO: How many teams are

in that age group?

MR. STURM: If I remember

correctly from the seeding meeting, I think

there was 17, because we had one play-in

game.

MR. RUFFOLO: You had one

play-in game?

MR. STURM: And with them being

12th, it's my understanding they were out,

everybody else moved up a seed, so now we've

got --

MR. RUFFOLO: No play-in games.

MR. STURM: We have no play-in

games but you have different match-ups

because everybody moved up in the standings

or in the bracketing.

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MR. RUFFOLO: All right. All

this generate any comments from you guys?

MR. COCKERELL: The only thing I

would like to just say is, you know, it's, it

was an unfortunate incident. I think if you

look at the grand, the larger picture, at

least in my eyes, it's, you know, the kids

that want to play, that don't understand the

hierarchy of this part, you know, that are

the ones that are going to suffer for this.

They just want the opportunity to play.

It was just a simple mistake.

And again, I just, I just feel that the

punishment does not fit the crime, I mean, it

just, it was a mistake.

I mean, everybody in this room

has made a simple mistake here or there.

They just want the opportunity to play. I

mean, they don't care who or when or

whatever, it just doesn't seem fair to them.

And I understand, I understand

what is involved in this and I understand

everything, but again it just, it was an

unfortunate mistake that wasn't not only

caught by us but wasn't caught by the

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referees as well.

MR. MANAHAN: So, Tom, you said

you read the rules when this all happened,

including the part about the punishment for

this year, right?

MR. FRISBIE: Yeah, at the time

we were with Marcia Bailey who I believe was

the manager of the team, she came to us at

some point possibly during the second game to

add a player to the roster, and that's when

Bud and I kind of were like that -- can't do

that.

And at that point I said if

you've played an ineligible player you would

have to forfeit not only this game but all of

your games. And she became a little bit --

MR. MANAHAN: And next year?

And you won't be able to enter next year?

MR. FRISBIE: Not at that point.

MR. MANAHAN: Okay.

MR. FRISBIE: I brought her into

the tent, at which point I read through each

and every rule for her so she would be aware

of all the impact of what she was about to --

because we were just discovering this also.

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And I read through everything at that point.

We got Jim Martella on the phone and we made

a decision there.

MR. MANAHAN: So, I mean, my

question, given that, why are we just hearing

about it now instead of a year ago? From you

guys, why are we not --

MR. RUFFOLO: That was my

question.

MR. COCKERELL: My

understanding, and again I was with a

different team, my understanding from

speaking with Marcia was that she was under

the impression that, again she was told that

it wouldn't affect the team for next year.

I think that, you know, I

understand that he read the rules, but with a

few other people that might have been in that

tent saying different things --

MR. FRISBIE: She was distraught

at the time, she was pretty shaken up about

it.

MR. COCKERELL: The reason she's

not here tonight is she just felt too much

anxiety. So it's, you know, that's a lot to

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take in when that happens and you have to

explain to a team of 15-year-olds at that

time, 14, 15-year-old kids, so who knows if

she was in her right mind or not.

But, you know, again she was

probably told, you know, probably heard some

different things in her head that, you know,

they won't have to worry about it next year,

or, and then hearing this, maybe she was just

confused about all the different things that

she heard in that tent.

MR. MANAHAN: Okay.

MR. COCKERELL: And then as soon

as we found out that they were out of the

seeding is when we started putting together

emails and letters and trying to find out.

MR. SHKRELI: But to be honest

with you guys, I mean, I'm going to take full

responsibility. I'm the one who put too much

blame she made a mistake, to be honest with

you. If there has to be a punishment, I

think I'd rather get the punishment, not the

team, to be real honest with you.

And the reason I say that is

because, who knows, maybe I probably should

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have followed up right away but I was under

the impression since the new age changes and

stuff like that, because nothing came across,

because our intention wasn't to cheat. And I

think that would have came quick or I would

have heard, you know, since our intention

wasn't to cheat.

And that's kind of how I see

everything, kind of just went around the

whole year not noticed, you know what I'm

saying?

But if it comes to suspension or

anything, I think I'd rather me not coaching

as a suspension of that team than the team

not to play. I mean, I'm fully aware of

that, I mean, I, I mean, I'd rather get a

suspension.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. I think

that's all we have for today. Thank you.

MR. COCKERELL: We appreciate

you guys letting us talk.

MR. RUFFOLO: And we'll take it

under advisement right now.

MR. SHKRELI: Thank you.

MR. RUFFOLO: Thank you very

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much. Appreciate all you're doing for soccer

though.

MR. COCKERELL: Thank you.

(Lesh Shkreli and Michael

Cockerell left the meeting.)

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay, let's go

back to our old business. Appointments. We

have to appoint an alternate Risk Management

Coordinator.

MR. STURM: I would nominate Tom

Frisbie for that role. He has served in that

role for a long time, a number of years.

MR. FRISBIE: Six.

MR. RUFFOLO: Isn't it my

appointment?

MR. STURM: No, actually not.

MR. RUFFOLO: No, it's got to be

approved? Okay.

MR. STURM: It's just like any

other officer.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. Any second

on that?

MR. COOK: Second.

MR. RUFFOLO: All in favor?

Anyone opposed?

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MR. RUFFOLO: Thank you. We now

have to approve an additional approver of

invoices. Jim?

MR. STURM: That is your

appointment, subject to board approval.

MR. RUFFOLO: And I would -- at

this point who approves them, George?

MR. STURM: No. The board

approves it. You name somebody, the board --

MR. MANAHAN: Who approves the

invoices today?

MR. STURM: Tom as executive

director, you, or George.

MR. RUFFOLO: George.

MR. STURM: But there's a

provision --

MR. RUFFOLO: To appoint

somebody else?

MR. STURM: Yes.

MR. RUFFOLO: And I would like

to nominate Mike Martini.

MR. STURM: I move to support

the nomination by the President of Mike

Martini as additional approver.

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MR. RUFFOLO: Mike, I know you

don't know this, but you're it.

MR. MARTINI: Yeah, I got it,

that's all right.

MS. STURM: I made that a

motion, too.

MR. RUFFOLO: Any second?

MR. MANAHAN: Second.


Anyone opposed?


MR. RUFFOLO: Thank you. The

authorization for issuance of credit cards in

OSYSA name. Jim?

MR. STURM: No, that is your

direct appointment for the next three items.

MR. RUFFOLO: Well, it's got

your name there.

MR. STURM: No, I just put it on

the agenda.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. Don't we

already have credit cards in OSYSA's name?

MR. FRISBIE: We do in the --

MR. STURM: The rule says you

have to approve the issuance of those. Not

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that you approve somebody else to do it, but

you approve that they can be issued.

MR. FRISBIE: I don't know, is

there any action due now?

MR. STURM: Well, in theory it

should have happened in January if you've

been using the Ohio South credit card.

MR. FRISBIE: Me?

MR. STURM: Or anybody.

MR. RUFFOLO: He's been -- yes,

everybody, yes, they use it. So I authorize

Tom to get the credit card from American

Express, right?

MR. FRISBIE: We have credit

cards from Twin Valley, we have credit cards

from American Express.

MR. STURM: As needed.

MR. RUFFOLO: As need. Anybody

agree? All in favor?

MR. STURM: Actually, John, it's

not a vote.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay, that's all

right, we'll just go to the next one.

MS. STURM: We just want it in

the minutes is what we're trying to do.

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MR. RUFFOLO: All right.

Executive director appointee, subject to the

approval of the President, a second person

authorized to approve tournaments. I would

like to -- I believe that's Carol right now,

or she no longer --

MR. STURM: No.

MR. RUFFOLO: Who's our first

one, Tom?

MR. STURM: Tom is the State

Commissioner, he approves. I would suggest,

Tom, that Pam be an appropriate person, she's

probably most familiar with those

tournaments.

MR. FRISBIE: I already told

her.

MR. RUFFOLO: All right. So

I've appointed Pam to do that, it's on the

record.

MR. FRISBIE: Did we skip item

four?

MR. RUFFOLO: We did the

Treasurer's report.

MR. FRISBIE: (a) (iv).

MR. RUFFOLO: Oh, I'm sorry. We

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need an additional person to approve expense

reports and who's the first one to approve

it? It's Tom and then me?

MR. STURM: You.

MR. RUFFOLO: And an additional

one, Mike Martini.

MR. STURM: That's all we need.

MR. RUFFOLO: You good?

MR. MARTINI: Yes.

MR. RUFFOLO: All right, thank

you. Let's see, set dollar amount to be

included with an appeal to OSYSA Appeals

Committee, a maximum of $300. What do our

rules call for right now?

MR. STURM: The new constitution

says the board sets the amount up to a

maximum of $300.

MR. RUFFOLO: What is the

current amount for an appeal, Tom?

MR. STURM: $50.

MR. RUFFOLO: $50? Do we have

any motions on setting the maximum?

MR. STURM: I would set the

appeal amount to be included with any appeal

at $300.

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MR. RUFFOLO: Any second on

that?


MR. RUFFOLO: Any discussion?



MR. RUFFOLO: All right. Tom,

Risk Management.

MR. FRISBIE: That's going to be

the issue that you --

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. In your

packet Jim provided for us some proposed

changes, after speaking a little -- I believe

he spoke with Greg Page on some of the items.

MR. STURM: John, I have not

spoken to him. What this is, Tom passed this

out at the January meeting and I took a look

at it, and the stuff that's in the gray

highlight is stuff that I was wanting to go

to Greg to get his opinion on some of the

questions.

Some of it, you know, we know

that we don't do anymore, and so when we're

redoing it I thought we ought to just really

clean it up top to bottom.

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MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. I spoke

with Greg today, I had about an hour

conference with him going through this. He's

got a lot of different comments.

What I would like is, can we

have a committee set up just to meet with him

and go through with all his comments, because

I didn't want to make those yea, nay, or

whatever, I think it has to come from a

committee.

And I know we used to have a

committee but I think we have to appoint a

new one. So I would like to appoint, Jim,

obviously you. Mike, I'm not going to

appoint you, okay?

MR. MARTINI: Okay.

MR. SAUER: Somebody's raising

his hand back here.

MR. STURM: Yeah, put Rossi on

it.

MR. SAUER: Mr. Rossi.

MR. RUFFOLO: Well, I was going

to get three, not from, from each -- one from

each district.

MR. STURM: Here's a point of

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order. With the new constitution,

board-established committees are subject to

the veto. So you don't necessarily have to

have somebody from each district on it, which

we always did in the past so they're balanced

if it ever came to the board with a majority

vote kind of, and veto.

With the new constitution,

board-established committees, which this

would be, goes -- the veto rule applies. So

if some district isn't represented on a

committee and the district doesn't like it --

MR. RUFFOLO: Mr. Rossi, do you

want to still be on that committee from the

old times?

MR. ROSSI: It doesn't make a

difference to me.

MR. RUFFOLO: All right. Mr.

Mulvaney, would you be willing to be on that?

MR. STURM: That's you, Rich.

MR. MULVANEY: With these two

guys? I'm kidding, all right? That's fine,

I'll do it, yeah.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. I think --

yeah, Mr. Rossi?

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MR. ROSSI: Go ahead. I had

another comment to add after you finish this.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. And, Sean,

would you also like to be on that committee?

MR. PALMER: Sure.

MR. RUFFOLO: All right, that

way we have one from each district. And I

think what we'll try to do, so you guys don't

have to meet somewhere, is get it on a

conference call, because it will take some

time but it won't take forever to go through

it, okay?

MR. STURM: Okay.

MR. RUFFOLO: It took us an hour

and so now he knows where everything's at

when we reviewed it, and it shouldn't take

that long, and hopefully you guys will have

it reviewed prior to that. And then report

back to us at our next meeting, okay?

MR. STURM: Certainly.

MR. RUFFOLO: Thank you.

MR. STURM: Jeff does have

another comment.

MR. RUFFOLO: Yes.

MR. ROSSI: And just as an

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addition, there's been changes made to that

particular background check stuff that's

effective in April, legislature passed at the

end of the year, so that will probably impact

going forward from April 6th.

MR. RUFFOLO: If you can get

that legislation to Greg --

MR. ROSSI: I've got it.

MR. RUFFOLO: Forward it to me

and I'll get it to Greg, okay?

MR. ROSSI: Yeah. It's minor

changes but it's going to be some more stuff.

MR. RUFFOLO: For everybody

here, if you're sending emails to me, if you

don't know, it's President@ -- oh, this is

impressive, huh? [email protected]. Okay?

I did not pick it. I did not pick it. But

anyway, if you would, send it there, that way

I know it's all about soccer. Okay?

MR. STURM: Grand supreme

commander was already taken?

MR. RUFFOLO: Jim, I think

that's yours.

MR. STURM: Oh, you're right, it

is.

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MR. RUFFOLO: Okay, tournament

sanctioning update. Mr. Frisbie?

MR. FRISBIE: Just an update to

let everybody know, updates to the tournament

sanctioning system. Carol Maas's signature

has been removed, mine has been implemented.

We have the lock, the lock will be put down

at the end of the month on the ability for

potential tournaments to apply within

120 days of their kick-off.

We are removing outdated leagues

that are no longer leagues with OSYSA. We

had some tournaments applying under outdated

leagues.

And we are going to be changing

some wording on the actual application and

remove some outdated wording.

And that should all be done by

the end of the month.

MR. RUFFOLO: Any questions or

comments?

MR. STURM: Tom, are they ever

going to be able to put the sanctioning date

on there, because the bottom of the form it

says date approved and there's never a date

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approved on there.

MR. FRISBIE: Got it.

MR. JABBARI: I have a question.

MR. RUFFOLO: Yes.

MR. JABBARI: Is there any

restriction on number of the tournaments or

can we restrict that to certain number on the

weekend, on a certain weekend, because we are

really have a difficulty having --

MR. COOK: For all Ohio South or

districts?

MR. JABBARI: No. For example,

the President's Cup weekend, the Round Robin,

we have five tournaments at the same time,

plus all of the league games, plus Buckeye

games, plus amateur league, and they're all

competing at the same time and we definitely

don't have enough referees for this. Somehow

we need to control the number.

MR. STURM: Here's the

challenge, BJ. If we say, okay, an Ohio

South rule, you can't do this, they'll just

card US Club and bypass us and then we have

no control over them whatsoever.

MR. JABBARI: I agree, but I

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think we are definitely looking for failure

on these weekends.

MR. STURM: Well, as far as the

President's Cup round of 16, that actually

was moved up. So normally it's almost always

the first weekend of May, and in the calendar

it got moved up a weekend and the girls' Nike

and the Club X tournament in Xenia -- or, I'm

sorry, the Nike boys and the Club X

tournament has always been the end of April,

so in that situation the President's Cup

moved on a weekend that was traditionally the

other weekends.

MR. JABBARI: I'm not

questioning what has actually took place, but

realistically there's no way to support all

of these tournaments on the same weekend,

they're competing with each other and some of

these tournaments are offering incentives

that most of the other tournaments cannot

keep up with.

MR. RUFFOLO: You mean for

referees?

MR. JABBARI: For referees. Not

for the teams, but for the referees.

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MR. SAUER: Who gets to decide

which club makes money and which club doesn't

make money?

MR. RUFFOLO: Well, that's me.

MR. SAUER: No, I'm just saying

is it history if they'd had the tournament

forever, they get to keep it, and a new

tournament can't come on that date? I'm just

thinking what solution do you propose?

MR. JABBARI: I'm not

questioning that part. And I understand the

dilemma, I agree with Jim, I understand that

fully, but I think that we are definitely

heading for situations that you're going to

have a lot of games and a lot of tournaments

with one or two referees.

MR. BALDEOSINGH: Or none.

MR. JABBARI: Or none.

MR. SAUER: So would it be

better to allow these people to fail and that

will take care of the problem itself? I

mean, all of a sudden now somebody comes up

and says, hey, don't go here, they can't get

refs, so the next year the tournament fails.

So they're going to have to go through a

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process on their own.

MR. JABBARI: I agree, too.

MR. RAZACK: Isn't the process,

to apply for a tournament, isn't it supposed

to go to the ref assigner first and the ref

assigner approves it and then it comes to

you?

MR. BALDEOSINGH: No. It used

to be. Now you go directly. They don't even

go to the sanctioning league.

MR. RUFFOLO: Here's the problem

you have. Everybody wants a tournament.

They submit their forms properly, they get a

tournament, okay? The question that I think

BJ is trying to get us to consider is whether

we want to have some kind of rules or

guidelines as to how many tournaments can be

approved and how quickly they are, is it

first come first serve and so on and so

forth.

I don't know how we're going to

do that because I will tell you right now

that tournaments that have been going on for

years expect that weekend is going to be

their tournament and they're not going to

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think anything else of it. And if it's a

race to Tom or Ohio South, we're going to

have a lot of problems.

It's quite obvious that it is a

problem. I mean, I've seen it, I've

witnessed it. Some tournaments you look and

there's only two referees there, if you're

lucky, okay, especially at the younger age

groups.

So, George, I agree with you, if

they fail then they fail. At some point in

time it's the product that's out on the

field, and if you have a good tournament

that's where everybody's going to go.

MR. MANAHAN: Or if you pay the

refs the most.

MR. RUFFOLO: Well, that's a

problem. If you pay the refs the most, I

can't blame a ref to go where the money's at.

MR. MANAHAN: That's what I

mean. That's what's going to happen.

MR. JABBARI: Right now we have

a tournament, without naming the name of the

tournament, but we have a tournament that

offers a $65 referee jersey and four gifts,

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plus it's paying the highest.

MR. SAUER: So what's the

problem? You represent the referees, I mean,

I don't mean to say that, but so you should

be happy that referees now are getting paid

more and getting free uniforms.

MR. JABBARI: Oh, I'm happy for

them, I --

MR. COOK: It's taking over

President's Cup, it's taking over --

MR. SAUER: So if we're in the

business here to run tournaments ourselves so

we've got to compete, so then why don't we

turn around and say if you're going to come

to President's Cup, you get a $300 gift

certificate to Dick's? Or you can do four

games or five games. And we've got to charge

more for President's Cup and State Cup to

stay competitive and get better refs.

MR. JABBARI: So are you willing

for me to spend $100 on each referee that

comes to the President's Cup, would the board

approve that?

MR. MANAHAN: No.

MR. RUFFOLO: One board member

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may not approve it, we don't know yet, we

haven't taken a vote yet.

MR. MANAHAN: Was there a vote?

Wait.

MR. JABBARI: I think -- I'm not

against it. I'm not against it.

MR. SAUER: I'm just saying

what's the solution?

MR. JABBARI: The solution is --

what's the alternative to us, is that Club?

MR. RAZACK: US Club.

MR. JABBARI: US Club? Maybe we

can coordinate with US Club and try to

limit --

MR. RUFFOLO: Good luck.

MR. BALDEOSINGH: The question,

though, we need more referees to cover all

the games. That's the solution. We need

more referees to cover all the games on a

particular weekend. How are we going to get

the referees? I don't know.

MR. RUFFOLO: I'll volunteer,

okay?

MR. MANAHAN: My thought would

be if we focus on that as the problem, we

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might get to a solution. Because I think

that we don't have enough referees, even on

weekends where we don't have five

tournaments, there's not enough referees. So

how do we focus on solving that?

MR. RUFFOLO: Well, if we're

going to be thinking about helping out the

referees then we as a board need to authorize

some clinics, some benefits for new referees

to get out there. They all have to buy their

own uniforms, they all have to spend money in

taking these clinics and so on, maybe it's

the onus on us to go out to them and say,

look, we're going to provide this for you,

you're going to give us a two-year commitment

or at least a one-year commitment. I don't

know if we can do that, but I think we've got

to start sitting down and thinking about it.

Jim, you're shaking your head.

What's up?

MR. STURM: A couple things.

One is, fundamental to this discussion is

that every referee is an independent

contractor and that is a starting point from

whatever we do.

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If a tournament wants to give

them extra bonuses, nobody can say they can't

because the referees are independent

contractors.

So it's like putting a deck on

your house, you know, if they want to charge

you, you want to pay for it, it's -- you get

the deck.

The other thing is, as far as

the scheduling problem is, and Tom and I have

talked about this before, there's actually a

by-law, 8.10.1, that says the Ohio South will

create a database so that tournaments can

apply -- not necessarily apply -- indicate

what weekend they want to have tournaments on

up through three years in advance. So it's

kind of like a reservation system as you

were.

In a lot of cases tournaments

are making plans, then -- and they're making

commitments to a certain weekend not

realizing somebody else has already got a

tournament that weekend.

As an example, there's a new

tournament, and I don't think it's even an

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Ohio South tournament, in Cincinnati on

Memorial Day weekend.

MR. SAUER: VOA?

MR. BALDEOSINGH: Yes, it is

sanctioned.

MR. STURM: It is? Okay, I

didn't know. It's a brand new one. It's

going to be a big one, it will be a 200-team

tournament. But that steps on a lot of other

tournaments that same weekend.

MR. RUFFOLO: What weekend is

that?

MR. STURM: Memorial Day. Yeah,

but if we have this reservation system, that

may go some way a direction to letting

tournaments spread themselves out. That

would be a good first step.

MR. RUFFOLO: Yes?

MR. BLIEDEN: Your comment

about, and BJ's, about we need more referees

and that, really what we need to do is from

the state level, board level or whatever, we

need to support our referees. Our young

referees go out there, they're starting with

8, 9, 10-year-olds, they're starting on

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lines. In our club that I'm from, we've even

had C bombs, and actually dropped on a

13-year-old girl and everything else.

We need, if our referees are

abused, we need to start showing them that we

will support them and there will be something

done about it. And the parents need to know

there will be something done about their

abuse. And if the abuse starts going away,

you may see the referees coming back.

MR. RUFFOLO: Well, the only

thing I can say to that is I think every

league does things a little differently.

I know if we hear about abuse of

a referee in my old district, we bring the

family, the parents in, we bring the coaches

in, the coach is responsible, and we've

suspended people over it. Whether they had

anything to do with it or not. We've

suspended parents. Because we believe a

coach and a parent should be responsible and

so on. But that's our district. Every

league has something different.

MR. MANAHAN: Well, and clubs

have some responsibility as well.

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MR. RUFFOLO: Well, you do. But

clubs, it's a lot tougher a lot of times for

clubs to do anything because these are the

people that are paying them, and to tell

these parents that they can't come to their

games, that's hard to do.

MR. MANAHAN: It's not. Not for

us. It's not. I don't know why you think

it's that hard. You tell them.

MR. RUFFOLO: But the point I

think we need to be looking at, and, Steve, I

agree with you, we need to be doing things

for our referees.

And what I would like to do is

the two of you guys come back to us at next

meeting, what can we do for the referees to

get referee -- new referees, to educate

referees, and what can Ohio South do? We

should be doing something, I think all the

board members would agree on that, it looked

like everybody was nodding their head when we

were talking about it. Get something to us

and we'll go from there. Anybody else want

to make a comment?

MR. COOK: I'm not a referee

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because I can't recertify in the time that

you guys allow.

MR. BALDEOSINGH: Why not? You

get three months to do it.

MR. COOK: In the winter it's

six months.

MR. BALDEOSINGH: Six months.

You can go all the way until June 1st.

MR. MANAHAN: So this comes up

all -- can I make a comment? This comes up

all the time. I hear us say this because I

say it too, and then I have somebody on the

refs' side, whether it's you guys or somebody

else, say that's ridiculous, you have plenty

of time. And then I go to people in our club

and say, hey, what are you telling me on

recertification? They never have times we

can go. This is in District 1. You know,

it's a time where I can't go or do this.

I've got a guy that's on my

board, he wants to ref, he says, sorry, I

don't have time to go recertify. Why

wouldn't we recertify that guy in an easy

manner, get him back on the field?

MR. JABBARI: May I jump in?

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MR. MANAHAN: Absolutely.

MR. JABBARI: I go to most of

the District 1 recertifications and I don't

even have to, but I can find one, I find the

evenings that I can go there.

I know that other people have

kids and I -- you can take one night off and

go and recertify if you choose to do so but,

no, you have to go play basketball, watch the

basketball kids, you cannot just take three

and a half hours one day and go recertify? I

disagree with that.

MR. MANAHAN: Okay.

MR. JABBARI: I just think that,

you know, it's just an excuse.

MR. RUFFOLO: Well, let me ask

you this. How many classes are there and --

MR. COOK: Oh, there's a lot of

classes, but I'm saying in the wintertime

when you guys offer most of them is my busy

time where I do indoor, I do coaching,

reffing, working, so I don't have time to

recertify. And you know that I've done this

for years and I would love to ref again,

but --

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MR. RUFFOLO: Well, BJ and

Kenny, can we find ways to open it up so they

can get recertified?

MR. BALDEOSINGH: Yes.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. Jim?

MR. SAUER: Can it be done

online?

MR. BLIEDEN: Most college

courses are online.

MR. RUFFOLO: Can they get

recertified online?

MR. BALDEOSINGH: No, not in

Ohio South.

MR. RUFFOLO: Can they do it

nationally?

MR. BALDEOSINGH: No.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay.

MR. BLIEDEN: Is there rules to

stop it in USSA?


MR. RUFFOLO: It's just not been

done?

MR. BALDEOSINGH: Because there

are certain things we got to teach the refs

in face-to-face. We do half of it online and

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half in a classroom. We give them the badges

and so forth, we found out, like the new

referees, we have the online training for

them, they come in there and they don't know

what the hell they do, and they have no clue.

So as a result of that, we have to have

classroom so we can get their attention so we

can teach them.

Like for example, this year we

have 16 laws we changed. We cannot do it

online. We have to do it face-to-face,

questions and answers.

So the thing is, other states

started, I've tried it and it was a failure

because the referee goes out there on the

field and it affects their games because they

don't know the laws of the game, they don't

know how to apply the laws of the game

online.

So to answer the question, they

tried it, wasn't successful. So we spend

half the time online, half the time in the

classroom.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. Kenny and

BJ, can you then get us something that you

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think that can work to help you guys out?

MR. BALDEOSINGH: Well, yeah. I

know right now --

MR. RUFFOLO: Not now. Not now.

We don't want to talk about it now, we've got

a whole full agenda, but we want to extend

opportunities for everybody to get

reregistered, and then we want to look at

what can the board do for the benefit of the

referees to get more referees. Okay?

MR. BALDEOSINGH: Okay.

MR. JABBARI: John, may I make

one last comment about the President's Cup

and State Cup?

MR. RUFFOLO: Yes.

MR. JABBARI: Unless --

MR. BALDEOSINGH: It's not going

to change, BJ.

MR. JABBARI: I understand that.

But unless we provide more incentives, it

does not hold the same priority for the

referees to participate.

MR. RUFFOLO: What conflicts are

going on on President's Cup weekend?

MR. STURM: Nike Cup boys, which

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is 500 teams in Columbus. You got the Club X

tournament in Xenia, same district as the

President's Cup is. And --

MR. JABBARI: We have Blue Chip

boys.

MS. STURM: Blue Chip boys in

Cincinnati.

MR. BALDEOSINGH: That's part of

Nike.

MR. RUFFOLO: Wow, those are all

big tournaments.

MR. BALDEOSINGH: The Nike alone

is about 500 teams.

MR. RUFFOLO: Yes.

MR. COOK: Is there a reason why

we have President's Cup and State Cup so

early? Because I know other ones move them

back.

MR. RUFFOLO: Tom, why did we

move President's Cup up?

MR. FRISBIE: Because we

couldn't get facilities for it in Dayton.

MR. RUFFOLO: Well, that's --

MR. COOK: Is there a certain

cutoff that we have to have it done by?

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MR. FRISBIE: Well, you want to

have it early enough to get your rain date

done so they can make travel plans for

Regionals. Both President's Cup and State

Cup.

MR. COOK: Okay. And that would

be end of June?

MR. FRISBIE: End of May.

MR. COOK: End of may is --

because Regionals would not be until what,

end of June?


MR. RUFFOLO: Not end. Usually

in middle of June, isn't it?

MR. COOK: June 24th last year.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. Yes?

MR. MANLEY: I guess one of the

things that I've always run into is that we

try to, we try to limit the number of matches

that people do in State Cup and President's

Cup.

If there was a way to limit the

number of matches that people do in all the

tournaments, would that help?

Because what typically will

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happen is someone will get an opportunity to

get a State Cup game, and they know they can

go to another tournament and do six games in

a row.

MR. JABBARI: Number of games

that referees --

MR. BALDEOSINGH: Let him

finish.

MR. MANLEY: Yeah. So if they

were somehow limited to the number of matches

that they could do per day, would that help?

I don't know. That's one that we always

hear, you know, why would I drive to Dayton

to do State games when I can go next door and

do six in a row?

MR. SAUER: But that would make

them an employee. If we told them that they

couldn't work more than two games a day then

that tends us to make them an employee of us,

right?

MR. BALDEOSINGH: Why?

MR. SAUER: You can't tell you

over here you can only do two games today.

MR. BALDEOSINGH: As an

assigner, I assign guys, like last weekend I

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only assigned three games.

MR. STURM: Kenny, as soon as

that assigner does that, he's become an

employee of that assigner. You can't tell a

guy building decks on your house you can only

build three decks today. As soon as you do

that you've limited his employment

opportunities.

MR. RUFFOLO: Kenny, there's

like 20 some factors that determine if

they're an independent contractor or not, and

one of the factors is what kind of control

you have, and that is an important factor in

determining who an independent contractor is

or not. So we have to be real, real careful

when we do that, otherwise we've got some

problems, okay?

MR. BALDEOSINGH: So you're

telling me that if a guy wants to do eight

games, we got to give him eight games?

MR. MANAHAN: No. We just can't

tell him he can't do more than two. We can't

tell him where to be and how to work.

MR. BALDEOSINGH: I'm not

telling them that. I'm assigning them that.

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MR. RUFFOLO: You can assign, if

you've got names and you're assigning, you've

got lots of names, you can assign whatever

you want.

MR. BALDEOSINGH: That's what I

do.

MR. RUFFOLO: You can't say --

because I come to you and say I want six

games, you don't have to give me six games.

MR. BALDEOSINGH: Okay. I don't

tell them, all I, I just assign them.

MR. STURM: But as soon as OSSRC

or the State association makes a rule to that

effect, there's the problem.

MR. RUFFOLO: It goes into that

issue of us controlling --

MR. BALDEOSINGH: But I have

enough referees that goes around that I give

three games because that's what the referee,

you know, gives me feedback --

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. I'd like to

move on, guys, I think we've talked about

this enough. Kenny and BJ, get back to us,

please. And if you want assistance from

anybody on the committee -- or this board,

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please let me know.

MR. BALDEOSINGH: Yes, I will.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. We're going

into new business. We're going to skip the

registration report and go to the statewide

registration system. Jim?

MR. STURM: Years ago, actually

on several occasions in the past decade or so

there's been some discussion about a

statewide player and coach registration

system, and for a variety of reasons it's not

ever been successfully considered.

I talked with several other

board members and they think the time might

be right now for a consideration of that.

Part of it also is the fact that

it is presumably a well-founded rumor that at

some point in the next year or two, and, Tom,

if I'm not correct in this, if you've got

anything additional or new, please speak up,

that every player will have to get a unique

player identification number prior to them

registering in any of our leagues. It has

something to do with FIFA demanding to know

about every player everywhere.

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Presently there are -- OSSL uses

the Affinity system, Buckeye and MOSSL uses

their own proprietary system, CUSL uses

theirs, Miami Valley uses theirs.

It's an open question about

whether our individual league systems are

ever going to be able to talk to the

Federation to get that international number.

The computer coding for all that

is going to be quite extensive. I mean, I

know that Sean's got a background, Craig's

got a background in computers. To be able to

come up with a unique identifying number

that's good throughout the world, with all

the different permutations of names and dates

of births and all that, it's going to be a

monumental task. No individual league is

going to be able to make that happen.

Tom, have you heard anything

about the international number other than

it's supposed to be coming?

MR. FRISBIE: Nothing.

MR. STURM: Okay. But with

that, we certainly might -- and that's why I

wrote it up as I did in this motion, to start

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working toward that direction.

Also, in the past, and we

continue to have a problem about players who

register in one league and then go and

register in another league and don't bother

telling the second league that they're

already a member over there, and kids are

running around carded on two different teams.

Realistically, I think the only

way to do that is if you have a common

database where the kid signs up and it flags,

oh, you can't be on this team because you're

already on that team. So my idea --

MR. RUFFOLO: Jim, I didn't see

a motion in my packet, is there a motion?

Did it come separately?

MR. STURM: Yeah, it looks like

this.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay.

MR. STURM: I think it's stuck

in amongst the Risk Management stuff.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay.

MR. SAUER: It's right after the

Treasurer's, I think. Or right after --

MR. RUFFOLO: Oh, okay, I got

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it. Thank you. So your motion is you want

an exploratory committee?

MR. STURM: Just to start the

process to talk about it.

MR. RUFFOLO: I don't know if we

necessarily need to have a vote on that, I

think we can appoint a committee.

MR. STURM: Well, that's what

I'm asking you to do in this motion, but it

also sets some criteria in that regard.

One of the things I would like

to do is, although we're almost all involved,

with a few notable exceptions like Tim here

and Rick, are involved with competitive

programs. But if we're going to do a

statewide system, it only makes sense that we

get input from the recreational leagues what

they're looking for in it as well. So I was

hoping that the committee would be wide

ranging.

MR. RUFFOLO: I would agree

that's the direction we need to be thinking

about because of the National directives that

are probably going to come down.

I'd like to get a committee

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together. From District 3, Jim, that would

be you since you take care of that for yours.

Kenny, can you do it for District 2?


MR. RUFFOLO: Or Sean.

MS. STURM: Or Gene. It doesn't

necessarily have to be board members.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay, why don't

we, yeah, we'll get Gene on that committee

because he's our guy.

MR. BALDEOSINGH: Yeah.

MR. RUFFOLO: And then from your

district, you?

MR. MANAHAN: Yeah, I'll be on

there.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. And the

idea here is to give us options, to let us

know what's out there. The one thing that I

do know is that because Dick's is our

sponsor, now there's some catches to it.

MR. FRISBIE: Dick's is not our

sponsor.

MR. RUFFOLO: Dick's is the

National sponsor.

MR. FRISBIE: Right.

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MR. RUFFOLO: Right. That's

what I meant. See, I was at the National

meeting so I'm the National guy now. And

Hawaii was beautiful a couple weeks ago,

right, Kenny?


MR. RUFFOLO: Since Dick's is a

sponsor of US Soccer, Affinity is now

supposed to be or could be potentially free

for us, but we have to give them some things

in exchange. I want to look at all of that.

Anything that we can look at, let's look at,

okay?

MR. STURM: If I may suggest

that Tim represents Southeast --

MR. RUFFOLO: Recreation?

MR. STURM: Recreation.

MR. RUFFOLO: Absolutely, you're

in. And Scott's just sitting over here, I

can even bring him in on it.

MR. RODGERS: No.

MR. RUFFOLO: No?

MR. STURM: And let me find --

if you can find a rec person from District 2,

and I'll try to find a rec person,

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65

knowledgeable person. I think I have --

MR. RUFFOLO: Well, Sean, are

you the rec --


MR. RUFFOLO: No?

MR. BALDEOSINGH: I'll try to

find somebody.

MR. STURM: The person I'm

thinking about from District 3 is John Muir

from Dublin Soccer League, the Executive

Director. He also has a background in

computers, I'm not sure what, but I know he

has some.

MR. RUFFOLO: I'm okay with

that. Let's get something, and I'm not going

to tell you to report back to us by next

meeting, but get us something.

MR. STURM: Well, that's what I

say, the motion and my suggestion was

December of 2018.

MR. RUFFOLO: Well, if we can go

a little sooner than that.

MR. MANAHAN: We'll be sooner

than that.

MR. STURM: Some people

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suggested next week, but I don't think that's

going to happen.

MR. RUFFOLO: Let's try to get

something by the second meeting in 2018.

MR. STURM: That's in November.

MR. RUFFOLO: No, that would

be -- the first meeting is January. A year

from now.

MR. STURM: Okay.

MR. RUFFOLO: All right, next

item on the agenda. Jim, you want to talk

about OSSL?

MR. STURM: Yes. From -- let me

get my dates right here. I think in 2014

through -- no, 2013 through summer of -- no,

take that back. Summer of 2013 through

January of '17, there was a limit on the

growth of OSSL. That limit expired January

of this year. And I would like to have the

board pass a motion that limits the size of

OSSL to what was listed in that chart that is

in here somewhere. It matches up what we've

done previously. It looks like this.

MR. SAUER: There's no page

number, but it's 19 and then 20, it would be

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20.

MR. STURM: Right after Risk

Management maybe.

MR. RUFFOLO: It's the first

thing right after Risk Management.

MR. STURM: Yeah. Tom, correct

me if I'm wrong, this is our --

MR. SAUER: Current model.

MR. RUFFOLO: The only issue on

that one, there's U19s that aren't included

on this.

MR. STURM: Well, in talking

with Tom, he indicated that U19s were a real

problem from him. And the whole idea of OSSL

from the beginning was to prep teams for MRL

for the following year. There is no U20 MRL,

so why U19s, I don't know.

MR. RUFFOLO: Well, I think we

do provide U19s, at least this year we are.

MR. STURM: We did.

MR. RUFFOLO: So I'd like to

keep them included in there.

MR. STURM: Tom, what's your

thought, do you need 19s?

MR. FRISBIE: I don't think that

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68

that, I mean --

MR. RUFFOLO: The option for it.

MR. FRISBIE: -- personally I

don't think we necessarily need it. I would

probably say we should go to the Coaches

Committee and get their opinion on it. I

would probably think that they would say the

same thing, because the reason I think what I

think is because of what they've conveyed to

me already.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. Then report

back to us.

MR. FRISBIE: I will.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. So we got

these 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17 and 18, and your

motion is to limit them for one more year?

MR. STURM: Yes. One -- the

next seasonal year.

MR. RUFFOLO: Do I have a second

on that motion?

MR. SAUER: Yes.

MR. RUFFOLO: George. Do I have

any discussion?

MR. COOK: Is there a reason why

you just want one year?

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MR. STURM: There's options for

some other changes coming forward and this

gives us the latitude, a year's time to work

on those changes.

One of the things that's been

talked about is a true promotion relegation

system. And with all the changes that's

transpired in the last couple of months, you

know, getting a new constitution and all that

put together, we just didn't get work to it,

and this gives us a year to work on it.

MR. RUFFOLO: I, as I spoke to

and told you earlier, I think it's premature

because when we met in January we talked

about several things. Promotion relegation.

We talked about trying to look at what

Buckeye can do to help the other district

leagues.

And I realize, Jim, that you

have some other issues with other clubs. I

would like to table this. At this point in

time we're not expanding, we don't have the

plans to do it, but I want to put the foot on

the pedal and I want us to go and resolve

this issue. And however we do that, I want

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it resolved.

I want us to put together a

promotion relegation program, and if -- as

long as I'm President, that is one of my

biggest goals. And then after doing a

promotion relegation, I want to do something

that helps the districts. The districts need

help, they're all hurting.

We have a lot of things out

there and I think we as a board should be

looking at all of that. And I don't think I

need a rule. I don't think I need to pass

it.

And I would like all of us to

keep pushing to get this thing resolved. And

I think when we all talked, we all talked

about that, and that's where I'd like to go.

Jim?

MR. STURM: One observation. If

you have no plans to expand it, Tom has

indicated he has no plans to expand it,

Gordon has indicated he has no -- as current

Director of Coaching he has no support for

expanding it, then why can't we pass the

rule? Because if the rule's not in place

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then Buckeye, which you've identified as part

of the equation, is --

MR. RUFFOLO: That's a nice way

of saying it.

MR. STURM: -- is, we're left

hanging. Because if this rule is not in

place, then as a league I would be hard

pressed not to assume that it won't be

expanding.

And if OSSL expands, it is my

belief that Buckeye will have no choice but

to continue forward with our present

direction.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay.

MR. STURM: I would also like to

point out that when OSSL was formed, that is

when Buckeye's numbers really grew. And my

concern for each of the leagues, which

includes MOSSL, is that if OSSL expands,

Buckeye continues to expand, that is only in

the end going to hurt the district level

leagues.

MR. RUFFOLO: Well, the choice

to expand by Buckeye was Buckeye's choice and

it wasn't as necessarily the result of OSSL,

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it was the result of you not having all the

requirements that you used to have to get

into the league. You pretty much now accept

anybody. And that's fine, that's your

prerogative, but it had nothing to do

necessarily with OSSL.

MR. STURM: It was the exact

same year.

MR. RUFFOLO: I understand that.

But that's when you started accepting more

teams, and without taking consideration,

because I know, I had a team and you kicked

us out, okay, and that team ended up being

the best team in their age group the next

year.

So you had requirements, you

don't have them now, and you're allowing

everybody in. And that's fine, that's your

prerogative, and that's Buckeye's

prerogative, and I don't have a problem with

that, but it's not getting us a result.

We talked three years ago when

we set this up that we were going to do

something during this period of time. We

haven't. By putting out another year, what

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we're going to do is delay it another year,

kick the can down the road. I don't want to

kick the can down the road. I want us to go

forward, do something, and I don't want to

hurt anybody but we need to do something for

the betterment of soccer.

MR. STURM: Three years ago I

did make this very same proposal, to limit

the size of Buckeye, but at that same time I

put forward several caveats. Since then,

none of those caveats have come to pass, and

so I put my idea forward and I made some

specific requests of the other, the other

member leagues. Those were not met.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay.

MR. STURM: It's a one-year

proposal. If it doesn't come to pass in the

next year, it doesn't go forward beyond that.

That's why it's only a one-year proposal,

that's why it was asked, it's one year. That

puts the gun to my head for Buckeye, with the

other people, to get this done next year.

MR. RUFFOLO: I don't think it's

a gun to your head, I think it's a gun to all

of our heads because we need to resolve this

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issue.

MR. MANAHAN: Can I have the

floor, John? So for us that haven't been

around forever, can you give a nutshell

version of this promotion relegation?

MR. RUFFOLO: Promotion

relegation would be an idea where let's say

you're in OSSL, you're one of the 12 boys

teams, okay? Promotion, they hopefully get

to go to MRL. Okay?

Relegation, if they are the last

two or the last team, or usually it's the

last two, they would drop down to the league

that is right below them.

Right now that league right

below them in my mind would be the state

league over at Buckeye. And then the top two

teams from Buckeye would then get the

opportunity to play in OSSL.

That's promotion, that's

relegation. So that's what we're talking

about. And I only throw that out, I'm not

saying that's how it was going to work, but

that's what promotion relegation is.

MR. MANAHAN: So what you're

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saying is you want to have a way -- you want

to have promotion and relegation from the

state league, no matter what that league

underneath looks like?

MR. RUFFOLO: Sure.

MR. MANAHAN: Okay.

MR. RUFFOLO: Sure.

MR. MANAHAN: All right. Just

want to understand it.

MR. BLIEDEN: Or if the state

league ends up with more divisions, you end

up out of the top division, you go to the

second division.

MR. MANAHAN: Probably shouldn't

say that because that's what the motion is

all about.

MR. STURM: If OSSL expands

their number of divisions, all of this is off

the table for Buckeye.

MR. RUFFOLO: Right. Well, and,

Jim, nobody is trying --

MR. STURM: There's no upside to

Buckeye then.

MR. RUFFOLO: Nobody is trying

to say, Buckeye, restrict yourself. We did

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say at that meeting when we all were

sitting -- standing around there, we wanted

to have an opportunity for you guys, George

and you, to get back to us in the May time

period. And now things have changed, and

you've pointed that out, there's other

leagues that are competing.

I just think we need to put,

like I said, our foot to the pedal and get a

resolution. And if it isn't going to be

resolved then we need to know that.

MR. STURM: Here's my

suggestion. Two things. One is, since this

is obviously a discussion primarily between

you and I, why don't you and I off record

away from the rest of the board, I will

elaborate some more concerns that I have with

this.

MR. RUFFOLO: And that's fine.

MR. STURM: And --

MR. MANAHAN: Hold on.

Personally, I want to hear what they are.

MR. RUFFOLO: Well, at this

point I want to put this motion at bay right

now, okay? That's my opinion. We've got a

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motion, we've got a second. Do we have

anymore discussion on this?

MR. STURM: As an alternate --

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay.

MR. STURM: Would the board

agree to not to change the OSSL rule, that

you have to play in OSSL to be considered for

MRL?

MR. MANAHAN: Isn't that the

whole point of the league?

MR. STURM: No. That you have

to play in OSSL simultaneously with playing

in MRL. After you make MRL, you also have to

continue to play in OSSL except for the top

division.

MR. RUFFOLO: Top division of

MRL?

MR. MANAHAN: Yeah, if you're in

the top division of MRL you don't have to

play OSSL.

MR. SAUER: That's the biggest

problem that I've heard from multiple teams

is that in order to maintain a position they

have to play again and they, it's double the

games and they have to play State Cup and

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there's just no time.

I've got State Cup games that

are standing in for Buckeye games and they're

saying can we play one game and count it in

three leagues? And it's like, it's up to the

other leagues, I don't care.

MR. RUFFOLO: I really want

Gordon involved in that discussion because

Gordon is the DOC that has helped promulgate

all the rules and I was not a part of it. So

I think before we even talk about that I

think we need some responses from Gordon.

Again, we have a motion, we have

a second, any further discussion on the

motion and the second? Okay, the motion is

to maintain OSSL as is for the seasonal year

2017 to 2018, and that would be from

basically June 1 to May 31st, whatever that

is. Okay? All in favor? Who is opposed?


MR. RUFFOLO: All right, so it

doesn't pass. Okay, let's go to the next

one.

MR. STURM: Assistant state

registrars?

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MR. RUFFOLO: Yes. That's you.

(BJ Jabbari left the meeting.)

MR. STURM: There's a two-page

thing, three-page. The new constitution

eliminated the position of District

Commissioners and created a new category of

Assistant State Registrars. The constitution

says as duties as defined by Ohio South

by-laws. This does that. It, you know,

there's a number of places in the by-laws

that refers to the State Commissioners,

District Commissioners, those are all

eliminated, and it defines specifically what

the Assistant State Registrars can do.

Specifically, on the first page,

5.16.3, may approve tournament guest player

cards, tournament guest player rosters and

tournament teams. So it defines that role.

And 5.16.5, it cleans up the

language there.

5.8.2.5, it's a little

contradictory in the middle of that

paragraph. It will not be approved for a

period of two weeks after its receipt by the

league or association to which the player is

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transferring, if the transfer is approved by

that member league or association. It can't

go through if the transfer's not approved, so

that phrase is superfluous and unnecessary.

Also, in the middle of that page

we have a problem, especially with, and in

particular I think for some reason it's

between MOSSL and Buckeye and Miami Valley

where the player pass, where a kid is

transferring and the player pass -- there's

dispute where the player pass goes. This

says it goes back to the league. So that if

they're leaving Buckeye going to Miami

Valley, then the card comes back to Buckeye.

We know where that card is. And you know

that we've got where the card is. Always

before it was a little ambiguous as to where

the card ended up with. This defines that

process.

I don't know if it happens in

your leagues, Kenny, or in CUSL, we have

coaches who think that it's their right to --

they have the right to refuse a transfer, and

they just say no, the, you know, the kid owes

me money, I'm not going to approve the

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transfer, any number of reasons, if I approve

the transfer, they're my best player or

they're my only goalkeeper. No, none of that

is applicable. And there's really no

sanction for that coach that is just being

difficult, for lack of a better term.

This makes it a rule that if

it's brought to the Conduct Committee, that

there's a sanction for it, the Conduct

Committee can find them guilty. Because

there's really -- because if the player is

not allowed to complete the transfer, the

player can't play someplace.

MR. RUFFOLO: Right. And we

have a player's right to choose, so --

MR. STURM: And this lies in

contradiction to that.

MR. FRISBIE: I would like to

point out that this is an important piece and

the board should really take note of that

being included, because we do get issues with

that, coaches just being obstinate for no

other reason than restrict a player from

playing until the waiting period is done, and

that's not equitable to the player at all.

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MR. RUFFOLO: Right.

MR. SAUER: Obstinate is a kind

word. It's, it's terrible. I mean, every

day I'm dealing with parents, coaches, well,

I don't want to do that, I'm not going to

sign them, or they just throw it in a file

and they don't care.

I mean, I understand that one

club's losing a thousand dollars, another

club's gaining a thousand dollars, but that

same coach that's holding onto it will call

me the next day, this guy's coming from the

other club, where's my card, where's the

transfer? So on one hand he's putting it in

his pocket and the other hand he's

complaining that the other coach is putting

it in his pocket.

MR. MANAHAN: Is there any way

we can just eliminate the two weeks and be

done with it? I mean, we're not stopping the

transfer anyway, what's the point of the

coach having the ability to delay them two

weeks?

MR. SAUER: That's something

that's above my grade.

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MR. STURM: Here's why that rule

has always been in place. Occasionally, I

know in MOSSL and Buckeye and I believe Miami

Valley has a no recruiting rule. If you

approve the transfer, there's really no

option to somebody to raise a flag, hey,

there was recruiting involved, and gives an

opportunity for the coach to complain that

the kid got recruited away.

MR. MANAHAN: Well, maybe they

did, but are we going to not approve the

transfer if that happens and make them stay

on the team?

MR. RUFFOLO: Well, that all

depends. If there is overt recruiting in

these various leagues, they will have some

action against the coach.

MR. MANAHAN: Agreed.

MR. RUFFOLO: And then the coach

that did it will probably say to the kid

that's being recruited, you can't come over.

That's ultimately what the result will be.

MS. STURM: And in our rules, in

MOSSL's rules, it says specifically the

transfer will not be approved if recruiting

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has been proved. Which is a disincentive for

them to recruit in the first place because if

they're proved to recruit, you can't get the

kid.

MR. RUFFOLO: What you're trying

to eliminate is anybody trying to see a great

kid and then start pounding on them and --

leave the kid alone, don't be recruiting

them, let him play on his team, and that's

the team he committed to for the seasonal

year.

MR. MANAHAN: We've all been

involved in these things, I mean, Steve and I

have been on the phone trying to chase down

coaches at fields to get signatures and when

really it should be, hey, he's transferring,

buddy, sorry, you know, they want to leave.

Or it could be, you know, I had

under United this year, over the winter they

didn't want to approach it because he said,

oh, I'm out of the country for a month, don't

worry about it. Okay.

MR. STURM: Well, there's other

alternate people that can approve it.

MR. MANAHAN: Right.

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MR. STURM: So that's not an

excuse.

MR. MANAHAN: It's not. But I'm

saying it almost, to me there shouldn't be

that -- the coach shouldn't have an ability

to say no.

MR. RUFFOLO: Well, I mean, I

don't have a problem reducing that two weeks

down to seven days.

MR. STURM: Because sometimes it

takes more time to know about it and to, for

the -- you got to give time for the league to

take action. Just because, you know, the

coach that's losing the player says, hey, the

kid was recruited, you got to give the league

some time to look into it. Well, why? You

got proof? Is there an email?

MR. RUFFOLO: Is seven days too

short?

MR. STURM: Yes. 14 days is not

a problem. Keep in mind, most transfers

happen over the winter anyway, so it's not

really impacting.

And I would say 50 percent,

random number, 50 percent of coaches approve

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it automatically when it's presented to them.

And so it's --

MR. SAUER: Or more.

MR. STURM: Or more. And George

handles a lot of transfers.

MR. BLIEDEN: Isn't the

tournament guest player the number one form

of recruiting there is out there?

MR. RUFFOLO: There's all kinds

of things.

MR. MANAHAN: No.

MR. RUFFOLO: There's that,

there's indoor soccer, there's any kind of

thing, I mean, there's recruiting all over

the place.

MR. MANAHAN: The dynamic parent

that walks across the other side of the field

and says, hey, who's number six?

MR. RUFFOLO: And then the last

paragraph on that, Jim? I see one typo, it

says the form it, it should be the form is,

to be submitted for signature.

MR. STURM: Yes. Also, as part

of this proposal, there's a revision of the

inter-team player transfer form.

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MR. SAUER: There's two in the

packet. The second one is the one. I don't

know where the first one --

MR. STURM: That's as it is now.

MR. SAUER: Well, it's missing a

line.

MR. FRISBIE: The original is

the first one, and the modified version is

the second one.

MR. STURM: Correct.

MR. RUFFOLO: And it's modified

down at the bottom.

MR. STURM: Yes.

MR. RUFFOLO: That's it.

MR. FRISBIE: Correct. The only

item I would bring up is Item 5.8.2.5.1.

That seems a little bit --

MR STURM: The very last

paragraph.

MR. FRISBIE: I just don't think

it needs to be there. I think that we've

covered all of our bases between the leagues.

MR. SAUER: I think the league,

the two leagues are the problem. I mean, if

you're dealing with just -- I'll just say,

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CUSL has registrars in every single club.

Trying to figure out who has got to sign the

card, the transfer form, we're not dealing

with a league now, we're dealing with the

club.

So that's why, we've talked

about, Jim and I talked about this, is

leaving it in there for somebody other than

the club official to sign the transfer form.

And that's where we, that's why we said we

didn't want to change that because that's

some of the problems we're having with, like

you said, the Thunder or somebody else, we're

waiting for somebody who's an employee to

sign the form, and the coach is telling them

don't sign it because I don't want the kid to

transfer.

MR. MANAHAN: Is there any way

we could put this online so we could start

the clock? That way they can have an

opportunity to sign it, go in and sign it and

say this is an issue recruiting. And if they

don't go in and they don't sign it or they,

then they --

MR. SAUER: I'll tell you what

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we do. If somebody calls up and says we're

going to transfer, I say to them, I want you

to send an email to the coach, to us, and say

I'm requesting a transfer on this date. And

from us, that's when I start the two-week

period, when they have showed proof that they

sent an email to the club requesting a

transfer. It's not when two weeks from now,

you know, they call up -- no.

MR. FRISBIE: I'm just looking

at the, from my perspective, the league that

they're leaving has signed off on it, the

league that they're transferring to has

signed off on it, now OSYSA has to sign off

on it, now we got to get back to the league

that they're transferring to. If the league

that they're transferring to has already

signed off on it, why does OSYSA need to?

MR. STURM: Because the team

from the league that the player is leaving

from signs off, but the league that they're

leaving from does not.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. So even if

we have the team signing and --

MR. SAUER: You're talking about

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the bottom half where it says signature of

league Registrar that transferring player is

from, and signature of league Registrar

they're transferring to. What are we talking

about --

MR. FRISBIE: And then if you go

back to 5.8.2.5.1, that's the part that I

think is --

MR. STURM: Unnecessary?

MR. FRISBIE: Then you're

sending it back to the state association to

send it back to the league who just signed

off on it.

MR. STURM: Okay.

MR. FRISBIE: If anything, the

league should just send it to us and say,

hey, this is what happened.

MR. SAUER: But then if it comes

back, how do we resolve the issue that

somebody, I mean, again say Buckeye refused

to sign, you know, the league Registrar, me,

refuses to sign it, how is that issue

resolved?

MR. RUFFOLO: Why would the

league Registrar refuse?

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MR. SAUER: I'm just saying, the

problem we're having is that the league

Registrar in CUSL, I mean, I'm just saying,

is not a league Registrar, she's the club

Registrar for the league. So there are 17

million clubs in CUSL, there are 17 million

league Registrars, and that person has to

sign it. And that's the problem.

I mean, I'm not saying

anything's wrong with it, that's the person

we have to track down to try to figure out --

and if something's going wrong, it's just --

MR. MANAHAN: So you're just

saying you want an authority above that

person that can sign it in the absence of a

club person to sign it?

MR. SAUER: Yes.

MR. FRISBIE: Then that's what

that rule should say.

MR. MANAHAN: Yeah, just needs

to be rewritten.

MR. FRISBIE: It should say in

the absence of transferring to, OSYSA -- I

don't even know because, like you're saying,

you could have recruiting rules that OSYSA is

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not --

MR. STURM: You'll never know

about.

MR. FRISBIE: We'll never know

about, but it's not our jurisdiction to

govern.

MR. SAUER: Correct.

MR. RAZACK: If we did it

online, then everybody would know.

MR. MANAHAN: That's what I say,

if we put it online, and you put their email

address in there, you shoot them an email and

say this transfer's on there, you have 14,

you know, 7 days, or whatever you decide, to

go in and either refuse or accept. And if no

one responds, that means they accept. If

they go in, they get an opportunity to say,

hey, I think this player was recruited,

here's why. And then we can stop it and say,

okay, we'll look into this.

MR. STURM: You're getting kind

of a complicated process. If we get a

statewide registration system, it's a piece

of cake.

MR. MANAHAN: I know I'm

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oversimplifying, I'm just saying there is a

way to solve this that isn't paper and

writing and hand it across the table.

MR. FRISBIE: We have to figure

out how to do that and then go backwards to

rewrite the by-law to make the two fit

together so we're not outside the by-law in

doing the form.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. I would

like to just ask you, Jim, if you would amend

and take out 5.8.2.5.1 right now, and then

let's pass everything else. I think we need

that.

MR. SAUER: And the new form,

yeah.

MR. RUFFOLO: And the new form.

I think we need that. And then let's

everybody look at this. Craig, since this is

a big one for you, you and Jim keep working

on that.

MR. BALDEOSINGH: John, I have a

question.

MR. RUFFOLO: I'm real good at

delegating.

MR. BALDEOSINGH: On the form,

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94

why do we have a signature for player? We

don't have them, in the card they don't sign

anything, why is it that we need a signature

for player?

MR. SAUER: Because that was on

the original form.

MR. BALDEOSINGH: I think it

should be out.

MR. RUFFOLO: Hold on. So

you're saying you want to take from the form

the signature of the player off?


MR. RUFFOLO: Anybody have a

problem with that? I think we're all in

agreement on that.

MR. STURM: Most kids can't sign

their name anyway.

MR. RUFFOLO: I've never

required my kids to sign the cards, never

did. Especially when they were 7 and 8 and

you're going, really?

MR. SAUER: That's why we left

it, it was on the original form.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay, let's take

that line off. But with everything else,

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95

Jim, would you go with the motion, take the

5.8.2.5.1?

MR. RAZACK: I think you have to

leave it on there because there's

18-year-olds that transfer that can sign.

MR. MANAHAN: Okay, then just

modify it and say or.

MR. RUFFOLO: No, no, no. What

you do, put in there something if 18 or older

they need to sign.

MR. MANAHAN: That's what I

mean.

MR. RUFFOLO: Yeah.

MR. MANAHAN: Yeah.

MR. STURM: Question. Did this

motion ever get made and was it seconded?

MR. RUFFOLO: No, no. You've

got the motion right now and I'm asking you

if you would amend your motion.

MR. STURM: Okay. I move to

adopt the proposal entitled Proposed OSYSA

By-Law Change Re: Duties of Assistant

Registrars as presented, less Paragraph

5.8.2.5.1.

MR. RUFFOLO: Do I have a second

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96

on that?

MR. STURM: And with the

modification of the proposed inter-league

player transfer request and approval form,

with, where it says signature of player,

parenthesis, if over age 18 -- only if age 18

or over. And ask for a second.

MR. HILTON: Second.

MR. RUFFOLO: Second, Solly.



MR. RUFFOLO: Thank you very

much. Okay, let's take a five-minute break.

We're at 8:00.

(WHEREUPON, a brief recess was

taken.)

MR. RUFFOLO: The next area that

we've got is the statewide by-law on tryouts.

Jim, this is your motion.

MR. STURM: Okay. This has had

several revisions over the last three weeks

that it's been out floating around.

These revisions were following

comments, suggestions by various people that

this by-law would impact.

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97

Just as long as you know you

have the very latest version, in 3.6.2,

3.6.3, and a couple other places you'll see

some green font that uses the phrase ID

camps.

So that we can start the

discussion process, I move that we adopt this

proposal as presented, and ask for a second.

MR. HILTON: Second.

MR. RUFFOLO: Who seconded?

MR. MANAHAN: Solly.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay, Solly. All

right. Tom, if you would pass out --

MR. FRISBIE: It's going around.

MR. RUFFOLO: It's going around?

Any comments about this motion? You're also

receiving a document that was forwarded to us

from US Soccer's attorney -- or US Youth

Soccer's attorney.

MR. FRISBIE: The Federation.

MR. RUFFOLO: Oh, Federation.

US Soccer's attorney. And they apparently

got note of this going on here and that is

his response.

I want everybody to take some

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98

time to review that because we just got that

today. And then if anybody has a comment,

let me know.

MR. STURM: In light of this --

MR. MANAHAN: Can we read this a

second?

MR. RUFFOLO: Yes. Let them

read it all.

MR. MANAHAN: Sorry, I'm a slow

reader. What's the second thing?

MR. RUFFOLO: The second thing

is a decision that happened several years

ago, then they're citing for the purposes of

showing that Ohio South by-law -- or not

by-laws, I think it was their code or

whatever -- mission statement was to assist

USSF and OSYSA in the development of National

teams in development programs. Which by the

way, I think we've changed that mission

statement last year, if I remember correctly.

I don't know how much of a change, but we

have changed it.

MR. FRISBIE: What they're

referring to in this email is still at our

purpose, but our mission statement is now

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99

something else.

MR. RUFFOLO: Yes. So, Jim, I

think you had your hand up.

MR. STURM: Well, first of all,

let me say it's ironic that they're

referencing the appeal decision that was

chaired by John Ruffolo that was in violation

of Ohio South's by-laws in reaching their

decision in that they considered information

contrary to the Ohio South by-laws that was

not part of the original process.

Having said that, I move to

strike Paragraph 3.6.6 from the proposal,

which would then put us in compliance with

the directive from the Federation.

3.6.6 is the section that would

define penalties for teams, clubs or persons.

So the Federation says we can't punish

somebody for doing that, so I'm striking

3.6.6.

MR. BLIEDEN: So we're

recommending a rule without any

ramifications?

MS. STURM: Well, no. 3.6.5

says that no competitive league can accept a

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100

team that does that.

The Federation cannot tell us

what teams we can and can't accept in our

leagues. That is a membership right.

And it's also addressed in other

sections of the Ohio South by-laws, in

particular in the Risk Management by-laws

where it says United States Soccer Federation

has determined that each member must comply

with USSF organizational rules, which we will

by dropping 3.6.6.

In addition, each member,

including OSYSA, has the right to establish

their own membership requirements. That's

what we're doing in 3.6.5.

In addition, United States

Federal Court has ruled that a private,

non-profit educational organization such as

OSYSA has the right to set eligibility

requirements for their membership. That's

what we're doing in 3.6.5.

So we're not going to punish

anybody if they hold them, anybody because --

if they hold tryouts early, but we're not

going to let our leagues accept them, because

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101

every league that is here, MOSSL, Buckeye,

Miami Valley, and CUSL, have rules against

having early tryouts. And through extension,

OSSL.

So this rule just makes it a

statewide rule that all the other leagues

already have in place.

These tryout dates as proposed

is -- will not negatively impact any of the

current leagues' planned tryout dates. In

fact, the dates shown on the top of the

second page mimic exactly what CUSL adopted

five or six months ago for this coming

seasonal year, so it doesn't impact anybody

in CUSL or in MOSSL, Buckeye, or Miami

Valley.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. Yes?

MR. FELDMAN: I have a question.

My rec kids, if they want to try out for a

club team, they have one day to do it?

MR. STURM: No, no.

MR. FELDMAN: Is it just one day

for that? Or so how does -- one rec player

can try out for any day as long as it happens

after the May 23rd?

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102

MR. STURM: After this. If you

want to have tryouts in July, great, nobody

cares. It's you can't hold them before these

dates, which is primarily Memorial Day or the

Tuesday after Memorial Day.

MR. RUFFOLO: Why do we have in

this proposal two different time frames?

MR. STURM: Because that is what

Miami -- or CUSL adopted for this year's

tryouts. That's what they decided to do.

Not sure why, but those are their dates.

MR. RUFFOLO: Because I received

a couple of emails from coaches in District 2

that did not like that at all. And they said

it makes it a hardship on smaller clubs to

have extended tryouts like that. I'm just

reporting what I received. So keep

discussing. Anybody else?

MR. MANAHAN: You're talking

about this top part here?

MR. RUFFOLO: There's two parts,

May 23rd and May 30th, yeah.

MR. MANAHAN: Right. So I can

give some commentary on that. That was, so

CUSL had a specific date in their by-laws

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103

when tryouts could be held for this year. It

happened to be May 23rd, which is before

Memorial Day.

A bunch of the clubs really

wanted to have them Memorial Day, so they

requested can we move the date to after

Memorial -- Tuesday after Memorial Day.

CU, Southeast, guys sitting over

there, had, they already rented turf for this

year based on the date that was in there. So

we made a compromise to go ahead, for this

year only, to allow some younger age groups

to go so those tryouts could get done in the

way that they need to get them done, for this

year. So then for next year it would move to

a Tuesday after Memorial Day.

That was why those two dates

exist because CUSL's date is May 23rd. We

really wanted to be -- other clubs wanted to

be after Memorial Day, so to compromise

that's what they did. So that's CUSL's rule

right now.

So to make this by-law work

without affecting this year, that's why that

section's there.

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104

The other option would be say to

adopt the by-law after tryouts this year,

with Tuesday after Memorial Day.

MR. STURM: This by-law at least

helps -- and what's happened in previous

years in Miami Valley because of the

closeness of the, especially the Centerville

area, the teams play -- kids might want to go

for a Cincinnati team or a District 1 team or

a District 2 team and they have two different

tryout dates. This at least moves half of

those conflicts, as it were, to after

Memorial Day, which matches up with Miami

Valley.

The other thing is, if you look

at the age groups involved, 8s, 9s and 10s

can't play across district lines anyway.

MR. MANAHAN: Right.

MR. STURM: And there's very few

18 and 19 teams out there to be worried

about. So the impact of having those five

age groups is very, very minimal for having

tryouts before Memorial Day. The vast, vast

majority, 90, 80 percent of our teams are in

the 11s through the 17 age group anyway, so

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105

that puts all of them on the same timeframe.

I can say that in the tryouts

that are held in District 3 for both MOSSL

and Buckeye are even more restrictive than

this.

MR. MANAHAN: I mean, should we

just leave that section out and just leave

that last bullet that says for teams being

formed for 2018, '19, and for subsequent

years this is it? Because those dates are

already set, we already made that compromise,

everybody's kind of planning on those dates

in District 1 anyways.

MR. STURM: Yeah, but Buckeye's

not going to agree to that because, and we

might as well throw all the cards on the

table, we've got representatives from Cup

here. If they hold their early tryouts in

March, there is no way I can tell my other

clubs we're going to make a rule that puts

you at a competitive disadvantage with Cup.

And Buckeye will allow early tryouts as early

as Cup holds theirs. And if Buckeye does

that, that kind of breaks up a whole lot of

things.

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106

So what we're trying to do is

have a level playing field across the board

for all teams in Ohio South.

It's also a, as one of the DOCs

pointed out, it's also a matter of a player's

right to choose. If you're forcing some

players to have early tryouts and make early

decisions, then they're at a disadvantage if

they want to play for a different club but

they got to stay here.

Also, it could be suggested that

this is discriminatory because there's only

one age group that's having early tryouts, or

one gender, the girls. But boys aren't going

to be allowed to have an early tryout.

MR. MANAHAN: Where does it say

that?

MR. STURM: No, the reality is

it's only going to be an early girls' tryout.

MR. SAUER: We don't have a DA

for boys.

MR. STURM: There's no DA for

boys in Cincinnati.

MR. MANAHAN: When is Cup having

their tryouts?

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107

MR. RODGERS: Well, that's why

we're here. And if I'm allowed to speak, I

would love to if --

MR. RUFFOLO: Hold on one

second. I'll get you in a minute.

MR. FRISBIE: Hold on, Scott.

MR. STURM: I can also point

out, I've got in my possession at least a

dozen emails from clubs big and small in

Cincinnati that are in support of this

proposal as written.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. Scott?

MR. RODGERS: First of all, I

appreciate it. This has been a great

experience, and we're here for this reason.

To make sure everybody's on the

same page and understands where Cincinnati

United is coming from in our joint venture

with Kings Hammer for the girls DA, you know,

we have no desire to disrupt any tryouts, we

support tryout reform. We believe that

tryout reform needs to occur to get everybody

on an, on an equal playing field.

We also support what US Soccer's

trying to do with their Developmental

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108

Academy. We currently do not have tryouts.

Even though I know some people would like to

say they are occurring, they are not. We

have not taken any notes, we don't have any

kids in bibs, we don't have any kids doing

anything.

We did put together an

opportunity for kids to come together and see

each other so we could start breaking down

some walls on the girls' side because we have

kids who have to come and play together who

currently have not played together nor may

have they ever played together.

So our tryouts haven't been

established yet because we're going to live

up to the rules that occur inside the leagues

that we play in and the rules that Ohio South

puts together.

We would like to put the DA

before anything that would occur. And the

rationale behind that is from my experience

in being involved in this. For years I've

had players who want to go up and play on the

boys' side. The Developmental Academy with

the Crew have looked at when OE had the DA

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109

and looked at other DA programs that are out

of state.

I personally as a director would

like to have that done before tryouts ever

occur. Reason being is, if we try to do it

all in one time while that kid's making that

decision, you're impacting several kids down

the road on other teams, on other places, on

other clubs.

I don't want any club calling me

going, wait a minute, this kid won't commit

to me because they're waiting on their offer

from the DA, or this kid committed to me

because they were scared they didn't get the

DA and now they're backing out and I don't

have any other kids to put in that roster

spot. And I agree with that. I've been in

that position. I've been in a position where

a kid told us they were playing for us, and

then called us and said, hey, I got offered

the DA, I'm taking off and leaving you, and

now there's a hole in our process.

So we are trying to be a club

that is trying to bring this to Cincinnati

because we feel it's vital for the

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110

development of these kids. If there's

something going on in California and a kid

can develop that way, we want to make sure

the Southern Ohio, Cincinnati kid has that

same opportunity.

So as we bring the DA into

Cincinnati, we're not trying to disrupt but

we'd like to get it over with so that

everybody can work on similar grounds.

I understand the complaints that

we might get an opportunity to see a player

before somebody else does. We would like to

listen to any ways that that can be adjusted.

Our thought process was a DA

tryout, a gap, and then our normal tryouts

for our club.

Now, during that gap we felt

that, yeah, there's a chance we're going to

lose players. They may not be happy that

they didn't get offered the DA program and

now they have time to go to other clubs'

tryouts and attend those tryouts, and if they

choose to play for another club then we know

that's what we have to deal with.

If you do them all at once,

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111

which we will support and we will do, what's

going to happen then is exactly what Jim and

I have talked about in prior conversations,

we're going to be making offers to everybody

in one shot, right? We're going to be making

offers to all the people in one shot and a

kid is not going to have an opportunity to go

look at other clubs because everybody is

going to be making offers within a 24 to

48-hour period of time.

MR. RUFFOLO: Scott, can I ask

you a question?

MR. RODGERS: Yes.

MR. RUFFOLO: All right. Say

you have your tryout in March, okay? You got

a hundred girls coming out, okay? You get a

team. How many are going to be on the DA --

in the DA program from an age group?

MR. RODGERS: 18 to 22.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. So you're

basically getting one team. How many teams

are you going to get in each age group?

MR. RODGERS: There are four age

groups, I believe.

MR. RUFFOLO: Yeah, but are they

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112

one age, one team for each --

MR. RODGERS: Only one DA team,

right.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. The players

will know within a short period of time after

that whether they're in DA and whether they

accept or not?

MR. RODGERS: As long as they

accept, but, yes, they would know quickly.

MR. RUFFOLO: So let's say

within a week you would have your team put

together.

MR. RODGERS: The offers would

be out, yes.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. What

happens to, and this is the issue I think

everybody has, what happens to all those

other girls that came out for your program,

what are they told?

MR. RODGERS: To attend, if they

don't make the team, to attend tryouts next

week or next session or whenever those -- our

tryouts would not be in March, just so you

understand, we would never do those tryouts

in March.

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113

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay.

MR. RODGERS: Those tryouts

would occur either --

MR. RUFFOLO: Are you going to

tell them to come back to your tryouts or are

you going to tell them to go back and try out

for other teams?

MR. RODGERS: I can tell you

what we do now for our club. Our Cup tryouts

go first and our CU tryouts go second. And

so what we tell kids who do not make Cup is

here are the dates for our tryouts.

MR. STURM: John?

MR. RUFFOLO: Yeah.

MR. STURM: Scott, I saw a

Twitter feed that was put out that said

there's a Combine March 31st, the players

should come prepared wearing a black jersey,

bring a white jersey, training pants and

shoes.

MR. RODGERS: Uh-huh.

MR. STURM: First of all, for

most people who are involved in soccer, that

sounds like a whole lot like tryouts.

My second point is, it said

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114

specifically this is a tryout for the DA

Academy and the Pre-DA Academy teams. How

can you invite people to a DA and Pre-Academy

tryout and say that it's not a tryout for the

teams that are going to play in the leagues?

MR. RODGERS: I understand that.

And that was a mistake by that person that

sent that out. We are not doing a tryout.

We have no notes from those events, we are

not running them as if we were.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. What is a

Pre-Academy?

MR. RODGERS: That probably will

not be the name of the team, but those will

be the kids that will be the next tier for us

in our club.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. So when I

asked you how many teams you're having,

you're having one team but then you're also

going to have a Pre-Academy team?

MR. RODGERS: Our club will

have, yes.

MR. RUFFOLO: Your club will,

okay. And they have to try out for that team

when you have tryouts?

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115

MR. RODGERS: There are kids in

our club who have told us they will not be

trying out for the DA, but will try out for

our next level team.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay.

MR. STURM: Scott --

MR. RUFFOLO: Wait a minute, He

had one before that. Craig?

MR. MANAHAN: Yeah, a couple

questions. Number one, did you guys do a

registration for the ID centers that you've

done already, online? Have you collected

information, you know, direction?

MR. RODGERS: We have

information for those people that have

attended, yes. If they wanted information on

the DA, we have collected that information.

MR. MANAHAN: No, I'm asking --

so before they went, did you ask them to

register with you so that you have their

name, phone number, parents' names?

MR. RODGERS: I don't think we

asked them to register, I'll have to go back

and check. We asked them to fill out a

waiver, though, so that we couldn't be sued

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116

if a kid got hurt.

MR. MANAHAN: Right.

MR. BERNING: That's correct. I

was at the registration. Nobody

pre-registered, they filled -- they brought a

form, filled out and handed --

MR. MANAHAN: So the only

information you collected from the kids that

attended was a waiver so that you, you know,

are covered from an insurance or whatever?

MR. BERNING: Correct.

MR. MANAHAN: So we, you know,

we all know there was a survey that was sent

out, and from what I understand from, I

talked to Tim Bronsil as well, he says that

it only went to Kings Hammer kids and Cup

kids. Can you confirm a hundred percent that

that went to just your club?

MR. RODGERS: We are still

researching that to make sure. Our two

people who sent it out, yes, are telling us

that they sent that only to our players. And

that's what the questionnaire was for, we

were looking for those kids to find out how

many kids were not going to try out for the

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DA from our clubs.

MR. MANAHAN: So my thought is

this: You know, the pre -- you're calling it

a pre-DA, but it's part of Cup, why aren't

you just keeping that Cup Gold?

MR. RODGERS: We haven't

given it -- it doesn't have a name, but it

has an identification as those would be the

next tier kids.

And again just so, Jim, you

know, we've had these conversations, we can't

call it Pre-DA because you wouldn't accept us

in State Cup, right, because it's a name

affiliated with another league?

MR. STURM: No, that's not true.

MR. MANAHAN: Well, hold on.

MR. STURM: The Crew has

Pre-Academy teams named in the State Cup.

MR. RODGERS: Okay.

MR. MANAHAN: Yeah.

MR. RODGERS: Well, we haven't

decided what we're naming them, so my answer

was we probably weren't going to call them --

MR. MANAHAN: But why is -- I

mean, there's been information that's been

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out there calling them Pre-DA, I mean, let's

be honest.

MR. RODGERS: I agree.

MR. MANAHAN: So you're telling

me that they're not called Pre-DA --

MR. RODGERS: Well, we haven't

come up with what their names are going to be

yet so, yes, that could possibly happen.

MR. MANAHAN: Okay, so that's

little semantics, I get it.

MR. RODGERS: Well, we just

haven't got there yet, we're not that far

down the road.

MR. MANAHAN: Right. So my

question is this: So I'm from Cincinnati, I

think it would be great to have a DA in

Cincinnati if we felt like it was kind of an

independent organization.

Is Bobby Puppione going to coach

both DA and Pre-DA or whatever you're going

to call them, Cup Gold teams, or will he be

strictly just for the DA?

MR. RODGERS: Tiffany and Bobby

will be DA and basically anywhere else

they're needed.

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MR. MANAHAN: So they could

potentially be coaching the DA and a

competitive league team?

MR. RODGERS: They could be

coaching a league team, yes.

MR. MANAHAN: Do you guys not

see that that may rub the rest of the clubs

the wrong way and not have them want to send

their best players to the DA?

MR. RODGERS: If we had enough

coaches to do it without, and that's our game

plan is to eventually get there, that's the

way we would like it to be.

MR. MANAHAN: So you said that

there's four teams per age group, right?

MR. RUFFOLO: No, four age

groups.

MR. MANAHAN: Four total.

There's four age groups. Four teams. But

you're saying that you are so short on

coaches that you have to have Bobby and

Tiffany --

MR. RODGERS: I still have 200

other teams besides --

MR. MANAHAN: I know you have.

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MR. RODGERS: So that's where

the coaching shortage comes out.

MR. MANAHAN: So Bobby is needed

on that side. So I'll just tell you, I like

to be nice and upfront. As long as you got

Bobby coaching in both, and Tiffany coaching

in both, you're going to have a hard time

convincing the rest of the city to go send

players to the DA.

And I really think the city

should embrace it, because it's great. But

the way you've got it set up, and when this

stuff happens like you hold these Combines,

you don't call the other clubs to have kind

of a pre-meeting, say, hey, we're coming,

we'd like you to be a part of it, come join

us, you know, then it looks -- it just

doesn't look genuine, it looks like you guys

are still out there trying to just take

everybody's players, do it the best way you

can, and no one wants to support it.

MR. RODGERS: I understand. We

have reached out to many directors, some have

worked with us, some we're still working to

get to.

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MR. MANAHAN: Right.

MR. RODGERS: We are working our

way through the system, yes.

MR. MANAHAN: So you could help

yourselves a lot by working together with

them versus doing it off on your own,

announcing it to the city, and not involving

everybody else. Just, that's my feedback to

you.

MR. RODGERS: That's one reason

why we're here.

MR. SAUER: Would you be averse

to allowing other clubs and coaches and DOCs

to attend the Combines and watch and observe?

MR. RODGERS: They are more than

welcome to come.

MR. RUFFOLO: Mo?

MR. RAZACK: The U12, 13, 14

boys, what are they doing?

MR. RODGERS: As of right now we

haven't made any decisions. That was given

to us a lot later. If you understand how the

offers were made, US Soccer made the offer

for the boys several months or a couple

months after the girls, so we hadn't made any

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decisions what we were doing yet. And then

all of this came about, so we're just kind of

sitting back with the boys right now waiting

to see how things unfold.

We're moving forward with our

plans to build the program but we haven't

opened up any doors to do anything whatsoever

until some of these conversations were done.

MR. RAZACK: So what you're

saying, your tryout dates is going to be like

a week before the regular tryouts?

MR. RODGERS: If I had it my

way, I would love to do it the week before

Memorial Day, and then --

MR. RAZACK: Okay, so then in

that case if the kids don't make the --

MR. RODGERS: We would go the

23rd, if we had it our way, and again, we're

just sitting on it, we haven't announced

anything, we would love to get the DA over

with the week of the 23rd, and then everybody

with all these older age groups get going the

week after.

If this committee and everybody

comes up with rulings that need to be in

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place, we're here to live by the rules that

go through. We're here to be supportive.

But on the other hand, we do

have a DA to put together, we're going to

have to make decisions based on this

information that is going to be in the best

interest of all considered.

MR. RAZACK: And I'm a hundred

percent with you, all right? If you have the

DA, you need the support of our clubs. I

mean, some places in Columbus did get emails

also to attend, but they also got emails from

Indy Premier, you know, to attend tryouts and

Combine, whatever they call it.

MR. RODGERS: US Soccer feels

that they can reach out to any player that

they feel --

MR. RAZACK: Correct. And

should be, you know, whether they come from

West Virginia or Kentucky.

But you see the perception, I

mean, you've been around the block and you

know when the Crew was involved and it was

the same situation.

So you have tryouts for the DA,

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you guys make the DA, you guys come next week

you'll make the Pre-DA or whatever you guys

going to call it, Cup Gold or Pre-DA. We all

know what it is, it's the Pre-DA.

MR. RODGERS: The difference we

were planning, and I understand completely

what you're saying, was we were giving a gap

for those kids to think about going to

another club. Whereas, what you're saying

happened, and I agree with you completely,

was not just the Crew.

MR. RAZACK: Right.

MR. RODGERS: There were other

entities that had the DA in the state, made

offers to the DA kids and the next level kids

at the exact same time.

MR. RAZACK: Correct.

MR. RODGERS: We were looking to

make the offer to the DA, leave a gap that if

a kid is frustrated and they want to go to

another club, they have every right to do so,

and then more tryouts to go forward.

Now, if that's not going to be

an option for us then we'll, like I said,

we're going to live to the rules that are put

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in place. If we have to do it all in

one shot, we will do it all in one shot. I

don't think it's going to be as productive

but we can make it work, we're not stressed

about that part.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. Scott, the

question now I have is Pre-Academy -- I mean

the Academy DA, that's great. Pre-Academy,

why is it that you need to say we're going to

have a Pre-Academy instead of saying to all

the kids, go out to your whatever club you

want to? Because what you're doing then is

telling these kids in order to get on the DA

you have to play for our club on the

Pre-Academy. And I think that is a problem a

lot of people are having.


MR. RUFFOLO: And the question

is then for these other clubs, you're getting

an unfair advantage. And that's what we're

here to try to level the playing field.

MR. RODGERS: There's an answer

to that.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay.

MR. RODGERS: US Soccer has

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informed us that in order to be a

developmental player and a DP where you can

come in and play small percentage of the

game, small environments, you must be in a

very similar training environment to what the

DA does.

So I can't go to Warren County

and see a kid and say, hey, we would like to

give this girl or boy an opportunity to train

in a -- play in a couple matches with the DA,

the DA is going to say, no, that player is

not eligible. So we have to create a

training environment that is similar but

would play in all USYSA leagues that we play

in.

MR. RUFFOLO: Now, those

Pre-Academy kids may get called up to the DA

then, is that what you're saying?

MR. RODGERS: There is an option

for a kid to be brought in as a DP player,

which occurs now with the Crew.

MR. STURM: Okay. And that -- a

couple things while you're on that. That is

the crux of the complaint to the concerns of

the clubs. You hold your DA Academy, you

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invite a hundred kids there, 20 of them make

the DA team, you tell the other 80 you're

pretty good but you're not quite the DA

level, you play for the Cup teams or

Pre-Academy teams, we can keep an eye on you

and, boy, if you get better we can put you

onto the DA team, or we can bring you on as a

temporary player for a tryout. But you can

only do that if you're in the Cup

organization. That is a huge, huge

competitive disadvantage.

MR. SAUER: How many Pre-Academy

teams per age were you planning?

MR. RODGERS: Just one.

MR. STURM: No. Pre-Academy.

MR. RODGERS: A kid that played

on our Silver team or first CU team in

Southeast would not be eligible under US

Soccer to be going into that academy.

MS. STURM: I do have a problem

with some of your rationale for this, about

having early tryouts and then a gap, because

it sounds like you say by doing a gap you're

doing the other clubs a favor. And that's

almost a little condescending from --

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MR. RODGERS: That's your

opinion. I'm giving an opportunity -- first

of all, understand where I'm coming from. I

wouldn't be here if I didn't want to have an

open conversation, okay, I just would have

stayed home and done what we need to do.

Every decision I make is based

on players and what is in the best interest

of a player. I believe if a kid is not happy

when we don't make an offer to them to make

the DA, they should have every opportunity to

go to any club they want to go look at and

have an opportunity to try out for that club.

If we do our tryouts all in one,

which is being proposed here, I do think kids

are not going to get that opportunity. So

it's not I'm trying to do them a favor, I'm

trying to do the players a favor. You have

an opportunity then to say, you know what, I

don't like what they have to say, I'm going

to go over here. We have great clubs on

every corner in the State of Ohio, we just

do, so I think kids should have an

opportunity to pick if there's another club

out there that goes for them.

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If they come to our tryout and

we have to go through our whole entire

process, then they don't get the offer they

want, and all these other clubs are already

done, that kid's going to be in a world of

hurt trying to find a place that they're

happy with. Or they're going to accept us

and then move to transfer. Which you just

talked about the whole transfer rule, which

is, I would love to prevent from happening.

I don't want kids having to move from club to

club.

MR. STURM: Well, first of all,

if they're in the DA, it's not a transfer.

MR. RODGERS: That's what I

said, the DA is different. I'm talking about

all the rest of them.

MR. STURM: But if the DA is so

good, if it is the end-all for the female

player in these age groups, why wouldn't they

go there in the first place?

MR. RODGERS: I'm not talking

about the DA kid, I'm talking about the next

kid. If they're not happy that they didn't

make the DA, I want them to have every

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opportunity to look at any club they want to

look at.

MR. MANAHAN: So let me ask a

question. Going back to what I said about

Bobby, right, when they go to the DA, are you

telling me they're not going to make the

sales pitch that they should stay at CU and

Cup or Kings Hammer to the kids that come

that aren't from CU and Cup or CU and KHA?

So they're standing there, they're at the DA

tryout, you've picked your teams or you have

a good idea who the kids are, we know how

tryouts work and you're talking to parents,

talking to kids, yeah, you know, we think

you're really good, probably not quite on the

DA level but, man, you would be really good

in our Pre-DA or, man, you would be really

good in our Cup Black or Cup Silver or

whatever it is, if you just come here and

work really hard you'll be on that next

level, come here and work hard you can get to

the DA.

Because that's how it works

today, right, we're not stupid, we know

that's how it works today. Hey, come to Cup,

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you can be on Cup Gold. Make it happen in

Cup Black, you get on Cup Gold. That's the

sales pitch. Are we going to see the same

sales pitch with the DA? That's why I got

back to the point about Bobby and Tiffany,

right, because if they're just DA, I still

probably think they'd sell their old clubs,

but at least then they're kind of a separate

entity and you can kind of see the separation

of, okay, now they can go work with other

clubs without those clubs feeling like, man,

that's a Cup coach, that's a Kings Hammer

coach, it's not a DA coach, it's a Cup and

it's a Kings Hammer coach. Until that's

solved you're never going to solve it.

MR. RUFFOLO: I don't think we

can limit the ability of Bobby or Tiffany

from earning income.

MR. STURM: No, you can't.

MR. MANAHAN: I'm not trying to

limit them, I'm just telling them the

perception.

MR. RUFFOLO: Well, you are.

MR. MANAHAN: No, I'm not.

MR. BERNING: Four teams can't

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financially support two top trainers in the

city, right?

MR. MANAHAN: I'm telling them

what the perception is.

MR. BERNING: We understand

that.

MR. RUFFOLO: I understand. But

what I'm saying is, I don't think we can

expect Bobby and Tiffany to say we're only

going --

MR. MANAHAN: Yeah, we can.

MR. RUFFOLO: You think we can

expect them to do that?

MR. RAZACK: No.

MR. RUFFOLO: No, we can't. We

can't expect them to say we're going to limit

ourselves just to the DA.

Let me throw out a question. At

your tryouts, do you know who's going to be

on your Pre-Academy? Are there going to be

different kids that you're going to invite

that weren't already there? Or going to

seek?

MR. RODGERS: We are being told

from our own club that there are kids who

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will not be trying out for the DA, that will

wait for the normal tryout because they

either want to play high school or --

MR. RAZACK: I can attest to

that, John.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay, that's fine.

MR. RAZACK: I've had some

meetings with Cup parents a couple weeks ago

before you guys went to Las Vegas with your

National League Soccer.

MR. RUFFOLO: Oh, you were

recruiting those Cup parents?

MR. RAZACK: They came to me for

advice actually. They're on super teams,

they won't come to me. I won't do them the

favor to come to me.

But anyway, so to his point,

some of those kids, especially on the female

side, they want to play high school. So some

of them are going to choose not to play in

the DA because the DA's going to require them

not to play high school.

So to his point, yes, they might

invite them but they're going to say, no, I

want to wait for the Pre-Academy or the team

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they're playing on right now which is the Cup

Gold team and go try out for that team.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay, I got it.

MR. RAZACK: Right.

MR. RUFFOLO: Didn't realize

that.

MR. RODGERS: And to be honest

with you, and I'm just throwing our cards on

the table, I know from talking to parents

that some of them want an opportunity to go

look at some other clubs too because they're

afraid once the DA kids are taken away,

what's left behind may not be what they're

looking for.

MR. RAZACK: Correct, yeah.

MR. RODGERS: So they are

looking to shop around. And again, I've

always been that director that says do what

you got to do, it's your career.

MR. STURM: Let me kind of

summarize the concern of the clubs in

Buckeye, and that's, this is not -- yeah,

it's a CUSL issue, but it's also a Buckeye

issue, because we have how many teams, 450

teams out of the District 1, so we're a

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pretty good size piece of that market, too.

MR. RODGERS: Yep.

MR. STURM: How are our clubs

going to know that the kids that don't make

the DA, you're going to encourage them to be

parked on the other Cup teams pending

promotion to the DA, promises of promotion to

the DA? How, what assurance, especially in

the light of the admitted mistake to say this

Combine was both for DA and Pre-Academy

teams? That window's already broken, that

perception --

MR. RODGERS: Yep.

MR. STURM: -- is already out

there that this is going to be a Pre-Academy

tryout. How do you reconcile that in these

other 30-some clubs that have competitive

teams that are already in competition with

Cup? You know, Cup is the big elephant in

the room.

MR. RODGERS: Well, that's the

reason why we got the DA.

MR. STURM: And that's why you

got the DA.


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MR. STURM: But now they're

competing effectively for the most part with

the Cup teams, but now they've got this huge

disadvantage at them and they're looking to

the state organization to level the playing

field out like it used to be. How can Cup

hold these early tryouts when it was Cup that

actually proposed these dates in the first

place early winter?

MR. RODGERS: This is before we

picked our DA stuff, this had nothing to do

with DA, but fair enough.

MR. STURM: Yeah, but you agreed

to this back in --


MR. STURM: And you actually

were the ones, it's my understanding, that

set this as the parameters for it, but now

that you've got everybody else in CUSL locked

into this, you are going off and doing

tryouts earlier. Seems inconsistent.

MR. RODGERS: Not for these

groups. But, again, we didn't know this.

The reason we did this was a completely

different reason, which is what he stated,

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again we didn't know what we were doing at

that point. But I understand that.

I would ask the question back,

and have asked a few DOCs, what would make

you feel comfortable? Because the honest

answer is, and we all know it, there isn't

any guarantee that's going to make everybody

feel comfortable, is there? I mean, we can

tell our staff not to say anything, we can

tell our people not to do stuff, we can tell

our people -- and hopefully our people won't,

but it doesn't matter, somebody's going to

say it happened anyway, because that's what

happens.

Just like there's an ECNL

meeting coming up here in a couple weeks that

Tim and Doug are hosting and you don't mean

to tell me some kids aren't going to be told

they can play in the ECNL? They've already

been told. I already know kids in my club

that have already been told don't worry about

next year, don't go to the DA, you can play

in the ECNL, you got a spot here. It happens

in all recruitings.

So again, I don't want to get

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into the recruiting part of it because it

happens, it happens all over the city.

My answer to you is, what can we

do to make a DA program function correctly

and still have the competitive teams

underneath? Because our club isn't going

away.

MR. MANAHAN: I gave you that

answer. Make it separate. And I disagree

with you, I'm not trying to make Bobby not

earn his money. If you want to put Bobby

down to the Cup teams, fine, put him there.

I'm just saying having that separation

between the people that are coaching and

running the DA and those bottom teams, at

some level, you know, even if it's a separate

coach for those Pre-DA teams, then at least

you can go to the clubs and say that, and

say, hey, we're separating this, we

understand the concern, hey, come work with

us. Versus --

MR. RODGERS: What happens if

they're coaching non-Pre-DA teams but youth

teams?

MR. MANAHAN: I think you would

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have a much better chance of having people

accept and work with you. But I think you'd

have to go to the clubs and talk to them

instead of doing it off separate. Come talk

to them first, say, hey, this is how we want

to set it up, would this make you comfortable

enough to send your best player to the DA?

Because that's what it is, right, it's one or

two players. We're not talking about a

hundred. One or two. And if you could make

people comfortable you're going to -- that

that's the case, then maybe it would take

that one player and go play in the DA.

That's your best opportunity if you want to

go be on the National team, play in the NWSL.

It is, we know it is. We want to support it,

to be honest, we just can't in the current

form.

MR. RUFFOLO: So let me rephrase

what you're saying is, basically you're

saying, okay, Bobby and Tiffany, DA. But if

they want to help out the club, as long as

they're not covering the Pre-DA, Pre-Academy,

then you're okay if they have other teams

that they coach?

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MR. MANAHAN: Yes. I'd be more

okay if they were either coaching one or the

other, but that would help, yes.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. I think

what, and I appreciate this, Scott, that

you're coming to us with questions, and I

hope all of you guys appreciate this --

MR. MANAHAN: I do.

MR. RUFFOLO: -- because we had

a problem up in Columbus and we don't want to

have that problem. We don't want to do that

again. And I really appreciate your time.

Jim, you have something to add?

MR. STURM: Scott, you asked

what could be done, you, I mean, I don't want

to paraphrase your question, but in essence

is, what could be done to help satisfy the

concerns, correct?


MR. STURM: Two things. First

of all, it's what you could have done in the

past. And that is, as soon as you were

awarded the DA, which everybody heard about

probably about a minute after you did, call

the clubs together and say, okay, here's --

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we got the DA, we want your support, here's

what we're planning is, give us your input

now, before you make announcements, before

you do surveys, before you send out

inappropriate Twitters, get them on board.

You and I did talk back in January several

times. One of the statements you made to me

was you've learned from the mistakes that the

Crew made in setting up their DA and creating

all the animosity in Columbus.

From my perspective, you're

starting to make the same mistakes the Crew

did and you're getting the same reaction that

the clubs in Columbus gave to the Crew DA,

and continue to do so.

Mistake in the past, can't

correct that. What can you do in the

forward? And this is what I'm proposing,

that this by-law be put in effect this year.

In essence, you have one year to show the

clubs in Cincinnati -- and it's really a

Cincinnati club issue. You're going to draw

a couple players out of Columbus, maybe a few

out of Dayton, not a big deal. But in the

next year, show the clubs in Cincinnati that

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you want to be their partner, not their

opponent.

As an example, FC Cincinnati,

when they came in, they learned from the

Crew. FC Cincinnati has said publicly

they're never going to have an FC Cincinnati

Juniors program to take away from the clubs,

they want to partner with the clubs.

My suggestion to you is in the

next year you figure out a way to partner

with the clubs so that they -- you get their

buy-in. If you get to the point that their

buy-in, and instead of a dozen emails saying,

no, we like this rule because it's going to

hurt us, it's unfair, it's not a level

playing field, then this by-law can go away

if the clubs realize that you are following

through with your promises that you're not

going to park kids that didn't make the DA on

your other teams, you're going to send them

back to the club that they came from, you're

not going to encourage them to go to the Gold

and the Black team with the hope that they

can make the DA.

MR. RODGERS: That's going to be

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a trick. I mean, first of all, I understand

what you're saying, and we are meeting with

DOCs individually because it's easier in an

individual conversation to let them tell us

what their concerns are. Maybe we'll have a

group meeting afterwards, but different clubs

have different needs -- I mean different

concerns.

A kid who wants to be in the DA

and says they're going to come to another

tryout, I can't not take them.

MR. STURM: No. Not saying

that.

MR. RODGERS: Okay. That's why

I wanted a separate tryout where I could say

to a DOC, say, look, they registered, they

showed up, they're just like you, if a kid

shows up and they're good enough to play

we're going to take them on that team.

MR. STURM: Nobody would expect

you not to take a good player that came to

your tryouts, nobody is suggesting that that

would be good business, it would be bad

business.

But I can assure you if a kid

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doesn't make the DA, is not the top 20, and

you tell them we need you to play for the

second team, that word will get back very

quickly.

MR. RODGERS: Well, that's where

I'm saying is under this by-law if we said

you don't want the DA to happen prior to

this --

MR. STURM: Yep.

MR. RODGERS: -- we're going to

have to do it in one room, we're going to

have to put our second team together at the

same time, correct? I'm not going to be able

to wait two weeks, all those kids will be

picked somewhere else.

So if we can have a DA tryout, a

gap, and then the rest of our club tryouts,

then I can tell you we'll do our best to make

sure that happens.

If the tryouts are like this,

I'm going to have to go, you're DA, you're

next team, you're the third team. I'm going

to have to do it at that time.

MR. STURM: I understand that.

Every club that has multiple teams in an age

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group does that very same, you're on the

Black team, you're on the Gold team, dah,

dah, dah, dah.

But if what you're saying is

you're -- you make that choice and you say

you're DA, you're Gold team, but I need you

on Gold team because you're potential DA, as

soon as that -- that's crossing the line that

every coach in the club is afraid of. That

is the kinds of coercion that the clubs are

afraid of.

If you make up a straight offer

you're on the Gold team, okay, everybody that

has multiple teams in an age group does that,

A, B, C team. But that encouragement to --

that coercion to come to the Gold team so you

may make the DA team at some point in the

future, that's, that's the nub of it right

there.

That's why I'm saying go through

one year with that and get the support of the

clubs, and although I know you said you're

meeting with the DOCs one-on-one --

MR. RODGERS: Certain ones, yep.

We can expand that.

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MR. STURM: An open meeting

where a lot of people can sit in and have a

roundtable might be a better effective,

because the perception is you want to meet

with this guy but you don't want to meet with

this guy. The perception is, well, you told

this guy one thing but this guy heard

something else in another meeting. One big

meeting a lot of times might be a more

effective and cohesive way of getting the

message out. That's why I'm proposing this

be done for a year.

MR. RODGERS: But is this saying

that DA groups can or cannot go on the week

of the 23rd?

MS. STURM: Well, they can in

the 18s.

MR. RODGERS: So we're saying

the tryouts will occur simultaneously?

MR. STURM: Yes.

MR. RODGERS: Which we're

prepared to do. We're making sure everybody

understands though, and in my conversations

with directors, when a kid shows up we're

going to make our offers to whatever team we

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think they fall.

MR. BERNING: You're being

contradictory, I'm sorry to interrupt here,

because if you make the DA have the tryout on

the May 30th, the DA, the Pre-DA, the Cup,

the CU, they're all going to be on the exact

same time. So what you want us to do is we

can't tell them to go to another club.

MR. RUFFOLO: Because they're

going to all be there.

MR. BERNING: They're all going

to be --

MR. RUFFOLO: They're all going

to be there.

MR. STURM: Not necessarily.

MR. BERNING: What do you mean

not necessarily?

MR. STURM: Because --

MR. BERNING: If you force all

of the U11s to be on May 30th, all my CU

teams, all the Cup teams, all the DA kids,

every one kid is going to be in one spot and

we're going to say DA, Pre-DA, Cup, CU, and

we're done, and they're not going to be able

to go see other clubs.

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MR. RODGERS: That's what we're

trying to make sure we understand. We

understand what your situation is and what

you're saying, and we're agreeing that to do

that, a gap in between the two tryouts makes

the most since, so now a kid who is mad at me

who didn't make the DA has time to call Mo

and say what can you offer me up there in

Columbus or what can Ohio Elite offer me or

CSA offer me or ACE, and say, hey, what are

these other clubs offering. Under these

rules they're not going to be able to do

that.

MR. STURM: Yeah, they could.

Here's how. You hold your DA tryouts on

May 30th, you hold your Cup tryouts two days

later.

MR. RODGERS: Why would we?

MR. BALDEOSINGH: That's a

disadvantage.

MR. RODGERS: I'm not going to

go to a disadvantage to the other clubs so my

answer is no.

MR. STURM: Do all the clubs

hold their tryouts on May 30th?

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MR. RODGERS: I'm going to tell

you right now, my two biggest competitors in

the last couple years have held their tryouts

very, very quickly right at the beginning of

everything and they're done in two days.

We've gone three days and four

days at times and taken chances that we might

lose a kid. By extending our tryouts, we

have to condense to meet the demands of the

city, yes.

MR. STURM: Well, all I can tell

you is --

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay, I'm going

to -- I have to --

MR. SAUER: Mo's been having his

hand up.

MR. RUFFOLO: I know. Mo?

MR. RAZACK: No. The DA --

which ages do you have on the Gold that

you're proposing to have your early tryouts

one week early?

MR. RODGERS: Well, we would do

them all, but the answer are 14s, 15, 16, 18.

MR. STURM: Well, you can do

your 18s early.

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MR. RAZACK: Right. So I don't

see any --

MR. BALDEOSINGH: What about

12s?

MR. RODGERS: We don't have them

on the girls. The boys have --

MR. BALDEOSINGH: Oh, the boys

have 12, okay.

MR. RODGERS: -- 12, 13, 14.

MR. RAZACK: So those are the

seven teams that will have early tryouts?

MR. STURM: So -- hold on.

You're going to hold early tryouts for 12, 13

and 14 boys, too?

MR. RODGERS: I didn't say that.

The DA's just sitting there right now, we

haven't made any decision on the boys' side.

But if we went according to the rules, yes,

we would go the 30th on the 12s, 13s and 14s,

we would go according to this plan and we

would put not only our DA teams but our

Pre-DA teams and our Cup Silvers and our CU

Southeast and our CU Sycamore and our CU

Lakota together as fast as humanly possible

because we can't take a chance on all those

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kids leaving and going to other clubs.

MR. STURM: But if we leave out

of here and tomorrow you decide to do the 12,

13, 14s, you're going to hold early tryouts

for them? So in essence --

MR. RODGERS: I'm asking if

that's even an option. We haven't made the

decision because the boys decided to wait for

this ruling to come down. So the boys are

just sitting there right now going we're not

doing anything until we know what we're

allowed to do at all.

MR. STURM: But if we don't pass

this then conceivably tomorrow you could

announce early tryouts for the 12s, 13s and

14s?

MR. BERNING: On the boys DA,

right?

MR. STURM: On the boys DA. But

it represents the same problems for the clubs

that you're proposing for the girls' four age

divisions. So altogether this would be

giving Cup an advantage on over half of the

divisions in 12s through 18s.

MR. RODGERS: Again, I

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understand where you're saying there's an

advantage, I also see disadvantages, but

that's -- some kids would be seen, yes.

MR. COOK: Can we hear what Mo

has to say?

MR. STURM: 20 -- I said a dozen

clubs are aware of that and they're

supporting this proposal, those are 20

Cincinnati clubs.

MR. RODGERS: And we're prepared

to do this schedule. I just want to make

sure everybody knows --

MR. RUFFOLO: Hold on a second.

We've got back and forth. Mo, what is your

comment?

MR. RAZACK: I was just going to

propose, you know, I'm with Scott, you know,

I mean, they've done a great job at Cup and

stuff, and their record shows it, so if we

need to help the academy and we can

compromise where we do the girls, you know,

14 through 18s in one week early, because

it's going to be an advantage to some of

those clubs as well. If they know they made

the DA or didn't make the DA, then they have

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the option to come try out at any other club

the week after, all right? So they're going

to know that.

And certainly with the social

media stuff, they're going to be known,

people are going to know, hey, we were told

we didn't make the DA but we're going to make

the Pre-DA and be in that pool of players.

People are going to talk. And at that point

you're going to lose your credibility with

us.

MR. RODGERS: Correct.

MR. RAZACK: All right? So I

recommend on the boys' side we leave the

playing field even with all the clubs for

this year until we figure out exactly what's

going on with the DA. But, you know, if -- I

think that's going to -- sometimes it

backfires, these things, because now you've

got to produce a team at the National level

and you've got to produce a team at the DA

and you can't cross-point kids in two

different leagues like that. So he's right,

so he's either got to pull some more kids to

play on, to make his National team, or he's

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going to lose kids to ECNL or to other clubs.

MR. RUFFOLO: All right. A

couple of things on this proposed tryout law

based on this email that I got. Well, not

me, but Tom got.

I'm noticing it says limiting

tryouts for Developmental Academy teams would

be detrimental to the development of

potential National team players in Southern

Ohio, therefore, the proposed rule would be

contrary to the best interest of soccer in

the USSF National team programs. I think we

got to look at that, guys, before we either

agree or disagree on that proposal.

He didn't cite any rule, but

that concerns me for having that because what

we're trying to do is, if we pass this rule,

we are going to be limiting them, and I don't

know if that's necessarily what we want to

have an issue with US Soccer.

So we've had a lot of

discussion. I think we have a motion and an

entry -- or a second. I'm thinking of law.

And in that motion we've indicated that

Paragraph 3.6.6 would be eliminated. So the

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question is before us. Do we have anything

further to discuss?

MR. SAUER: Did Mo have a motion

to change the -- he wanted to change

something.

MR. RUFFOLO: You want to change

it?

MR. SAUER: I mean, then that

would have to be seconded and vote on the

proposal to change it before you vote on

the --

MR. STURM: Yes, that is

correct. Do you have a motion to amend?

MR. RAZACK: Yes. I would just

amend they allow that, on the girls' side,

the 14 through 18s, to have their tryouts one

week before.

MR. SAUER: 14, 15, 16, 18.

MR. RAZACK: 14 through --

MR. STURM: Is that for

everybody or just the DA teams?

MR. RAZACK: Girls' DA.

MR. STURM: Now, hold on. Hold

on. If you're going to start making a rule

to allow a group to have tryouts that aren't

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even part of us, we have never had an Ohio

South rule that says this rule applies to

this group but not to this group.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. My point,

though, then is you're saying they're not a

part of us, so why are we putting rules to

limit what they're doing?

MR. STURM: We are not limiting

what the DA does. We are not, because this

email says we can't.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay.

MR. STURM: But what we are

doing in the proposal is, if the DA is part

of a club that holds early tryouts for,

regardless -- by the way, we do have early

indication it was for Pre-Academy teams --

that they can't be a part of any league.

They can hold DA tryouts.

In fact, if the only team that

they were going to have was the four DA

girls' teams, there's nothing we could do,

but the fact that they have the girls' DA

teams and other teams in our competitive

leagues, that's the problem.

MR. RUFFOLO: So basically since

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Cup was awarded the DA along with Kings

Hammer --

MR. RODGERS: On the girls' side

Kings Hammer. Boys, just Cup.

MR. RUFFOLO: Boys, just Cup?

MR. RODGERS: Just Cup.

MR. RUFFOLO: And the girls'

side, Kings Hammer?

MR. RODGERS: And Cup.

MR. RUFFOLO: And Cup, okay.

Because of that then we're telling them in

order for them to have a DA they have to

disassociate themselves from Cup?

MR. STURM: In fact --

MR. RUFFOLO: I mean, our rule

is saying that.

MR. STURM: Yes.

MR. RUFFOLO: Because they can't

have any of those people try out for their

teams the next week.

MR. RODGERS: Unless we do

tryouts exactly the same time.

MR. RUFFOLO: I understand.

MR. RODGERS: So if I do DA

tryouts --

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MR. RUFFOLO: I understand. My

thing is, I really am hearing the idea of

having it for the kids a week early and then

letting them have options to go somewhere

else.

If they're all trying out at the

same time for DA and everything else, they

are not going to have the chance to try out

for their other teams unless those other

teams have tryouts later than the DA, and so

they're going to get hurt because most kids

will not make that DA team. They'll want to

make that DA team, but they won't. And so

what are we doing, we're hurting those kids.

Our priority, guys, have to be

the kids. And what we're doing is hurting

them by passing this rule that affects the DA

program and Cup and Kings Hammer. Just

because they were awarded, we should be

ecstatic that it's in Southwest Ohio.

Now, as a coach, it's not a

great thing, it's not a great thing for me.

But as a player, as a person who is promoting

the players, we should be ecstatic.

MR. MANAHAN: I'm going to say

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this: The big winner in all this is Cup and

Kings Hammer. And we really are not going to

help ourselves if we pass this, we're not

going to help ourselves if we don't pass it.

The bottom line is they got the DA, they're

going to do what they want, it's going to

happen, so either -- I don't even know if

it's worth passing.

MR. RUFFOLO: So do we want to

limit kids' ability to play for other teams?

MR. MANAHAN: I never want to

limit kids' ability to play for anybody.

MR. STURM: Here's the thing

though, John.

MR. RUFFOLO: Yeah.

MR. STURM: They go through

that -- how many tryouts are in Cincinnati in

the spring from all the different clubs and

all the different days? 200, ballpark?

MR. RODGERS: How many days?

MR. STURM: Yeah, tryout

opportunities.

MR. MANAHAN: You mean different

clubs?

MR. STURM: Different clubs,

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different days, different age groups.

MR. RUFFOLO: For age groups,

it's three or four days.

MR. STURM: Yes. So my point

is, there's already potential for conflict

for kids that, do I want to play for Cup, do

I want to play for Ohio Elite, those

opportunities are for kids to make choices --

MR. COOK: That's totally

different because if I have a kid that's

coming from Columbus, they're going to go to

all four DA days, they're not going to go to

two and then come to my mine for two, they're

going to go to his for all four days. I'm

losing them if he does it the week before and

he accepts them or I'm losing them period,

they're going to go and stay in Cincinnati

afterwards.

MR. STURM: If this proposal

cuts out an exception for the Cup, DA,

Pre-Academy teams, it is patently unfair to

put the other teams, the other 98 percent of

the players in Ohio South at a competitive

disadvantage. You got to do it for one, you

do it for everybody. You can't have --

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MR. COOK: But what you're

telling them, though, is his kids are going

to go try out for the DA. They're not going

to come back to them. So if we're doing all

at one time, he's losing them anyways, and

now he's losing them for good instead of

having an opportunity saying, hey, look, you

are a good player, if you make the DA,

congratulations; if not, remember we are

still here.

MR. MANAHAN: The truth of the

matter is they have an advantage either way,

they got the DA, they're going to make offers

to second, third, fourth teams.

MR. COOK: But they can't

technically do that until --

MR. MANAHAN: Well, they may not

until tryouts but they're going to talk to

kids there, that's the way it works. So to

me, what's the point of us having this if

it's, I mean, we certainly don't want to be

in a position where we're having to go to

have litigation with US Soccer, that's just

foolish. You know, if they're saying that

they're the DA, they can do what they want,

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162

that's what's going to happen. What I would

really prefer is if CU and Kings Hammer would

be good citizens and come work with the

clubs. You know, forget all these rules and

everything, just go be good citizens. Don't

compete with us.

MR. RUFFOLO: I think by them

coming here today --

MR. MANAHAN: It's a start.

MR. RUFFOLO: It's a very good

start.

MR. MANAHAN: You don't live in

Cincinnati.

MR. RUFFOLO: I don't live in --

I don't have any teams anymore, guys, I'm out

of it. I'm out of it. I'm not worried about

it anymore, okay?

MR. MANAHAN: That's a lot

easier.

MR. RUFFOLO: When I had my

other kids that were really good, yeah, I was

always after his boys and they were always

after ours.

MR. MANAHAN: Yeah.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. Not -- but

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163

anyway --

MR. MANAHAN: So I don't know if

it's worth it for us to pass a rule that

we're going to invite the US Soccer --

MR. RUFFOLO: We have a motion,

we have a second. Mo, are you going to amend

your motion?

MR. RAZACK: I can't because I'm

not a member league.

MR. RUFFOLO: You could amend a

motion, you're on the board.

MR. RAZACK: No, but I'm saying

if we make an exception to the DA, which is

not part of Ohio South.

MR. RUFFOLO: Right. So it's no

motion?

MR. RAZACK: Yeah.

MR. RUFFOLO: So we have a

motion and a second. Anything else? All

right. All in favor, raise your hand? All

opposed?


MR. STURM: Great. Buckeye will

be having tryouts to match whatever you do,

Scott.

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MR. BLIEDEN: I got to, as a CU

member I have to abstain.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay, you abstain?

For the record, he, Steve abstained. Let's

take two minutes. That was a long

discussion, guys.

(WHEREUPON, a brief recess was

taken.)

(Scott Rodgers and Brian Berning

left the meeting.)

(WHEREUPON, a discussion was

held in Executive Session.)

MR. RUFFOLO: The international

clearance form, can we hold that off, Jim?

MR. STURM: Well, the only

problem is we start registering players

June 1.

MR. RUFFOLO: When's our next

meeting?

MR. STURM: June 17th, something

like that.

MR. FRISBIE: 13th.

MR. RUFFOLO: Can we move a

meeting to May? I know we've got State Cup,

but can we move a meeting to May?

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165

MR. MANAHAN: No.

MR. RUFFOLO: No?

MR. STURM: This by-law, as Tom

and I already -- I sent it to Tom several

weeks ago, he believes it meets all the

requirements. The challenge is --

MR. RUFFOLO: So do I. If that

means anything. Does anybody have any

problem with it?

MR. BALDEOSINGH: Make a motion

to accept.

MR. RUFFOLO: You got a motion.

I got a second?

MR. STURM: Yes.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. All in

favor? Anyone opposed?


MS. STURM: Very quickly, the

present rules let this year's player passes

be used as birth identification. We have no

idea if the underlying birth certificate is

US or not. This allows, for this year only,

to not use that, and it clarifies what can

and can't be used.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay, we did the

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166

executive. Authorization to hire member

services, we'll hold off.

MS. STURM: I'll pass this

around. I've changed the title, as suggested

by several people, to Business Development

Director. Gordon has expressed an interest

in talking about it over the next two months,

I'll meet with him and see what else he wants

to tune it up with.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. And then we

had a proposed amendment to State Cup or

something like that.

MR. MANAHAN: That's mine.

MR. RUFFOLO: Yes.

MR. MANAHAN: Mine's real easy,

it has to do with Lesh. I think we need to

eliminate the second sentence that's in the

rule that basically kicks him out of State

Cup for the following year based on a

forfeit, because I one hundred percent agree

with these guys that came in tonight, that is

a sad state of affairs that we're having the

team not participate.

MR. RUFFOLO: I agree with you,

totally.

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167

MR. MANAHAN: So if we eliminate

that second sentence, it eliminates that

they're not able to participate in --

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. We have a

motion to eliminate the sentence that says

that after the first year you

automatically --

MR. MANAHAN: Here, I'll do the

motion. For rule 10.2.8, eliminate the

sentence that says the team shall be

prohibited from entering the following year

State Cup or President's Cup.

MR. RUFFOLO: I would say may be

prohibited. That way if it's a very bad

violation, we can do something about that.

MR. MANAHAN: Okay.

MR. RUFFOLO: Do you have any

issues with that?

MR. MANAHAN: No.

MR. STURM: Tom, is there a part

of the National Championship rules that say

if you cheat this year you can't play next

year?

MR. MANAHAN: Then why do we

have a separate rule?

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MR. FRISBIE: I don't know if

what you're saying is correct, I'll have to

check that.

MR. STURM: I move that we table

this until we verify whether it's contrary

to --

MR. RUFFOLO: I agree. That's

fine.

MR. MANAHAN: That's fine.

MR. RUFFOLO: Mo, you had a

motion you wanted to give?

MR. RAZACK: Those guys left.

They asked me to bring a motion forward to at

least reconsider what the board has decided

before.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. First of

all, I'm going to stop you real quick. We

did not do anything because we didn't have an

official motion and there wasn't a second, so

there was no vote.

From now on, if we have email

votes, so all of you know, they're outside of

a meeting so it's basically a written vote,

it needs to be in writing and unanimous,

okay? If we don't have an actual meeting,

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169

all right? That's in most charters and the

statute, okay? Now --

MR. STURM: It's also in our

constitution now.

MR. RUFFOLO: All right. So in

order for us to do an email vote, it has to

be unanimous. We didn't get to that vote

because there wasn't a motion and a second.

So, Mo, you're doing a motion now to allow

them in. We don't know how it's going to

work but you would like a motion to allow

them in. Is there a second to that motion?

MR. HILTON: Second.

MR. RUFFOLO: Solly's got a

second to that motion. Okay, limited

discussion. How do we get them back in?

MR. SAUER: Can we get them back

in?

MR. RUFFOLO: Well, wait a

minute. Wait a minute.

MR. FRISBIE: I've already

conferred with the NCS Chair and he's said

you can't do that.

MR. RUFFOLO: Okay. That's a

problem.

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170

MR. STURM: I ask that we call

the question because if we do it contrary to

the National Championship rules, we're

required to follow those rules.

MR. RUFFOLO: I'm there. I just

want to put it on record that we did look at

it, we got our motion, got a second. All in

favor of the motion, please signal by raising

your hand?


MR. RUFFOLO: No one raised

their hand -- well, the guys that raised

theirs, Mo and Solly, and everybody else is a

nay. Okay, that does not pass.

Anything else for the good of

the game, Tom?

MR. FRISBIE: There's a

housekeeping piece for State Cup that I

passed around that had to do with a new

clause for National Championship series

regarding match fixing. I would just move

that we adopt the match fixing clause as a

portion of our State Cup rules.

MR. RUFFOLO: Do I have a

motion?

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171

MR. COOK: Motion.

MR. BALDEOSINGH: So move.

MR. RUFFOLO: Second?

MR. HILTON: Second.



MR. RUFFOLO: All right. I want

to thank all of you. I don't think I have

anything else. Anything else for the good of

the game? Thank you, everybody, have a safe

trip back.

MR. MANAHAN: Should I move to

adjourn?

MR. RUFFOLO: Yeah, move to

adjourn. Move to adjourn.

MR. STURM: Second.

MR. RUFFOLO: Second.


(Meeting concluded at 9:44 p.m.)

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C E R T I F I C A T E

I, Tina M. Shell, a Registered

Professional Reporter, do hereby certify that

the foregoing is a full, true and correct

transcript of my notes taken in the

above-styled case and thereafter transcribed

by me.

/s/ Tina M. ShellTina M. Shell

Registered Professional Reporter

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